iMac Review, iMac Software Update 1.0

[VanNess]

It's more or less a minor thing, but I notice that Apple isn't providing any third-party software freebies with this edition of the iMac.

Previous generations usually threw in a game and/or a few apps. The previous iMac gave you fully functional versions of Comic Life, OmniOutliner, and Big Bang board games, all free of charge. Nothing doing with the new iMac. It's iLife 08 and that's it. Kind of a bummer.

 

[Igantius]

It was a slight error which I believe has already been fixed. And the fact is that Ars Technica is propably the smartest website out there when it comes to tech.

Absolutely – plus, it’s not as if anyone is able to reel off a list of inaccuracies in that review.

Mistakes do happen to the best of us – and in journalism, when there’s a mistake in a finished article, it may not be the writer’s fault but whoever subbed the article.

I also notice that the vast majority of the naysayer comments are from people who, as far as I can tell, have not yet actually seen the new iMac...

All par for the forum course.

 

[0racle]

This morning - power on and I hear a short burst of fan noise...then nothing... it tries to start again... a little fan and nothing... lather, rinse, repeat....

Had an xServe do this a few weeks ago. Logic board replacement (x2) finally fixed it. So you might be getting a new board in that new Mac.

 

[WannaGoMac]

Those performance figures are pretty good. But of course, there's no gaming tests. Not that I play games on Macs.

And isn't it a shame you can't?

I think Apple intentionally puts in subpar/average GPUs to discourage pc gamers. PC gamers want to tweak everything to get every last frame and squeeze performance out of their machines, and they would demand regularly updated graphics drivers which Apple has never done. Plus even if they put in a great card, in a couple years it will enviably suck for later games so people will complain about it not being upgradeable. Apple's whole philosophy is that you plug it in and everything works; no tweaking, no messing with the insides. Steve Jobs probably views PC games with all their different requirements and configurations as too much hassle.

What a shame. Gamers represent a nice market of constant upgrades. Apple could not only get more sales, but also lots of upgrade money even if they went with proprietary GPU boards for upgrading imacs/Macbooks etc. Then again, the way apple works they likely figure why sell an upgrade when you can sell a completely new system?

SO... I'm all excited and I bring my new 24" home and I unbox the wonder of aluminum and glossy glass... power it up and I get 8 (yes eight) startup chimes before it finally starts up. I make my way through the account set-up screens and as I'm beginning to play around with the machine... I notice it's REALLY SLOW - then I get the Software Update message that I need to update the software - no problem... I go through that OK... still, the machine is REALLY SLOW - so I power it down for the night. This morning - power on and I hear a short burst of fan noise...then nothing... it tries to start again... a little fan and nothing... lather, rinse, repeat....

I have an appointment at the Genius Bar tomorrow (couldn't get in today at a time that would fit my schedule).

(sigh)

What a shame.It is a good thing that Apple has such better quality than Dell/HP/whatever. Sorry, couldn't resist after reading so many times here how Apple stuff is expensive because the quality is so vastly superior

 

[notjustjay]

What a shame.It is a good thing that Apple has such better quality than Dell/HP/whatever. Sorry, couldn't resist after reading so many times here how Apple stuff is expensive because the quality is so vastly superior

Well, it's not like Apple has access to Magic Solder (tm) that never forms cold joints, or magical IC fabs that never turn out duds. In fact it's not like Apple has anything at all that the competition doesn't have -- they use the same parts, built in the same factories in China.

What they do, of course, is specify higher quality materials (a single piece of stamped aluminum?) and possibly have tighter tolerances which generally leads to better build quality, but failures can obviously still occur. Highlighting one of them, as above, should not be seen as a sign that Apple is better or worse than anyone else.

 

[ChrisA]

From those that have seen it, I have seen just as many "this is fantastic!" as "the glossy display is horrible!" so obviously it's very subjective.

Not so much "subjective". The display is acceptable or not depending on you intended use of the iMac. Porsche makes nice cars but if you need to haul around lumber and tools to a construction site they make useless cars. Same here. The glossy screens are designed for "media consummers", that is people who watch videos and play games and so on. They are horrible for "media producers" like photographers and editors. My gues is that Apple knows this and did it so that iMacs sales would not cannibalize Mac Pro sales. The pros simply can't use the glossy screen and are forced in the Mac Pro. Apple may have made the right call, after all very few people are doing serious work in photo or video editing or graphic arts. 99.9% are consumers not producers.

 

[Trout74]

Maybe Just Maybe.........

The GPU in this sucker stinks so bad is that there is something on the horizon...............like a gamming machine coming out soon???

eeehhhh.maybe?

Trout

 

[Yateball]

Great Early Review

That review is very well-written and informative and I think they hit it bang on.

I personally wouldn't be able to get past the glossy screen, and am more than content with my "last gen" iMac

 

[WannaGoMac]

Well, it's not like Apple has access to Magic Solder (tm) that never forms cold joints, or magical IC fabs that never turn out duds. In fact it's not like Apple has anything at all that the competition doesn't have -- they use the same parts, built in the same factories in China.

What they do, of course, is specify higher quality materials (a single piece of stamped aluminum?) and possibly have tighter tolerances which generally leads to better build quality, but failures can obviously still occur. Highlighting one of them, as above, should not be seen as a sign that Apple is better or worse than anyone else.

Agree 100%. That is exactly my point. Just funny how so many ignore these facts.

 

[UltraNurd]

Matte Screen

My friend who works as an Apple Genius just completed their training in alMac screen removal - the glass plate is held on by magnets in the bezel, and requires a suction cup tool and special clean gloves to remove and handle.

Given the magnets, it seems like it wouldn't be too hard for a 3rd-party manufacturer to make a standard matte plastic screen of the same size with magnets in the same position as a replacement option for people who don't do glossy.

 

[Headrush69]

The truth is more likely that their designers get more priority than their engineers, that the design direction of Apple tends towards the silent, and that the engineers don't quite have the skills of those at Sony or Dell.

Bingo!

Just looking at the cooling requirements between the HD 2600 Pro and the HD 2600 XT show that. The XT model has almost double the texture fill rate of the Pro so why did Apple choose that? Probably because the XT requires better cooling AND the video ram needs heat sinks, the Pro model doesn't.

Obviously the 2600 with all its video enhancements is aimed at a general home user, (aka not game player), apparently from the several articles I read trying to evaluate the 2600, newer games that can take advantage of shader 4 and the 120 streaming processing units will help balance out some of the current sub-par features of the card. (As benchmark using current games.)

I think I might have to hold out a little longer and see if the new iMacs are worth it after hearing some practical reports or save some money and pick up one of the previous models with a Nvidia video chip.

Edit:

These cards are obviously not geared to hardcore gamers, but at lower resolutions without high levels of AA and anisotropic filtering enabled they’ll be adequate for casual gaming. These cards are also well suited to HTPC applications where video playback performance and low-noise output are of the utmost importance.

If that doesn't describe an Apple iMac and it's market, I don't know what does.

 

[WannaGoMac]

Bingo!

I think I might have to hold out a little longer and see if the new iMacs are worth it after hearing some practical reports or save some money and pick up one of the previous models with a Nvidia video chip.

Edit:

I believe more and more that if you like computer games the most efficient way to own a Mac is to buy the Mac mini and a Windows PC. This way the two can share a single keyboard, monitor, and mouse.

 

[Maccus Aurelius]

What a shame.It is a good thing that Apple has such better quality than Dell/HP/whatever. Sorry, couldn't resist after reading so many times here how Apple stuff is expensive because the quality is so vastly superior

This reminds of the time my uncle's Ford Mustang broke down and a bunch of hicks drove by in a GMC pickup wooping and cheering that they saw a 'stang Found On Road Dead.

After dealing with HP's with crappy cooling fans, Dells with dying motherboards and Alienwares with failing keyboards I've come to the conclusion that computers suck.....out and out suck.

It's more or less a minor thing, but I notice that Apple isn't providing any third-party software freebies with this edition of the iMac.

Previous generations usually threw in a game and/or a few apps. The previous iMac gave you fully functional versions of Comic Life, OmniOutliner, and Big Bang board games, all free of charge. Nothing doing with the new iMac. It's iLife 08 and that's it. Kind of a bummer.

It could always be because of some new licensing of this software, but that is a bummer, as I use ComicLife often. I wonder if I can transfer it somehow from my Macbook. Probably not though :/

As for GPU's.......big woop. Maybe Apple will one day provide upgrades so you can also install your own clear case with neon strips and components with flame art printed on the casings, so it can look like a ricer custom while sitting on your desk.

 

[Headrush69]

I believe more and more that if you like computer games the most efficient way to own a Mac is to buy the Mac mini and a Windows PC. This way the two can share a single keyboard, monitor, and mouse.

Depends, on the games I suppose. For first person shooters which are the most predominant, the 7300 was sufficient

The test for me is the next UT, if it can't handle that, its not an iMac I can use. People will chime in "well, if you play games buy a Windows machine", but considering there is own two series of games I play, (RCT & UT), its not an easy toss up to sacrifice all others features of OS X for 2 games. (Yes, I know and have run OS X on PC hardware.)

Anyone see an review of the 2600 Pro that includes benchmarks without AA, Antistropic Filtering etc on? Every review seems to always have at least one of those on and generally they are a performance hit. Considering I never had them on past cards if performance is decent with those not enabled, it might be livable.

 

[plumosa]

whirring?

I have a 20" 2.4, and the hard drive seems to be fairly loud. The imac g5 I was using previously was silent.


anybody else notice this?






(in all other things I love, love, love my new imac!)

 

[jellomizer]

I think Apple intentionally puts in subpar/average GPUs to discourage pc gamers. PC gamers want to tweak everything to get every last frame and squeeze performance out of their machines, and they would demand regularly updated graphics drivers which Apple has never done. Plus even if they put in a great card, in a couple years it will enviably suck for later games so people will complain about it not being upgradeable. Apple's whole philosophy is that you plug it in and everything works; no tweaking, no messing with the insides. Steve Jobs probably views PC games with all their different requirements and configurations as too much hassle.

I think it would be simpler then that. High end Video Cards tend to give off more heat, bad for thin formfactor systems where all the components are as crammed togeter as it can get. Also there is geting good drivers to work with the OS. Those cards may have been top of the line or close to it when they started R&D the design and making the drivers for it. Having the latest greatest Video would require more time to perfect the drivers. Price besides gamers most people don't know or really care about their video card. Just as long as it can display graphics at or better then the resolution then the screen can provide and software doesn't barf at you because it is lacking a widly used feature.

Apple could make their iMacs top of the line best in everything but they will run $3000 - $5000 each. Then you will get those dell guys saying well I can get a system with the same processor speed for 1/10 the price.

 

[Headrush69]

In DX9 based benchmarks the Radeon HD 2600 Pro gets blow away by the NVidia 8600 GT.

Interesting, for DX10 based benchmarks, the 2600 Pro doubled the 8600 GTS. Of course its all academic as the test game, Call of Juarez, produces 10fps on the 2600 Pro, and 6fps on the 8600 GTS. Looks like DX10 is going to be the domain of only very high end gamers.
(Matters to Mac users as these are ported from that code base.)

(Benchmarks from 2600 HD Pro review at extremetech.com)

 

[JGowan]

SO... I'm all excited and I bring my new 24" home and I unbox the wonder of aluminum and glossy glass... power it up and I get 8 (yes eight) startup chimes before it finally starts up. I make my way through the account set-up screens and as I'm beginning to play around with the machine... I notice it's REALLY SLOW - then I get the Software Update message that I need to update the software - no problem... I go through that OK... still, the machine is REALLY SLOW - so I power it down for the night. This morning - power on and I hear a short burst of fan noise...then nothing... it tries to start again... a little fan and nothing... lather, rinse, repeat....

I have an appointment at the Genius Bar tomorrow (couldn't get in today at a time that would fit my schedule).

(sigh)

It's hard to take you seriously AT ALL when your NEGATIVE "reporting" is your absolute first and only post on this forum.... ever.

how would they add Blu-Ray later? I don't assume Apple is intending to make an Apple-branded Blu-Ray drive, is it? And they also didn't berate Apple for at least having a Blu-Ray drive as a CTO option on the 24" model...

You can bet that the first time we see Blu-Ray or HD-DVD in any Mac, it'll be in a Mac Pro.

 

[WannaGoMac]

This reminds of the time my uncle's Ford Mustang broke down and a bunch of hicks drove by in a GMC pickup wooping and cheering that they saw a 'stang Found On Road Dead.

After dealing with HP's with crappy cooling fans, Dells with dying motherboards and Alienwares with failing keyboards I've come to the conclusion that computers suck.....out and out suck.

Haha . So true. They ALL have problems, and when people say X is so much better than Y, it's so bogus.

Remember when computers were built well back in the 1980s? Those things were made from STEEL (and you paid for it). But wow those suckers took a beating and kept on ticking. it's not uncommon to find some of those 1980s beasts still in perfect working condition...

It's hard to take you seriously AT ALL when your NEGATIVE "reporting" is your absolute first and only post on this forum.... ever.

Very good point. Might not be true at all...

 

[DakotaGuy]

I think Apple intentionally puts in subpar/average GPUs to discourage pc gamers. PC gamers want to tweak everything to get every last frame and squeeze performance out of their machines, and they would demand regularly updated graphics drivers which Apple has never done. Plus even if they put in a great card, in a couple years it will enviably suck for later games so people will complain about it not being upgradeable. Apple's whole philosophy is that you plug it in and everything works; no tweaking, no messing with the insides. Steve Jobs probably views PC games with all their different requirements and configurations as too much hassle.

I am going to differ on your opinion here. I think the ONLY reason that Apple puts low-mid GPU's in the iMac is money. The less parts cost the more profit is made. If they did use high end graphics cards, then they would have to raise the price of the iMac to ensure the same amount of profit would be made. Higher prices would equal less sales. Think about it this way...if they can engineer a new computer that takes one less screw to build they can end up saving thousands a year. All corporate businesses work this way and Apple is no different.

 

[Maccus Aurelius]

It's hard to take you seriously AT ALL when your NEGATIVE "reporting" is your absolute first and only post on this forum.... ever.

I usually try to give people the benefit of the doubt when they post their bad news about their supposed purchase. The things I do find questionable are the comments on the software updates and the multiple chimes. I've only ever heard this when I installed a firmware update or reset the PMU. The last few updates I received were for iTunes and the Security update (and I think another), but this was well over a week ago. I would assume that any computers newly released after this would be preloaded with these updates as well. I could be wrong, but that's just what I think. Maybe they were just sitting in Apple's warehouse since last week and didn't receive them...who knows

You can bet that the first time we see Blu-Ray or HD-DVD in any Mac, it'll be in a Mac Pro.

Probably yes, because you can remove it *easily*. But I'd think that the first time you ever see a Blu-Ray disc in any mac at all is when the format wins and Toshiba abandons HD DVD, whenever the heck that is.

 

[Maccus Aurelius]

I guess he/she has never seen Sony's All-in-one system.

 

[JobsRules]

Nice review. The machines looks fast. Just need to see that glossy screen in the flesh to see if this is for me.

I hated the glossy MacBook screen when I saw it in an Apple store - it was reflecting everything. Then my wife got one and I never notice any bad reflections when i use it in a domestic environment or out and about, so I'll be fair on the iMac.

Ultimately, though, I don't need a freaking quad core Xeon mac pro, but Apple seem to want to make me spend 100s on overkill to have something that's reasonably configurable.

I think they should have made a sleek pizza-box design where internals were fully accessible and made cinema diplas that can optionally 'integrate' with that design. Then they could still claim it was an easy 'all in one' but allow you options.

It's hard to say Apple are good designers nowadays. They make form-over-function stuff similar to those retro-futurist plastic chairs that are horrible to sit on yet cost 500 quid.

 

[adom]

lol i laugh at those who diss the new imac and have not yet used it or seen it in real life. im using my new 2.4 20" right now, and i can say there is not one think i would change about it. its ace!

 

[sbarton]

from the article:

"Despite its new ATI Radeon HD 2600 Pro graphics chip, the iMac still isn't very well suited to playing 3D games. On our Quake 4 test, at a forgiving 1,024x768 resolution, the iMac turned in an only marginally acceptable 39 frames per second. We were surprised by that, since Quake 4 sits on the tail end of what we consider current 3D games. Comparable Windows PCs from Dell and Velocity Micro perform much better. You should be able to play less-advanced 3D games on the iMac, but we're still disappointed that Apple doesn't want to take gaming seriously."

And to add insult to injury they ran the test at 1024x768. The result for the iMac's native resolution would have been too embarrassing.

Also, why is it that anyone that wants to play a game on one of these things is all of a sudden a "gamer"?? Is playing 3D games occasionally now outside the expectations of a "home" computer??