Intel iBooks with Front Row?

[nagromme]

And I still think having MacBook and MacBook Pro could provide for some consumer confusion, but I guess it kinda makes sense.

It confuses us (me included--until I get used to it) but it's LESS confusing for the huge masses of people who don't even KNOW that a PowerBook and an iBook are in fact Macs. Accumulating mindshare for "Mac" is a good idea I think.

It also allows there to be more than just two laptop lines: you can then have multiple MacBook names, just like we have had the iPod nano, iPod shuffle, iPod mini, iPod photo... In fact, there might never be a "plain MacBook." The iBook replacement might have a two-part name.

For instance, maybe sometime there will be a Mac subnotebook--in some ways more powerful than an iBook/MacBook, in some ways less... smaller than an iBook/MacBook screen yet with the aluminum case of a MacBook Pro. What to call it? Use the consumer name or the pro name? With MacBook it's not an issue: they can use a third name if they wish. (MacBook Express, MacBook Nano, MacBook Madonna Special Edition, whatever). It's all still "MacBooks" and is still unified branding in peoples' minds. Which is something iBook and PowerBook did not achieve--they were separate from each other AND they were separate from the "Mac" name.

Off-tangent a little - is there a chance that iSight models would be banned in some places?

I'd say so, yes. A camera's a camera, and they're banned some places.

A lot of gyms ban the use of camera phones in the showers. Now you won't even be able to use your iBook in the shower

The Griffin iDuctTape will disable the camera if needed, though.

 

[asherman13]

This rumor is giving me doubts about ordering a MacBook Pro. The only reason I haven't gotten a new laptop yet (my HDD died on my G3 iBook) is because I wanted to read user opinions of the MBP. The iSight (and, I suppose, Front Row) is really important to me, since I'll be abroad next year and I can use it to talk to my family here at home (we already have an older iSight for talking with family elsewhere around the world). Now there are rumors about an i/Mac-Book with iSight and Front Row? I may have to wait a bit longer...

 

[nagromme]

This rumor is giving me doubts about ordering a MacBook Pro.

Waiting is ALWAYS a good idea with computers. You tend to get more power, lower cost, and more choices if you wait. Until you really need/want a machine, and until you're giving up things you want/need to be DOING with it. Then it's time to stop waiting

At the present, although the 15.4" MacBook is the ideal size for many (maybe most) people, I'm sure that waiting will reveal new options--in size AND price. For instance I'm waiting to see what kind of smaller Core Duo Mac Book comes out (if any). Then I can decide between that or waiting for a quad-Conroe tower.

 

[MrCrowbar]

iSight everywhere is nice. It'll be like cell phones: every one got a camera, but with iChat (and skype once they get video workinfg for OSX), it actually serves a purpose. Not to forget PhotoBooth

But I checked for the proce difference of the core solo and core duo. It's 20 bucks of difference for same frequency. Actually intel doesn't really make core solos. The available core solo is a duo where one of the chips is disabled afterwards. So productions costs are the same. (I've had a similar thing once when I vought a Athlon 800 for my PC and found out it was actually a 1000 MHz Model. With some tweaks I had it up to the native Speed on 1000 MHz.)

So I think the Macbooks will get the slowest Core Duo available (when it will be much cheeper) so Rosetta will run smoothly. At the same time as the MacBooks get the update, I think there will also be an upgrade on the Pro line with 17" (and I pray for a 12") model.

 

[nslyax]

With rumors of the iBook going to a single 13" widescreen model, and the 12" PowerBook being dropped, it would be possible to allow the "iMacBook" higher specs than possible over the last few years. The iBooks competed much more with the 12" PowerBook than the 15", so with the 12" out of the picture the iMacBook could have slightly higher specs without the risk of cannibalizing the Powerbook line. A CoreDuo seems possible, along with iSight and such, but extended monitors very unlikely. Video RAM I would probably say 64MB, to keep off the MacBook Pro's heels and keep price down some.

Just my $.02

 

[dongmin]

pricing will be interesting

The MB Pros start at $1999 which is pretty high. I doubt Apple will introduce the new 13" MacBooks at under $1000. That's one part of the AI report that just doesn't make sense. If the Superdrive is the only difference between the two models, then the price difference will only be a couple hundred bucks. So we'll have one at $1000, the superdrive version at $1200-1300, and the MB Pros at $2000??? Doesn't make much sense to me. Too much of a gap. I'm expecting at least three models to bridge the gap: $999, $1299, and $1599.

BTW, including iSight, IR remote, 1.67 ghz Core Solo, 13" widescreen LCD, and iLife '06 for $999 would be a hell of a deal.

 

[hayesk]

While I love iSights and want them built in to all Macs/displays over the course of 2006, I think that Apple should have other priorities for the iBook (MacBook). Which would you rather have: an iSight or 128MB of VRAM? Or a SuperDrive standard? or a brighter-higher res screen?

You could have all of those things.

 

[asherman13]

Off-tangent a little - is there a chance that iSight models would be banned in some places?

I've been in a number of places that force you to leave camera phones at the front desk, slightly smaller than an iBook, but same principle/risk. Perhaps a risk for MacBook Pro users, rather than the target audience of the iBook, although Schools have also banned camera devices in the past, due to mis-use.

I think there's a difference between camera phones and laptops with built-in iSight cameras. The laptop, due to the position of the iSight, directs the camera at and only at the user of the laptop, whereas camera phones usually only direct the camera outwards. I mean, it'll be pretty obvious if you're trying to get a picture of something inappropriate with a built-in iSight, right?

On another tangent...my ideal i/Mac-Book specs would be (this is what I would get, BTO):

+1.4Ghz Intel Core Solo
80GB HDD
512MB RAM, expandable to 1.5GB
13" Wider-screen (like 15.4 vs. 15.2)
built-in iSight and Front Row
64MB VRAM (I'd prefer more, but then I'd probably get a MBP)

for a price of: $1200 or so.

 

[asherman13]

Actually intel doesn't really make core solos. The available core solo is a duo where one of the chips is disabled afterwards. So productions costs are the same.

Does that mean that one could, with some tinkering, enable the other core? Hypothetically, of course...

BTW, including iSight, IR remote, 1.67 ghz Core Solo, 13" widescreen LCD, and iLife '06 for $999 would be a hell of a deal.

That would be nice...

 

[eXan]

They can keep the design, but make a better keyboard (like on PowerBooks, but in white would be nice).

Also include a nice GPU, like X1300 (I doubt they'll put X1800 in it )

 

[WillMak]

I don't think having an isight on a laptop will cause issues. Aren't restuarants and coffeeshops allowed to have cameras in their bathrooms?

 

[Eidorian]

Looks like I'll be getting a Rev. B MacBook Pro then...

I need my dual-core and VRAM.

 

[Legacy]

I still hope there is room for a 13" MacBook Pro at $1499..the MacBook should retain its $999/1299 price tag. Main drawbacks to this will be:

Intel Core SOLO processors
X1300 Chipset w/ 64Mb VRAM
Possibly retain CDRW/DVD Combi on the cheaper model
FrontRow ONLY with no iSight on any of the models
No Modem built-in, and despite rumours I'm still betting bye bye to firewire..

Advantages will be:

Old PowerBook quality displays (finally)
Retain Airport and Bluetooth
Better form-factor and newer software (iLife 06..dunno if its currently bundled with the iBooks)
Same Prices

The MacBook Pro 13" should come with a Duo Processor and iSight and 128Megs of VRAM (X1600 I think is too farfetched for a $1499 computer with a Core Duo and iSight built in)

Remeber folks, lets not dream..this is Apple they always seem to 'think different'...even to the consumer

 

[weg]

Hopefully, they'll use Core-Duo chips rather than the upcoming Core-Solo chips. Also, Apple should put a higher-rez screen and allow extended-video rather than just mirroring.

Of course they will. Why shouldn't Apple keep up the tradition to make the iBook faster and cheaper than the professional line (=McBook, nowadays)? ;-)

 

[Laser47]

Seriously, why does everyone say that the ibook wont have an iSight. I think an iSight would be more appropriate for a consumer laptop rather than a professional laptop.
Hmm if they keep the iBook name, although I seriously doubt it their ad campaign can be;
"iBook meet iSight" or something along those lines.

Oh I cant wait until they announce the new MacBook'

 

[MacinDoc]

The new iBook (MacBook) will almost certainly have a Core Solo processor, otherwise it will cannibalize MacBook Pro sales. Furthermore, the recent article which I believe was in Forbes about how much Apple is paying for the Core Duo implies that it is a very expensive chip (Probably more than twice as much as the G4 in the iBook), and putting it in an iBook would cut profit margins dramatically.

If Apple goes with the Core Solo, it will not be because of price - the price difference between the Core Solo and the Core Duo is less than 40 dollars. If it is the Core Solo, it will only be for reasons of heat and space.

More likely that the MBP will get a processor upgrade at the same time to differentiate it from the iBook (remember, the iMac is still the iMac, not iExpress or Mac Express). After all, Apple will now have to keep the MBP near the cutting edge of mobile technology, since it is easy to compare its hardware with that of other manufacturers.

I agree with Legacy that X1300 is a likely choice for video, although Intel's improved integrated graphics (ducks head to avoid flames) might also be an option and would help offset the additional cost of the Core processor.

That's my opinion, and I'm sticking with it.

 

[Eidorian]

Seriously, why does everyone say that the ibook wont have an iSight. I think an iSight would be more appropriate for a consumer laptop rather than a professional laptop.
Hmm if they keep the iBook name, although I seriously doubt it their ad campaign can be;
"iBook meet iSight" or something along those lines.

Oh I cant wait until they announce the new MacBook'

With the widescreen and processor update I wouldn't be surprised to see it called "iBook HD".

 

[Legacy]

If Apple goes with the Core Solo, it will not be because of price - the price difference between the Core Solo and the Core Duo is less than 40 dollars. If it is the Core Solo, it will only be for reasons of heat and space.

More likely that the MBP will get a processor upgrade at the same time to differentiate it from the iBook (remember, the iMac is still the iMac, not iExpress or Mac Express). After all, Apple will now have to keep the MBP near the cutting edge of mobile technology, since it is easy to compare its hardware with that of other manufacturers.

That's my opinion, and I'm sticking with it.

I think MacBook will be Solo for the reasons above and also the differentiation factor. Until MB Pro can use the Merom 64 bit processors (which wont be realistically available until Autumn), the Solo will be the only dif. between a consumer and pro laptop. When Merom comes out, Apple will bombard us with the 64bit transition in the MB Pro, which will allow the MacBook to go Intel Duo Yonah..seems logical to me..

On the point about the iSight being far more important at a consumer level. Yes that is a very true point and evidently a very good selling point for the current iMac range. However, since the ineffiency of IBM to deliver a portable G5 and indeed Freescales mediocre G4 offerings, the discrepancy between the iLine has grown so much that we are not at the stage of the iMac being better than the top of the range Mac Laptop (MacBook Pro)...I think the ideology of 'iMac to go' is long past its sell-by date.

If we are to see an iSight in the MacBook it HAS to be of a lower resolution, possible that of the original iSight. This should cut costs and allow some differentiation between the Consumer and Pro level. More importantly, it satisfies the consumer who wants a nice lil cam for webchats and on-the-go photos, while the consumer gets a better value camera for his money with higher resolution capabilities.

I think the most important thing here people is the reversible equilibrium the is Apple <===> Customer, both must be happy and satisfied. If the equilibrium is somewhat imbalanced (as is the case with the PowerBook range) you get problems from the consumer end. If it is imbalanced from Apple (ie very small profit margin), the company can't survive and invest in future developments..its a two way game

 

[Analog Kid]

Is Apple using Front Row as a way of pushing people to buy new machines? I've got a Dual G5 with a Cinema display that I use for DVDs in lieu of a TV-- Just rotate it 180º and watch from the couch which faces my desk. FR would be perfect for that. For now I get by with a bluetooth mouse.

I can't understand why they'd think FR is better put on a portable with a 13" display, lousy sound, and barely enough battery to get through a single DVD than it would be to make it available for their pro desktops.

The only hardware restriction I can think of is the receiver for that IR remote-- but Apple intentionally made the (bad) decision to not use BT for the remote. No reason they couldn't sell a USB IR receiver, though.

My worry is that they're starting to do what they do with the iPods. The next generation iPod is going to carry new software features. There's no technical reason why those features can't be made available to previous owners, but they aren't. Presumably that's to encourage people to upgrade... If they do that with their Macs, I'll be pretty pissed.

 

[MacinDoc]

I think MacBook will be Solo for the reasons above and also the differentiation factor. Until MB Pro can use the Merom 64 bit processors (which wont be realistically available until Autumn), the Solo will be the only dif. between a consumer and pro laptop. When Merom comes out, Apple will bombard us with the 64bit transition in the MB Pro, which will allow the MacBook to go Intel Duo Yonah..seems logical to me..

The Core Duo will have speed bumps before Merom comes out. This is Intel, not IBM or Freescale. And if Apple doesn't upgrade its pro chips when everyone else does, well, we know where Apple's sales will go.

The Griffin iDuctTape will disable the camera if needed, though.

ROFL

 

[Austin.xstone]

YaY!!!!

Finaly some news on the new ibook. Sounds cool.

Im still disipointed that it wasn't released at MWSF, but ohwell.

I hope it does have a Dual Core Chip - im suprised about the iSight though.

Does anyone know where they are going to be released?

 

[nagromme]

But I checked for the proce difference of the core solo and core duo. It's 20 bucks of difference for same frequency. Actually intel doesn't really make core solos. The available core solo is a duo where one of the chips is disabled afterwards. So productions costs are the same.

As I understand it, it's not that they necessarily disable a perfectly good core (although they could if Core Solo demand called for that), but that one core may have tested as a failure.

So Intel has ONE design, not two, being made--very smart and efficient! But a dual-core chip has a greater chance of being useless if one core tests bad. Why waste the chip? Intel has designed it so the bad core can be disabled and the remaining core used as a Core Solo. Core Solo is thus simply "rejected" Core Duos.

As for the small price difference--I don't doubt that, but I don't think it's that somple: by that reasoning NOBODY would use Core Solo. And yet they will, or else Intel will drop the price. If it makes sense for ANYONE to use Core Solo, it makes just as much sense for Apple. Even if the only savings is $20 to Apple ($30 to us?) plus whatever savings (money and/or space) results from needing less cooling.

So unless the Core Solo is a product priced so that NOBODY would use it, I think the low-end Apple laptops will. I'd love ALL Macs to be dual, despite having entry-level pricing... but don't hold your breath for it.

 

[Legacy]

The Core Duo will have speed bumps before Merom comes out. This is Intel, not IBM or Freescale. And if Apple doesn't upgrade its pro chips when everyone else does, well, we know where Apple's sales will go.

Yes but those speed bumps, I don't think can be a significant enough differentiating factor between the lines, although with the G4 that has largely been the case. How much faster is a 1.86Ghz Duo going to be from a 1.67Ghz (which will probs be the difference between the MacBook line and the entry MacBook Pro).

I don't know. I mean I would personally hope for the Duo for obvious reasons, but as I keep saying this is Apple. If a company goes far enough to seek 4200rpm drives in order to differentiate between a Pro and Consumer laptop, using Solo in preference to Duo (together with the fact that 40$ will help a company that will be on a very low profit margin with the adoption of the Intel processors) seems a very probable result to me.

 

[MacinDoc]

Yes but those speed bumps, I don't think can be a significant enough differentiating factor between the lines, although with the G4 that has largely been the case. How much faster is a 1.86Ghz Duo going to be from a 1.67Ghz (which will probs be the difference between the MacBook line and the entry MacBook Pro).

I don't know. I mean I would personally hope for the Duo for obvious reasons, but as I keep saying this is Apple. If a company goes far enough to seek 4200rpm drives in order to differentiate between a Pro and Consumer laptop, using Solo in preference to Duo (together with the fact that 40$ will help a company that will be on a very low profit margin with the adoption of the Intel processors) seems a very probable result to me.

MBP is already at 1.86 GHz, other notebooks are using the Core Duo 2 GHz chip, and Intel is already selling a Core Duo at 2.16 GHz. I suspect there will be at least a 2.33 GHz Core Duo (or even 2.5 GHz) available by the time the iBook is introduced in Q2, and there is certainly enough room between a 2.33 GHz Duo and a 1.66 GHz Duo. Of course, the display resolution, memory capacity, graphics and ports will also differentiate them.

 

[Natron]

I've been hoping Apple would put out a barebones laptop in the $600-$800 range. Maybe this is where the iBook is headed.

iBook - no iSight, no Front Row, single core, $799 and $999

MacBook - iSight, Front Row with remote, single core (maybe duo), $1299 and $1599

I'm not sure what the screen sizes would be in this configuration, though.

I could definitely see the iBook scaling down a bit to the Mac Mini's level. With such a basic computer, I just wonder how many people would need an iSight, or use it if they had it. I think that in the education market, especially, an iSight is not necessary.

Also, if it cuts the price down, I think cutting the iSight is a good idea.