Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Any steps to curb spam/scam/phishing is good in my book, and I'm glad Apple is taking steps. There are more and more spam emails escaping the filters of most mail providers like GMail and Outlook.
 
But how much will this cost? Will small companies be able to enroll in this scheme for mails sent to their customers? Will you need Apple's approval to send legit emails?
 
Gmail basically does that now. As of recently if a sender doesn’t have a good SPF record at the very least, the email is flagged. DKIM is preferred. Unfortunately DKIM adoption seems slow even now that SPF has finally caught on.

Between Google and Microsoft that’s 90% of (business) email, which is pretty close and as good as we can get in this duopoly system.

Unfortunately it seems like e-mail is fundamentally not designed for what we’ve made it into. Hard to believe that in the year 2022 communications are still so fragmented. I do like the federated nature but it seems it’s doomed to consolidation like everything else.
DKIM adoption is a good example why stuff like this should be an ISO standard rather than RFC which is more like a recommendation... Microsoft Exchange for example doesn't even support DKIM... If DKIM was part of an ISO Microsoft could not afford to ignore it. Back in the days RFCs were taken more seriously, but these days the big players rather try to push their propreitary solutions, ignoring RFCs (the boycott of IMAP IDLE would be a good example).
SPF and DKIM is as good as it gets when it comes to domain validation, i.e. that no other server is allowed to send an email from someone@macrumors.com. However domain validation does not prevent someone from setting up a look-alike domain, server and email showing up as someone@macrumos.com (missing the "r"). In order to prevent that you need organization validation, which involves the certificate authorities to perform a manual check of applicant, its domain and check if the applicants company actually exists or at the very least verifying the applicants identity. Naturally, that costs more than a simple domain validation certificate, but is very well affordable for everyone. Since no certificate authority in their right mind will issue an OV certificate for macrumos.com a sending server could not use that domain if OV certificates were mandatory.
As such, that would be by far the most simple approach to getting email fixed. Beyond that, it's not going get much better if we want to keep a decentralized infrastructure -which for me is a fundemantal principle of the internet -and centralizing or federating it under some big corporation is not an option.
 
  • Love
Reactions: CarAnalogy
Apple (or the IETF) needs to replace IMAP. It was written for another age, and it's way long in the tooth.

Basically, security needs to be baked in instead of security as an afterthought. Verified senders needs to be a part of the infrastructure. It's ok to have unverified senders, but they should be marked as-such.

These days, certs are free and processing power is cheap, so issuing everyone a cert and using them for validation shouldn't be as much of a burden as it was back in the day.
No we don't want Apple (or any other big company) to replace IMAP or SMTP or HTTP. Those are the last three major open protocols left that are widely supported, even by the monopolies in email (Microsoft and Google). We should be encouraging their use to keep the Internet open, rather then siloed. Do you want what happened to chat to happen to email? In the past there were open chat standards like XMPP, well just a few days ago Google shutdown Google Talk which supported XMPP, the last widely used chat service to support XMPP. Now you have to decide to use Facebook Chat, Google Chat, Skype, WhatsApps, LINE, etc etc.. all which are siloed and don't communicate with each other or can be run on-premise in your own datacenter. You know how annoying it is for me as a Android phone user when someone uses iMessage to send me something that is not supported in my normal SMS app. I wish Apple would support RCS.

You need to understand email is comparable to phone service (calls and SMS) in the sense it is a widely supported standard, due to it being long in the tooth. These standards are open where anyone can contact you. To deal with spam email or calls, the easy thing to do is only accept them from people on your whitelist you trust. This is how most chat networks work, only people that know you (such as have your phone number in their contacts) can see to add you, which is why you notice less spam.

SMTP already supports sender verification as already described in the forum using SPF and DKIM. The mail server just needs to enforce using it. I don't think they should be blocking email completely just because the SPF or DKIM fails (since many people misconfigure it), but it should cause the mail system to score the email so high it ends up in the spam folder. When it comes to phone calls, they are trying to implement STIR/SHAKEN to combat the same thing with phone calls when it comes to verification to combat spoofing.

Even with email verification it won't completely fix the spam issue since a lot of spam is verified. A lot of email is being sent from hacked email accounts, which will look like they are verified. This means that the root of the issue with this is login authentication. Things are already occurring to improve login authentication, but using a unique hard to guess password for your email account is a major first step. A major second step being MFA. In most instances users pick easy to guess passwords, and even worst reuse that password at other places. Once one of these other places gets hacked, they have your email password. Your email password should be treated like one of you most important passwords, since every service you sign up requires your email for communication, including for security purposes. Simple security practices can go a long way to resolving a lot of issues. If your system gets hacked by way of a virus, then you are completely compromised and nothing will really protect you at that point other then a virus program that can detect and block malicious activity occurring on your system due to the virus infection.

So no we don't want to replace those, we just want to improve them as what have been occurring over the years, such as with HTTP/1.1 moving to HTTP/2, and now HTTP/3, all of which still work in a web browser. Having alternatives is not a problem, but replacing what is already open and supported will just make things more siloed since most of the companies (Google, Microsoft, and Apple) making the decisions do it for their own interests.
 
This sounds like a step in the right direction against phishing, but not perfect because socially engineered hacks towards the companies could still entrap end users (as they would then correspond with end users using legitimate email addresses)
Most companies will quickly discover if a hacker is using their own email to send emails to trick end users. It could be a problem but do not let perfection be the enemy of good.
 
While I always welcome features that increase security or privacy, I don't think this will make much of a difference because inattentive or ignorant users are easily fooled by logo graphics attached by scammers to messages. Plus from a behavioral perspective, scammers rely on fear and greed emotions. The human fight-or-flight reflex means that red flags such as obviously bogus URLs, awful grammar, bizarre word choice, or a government agency asking for gift cards are all too often ignored or discounted.
This is a massive step in the right direction and will cause a LOT of scammers to think twice and have to try to think of new tactics which slows them down, in some cases even stop them.
 
Not a fan of BIMI because it's once again not a solution, but just another overly complex workaround to fixing a broken system.

If all mail-servers required and enfored an organization validated server certificate for inbound connections from other servers the amount of spoofed mails and junk would be reduced by 99+%. Unfortunately, no mail provider can do that alone...

If that was about to be required by law, there would be an instant adoption and the problem essentially solved.
Actually what you propose would not stop spoof emails one bit as security certificates can so EASILY be forged and faked.
 
I have just made it a point NOT to click links in my email. Regardless what the email is about, if I want to check the account it was supposedly sent from, I go to the web page manually. Takes just a few seconds of extra effort, and it buys me 100% peace of mind.
I've already been doing that for longer than most people are alive and they still think I am mad lol
 
  • Like
Reactions: lordofthereef
Unfortunately in order to support this, on top of an https domain and the required DNS records, you have to get a bespoke "verified mark certificate" that signs the logo. There are currently only two options, costing between $1000-1500 per year. Feels like a scam.

No, it is called business.
 
Unfortunately in order to support this, on top of an https domain and the required DNS records, you have to get a bespoke "verified mark certificate" that signs the logo. There are currently only two options, costing between $1000-1500 per year. Feels like a scam.

If the companies participating in this know the pros and cons and still sign up, it's not scam.
 
Actually what you propose would not stop spoof emails one bit as security certificates can so EASILY be forged and faked.
No they really can't... not sure if you may be confusing it with something else, but TLS OV Certificates are certainly not easily faked or forged. If they were, every HTTPS website would be insecure, which it isn't. The crypto is working.
 
Apple (or the IETF) needs to replace IMAP. It was written for another age, and it's way long in the tooth.

Basically, security needs to be baked in instead of security as an afterthought. Verified senders needs to be a part of the infrastructure. It's ok to have unverified senders, but they should be marked as-such.

These days, certs are free and processing power is cheap, so issuing everyone a cert and using them for validation shouldn't be as much of a burden as it was back in the day.
Well, IMAP has no much to do with this. It works well in displaying what was carried over SMTP in between mail servers. If anything, it is the SMTP protocol that should be reworked to include features you have mentioned - although many are already there as extensions (SPF, DKIM, DANE, MTA-STS), but there are so, so many broken and misconfigured system out in the wild, including from big players, it is close to impossible for this 40 year old protocol to evolve.

You can look at HTTP, for instance. We are already running HTTP3/QUIC, and yet, some sites still relies on HTTP/1.1 - not even HTTP/2… this tells something: if the interactive protocol has resistance, who wants to change what users don’t see?

Plus, IMAP was already replaced by HTTP in some scenarios. Take corporate Outlook, for instance.

Now, this is a two fold problem. Yes, certs are free and easily available, which makes spinning up false “secure” sites trivial. Which is one of the reasons BIMI requires a somewhat large investment on their unique certificate: average folks won’t be shelling a grand for an uncertain return scam and the risk of being identified, so to a point, this is where this service is, for now, slightly more trustworthy.
 
Most companies will quickly discover if a hacker is using their own email to send emails to trick end users. It could be a problem but do not let perfection be the enemy of good.
Not at all what I was trying to imply, I am always in support of progress!
 
this article is misleading and potentially harmful.
BIMI is not designed to combat email spoofing. in fact, they say so on their site (https://bimigroup.org/all-about-bimi/): "it is important to know that BIMI is not a security solution".
BIMI does not help users verify authenticity of emails. DMARC does.
BIMI was created for companies (brands) to push their logos in order to "enhance brand value", "improve email opens and clicks".
as for potential for abuse, what will stop a scammer to attach a (e.g.) Chase logo to their DMARCed domain? trademark law?
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.