IPAD GPS or NOT?

Discussion in 'iPad' started by Prynce, Apr 17, 2010.

  1. Prynce macrumors member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2008
    #1
    I know IPHONES and IPADS don't have real GPS receiver chips, so how can Apple get away from implying that IPAD users can use "Find My IPAD" feature if it don't have Cellular support?

    Excerpt from Mobile Me link on front page titles learn more:
    http://www.apple.com/mobileme/news/2010/04/setting-up-mobileme-on-ipad.html

    Setting Up MobileMe on iPad
    You can access your MobileMe mail, contacts, calendars, and bookmarks on iPad and use Find My iPad if it's missing.

    To set up MobileMe, follow these steps:

    On your iPad home screen tap Settings
    Tap Mail, Contacts, Calendars and check that Fetch New Data is set to Push
    Tap Add Account, choose MobileMe, and enter your account information
    Tap Next and turn on Mail, Contacts, Calendars, Bookmarks, and Find My iPad. Tap Save.

    Find My iPad will be available immediately (go to me.com/find to try it), and your other information will be available as soon as iPad finishes the initial over-the-air sync with MobileMe. If you haven't already, remember to also sync your Mac or PC with MobileMe.
     
  2. gwynne macrumors 68000

    gwynne

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2010
    #2
    It works if your ipad is awake and talking to a wifi network.
     
  3. drjsway macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2009
    #3
    iPhone 3g/3gs and iPad 3g have real GPS receiver chips. Also, you can find your iPad/iPhone by triangulating WiFi networks, which is a far better way. You can't get GPS signals indoors so GPS won't help you anyway unless you left your iPad in the park
     
  4. Tom G. macrumors 68000

    Tom G.

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2009
    Location:
    Champaign/Urbana Illinois
    #4
    It works on my WiFi only 16G iPad if it is on and connected to a WiFi hot spot. I can find my iPad from my iPhone.

    I'll admit I haven't tried it the other way around but can see not reason why it wouldn't work also.
     
  5. drjsway macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2009
    #5
    It doesn't need to be connected to a WiFi hotspot. As long as there are WiFi networks around you (which, unless you are living in a rural neighborhood, there will be) it'll work.
     
  6. /dev/toaster macrumors 68020

    /dev/toaster

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2006
    Location:
    San Francisco, CA
    #6
    WTF are you talking about ?! My iPhone 3GS does use GPS for positioning, it doesn't rely on tower triangulation.

    I just went to me.com, requested the location of my devices and both popped up within 20 seconds. In fact, the iPad showed up quicker.

    The iPad uses a system called skyhook. They have a massive database that shows the location of millions of access points. They have both the SSID and Mac address of the device. You do NOT need to be connected to the device in order to get this information. Although I am not 100% sure you can get the Mac address off a device without finishing the encryption handshake. But welp, looking at KisMac I see 2 unencrypted networks in close range. However, it will need to be connect to a known network in order to send this information back. Its not perfect by any means, but does work.

    There are 3 methods of location services the iPhone OS can do.

    - Tower triangulation
    - GPS
    - Skyhook
     
  7. Tom G. macrumors 68000

    Tom G.

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2009
    Location:
    Champaign/Urbana Illinois
    #7
    Just for giggles I decided to try to "find my iPhone" from my iPad. It worked fine and I successfully placed a message on it. So it does work both ways.

    I see no reason for your original question doubting the ability of the iPad to work with "Find my iPad."

    Adding a note: This experiment was actually three way as my iMac reported that the message I sent from my iPad to my iPhone was received. Isn't Mobile Me terrific?
     
  8. wovel macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2010
    Location:
    America(s)!
    #8
    Either you misspoke or are very confused. Iphones (3G and 3GS) and iPad (3G) do in fact have real GPS receivers. Assisted GPS means they use cell towers and wifi data to speed things up and when it can not receive GPS data. Assisted GPS is better than plain GPS not worse.

    Original iPhones use wifi and cell towers for location data and iPads use wifi hot spots for location data. I do not think the original iPhone works with find my iPhone and I do not know if the Wifi iPad works with find my iPad.
     
  9. Alrescha macrumors 68020

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2008
    #9
    In order for 'Find my Ipad' to work, the iPad must be connected to a WiFi network. For 'Find my iPad' to work it needs to talk to the iPad, hence the iPad must be on a network.

    A.
     
  10. Runt888 macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2008
    #10
    How does the iPad find itself without being connected to a network?
     
  11. avaloncourt macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2007
    #11
    I have the original and 3G iPhones here. Both can use Find my iPhone but the 3G is far better at it. The 3G nails the exact location easily. Without a Skyhook location the 2G just gives me a very broad location via cell tower locating. It's not very accurate and would put it in roughly a square mile+ area. Without a Skyhook location, about all it is good for would be to help you remember where you left your phone if you've been to several diverse places. If you were six different places in a couple of square miles Find my iPhone and the 2G aren't much help.
     
  12. Alrescha macrumors 68020

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2008
    #12
    Ummn.. it caches the entire Skyhook database? Ok, maybe not. :)

    A.
     
  13. Runt888 macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2008
    #13
    :) lol, not trying to trip you up, just wondering if everything I thought I knew about skyhook was wrong!
     
  14. avaloncourt macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2007
    #14
    Your explanation was very good right up to that one little item. Even with Skyhook referenced area, the iPad would need to connect to something so it could get the location information. That was the advantage the iPhone 2G had. It could see wifi hotspots and then poll Skyhook via edge for a location. Without the cell side it needs to get to Skyhook to look up the hotspots on a live Internet connection. Well written information otherwise though.
     
  15. MultiFinder17 macrumors 68000

    MultiFinder17

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2008
    Location:
    Tampa, Florida
    #15
    One of the interesting things that I've noticed about the wifi iPad is that it keeps its connection to the local wifi network alive even when asleep. This way, it can keep checking e-mail and whatnot while sleeping. This also, assuming that you're in range of a wifi network, allows Find My iPad to work fine with it - I used it yesterday when my roommate had hidden my iPad.
     
  16. Prynce thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2008
    #16
    Has anyone got a picture of the GPS Receiver chip in any IPHONE, because both Iphone and IPAD 3G descriptions say nothing about an actual chip, but only list assistive GPS therefore only implying that it uses only cell towers to coordinate its response. Just check the Apple website to verify this. Just curious, if you got links to a breakdown of a Iphone showing the GPS chip it would be appreciated.


    And as for WiFi location finding by mobileme, how the HECK does mobileme have a PERSONAL IP include someones personal address information included with the IP, ie for example a friends home wifi router? I sense a breach of privacy without warrants by ISP's if that is the indeed the case? Please elaborate how this is done so as to answer how a breach of privacy is avoided if what some say is the case of a IPAD being located by a WIFI network. I can see Commercial Networks having public address info.
     
  17. Prynce thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2008
    #17
    However, Skyhook should not have personal IP's and WiFi info, if so where do they get this information? Tower Triangulation is a given understanding for me. But no where does Apple indicate beyond that in its technical specs description such as a GPS receiver.
     
  18. illutionz macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2007
    Location:
    Rhode Island
    #18
    They do not use IP address to determine where you are. Skyhook people literary drove in a van around the country (and globe) and capture the information of your wireless network such as SSID and Mac Address.

    **************************: http://tinyurl.com/yd9k6tp

    http://www.skyhookwireless.com/howitworks/coverage.php
    and
    http://www.skyhookwireless.com/howitworks/
     
  19. avaloncourt macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2007
    #19
    You really need to learn how to use Google. The iPhone 3G chip and antenna connector as posted on ZDNet:

    [​IMG]

    The 3G and 3GS side-by-side showing the GPS chip placement slightly different between the two:

    [​IMG]

    Is that good enough for you? Yes, there's a real chip. There's pictures.
     
  20. TheMacBookPro macrumors 68020

    TheMacBookPro

    Joined:
    May 9, 2008
    #20
    Why does nobody ever understand what assisted GPS is?

    Assisted GPS= a real GPS chip+tower/WiFi triangulation to speed up the process.

    The WiFi iPad only has triangulation (which is why Apple's site does not say the WiFi version has GPS). The 3G iPad and both iPhone3G and 3GS have Assisted GPS.
     
  21. dejo Moderator

    dejo

    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2004
    Location:
    The Centennial State
    #21
    My iPad location accuracy is noticeably better than my iPod touch. It's eerily accurate. I could swear this thing has GPS.
     
  22. fraggot macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2009
    Location:
    Cox's Creek, KY
    #22
    A-GPS is real GPS, it's just ASSISTED by your cell network. If not the iPhone would probably take twice as long to find your position. Your phone already has a general idea of where you're at based cell tower triangulation, so when you tap the current location button it uses that information to find your location even faster.

    Hence, Assisted GPS
     
  23. Prynce thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2008
    #23
    Because its a new term, that may have been completely explained to you but never explained to common man or woman.
     
  24. Runt888 macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2008
    #24
    Skyhook is generally very accurate. I had the opportunity to watch a technical presentation by a couple of their engineers at a conference last week. Their self-healing location database is quite impressive, from a technical standpoint.

    So whenever you don't understand something, you post an outraged diatribe on a online forum instead of doing a little research to educate yourself? Welcome to MacRumors, you'll fit right in!:D
     
  25. rusty2192 macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2008
    Location:
    Kentucky
    #25
    A little research goes a long way

    But before not only starting a post, and then denying what everyone was already saying, it would be safe to assume that one would do a simple google search to inform himself.
     

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