slplss
macrumors 6502a
Impressive. I can’t see it on my own eyes or the 240fps iPhone 8 slow-mo. Are you keeping your mini?
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iPad mini iPad Mini 6 jelly scrolling
- Thread starter EHD80
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Mine is doing it in portrait mode, if I scroll down a page with lines on it like this forum The lines go wonky depending if you go up or down. Not great at and makes me feel dizzy! I hope it’s a software fix as the device is great apart from this.
I blame excessive amounts of Counter-Strike in the past 20 years 😛.
I want to keep the mini, but it is also very distracting while scrolling web pages the way I normally do. Then again I am not meant to use it for hours on end for web browsing. Hard choices…
Macintosh101
macrumors 6502a
Macintosh101
macrumors 6502a
Finally…
www.macrumors.com
iPad Mini 6 Users Complain of 'Jelly Scrolling' Issue in Portrait Orientation
Now that new iPad mini 6 owners have had a couple of days with Apple's latest redesigned tablet, some users are noticing an issue being referred to as "jelly scroll" when viewing the screen in portrait mode. The term refers to a noticeable effect when scrolling vertically through text-based...
www.macrumors.com
Macintosh101
macrumors 6502a
I‘ve no idea how authentic this info is, but this site claims that: “Apple has responded to complaints from iPad mini 6 users about quality issues with the tablet, which just went on sale last week. The Cupertino-based company said it is still investigating the situation and cannot yet say exactly what is causing the problem and when the situation will be corrected.”
gadgettendency.com
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sracer
macrumors G4
Obviously, without knowing the internals of the Mini 6 and Mini 5 it is impossible to know.
But these things I know...
- This issue is NOT due to a screen having a 60 Hz refresh rate
- This issue is NOT prevalent on other iPads in past or present
- People are already entrenching themselves into two extreme camps (spending a lot of time defending their position)
- If the root issue is software-based, Apple will release a fix
- If the root issue is hardware-based, Apple will deny, delay, defend
I believe that the root issue is not entirely software or hardware. I think it is a combination. The Mini 6 is a new form-factor. It isn't just a refreshed Mini 5. Although it has the same dpi density, the display panel is a different size and not simply using the panels from the Mini 5.
I suspect that Apple's engineers took the opportunity to tweak the design slightly (compared to the design of the Mini 5 panel) to reduce the cost of manufacturing. There may be some timing differences that need to be adjusted for in the drivers for the panel.
If this is true, then the question becomes, "can iPadOS be tweaked to completely overcome this issue?" If so, then the problem will be corrected with an iPadOS update. It may not be possible to completely eliminate the issue, so an iPadOS update might only reduce the effect.
I'll say it again... if a person's Mini 6 is exhibiting this symptom AND they're dissatisfied with it, then return the device for a refund...and don't question a person's intelligence if they aren't dissatisfied. I don't recommend exchanging it for another unit that may exhibit the same symptoms... or maybe it doesn't at the moment but then develop it later on (without knowing the root cause it might be possible).
If a person's Mini 6 is exhibiting this symptom AND it is not a problem for them, then be happy and enjoy your device... and don't try to minimize the issue to justify why it's not a problem for you.
Macintosh101
macrumors 6502a
Very good advice 👍🏼
One thing I’d say however, is that other iPads do exhibit this issue, just to a much less noticeable degree.
On my 12.9 iPP (M1), I see the same effect when I scroll in portrait, but its not as obvious.
Also, see this:
Macintosh101
macrumors 6502a
I think other screens can do this, the problem is how visible the issue is. On my Mini it is incriedbly visible and very jarring to experience.
ScanTheNavian
macrumors 6502
I was wondering whether I exaggerated the effect to myself so I went and tested another store's Mini, but it was as bad as I remembered. And a store worker saw it instantly when we talked about it.
I'll be keeping my order just in the hopes of Apple pulling off some software miracle in the coming weeks, but my hope is diminishing.
I'll be keeping my order just in the hopes of Apple pulling off some software miracle in the coming weeks, but my hope is diminishing.
sracer
macrumors G4
Your 12.9 iPP (M1) is also the latest gen for that form-factor and (if my theory is correct about a slightly tweaked panel design) that might be the cause... the lesser degree could be due to faster components. Jelly scrolling was NOT an issue with the previous generations of 12.9 iPad Pros.
Regarding that tweet and video, none of my iPhones ever exhibited this symptom... I'll admit though, the last iPhone I owned was the original iPhone SE... nor have I heard over the years by iPhone owners that this was an issue.
The bottom-line is... SOMETHING changed... and changed recently.
klasma
macrumors G4
Received my mini 6 today (Starlight 256 GB cellular, not that I think it matters), and the jelly effect is more jarring than I expected. I had hoped to not be susceptible to it, and to be able to ignore it even if I should notice it, but now when scrolling in portrait mode, horizontal lines and text are so slanted it's not funny. I can understand those who get nauseous from it. I also don't expect this to be fixable by software.
Otherwise the screen is significantly better (in particular brighter) than my mini 4. I'll probably return the mini 6 and get a mini 5 instead, as the trade-offs aren't worth the extra money. (More on that in the "Returning my iPad Mini 6" thread.)
Otherwise the screen is significantly better (in particular brighter) than my mini 4. I'll probably return the mini 6 and get a mini 5 instead, as the trade-offs aren't worth the extra money. (More on that in the "Returning my iPad Mini 6" thread.)
Macintosh101
macrumors 6502a
🤔 Very good point. I wonder if it could something to do with iPadOS 15. I’ve was running the beta build from when it was released in the summer.
I got the following Apple devices at home that I now tested and they all have jelly scrolling, Mini 5 in landscape (iPadOS 15), M1 iPad Pro 12.9” in portrait (iPadOS 15), 2020 iPad Pro 12.9” in portrait (iPadOS 14.8) and iPad Mini 6 in portrait (iPadOS 15), iPhone 12 in landscape (iOS 14.8), iPhone 12 Pro in landscape (iOS 14.8), iPhone 12 Pro Max in landscape (iOS 15). I bet I could set up the iPhone XS and XR as well and they would have it but they are reset at this time so I can’t be bothered. The 120 Hz devices have a lot less of it (which makes sense due to the screen being faster in general) and the iPhone screens are smaller so it isn’t as much of a bother.
From what I read about this over the weekend it definitely is an effect of how screens are updated hardware wise, I was aware of how they updated before but was not aware the delay could produce a noticeable effect. For some reason the iPad Mini 6 seems to have it a bit more noticeable than before, they might be able to reduce the effect in firmware but who knows. It could also just be an increased perceived effect based on knowing it is there, we didn’t notice it on previous devices because we didn’t go looking for it. Until I went looking for it on the Mini 6 I wouldn’t have noticed it but now it does bother me, unfortunately that is how we humans work.
I’d love to see some sort of objective measurement for the different iPads over the years. I already see some people strawman this issue as “fake controversy, all LCD displays have this”.
Well yeah, sure, but the question is: how much?
Well yeah, sure, but the question is: how much?
thadoggfather
macrumors P6
It rearing its head in portrait is a problem with orientation prioritization from apple’s side. The mini is marketed as being held in portrait mode. It’s perfect kindle size for articles and such
how intensely you see it with mini6 is the other issue, it’s jarring
you actively have to hunt for it in landscape with other devices to the point where that’s being analytical
..
decypher44
macrumors 68000
klasma
macrumors G4
What I think is happening is that the scan offset between the left and right edge of the screen is the same (for a given screen refresh frequency, e.g. 60 Hz) regardless of how wide the screen is. Hence the effect is more visible (the lines appear more slanted) the narrower the screen is (for a given scrolling speed). The mini 6 being particularly narrow in portrait mode, it becomes more visible there.
Maybe it also gets worse the taller the screen is in relation to the width. The mini 6 has the widest/tallest aspect ratio of all iPad screens.
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Macintosh101
macrumors 6502a
It's a bit counter-intuitive since that implies that a meter-wide screen has the same offset as a 5 cm-wide screen. If it's true, it would make me more convinced that the scan direction Apple has chosen was a mistake. But something tells me there are more variables than just refresh rate and width.
decypher44
macrumors 68000
Finally made it to the front page. Now with multiple sites putting in calls to Apple, something should emerge. If not a fix, then at least an explanation.
CrazyForCashews
macrumors 65816
Just saw this video now, this is a really good comparison to show the issue.
klasma
macrumors G4
I definitively think that the choice of scan direction was a mistake.
Regarding the intuition: The refresh scans the screen line by line, once per frame (e.g. once per 1/60th second). The fewer lines there are in the scan direction, the longer the time delta between one line an the next, and the more the underlying screen contents will have changed from one line to the next, in a scrolling scenario. On the old mini, there are 2048 lines in the scan direction, versus only 1488 lines on the mini 6. That by itself corresponds to a 37.6% increase in the effect.
EDIT: No, it’s not quadratic, both are the same effect. Fundamentally, refreshing the display takes (at most) 1/60 second, which defines how far the image contents has moved vertically between the scanning of the left and the right edge. That vertical amount remains the same regardless of how wide the screen is. But the narrower the screen, the more slant that vertical amount translates to. A possible second factor is the duration of the vertical blank, that is, the time between two refreshes. The shorter that time, the longer the actual refresh (because the sum of both is 1/60 second) and hence the larger the vertical offset. Conveivably the mini 6 could have a shorter time between refreshes than the old mini, increasing the slant.
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