iPad iPad Pro Going Back to MacBook Pro

[Kal Madda]

I played around with it a few times, but I always come back to my Macbook. I do a lot of command line work and programming, so the iPad is a non-starter for me.

It is a great consumption device , and I use it daily for playing youtube videos and podcasts...mostly youtube videos.

If you do a lot of command line work and programming, then I can totally understand why you’d prefer the Mac for that. 👍🏻. I tinker with some coding on my iPad, but I’ve never really used the command line on the Mac even when I was a Mac-primary user back in the day, so that doesn’t really impact my workflow. But yeah, for professional coding, I think a MacBook probably makes more sense just on the hardware front: built-in keyboard, larger display options, higher thermal envelope with active cooling and bigger chassis, higher performance options of M-Series chips etc. Though it does really depend on the type of coding, as I have a friend who uses an iPad for his web development work. 👍🏻

For me, I love the versatility of the iPad for my use case, and I prefer iPadOS for my workflow. 👍🏻🙂

 

[cjsuk]

Guess the iPad just isn't the device for you.

I’ve productively zoomed past many people who think the iPad is for them….

 

[cjsuk]

My MacBook is booted up once monthly. I’m a healthcare worker and all my work is done on my iPad, and consuming and reading medical journal articles and taking notes is much more pleasant on my iPad than on a laptop. I edit my raw photos on my iPad as well. I don’t edit video, I don’t code, I don’t work with spreadsheets. My bet is there are plenty of folks for whom the iPad is more than enough for their professional endeavors and whenever someone tries to minimize that utility case, it’s incredibly myopic in my estimation.

My ex wife was nearly killed by an input entry mistake on an iPad.

YMMV but precise repeatable work they should not be used for.

On the academic side my speciality is mathematics and it’s seen by some as a wonderful device. That is until you need to do some actual applied work rather than study at which point it becomes a chore. After writing on an iPad for 4 years I went back to paper and scan and use a Linux box for applied stuff. Same thing seems to be happening in a few areas (biochem and physics as well).

 

[Nikhil72]

While I’m sorry for your struggles, I’m sure no one has made a computing input error on a desktop or laptop before <s>. And handwritten charting and paper prescriptions have never been linked to medical errors.

The common ground in errors is not the tech tool; it’s the user, because it is a human centric field for now and for a long time.

 

[Kal Madda]

While I’m sorry for your struggles, I’m sure no one has made a computing input error on a desktop or laptop before <s>. And handwritten charting and paper prescriptions have never been linked to medical errors.

The common ground in errors is not the tech tool; it’s the user, because it is a human centric field for now and for a long time.

Exactly. 👍🏻. Input error is human error, it really doesn’t have anything to do with which computer you’re using. Especially when iPad’s can be used with keyboards essentially just like a laptop…

 

[cjsuk]

While I’m sorry for your struggles, I’m sure no one has made a computing input error on a desktop or laptop before <s>. And handwritten charting and paper prescriptions have never been linked to medical errors.

The common ground in errors is not the tech tool; it’s the user, because it is a human centric field for now and for a long time.

Nope this is completely and utterly wrong and it scares me you work in healthcare. It sounds like you're just capable of throwing everything at human error and shrugging. I suggest you go read some papers on adverse event modelling.

All errors are compounded. We went from freeeform notes to forms because information was inaccurately recorded or missing. We went from that to typed notes because people can't read handwriting and typed notes are considerably more accurate. We went from that to computers for efficiency and more flexible forms and the ability to maintain accountability through auditing. And now we have a singular regression typing on a touch screen and letting the machine infer what your meaning was.

The end game is the machine or the input methodology gets the blame for the decision, it's an "accident" or "human error".

That leads to people making the same mistakes over and over again because they are not held accountable as they should be. That is the people who choose the machine and the people who use the machine.

The are tools and the are bad tools which increase errors. The iPad is an incredibly bad tool. (so are iPhones I will add).

 

[cjsuk]

Exactly. 👍🏻. Input error is human error, it really doesn’t have anything to do with which computer you’re using. Especially when iPad’s can be used with keyboards essentially just like a laptop…

This is a faulty assertion. Just because they can does not mean they will be. You have to take the least common denominator of input. If you give 1000 people an iPad with a keyboard, x% will not use it and just poke the screen, y% will not have it set up properly (disable completion etc) etc. This is a compounded risk.

 

[Kal Madda]

This is a faulty assertion. Just because they can does not mean they will be. You have to take the least common denominator of input. If you give 1000 people an iPad with a keyboard, x% will not use it and just poke the screen, y% will not have it set up properly (disable completion etc) etc. This is a compounded risk.

It is you who are making the faulty assertions. And the fact of the matter is that input error is a result of human error regardless of the tech/computer being used. If someone fails to double check that what they typed in is correct, then that is on them. You assert that the on-screen keyboard somehow causes input errors, when it is the person typing who makes said errors, not the device. Someone could input the wrong data whether they’re handwriting it, typing it on a keyboard, or typing it on an on-screen keyboard. This isn’t inherent of one particular computer over another, it is inherent of human error…

Also, I never asserted that “all will use a keyboard with the iPad”, I merely poked a gaping hole in your faulty argument by pointing out that people can and do use a physical keyboard with an iPad just like a laptop. The poor argument you’re trying to make is completely irrelevant as many of the people using an iPad to replace a Mac are pairing keyboards with said iPads when they so desire or need to…

Furthermore, text completion is a thing on the Mac and other desktop systems as well, so pretending this is something relegated to only iPads is silly. Most such devices used in an industry manner (whether they be laptops, desktops, or tablets) will be managed by an IT department, and will have whatever settings and software deemed necessary or important by said IT department enabled…

You seem to think your subjective opinions are facts, but they are not. I respect your opinion, but it is merely that, an opinion, and nothing more…

 

[cjsuk]

It is you who are making the faulty assertions. And the fact of the matter is that input error is a result of human error regardless of the tech/computer being used. If someone fails to double check that what they typed in is correct, then that is on them. You assert that the on-screen keyboard somehow causes input errors, when it is the person typing who makes said errors, not the device. Someone could input the wrong data whether they’re handwriting it, typing it on a keyboard, or typing it on an on-screen keyboard. This isn’t inherent of one particular computer over another, it is inherent of human error…

Also, I never asserted that “all will use a keyboard with the iPad”, I merely poked a gaping hole in your faulty argument by pointing out that people can and do use a physical keyboard with an iPad just like a laptop. The poor argument you’re trying to make is completely irrelevant as many of the people using an iPad to replace a Mac are pairing keyboards with said iPads when they so desire or need to…

Furthermore, text completion is a thing on the Mac and other desktop systems as well, so pretending this is something relegated to only iPads is silly. Most such devices used in an industry manner (whether they be laptops, desktops, or tablets) will be managed by an IT department, and will have whatever settings and software deemed necessary or important by said IT department enabled…

You seem to think your subjective opinions are facts, but they are not. I respect your opinion, but it is merely that, an opinion, and nothing more…

Sorry but I know exactly what I am talking about here. I designed safety critical systems for many years. My expertise landed me in a position to design software to prototype and test interfaces for physical hardware. Hundreds of bits of it are flying around right now.

This isn't opinion, it's safety engineering.

And it's something the medical profession really need to start understanding due to the sheer number of high profile **** ups over the last decade. Especially ones that can be written off with zero post-mortem analysis as "human error" and then repeated again and again.

 

[cjsuk]

A. Faulty appeal to authority, which is a logical fallacy. And is completely unverifiable and has nothing to do with anything…. It’s irrelevant to the topic at hand…

When an Airbus falls on your head, call me.

B. It absolutely is your opinion and nothing more than that. Pretending it’s anything beyond that doesn’t make it so. And you clearly seem to not understand how IT departments manage devices in such applications…

Bingle bongle. That's as sensible as a reply i can muster to that one.

C. You have provided zero evidence for your claims that touchscreen keyboards are the only input method that cause input errors. And such a claim is absurd on its face… Input errors are a result of human error, not input device…

Lets get to the meat: you can't interpret my statement accurately. My statement is that touch screens have a higher input error rate than physical keyboards. That does not assign cause, merely state what the data presents.

And that is backed up by multiple studies and meta-analyses which one can Google and, I assume based on your superior knowledge thus use your academic access, to go and read the journals on rather than harangue me in the next reply about it then complain about it after.

Man this place is like Slashdot in the 90s sometimes.

Anyway, fin. I have wine to drink which is far more productive.

Edit: typo. Wine clearly working already!

 

[Woodstockie]

Did the same thing back in 2021 by getting a 13" iPad Pro with a Logitech keyboard and trackpad, but noticed I couldn't do the things I wanted, so reverted back to a MBP and use the iPad for entertainment or short travels for light work. Hesitated even with upgrading from ios18 to 26 because I like slideover. So, for me it only looses functionality instead of gaining.

 

[Nikhil72]

When an Airbus falls on your head, call me.



Bingle bongle. That's as sensible as a reply i can muster to that one.



Lets get to the meat: you can't interpret my statement accurately. My statement is that touch screens have a higher input error rate than physical keyboards. That does not assign cause, merely state what the data presents.

And that is backed up by multiple studies and meta-analyses which one can Google and, I assume based on your superior knowledge thus use your academic access, to go and read the journals on rather than harangue me in the next reply about it then complain about it after.

Man this place is like Slashdot in the 90s sometimes.

Anyway, fin. I have wine to drink which is far more productive.

Edit: typo. Wine clearly working already!

Out of curiosity what’s the statistic on the number of industry errors, say, in healthcare attributed to computer or touch inputs when taking into account the broad number of error free inputs for medical charting, prescription writing, etc? If a doctor sees 45 patients a day and inputs everything on their iPad, multiply by 5 days of that patient load, 48 weeks a year, times, say 5 doctors at a practice, how many critical errors might be occurring amidst those numbers that are attributed to charting errors from a touch based device? Are you suggesting everyone walk around with a laptop instead, and then pray tell how should someone be expected to see 40+ patients daily with the sluggishness of an antiquated input system where everything is Freeform text entry via laptop.

 

[dumastudetto]

I returned to Mac, but only as a means to safely and securely backup all my iCloud and device data locally. Almost all my work is done on iPad Pro M5 (both 11" and 13" models).

So I got the entry level Mac Mini with 16GB+256GB. How I set it up was destroy the internal drive macOS installation (Tahoe installer kept failing when there was an active internal drive installation), connect a 4TB USB-C drive and installed Tahoe on it. This allows me to easily keep a synced copy of the entire contents of my iCloud Drive, which in turn can then be backed up to multiple drives, versioned, rotated, sent to offsite storage etc.

macOS is the only way to easily access some data you may want to backup. macOS can also, sometimes, give you extra troubleshooting abilities if something goes wrong (almost never happens with Apple).

Performance is absolutely fine using an external T7 Shield. I can barely tell the difference from the internal SSD and for my needs its the sweet solution.

 

[cjsuk]

Out of curiosity what’s the statistic on the number of industry errors, say, in healthcare attributed to computer or touch inputs when taking into account the broad number of error free inputs for medical charting, prescription writing, etc? If a doctor sees 45 patients a day and inputs everything on their iPad, multiply by 5 days of that patient load, 48 weeks a year, times, say 5 doctors at a practice, how many critical errors might be occurring amidst those numbers that are attributed to charting errors from a touch based device? Are you suggesting everyone walk around with a laptop instead, and then pray tell how should someone be expected to see 40+ patients daily with the sluggishness of an antiquated input system where everything is Freeform text entry via laptop.

Well there's a lot to break down in that statement, most of which needs to be considered separately. But it should start by posing a question and a proper research project being designed around it. And that should be done before adopting the technology blindly and hoping the hell it is going to work or trusting the vendor's claims.

I'd encourage people to do that here as well before spending lots of money on an iPad and expecting it to be a laptop replacement.

Some antiquated input systems work really well

Until someone comes along and says they made a better one which isn't.

 

[Meedoss]

The problem people took issue with in that thread (myself included), was that you were speaking as if your opinion/experience were universal truth, as if it were the only “correct” opinion. It isn’t.

Well if things don't work like I pointed out they don't, not my opinion it's fact.

 

[Kal Madda]

Well if things don't work like I pointed out they don't, not my opinion it's fact.

They do work, it’s just your opinion they don’t “work well”… 🤦🏼‍♂️

 

[cjsuk]

They do work, it’s just your opinion they don’t “work well”… 🤦🏼‍♂️

That thought process is what Boeing was trying to get away with...

 

[Meedoss]

You seem to think your subjective opinions are facts, but they are not. I respect your opinion, but it is merely that, an opinion, and nothing more…

This seems to be your standard answer to anyone that disagrees with you.

 

[Kal Madda]

When an Airbus falls on your head, call me.



Bingle bongle. That's as sensible as a reply i can muster to that one.



Lets get to the meat: you can't interpret my statement accurately. My statement is that touch screens have a higher input error rate than physical keyboards. That does not assign cause, merely state what the data presents.

And that is backed up by multiple studies and meta-analyses which one can Google and, I assume based on your superior knowledge thus use your academic access, to go and read the journals on rather than harangue me in the next reply about it then complain about it after.

Man this place is like Slashdot in the 90s sometimes.

Anyway, fin. I have wine to drink which is far more productive.

Edit: typo. Wine clearly working already!

A. So basically more completely irrelevant commentary that does nothing to forward you argument, but why should I be surprised?

B. Seems consistent with the rigor of the rest of your argument. Your subjective opinions aren’t facts…

C. You haven’t cited a shred of “data” to support such claims that iPad’s have any significantly higher rate of input errors than any other method of inputting data… Input errors are the result of human error, it doesn’t really matter what input method or computer the humans use to input the data, they can still make errors… If someone inputs the wrong data and fails to correct it, that is entirely a matter of human error, not the device they used to input said data…

D. And I never claimed to have “superior knowledge”, it is you who are making that claim with faulty appeals to your own claimed “authority” on the issue…

 

[Kal Madda]

This seems to be your standard answer to anyone that disagrees with you.

No, just my response to people who repeatedly act as if their subjective opinion on a matter of subjective opinion and personal preferences/needs is the only “correct” one…

 

[Bungaree.Chubbins]

The are tools and the are bad tools which increase errors. The iPad is an incredibly bad tool. (so are iPhones I will add).

That’s an awfully universal statement for a situational position. iPads are incredibly bad tools? So graphic designers shouldn’t use them? Artists? I’m a draftsman, and using an iPad as an ancillary device REDUCES my errors.

The iPad seems to be quite useful for “an incredibly bad tool”.

 

[cjsuk]

That’s an awfully universal statement for a situational position. iPads are incredibly bad tools? So graphic designers shouldn’t use them? Artists? I’m a draftsman, and using an iPad as an ancillary device REDUCES my errors.

The iPad seems to be quite useful for “an incredibly bad tool”.

In context to a laptop replacement. Which is what the thread is about.

Your use case, fine!

 

[Bungaree.Chubbins]

In context to a laptop replacement. Which is what the thread is about.

Your use case, fine!

Even so, an upgraded iPad would probably see my laptop operating as a desktop replacement, as I would rarely ever need it away from my desk.

No one is claiming that the use cases for an iPad instead of a laptop are all encompassing, there are a great many people and situations where an iPad is not the right tool, but there are plenty where it is. The way my business is developing, the ideal setup for me would be a Mac Studio and a 13” iPad.

This statement is not aimed at you at all, nor at the OP and likeminded people who tried the iPad as a replacement and didn’t like it, but it’s always amusing when people try to interrupt people doing a thing to tell them that doing that thing is impossible.

[edit: removed early morning typos]

 

[Abydos]

I think you are dealing with the Mordor complex here, even Sauron needed orcs and goblins (maybe more clever ones would have been more useful)

 

[Bungaree.Chubbins]

I think you are dealing with the Mordor complex here, even Sauron needed orcs and goblins (maybe more clever ones would have been more useful)

I think that’s an inevitable path online discussion takes these days, here and everywhere.