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Iphone 5S Verizon Data & Voice Simultaneous?

D

DaNiBuZ

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Any word on whether or not the Verizon 5S (I know they are identical phones) will offer simultaneous voice and data? Searched around but could not find anything definitive either which way.

Edit: Posted in the wrong forum, mods please move.
 
DaNiBuZ said:
Any word on whether or not the Verizon 5S (I know they are identical phones) will offer simultaneous voice and data? Searched around but could not find anything definitive either which way.
Click to expand...

I don't think Verizon updated their network yet. It would have made the news.
 
DaNiBuZ said:
Any word on whether or not the Verizon 5S (I know they are identical phones) will offer simultaneous voice and data? Searched around but could not find anything definitive either which way.
Click to expand...

The answer would be no. Verizon and Sprint are both CDMA and cannot do voice and data at the same time. It doesn't matter the phone. GSM carriers like AT&T can.
 
Armen said:
The answer would be no. Verizon and Sprint are both CDMA and cannot do voice and data at the same time. It doesn't matter the phone. GSM carriers like AT&T can.
Click to expand...

Actually the technology exists and Verizon has stated that they will upgrade their network to make it happen.

http://www.gottabemobile.com/2013/01/25/verizon-iphone-5s-browse-and-talk-at-same-time/
The good news is that Verizon is working in bringing a new network technology online. VoLTE uses a single antenna in the phone to send voice over 4G LTE, and it is capable of voice and data at the same time.

Verizon confirmed to Gotta Be Mobile that VoLTE will be enabled later in 2013, for a full launch in 2014.
Click to expand...
 
Armen said:
The answer would be no. Verizon and Sprint are both CDMA and cannot do voice and data at the same time. It doesn't matter the phone. GSM carriers like AT&T can.
Click to expand...

It has nothing to do with this. Most LTE phones can on Verizon because they use separate radios for CDMA and LTE. The iPhone 5 was notable because unlike older LTE phones on Verizon, it used one radio and could not handle this.
 
Mengels7 said:
It has nothing to do with this. Most LTE phones can on Verizon because they use separate radios for CDMA and LTE. The iPhone 5 was notable because unlike older LTE phones on Verizon, it used one radio and could not handle this.
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That's news to me. Thanks for the correction.
 
Mengels7 said:
It has nothing to do with this. Most LTE phones can on Verizon because they use separate radios for CDMA and LTE. The iPhone 5 was notable because unlike older LTE phones on Verizon, it used one radio and could not handle this.
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So I guess the question is whether or not the 5S (and/or 5C) might change that.
 
Armen said:
That's news to me. Thanks for the correction.
Click to expand...

But you are correct about CDMA not being able to do that. Well...they actually have since found a way around it. I know the HTC Thunderbolt, despite it being an LTE device, could actually do voice and data simultaneously over EVDO. I'm not sure why whatever they did to make that work isn't yet a standard on Verizon/Sprint but it sounds like it isn't far off.
 
Mengels7 said:
But you are correct about CDMA not being able to do that. Well...they actually have since found a way around it. I know the HTC Thunderbolt, despite it being an LTE device, could actually do voice and data simultaneously over EVDO. I'm not sure why whatever they did to make that work isn't yet a standard on Verizon/Sprint but it sounds like it isn't far off.
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure most LTE phones use dual radios.

LTE is a GSM standard, but hasn't been implemented to have voice yet. On AT&T when on a voice call your using HSPA for voice and data. On verizon or sprint iPhones you are using Edge for voice which doesn't support data.

Non-Apple phones on Verizon and Sprint work around this by running two radios at once, one for LTE and one for Voice.

It's not clear yet if Apple changes this with iPhone 5S but I don't think they did. I can't think of a single LTE phone the size of the iPhone, and don't think there's enough wiggle room to implement the change.

I could be wrong but from what I understand the antenna has to be set up differently to do it. Because apple uses the metal enclosure as part of the antenna design, and the baseband is monitoring the signal across the antennas to deal with signal attenuation from holding it, there isn't the room for dual simultaneous support.

I'm sure someone smarter then me will interject and prove me wrong though.
 
vigilant said:
I'm pretty sure most LTE phones use dual radios.

LTE is a GSM standard, but hasn't been implemented to have voice yet. On AT&T when on a voice call your using HSPA for voice and data. On verizon or sprint iPhones you are using Edge for voice which doesn't support data.

Non-Apple phones on Verizon and Sprint work around this by running two radios at once, one for LTE and one for Voice.

It's not clear yet if Apple changes this with iPhone 5S but I don't think they did. I can't think of a single LTE phone the size of the iPhone, and don't think there's enough wiggle room to implement the change.

I could be wrong but from what I understand the antenna has to be set up differently to do it. Because apple uses the metal enclosure as part of the antenna design, and the baseband is monitoring the signal across the antennas to deal with signal attenuation from holding it, there isn't the room for dual simultaneous support.

I'm sure someone smarter then me will interject and prove me wrong though.
Click to expand...

LTE is based off GSM/UMTS. UMTS actually encompasses wideband CDMA (WCDMA).
 
Verizon needs to roll out VoIP/LTE (voice over LTE) to do this it has nothing to do with the iPhone specs or baseband chip.
 
vigilant said:
I'm pretty sure most LTE phones use dual radios.
Click to expand...

I know, that was my point on an older post. The last one was about how the HTC Thunderbolt not only let you have the whole dual radio LTE/CDMA bit going on, but also voice and data over 3G only with SVDO. The HTC Evo 4G LTE also did it, and possibly some others.

----------
apollo1444 said:
Verizon needs to roll out VoIP/LTE (voice over LTE) to do this it has nothing to do with the iPhone specs or baseband chip.
Click to expand...

Well yeah, that would work too.
 
vigilant said:
I'm pretty sure most LTE phones use dual radios.

LTE is a GSM standard, but hasn't been implemented to have voice yet. On AT&T when on a voice call your using HSPA for voice and data. On verizon or sprint iPhones you are using Edge for voice which doesn't support data.

Non-Apple phones on Verizon and Sprint work around this by running two radios at once, one for LTE and one for Voice.

It's not clear yet if Apple changes this with iPhone 5S but I don't think they did. I can't think of a single LTE phone the size of the iPhone, and don't think there's enough wiggle room to implement the change.

I could be wrong but from what I understand the antenna has to be set up differently to do it. Because apple uses the metal enclosure as part of the antenna design, and the baseband is monitoring the signal across the antennas to deal with signal attenuation from holding it, there isn't the room for dual simultaneous support.

I'm sure someone smarter then me will interject and prove me wrong though.
Click to expand...
Its actually 1x that is used for voice on CDMA (rather than EDGE which is for GSM). But yeah the basic thing comes down to radios: if there's ate separate ones for LTE and CDMA then voice and data can happen simultaneously, otherwise it won't work (as is the case with iPhone 5).
 
Lancespahr said:
The iPhone 5s uses one model for AT&T, Verizon, and T-Mobile, so why can it not use simultaneous voice and data? 😕
Click to expand...

because they use different network technologies.

ATT/Tmo is gsm
VZW is CDMA

As others have said, without dual radios you cannot get voice and data simultaneously on VZW. If you are at home on wifi, you can use data and voice though.
 
Lancespahr said:
The iPhone 5s uses one model for AT&T, Verizon, and T-Mobile, so why can it not use simultaneous voice and data? 😕
Click to expand...
Hardware for now. It's there, it just needs the hardware or VZW needs to go to VoIP/LTE.

mrapplegate said:
I don't think Verizon updated their network yet. It would have made the news.
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Nope. But still, some phones do it on the current network.
Armen said:
The answer would be no. Verizon and Sprint are both CDMA and cannot do voice and data at the same time. It doesn't matter the phone. GSM carriers like AT&T can.
Click to expand...
Wrong. Some phones on VZW are capable of using voice/data at the same time. Nexus, HTC, etc.

apollo1444 said:
Verizon needs to roll out VoIP/LTE (voice over LTE) to do this it has nothing to do with the iPhone specs or baseband chip.
Click to expand...
Yes it does. At least with the iPhones. Either they need to include the necessary hardware or do the upgrade like you said.
 
So if Verizon upgrades their network to VoIP/LTE then the 5s will be able to have simultaneous voice and data or no?
 
Lancespahr said:
The iPhone 5s uses one model for AT&T, Verizon, and T-Mobile, so why can it not use simultaneous voice and data? 😕
Click to expand...
From what I've read numerous times, it was a design choice by Apple to keep the phone thinner and also a way to save battery life. The radio they use in iPhone 5 (and probably 5s/5c as well) only works in either CDMA or LTE mode. So when you get a phone call on Verizon or Sprint, it switches to CDMA mode until the call is over, meaning you can't use data.

Verizon is allegedly working on deploying VoLTE that will finally allow simultaneous voice and data. Not sure if iPhone 5/5s/5c hardware actually supports it though.
 
Tyler23 said:
No, the issue isn't with Verizon's network. It's the phone.
Click to expand...

It's both.

Currently the iPhone 5S can't do D&V because unlike the other devices, the iPhone 5S only has one radio for CDMA and LTE, whereas devices like the Samsung Galaxy S4 have one radio for CDMA (Talk) and one radio for LTE (Data).

Once Verizon upgrades their network to VoLTE, which allows you to use LTE as your Talk connection AND your Data connection, the iPhone 5S (and IIRC, the iPhone 5 as well) will be able to do simultaneous voice and data.

Apple has already made it clear they aren't going to switch to a dual-radio system, meaning the only way we'll see D&V on Verizon/Sprint/Virgin Mobile/other CDMA networks is if they all support VoLTE.

Personally I think VoLTE is the better solution, as one radio for LTE is more efficient and costs less than having to include 2 radios.
 
The amount of outdated info in this thread is pretty surprising. You do not need two different radio chips to do voice and data on CDMA. The single chip in the iPhone 5/5C/5S is more than capable of handling it.

Not being able to do voice and data simultaneously is a purposeful design decision by Apple. LTE requires a two antenna diversity setup. In order to use voice at the same time you need a third antenna. That is true if you use one radio chip or two (like in the old Android phones). The problem is that the iPhone 5/5C/5S only have two cellular antennas. When voice is active, both are in use for Apples dual antenna diversity.

The only reason it works for AT&T and TMobile (and other GSM providers) is that the protocol is already built in to the HSPA spec. Of course, VoLTE will fix this problem regardless. That's still another year or so away for Verizon. They're trailing now, I believe.

Anyone interested in a more thorough technical explanation of the antenna setup and the the design choices impact how it works should check out Brian Klug's article from the iPhone 5 launch that covers this very topic. It is unchanged for the iPhone 5C/5S.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6295/...ous-voice-and-lte-or-evdo-svlte-svdo-support-
 
Last edited:
Keep in mind even GSM LTE models cant do voice and LTE data. It will drop back to their 3G network. Regardless you can't blame that on Verizon.

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Instead of creating a new topic, I'd thought I post here.

Will an unlocked verizon cdma 5S being used with Tmobile or AT&T be able to have simultaneous voice and data then?

It looks like the 5S has the same exact radios with both GSM and CDMA 5S but the CDMA one just has the extra CDMA network.
 
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