It's possible the lack of Band 12 might be a restriction set forth by the FCC.
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iPhone 6 LTE Bands
- Thread starter nateo200
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So what's the best bet for China?
Please excuse in advance the newbie-ish question. I read this thread carefully and you guys know a lot more about this than I do.
I want to buy an iPhone 6 here in the US for a friend in China. I'm going there on a business trip in 3 weeks. Now that the iPhone is delayed in China, it seems like a nice thing to do.
However, from reading up, my impression is that the unlocked phone I can buy here in the US relatively easily (ie, T Mobile version) will NOT work on the newest, fastest networks in China.
I have a US-bought unlocked 5s which I use frequently in China on China Unicom and I get 4G service there when it is available. I guess the competing China Mobile now has LTE available too but I've never seen LTE pop up on my phone in China. Looking at Apple's LTE page I don't see China Unicom listed, so maybe they don't have LTE at all.
So it seems that in order to have access to the fastest networks in China, the best thing to do is either try to buy in Hong Kong, or wait until it is available in China itself. Right?
Please excuse in advance the newbie-ish question. I read this thread carefully and you guys know a lot more about this than I do.
I want to buy an iPhone 6 here in the US for a friend in China. I'm going there on a business trip in 3 weeks. Now that the iPhone is delayed in China, it seems like a nice thing to do.
However, from reading up, my impression is that the unlocked phone I can buy here in the US relatively easily (ie, T Mobile version) will NOT work on the newest, fastest networks in China.
I have a US-bought unlocked 5s which I use frequently in China on China Unicom and I get 4G service there when it is available. I guess the competing China Mobile now has LTE available too but I've never seen LTE pop up on my phone in China. Looking at Apple's LTE page I don't see China Unicom listed, so maybe they don't have LTE at all.
So it seems that in order to have access to the fastest networks in China, the best thing to do is either try to buy in Hong Kong, or wait until it is available in China itself. Right?
So I can hypothetically use my iPhone 6 (at&t) on Verizon and it will still work? Once its unlocked that is...
Not likely...if anything the FCC would be practically begging Apple to include Band 12 because the FCC is really cracking the whip on wireless providers getting and staying competitive....Band 12 would have made the iPhone 6 a billion times easier for carriers like US Cellular and T-Mobile who do or will have Band 12 LTE networks in places they don't even have GSM.
Not likely...I mean once VoLTE works for Verizon it could work on LTE only but thats if Verizon "allows" the device on their network and they are extremely stingy about that but that might change.
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China Unicom DOES have LTE, Band 41 which is TD-LTE....so you need the international version that supports all the TD-LTE bands along with TD-SCDMA support for it to work properly on other carriers. China Unicom is the only network that runs a standard 3G WCDMA network so any iPhone with 3G will work on China Unicom's 3G network but not the case on the other networks and for LTE you need TD-LTE Bands 41, 40, 38, and 39. I would just wait since its unlikely they will sell the international version unlocked in the US, on the 5S you had to buy the US AT&T/T-Mobile model for unlocked use, you could not buy the Euro-Asia model with TD-LTE support. Hong Kong would be a safe bet provided its released soon.
Alright, thanks for the confirmation. That makes sense. 3G works fine with my 5s in China (in my earlier note I guess I was mistaken... I wrote that I have had 4G service in China on my unlocked T Mobile 5s, but I must be wrong about that), but I'll probably wait and get one in Hong Kong for my friend in China. Better to have the latest network on a phone they'll probably have for two years or more.
I do remember a few years ago when I switched from China Mobile 2G (before there was a China Mobile specific iPhone) to China Unicom 3G the difference was night and day -- 2G was so slow as to be useless, 3G wasn't amazing but was perfectly usable for email and maps the stuff I use.
I remember that the original at&t iPhone 5 only supported LTE band 4/17 and then it was later updated to support LTE bands 2/4/5/17 when T-Mobile came out. Maybe apple will have some sort of similar update later on when T-Mobile officially announces Band 12 markets?
To my understanding, band 12 can't be deployed in a lot of places due to interference with broadcast tv channel 51, so apple may be waiting until all of those broadcasters vacate the channel before pushing an update to allow band 12. Band 12 is simply a superset of existing band 17, so it shouldn't really be any more than a baseband/software update to the iPhones.
To my understanding, band 12 can't be deployed in a lot of places due to interference with broadcast tv channel 51, so apple may be waiting until all of those broadcasters vacate the channel before pushing an update to allow band 12. Band 12 is simply a superset of existing band 17, so it shouldn't really be any more than a baseband/software update to the iPhones.
IPhone 6 LTE bands
So I purchased an iPhone 6 plus tmobile. I called apple and they said its unlocked with a tmobile sim inside. I want to use it over seas in Hong Kong but i have no clue if the LTE bandwidth will work. Someone enlighten me about the frequency and band? Thanks. If you can figure if the Tmobile will support HK LTE will be great.
So I purchased an iPhone 6 plus tmobile. I called apple and they said its unlocked with a tmobile sim inside. I want to use it over seas in Hong Kong but i have no clue if the LTE bandwidth will work. Someone enlighten me about the frequency and band? Thanks. If you can figure if the Tmobile will support HK LTE will be great.
Yes, the new hardware was the addition of AWS UMTS/HSPA. But band 4 (AWS) was already present on the day 1 at&t phones. Band 2/5 were excluded from product packaging, but was found to be there according to FCC documents. I was talking about the software update they pushed to enable these two bands. I don't even know if the bands were enabled in a software update or were they present day 1? I don't know, because at&t only operated band 4/17 networks at the time. It wasn't until 2013, they deployed LTE over band 5 in locations they did not have pre-existing band 17 licenses, and late 2013/early 2014 they started refarming PCS to support band 2.
I have a day 1 iPhone 5, and I've confirmed with field test mode that my iPhone does in fact connect to band 2 LTE periodically if not on band 17. I've seen band 4 in other cities, but have yet to see band 5, at&t's unicorn LTE band.
T-Mobile and AT&T call HSPA+ "4G" while most other HSPA+ providers do not, its really 3G so if you had a T-Mobile phone their it was probably reporting their 3G HSPA+ network as "4G". It should say "LTE" if you connected to LTE for 90%~ of providers on the planet
It will work, but not with TD-LTE but in Hong Kong they run LTE on regular LTE Band 3 1800MHz and Band 7 2600MHz along with 3G on 2100, 900, and 850. Again heres a link for you to confirm: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_LTE_networks#Asia
Band 5 is Cellular 850, currently used for GSM and 3G. Only places AT&T currently uses Band 5 is parts of Illinois and the mid-west where they have zero band 17 licenses (like you said) so they run a sliver of LTE on 850 (Band 5) next to HSPA+ and GSM/GPRS. You won't see every band in every location but as AT&T starts refarming more spectrum for LTE you might see 850 (B5) LTE in more places on bigger slices. Band 5 and Band 17 both offer better indoor coverage and range so I would definitely prefer to be on Band 5 or 17 over 4 or 2 in rural areas. Band 5 isn't unicorn though, 850 is used by quite a large number of 3G providers and LTE providers now.
As for the "update" well it was not a software/firmware update as many T-Mobile customers using unlocked AT&T iPhone 5's had hoped it would be, the LTE chipset did support the bands and the FCC would have easily approved a firmware update but Apple simply decided to start selling the current AT&T iPhone 5 with the bands enabled without any software updates for the older handsets.
If Band 12 can be activated with a simple update (I pray so) will the lower frequency theoretically solve T-Mobile's problems with building penetration?
I mean, when there's maybe a 2 bar LTE signal, just putting my phone in my pocket will kick me over to EDGE a lot of the time.
Indeed it will! Of course thats provided T-Mobile has Band 12 700MHz licenses in the areas.....Heres a map of what they already own, and what they have pending (imminent purchase just waiting for the paper work pretty much): http://tmonews.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/tmo700big-660x510.jpg Its nothing like Verizon or AT&T but its going to do a ton.
EDIT: Heres an article about T-Mobile scooping up even more 700MHz as of late, it includes a similar map but with even more spectrum being bought in the California and Nevada area as well as some additional buys in the PA/MD/Delaware area as well as ALL of Alaska!
http://www.fiercewireless.com/story/t-mobile-looks-scoop-more-700-mhz-spectrum-triad/2014-09-29
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Sweet, thanks. Yeah, I'm in Northern California so this is awesome. Of course, we'll have to see if Band 12 support is hidden/locked inside of the 6.
Do you have any links to where T-Mobile has future plans for towers? My home happens to be in a dark pit of coverage. It's frustrating.
I wouldn't hold out too much hope that Band 12 is hidden/locked in the 6 because there'd be no reason for Apple not to advertise that the phone supports LTE band 12 from the start, regardless of whether it's presently in use or not. The iPhone 5/T-Mobile case is a little different because at the time of the 5's original release, T-Mobile wasn't a support carrier.
A few recent phone releases compatible with T-Mobile, like the 2014 Moto X, explicitly support band 12 in the documentation, so it's not like T-Mobile is asking OEM's to not document band 12 support.
It's a damn shame, though.
I just don't get it. I love my unlimited data but putting my phone in my pocket drops me to edge if I'm not careful. That's simply ridiculous.
Nah I wish I had a list. I barely get HSPA+ at my home and putting my phone in my pocket drops to EDGE every time! :/ All I know is T-Mobile is upgrading cell sites VERY aggressively on the east coast and upper mid-west. In Ohio and Indiana they jammed LTE on multiple cell sites that only had GPRS in relatively rural areas just to get better coverage on I-90. They are working very fast and the past year they have rolled out LTE faster than most of the other carriers so they are a pony I'd be willing to bet on. I'm not in their Band 12 area but I suspect they will make the purchase for my area relatively soon since its a very large piece covering some major metro areas where I live. Even though I just bought the iPhone 6 on verizon I'm bummed about no Band 12 support, I really like T-Mobile. I'll probably grab a mobile hotspot with Band 12 support when it comes out. I believe the Baltimore-DC Metro area will be first to 700MHz if its not already up...after that its going to spread like wild fire.
Wow, thanks for all the info. Yeah, I'm overall very pleased with T-Mobile aside from the common complaints that it appears Band 12 would address. I seriously just don't get why Band 12 would be included as standard. Is it a conspiracy by AT&T? Are there weird sort of technical concerns about including it? It's strange to me there's not more people out there really making this an issue, especially if it's something that T-Mobile, america's fastest growing wireless company is investing its future in.
I don't get it. Apple includes every other 700MHz variant, and they even went out of their way to make a model that's more or less exclusive to the US and Canada (A1549 and A1522). You'd think they could have included band 12 on that second model
See my post below. There are many tech sites that have raised the issue, fierce wireless is one that is always keeping track of this kind of very nerdy stuff haha. I frequent there allot so allot of that rubs off on me.
EDIT: Heres an article about T-Mobile scooping up even more 700MHz as of late, it includes a similar map but with even more spectrum being bought in the California and Nevada area as well as some additional buys in the PA/MD/Delaware area as well as ALL of Alaska!
http://www.fiercewireless.com/story/t-mobile-looks-scoop-more-700-mhz-spectrum-triad/2014-09-29
I honestly don't understand Apple's reasons for making the different models for LTE of the iPhone 6 at this point....the Sprint iPhone 6 could run on EVERY single carrier but they go and make the Verizon iPhone 6 the same except with 0 TD-LTE bands! Come on...And the addition of Band 12 would have been so easy. Basically AT&T and Motorola made a big stink about how Band 12 would be a massive issue due to interference from the existing incumbent TV broadcasters who are broadcasting on the upper part of 600MHz in the range thousands and thousands of watts; think around 3kW's to 25kW's for "low power TV broadcasts" and 45kW's to 300+kilowatts for full power or higher power TV broadcasts....just to put that into perspective a typical basestation is not even going to touch 100watts.....so the concern was valid...when near those TV broadcast antennas but they have exclusion zones of like 90-200 miles or something like that and regardless all those TV broadcasters must stop using the spectrum relatively soon so the issue is no big deal. If a device can support band 12 then it can support band 17 so its not some complex issue, in fact Band 17 transceivers are basically band 12 transceivers but with extra filtering on the low end to block the signals from TV and at the same time Band 12 in the future....Band 12 is being used by so many small carriers so its almost prejudicial against small carriers in general and not just T-Mobile. The fact that they can not only support Band 13/17 but Band 28 as well pretty much tells me that omitting Band 12 was either a calculated decision or just pure laziness somewhat like how the Verizon and AT&T iPhone 6 do not have TD-LTE bands...it just seams like a calculated decision to discriminate against the little guys and hinder roaming ability in the future.
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