iPod iPod Lawsuit Settled

[whooleytoo]

Once a company has settled a class action suit in the U.S., is winning a nearly identical class action suit in another country as easy as it sounds?

I actually don't really know. Common law (which British and Irish, and I think US law is based upon) means a precedent would have been set by the ruling in this case which should help in similar suits in the future. However, since it's in an entirely different jurisdiction, I doubt it would be taken into consideration.

In any case, I don't even know if it'll go to court, IMO Europeans tend to be less litigious, whereas the EU governments seem to be more so (perhaps a difference in 'culture' between the EU and US?). I seem to recall this being even debated in the UK parliament a while back.

 

[puckhead193]

i can't seem to find my original reciete for my ipod. I did however in Aug. of 03 bring it into a apple store because it decided not to sync any more. anyway.. it ended up with me getting a new 3g ipod. I have the paperwork from that, is that good enough for the reciete or do i need to have the original. I called the stupid number and a recording of the same stuff that's on the website....
Thank for your help

 

[MontyZ]

If you did not buy the iPod new, then you do not have a valid claim. A person who received an iPod as a gift is not the original owner, they are the second or third owner. The purchaser of the iPod is the original owner.

How exactly do you define "owner"? Under your logic, if I purchase something with a credit card, the credit card company is the actual owner because they in fact paid for it first.

 

[sacear]

i can't seem to find my original reciete for my ipod. I did however in Aug. of 03 bring it into a apple store because it decided not to sync any more. anyway.. it ended up with me getting a new 3g ipod. I have the paperwork from that, is that good enough for the reciete or do i need to have the original. I called the stupid number and a recording of the same stuff that's on the website....
Thank for your help

The battery is still good on your 3G iPod then right? You are getting over four hours of use between each recharge right?

Please read the settlement statement.

 

[aegisdesign]

This is why the only stocks I have are ones I've inherited.

I think the problem is more that the battery dies (of course it will) and Apple made it a bi*** to try and replace, and did not offer a replacement program when this was started. They told people to just buy a new one after the battery died in under 2 years.

This isn't true.

Apple launched their battery replacement program on November 14th 2003. The furore didn't happen till the ipoddirtysecret.com site went live a week later. The class action suit didn't start till 23rd December 2003.

Source: http://www.ipodbatteryfaq.com/#18 and http://homepage.mac.com/techedgeezine/122303_ipod_classaction1.htm

 

[aegisdesign]

I actually don't really know. Common law (which British and Irish, and I think US law is based upon) means a precedent would have been set by the ruling in this case which should help in similar suits in the future. However, since it's in an entirely different jurisdiction, I doubt it would be taken into consideration.

There is no ruling. It was settled out of court with Apple admitting no fault. Presumably Apple thought it cheaper to settle out of court and offer $50 vouchers to placate the claimants.

 

[sacear]

credit card loan

How exactly do you define "owner"? Under your logic, if I purchase something with a credit card, the credit card company is the actual owner because they in fact paid for it first.

I see where you are trying to take this, and that seems true theoretically, yet that is not how credit cards work. Credit cards and charge cards do not work like mortgages and vehicle loans.

Credit cards are where you have credits (an amount of money on deposit) already established and set aside and then you make purchases using up that credit. Charge cards are where the loan company gives you a virtual amount of credits (a credit limit) and then gives you the money to make the purchase at the moment of the purchase up to your credit limit, you make a "charge" towards your credit limit. Similar to someone handing you cash while at the check-out register. The card company does not make the purchase, they simply loan you the money to make the purchase. The product you purchase is not held as collateral, as a house or car is with bank loans.

With credit cards you make purchases using your own money. With charge cards, "you" actually purchase the product, not the card company, you are simply using borrowed money to do so. Same as borrowing cash from someone to make the purchase. The charge card company does not care what you are buying, they just want the monthly payment. Where as a bank that gives you a loan for a house or a vehicle does care what you are buying, in case you default and they have to re-sell that item themselves.

Now if you borrow money from a pawn shop or a loan shark, then they probably do care what you are buying, because more then likely they will end up having to re-sell that item themselves.

 

[puckhead193]

The battery is still good on your 3G iPod then right? You are getting over four hours of use between each recharge right?

Please read the settlement statement.

Also my battery is experiencing "failure" or else why would i bother with this, just for $50.....i'm not like that...
The number is the exact same thing as the website... their is no human to talk to. They read the F.A.Q......

 

[vaka]

If an ipod was purchased Easter of '04 in Florida but the owner is from the UK, are they still entitled for the battery replacement?

 

[sacear]

If an ipod was purchased Easter of '04 in Florida but the owner is from the UK, are they still entitled for the battery replacement?

Apple most likely does not care where we are from or what our nationalities are.

 

[MontyZ]

The card company does not make the purchase, they simply loan you the money to make the purchase.

And my parents gave me the money to buy an iPod using their credit card. It was shipped directly to me, not to them. I own it, they paid for it. Are you telling me that if an iPod is given as a gift, Apple won't honor the warranty because I didn't actually pay for it? I don't think so.

 

[sacear]

And my parents gave me the money to buy an iPod using their credit card. It was shipped directly to me, not to them. I own it, they paid for it. Are you telling me that if an iPod is given as a gift, Apple won't honor the warranty because I didn't actually pay for it?

No, just the opposite.

 

[tangerineyum]

well now i have questions...

i have a 3g thats just beginning to fail, but i also have a 4 year best buy warranty. Do i submit the claim, or use the warranty? I can live with the shorter charge times because ive been using my shuffle more and more. But i would also like to get an airport express or isight. And on my receipt it shows i have a purchased warranty, will that affect my ability for receiving the voucher? if i went that route.

 

[sacear]

i have a 3g thats just beginning to fail, but i also have a 4 year best buy warranty. Do i submit the claim, or use the warranty? I can live with the shorter charge times because ive been using my shuffle more and more. But i would also like to get an airport express or isight. And on my receipt it shows i have a purchased warranty, will that affect my ability for receiving the voucher? if i went that route.

IMO, Apple probably does not care that you bought the Best Buy warranty (although they would have preferred you bought Apple Care 🙂 ), and that should not affect a claim for iPod battery replacement voucher. Submitting a claim to Apple for a failing 3G iPod battery probably does not negate your Best Buy warranty. Each is separate, one is a warranty and one is a settlement award. That's how I see it.

 

[whooleytoo]

There is no ruling. It was settled out of court with Apple admitting no fault. Presumably Apple thought it cheaper to settle out of court and offer $50 vouchers to placate the claimants.

Ah, mea culpa. Thanks.

 

[rt_brained]

Hmm... I actually agree with you, but I'm still going to get a $50 coupon to put toward a new iMac.

Here's how I see it:

* Replacement 2100 mAh battery from OWC - $40
* Coupon from Apple - $50

I'm still a whopping $10 ahead. HOWEVER, since I've already budgeted for the new battery from OWC next month I would have spent this money regardless of the lawsuit settlement. So, I look at it as a free $50 from Apple for buying one of their products.

I confess that my 2G iPod still gets between 2-3 hours of play-time (which would be expected with an ageing LiOn battery), but hey, OWC's replacement battery will get me 15+ and add to the overall lifetime of my product - so I want it. It will keep my iPod out of the trash for at least several more years, and I can recycle its old battery at Walgreens.

Yeah, I'm taking the money and running, but I've come up with a slick, morally-slippery justification for it. 😉

Fair enough.

By the way, I called the White House today and confronted the President with the sentiments from your signature about Iraq and Guantánamo. You know, "Stop the War on Iraq. Shut Down Guantánamo NOW." I let him know that you feel the war is unjust and that claims about WMD were just an excuse for he and his friends to get rich off Iraq's oil.

The President, perhaps humbled by your high standard of morality, was surprisingly forthcoming. He said, "Yeah, we're taking the money and running, but we've come up with a slick, morally-slippery justification for it."

 

[rt_brained]

If you did not buy the iPod new, then you do not have a valid claim. A person who received an iPod as a gift is not the original owner, they are the second or third owner. The purchaser of the iPod is the original owner.

Correct.

How exactly do you define "owner"? Under your logic, if I purchase something with a credit card, the credit card company is the actual owner because they in fact paid for it first.

The same way we all define "owner". The contract is between the original buyer and Apple, not the "giftee". The "giftee" has no right to a claim beyond the product's warranty. Technically (or morally), as a "giftee", you should have zero expectations about your gift — and an obligation to be thankful for the kind gesture. If the iPod lasts just one day and dies, then you should be grateful for the joy your FREE iPod provided you for that day.

Unless of course, you feel you are owed better, longer-lasting gifts.

[By the way... I wasn't supposed to say anything, but the iPod actually was in perfect condition when it left the store. Your aunt accidentally dropped it down a flight of stairs when she got home and didn't notice any damage... so she didn't figure it was worth mentioning.]

 

[rt_brained]

Ok, i've read 3 of these pages, and haven't seen the answer i'm looking for.

So, I've got a 3G ipod bought in june of '03. My battery is fine, but i'm running out of space and could use the extra gigs. Would i be able to get a new ipod if i sent it in? I'm thinking no, but does anyone know FOR SURE?

Otherwise, i fill out a form and get a $50 rebate?

Boy, you're in luck. I called the Apple store and they agree that you could use the extra gigs and...geez, you're not gonna believe this...they're thinking 60 gigs of extra space and a COLOR LCD SCREEN!

And judging from that dolly they were wheeling out, I know someone who's also gonna need to make space for all of that extra music on their BRAND NEW DUAL 2.3 GHz TOWER!

 

[rt_brained]

How is transferring the warranty different? The manufacturer is still liable to repair any defects during the covered time. Who owns it is completely irrelivent (sic) from that standpoint.

<banging head against wall>Right... which is why I mentioned that specifically as a caveat to my argument. The caveat was the part you were supposed to ignore. You actually answered your own question and completely ignored the point I was making (i.e., that MOST used electronic devices are sold to second-hand buyers "as-is" after the basic or extended warranties have expired, leaving the buyer zero rights to warranty claims if the used equiptment fails).

So? WHat's your point? The amount of reward definately (sic) is LESS than the cost of having Apple replace the battery, or the price of a new iPod, but that doesn't seem to matter. The fact that you bought the iPod from another party doesn't change the fact that Apple advertised the device to have certain characteristics, and then when it failed to deliver on that they did not offer to replace or repair the equipment.

You're absolutely wrong on your point as stated. Apple has no clue how the original buyer treated the equiptment prior to selling it to you. If the original owner was negligent in the way they charged/discharged the iPod's battery, resulting in an iPod that only works for 10 minutes per charge and they decide to sell the f'd-up iPod to you at a discounted price, then what is Apple liable for? Apple advertised the product to have certain characteristics when sold NEW from the factory. You didn't buy the second-hand iPod from Apple, you bought it from a private party. However, if Apple knowingly sold defective iPods and/or failed to adequately describe proper charging/discharging proceedures, then Apple would be liable to whomever currently owns the f'd-up iPod.

The advertising for the iPod effects (sic) all iPods sold, not just new ones.

Oh god I hope you're right, because I noticed those new iPod commercials show color LCD screens, yet mine is still stuck in black & white mode. If it doesn't change to color soon, I'm gonna demand a refund.

The availablity of this reward (sic) is going to make older iPods to maintain a minimum level of value.

Sure...provided every iPod owner is aware of the iPod's used value relative to the award.

WHO CARES if someone managed to buy a ton of iPods and get $50 each for them from Apple? They are intent on paying the $50 for that iPod, what does it matter who gets it?

Perhaps you should consider practicing law. And then perhaps you should consider practing law for Apple and promote that kind of free enterprise while helping sign all of those award checks. And later perhaps you would consider why Steve Jobs called you, "The worst lawyer Apple ever had."

...if I am reading it correctly, excludes anyone who recieved the iPod as a gift. They didn't buy the iPod AND currently own it, so they aren't eligable. That's complete bunk. They are the original owner, and they have just as much right to be part of the settlement as customers who happened to have bought them direct from Apple or another reseller.

If someone else bought it and gave it away as a gift, then the "giftee" is the second owner, not the original owner. Original "USER" perhaps, but not the original owner.

 

[MontyZ]

The "giftee" has no right to a claim beyond the product's warranty. Technically (or morally), as a "giftee", you should have zero expectations about your gift

Morally?? I see, so, if I buy a car for my son and it stops working after a week, he should just be glad it worked for a week and have zero expectations of it ever working again?

That's just a crock of crap. You're just making this stuff up now.

 

[FoxyKaye]

Fair enough.

By the way, I called the White House today and confronted the President with the sentiments from your signature about Iraq and Guantánamo. You know, "Stop the War on Iraq. Shut Down Guantánamo NOW." I let him know that you feel the war is unjust and that claims about WMD were just an excuse for he and his friends to get rich off Iraq's oil.

The President, perhaps humbled by your high standard of morality, was surprisingly forthcoming. He said, "Yeah, we're taking the money and running, but we've come up with a slick, morally-slippery justification for it."

Well, there you go, I learned it from our Fearless Leader. Never said I wasn't being a hypocrite. I think the Weather Underground had some great ideas, too, but you can't say what they were doing wasn't morally slippery either.

<off topic>You raise a good point though, aside from the fact that everything is shades of grey: our endless war won't be ending anytime soon, Guantánamo is our country's latest incarnation of Japanese detention, and Bush and his family are going to walk out of 2008 richer than Bill Gates. I might have agreed with you once, but nowadays $50 from Apple is $50 from Apple.</offtopic>

Incidentally, I filled out the claim form for my 2G today - I actually opted for the $25 cash option since it seemed from the information on the settlement site that the delivery of the settlement could happen some time between now and "whenever the court ratifies the decision and time for appeals has expired" - which to me impies another year or more.

[Edit]: Oh and in case you're wondering, the last time I checked, no-one filing claim forms for their iPods were also sending people into a desert with guns to collect them.

 

[razorcool]

Alright, I received my claim letter in the mail today from Apple (same as the form online) and I'm wondering: I bought a new 40 gig, 3rd gen ipod from Apple during the right time. If I go for the battery/replacement and they can't replace the battery and give me another ipod. What kind of ipod is this going to be? ie. what gen, what size, photo or no photo?

 

[sacear]

Fair enough.

By the way, I called the White House today and confronted the President with the sentiments from your signature about Iraq and Guantánamo. You know, "Stop the War on Iraq. Shut Down Guantánamo NOW." I let him know that you feel the war is unjust and that claims about WMD were just an excuse for he and his friends to get rich off Iraq's oil.

The President, perhaps humbled by your high standard of morality, was surprisingly forthcoming. He said, "Yeah, we're taking the money and running, but we've come up with a slick, morally-slippery justification for it."

Oh, rt_brained, good catch on that! That is awesome. Can anyone spell hypocrite?

Also, your other comments above are all spot on the mark! Good job. Here, here!

 

[sacear]

Alright, I received my claim letter in the mail today from Apple (same as the form online) and I'm wondering: I bought a new 40 gig, 3rd gen ipod from Apple during the right time. If I go for the battery/replacement and they can't replace the battery and give me another ipod. What kind of ipod is this going to be? ie. what gen, what size, photo or no photo?

Probably as close to what you currently have as they can get.

Since this is MacRumors, I have heard (from a friend that heard it from a friend that has a friend whose cousin's friend works at Apple as a grounds keeper) that Apple still has 3G iPods specifically for warranty replacement. Or better yet, I read it on the internet (so it must be true!). Anyway, all kidding aside, supposedly Apple does still have some 3G iPods for warranty replacement.

I do have a friend who took her non-working iPod into an Apple Store, and they could not get it to work, so they replaced her non-working one with a brand new iPod. I do not know what generation, model, or size either iPod was/is.

 

[chimerical]

If we go for the battery replacement option, they'll actually try to change our battery instead of sending us a refurbished one? It seems to sound that way, but I just wanted to be sure.