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The "touch" is the new "classic" and it is supposed to appeal to the same people the iPod classic is supposed to appeal to, but due to the amount of storage, or lack there of, it seems to be a 'white elephant in the line up'. As NAND flash memory gets cheaper the iPod touch will get larger capacities until it catches up to and replaces the iPod classic. It has started out with 8/16GB models, but they will move to 16/32GB then 32/64GB then, well, you get the picture, and best of all, the prices will stay the same or drop.

While adding "classic" to the original iPod gives consistency to the lineup, I think it has more to do with the iPod classic taking its first steps into hardware history. Due to the storage issue, 16GB for the "touch" vs. 160GB for the "classic" Apple has to sell both, but you can be sure they want to EOL the iPod classic ASAP. For this reason I do not think we will see any more hardware updates for the iPod classic. When the iPod touch get a 64GB model then the 80GB iPod classic will get dropped, and when the iPod touch gets a 128GB model the iPod classic will be but a memory.

I totally agree with you. The ipod classic is done, no more updates for it. That's why Apple decided to go all out with a 160gb hard drive, it needs to be top dog for the next year and compete with other high capacity players the year after that. In 2 years time the touch will have 128gb NAND capacity and the ipod classic will be gone.

Jan 2008- 16gb iphone, 32gb iPod touch
June 2008- 32gb iphone 2, introduction of iphone nano 16gb
Sep 2008- 64gb iPod touch 2
Jan 2009- 64gb iphone 2
Sep 2009- 128gb iphone 3, 128gb iPod touch 3, iPhone nano 2 32gb

(highest capacity models only)
 
I totally agree with you. The ipod classic is done, no more updates for it. That's why Apple decided to go all out with a 160gb hard drive, it needs to be top dog for the next year and compete with other high capacity players the year after that. In 2 years time the touch will have 128gb NAND capacity and the ipod classic will be gone.

Jan 2008- 16gb iphone, 32gb iPod touch
June 2008- 32gb iphone 2, introduction of iphone nano 16gb
Sep 2008- 64gb iPod touch 2
Jan 2009- 64gb iphone 2
Sep 2009- 128gb iphone 3, 128gb iPod touch 3, iPhone nano 2 32gb

(highest capacity models only)

I would be surprised to see that fast acceleration.

Last 3 years running its been one update a year, so I think whilst the phone will likely see 3G model and 16GB, the iPods could easily remain static until Sept 2008
 
I would be surprised to see that fast acceleration.

Last 3 years running its been one update a year, so I think whilst the phone will likely see 3G model and 16GB, the iPods could easily remain static until Sept 2008

I think we'll be seeing a slightly accelerated update rate, 32gb NAND chips will be available in big enough quantities in the first few months of the new year so I don't see why Apple couldn't put them in the touch. It already has a high enough price point.

With the phones, Apple definately needs to introduce a low end iPhone to really compete and gain marketshare and I think they will do it 3rd quarter 08. In the same year the iPhone will get a refresh with added features such as 3G, GPS, improved camera, and some currently unknown functionality. By 2009 flash chips will be easily available at 64gb capacities and at the end of the year 128gb will definately be an option. They will be included in a big event that will include a refresh of the entire line of ipods and iphones, with the ipod classic and click wheel becoming extinct (touch screen 'nanoshuffle' introduction- touch interface transitioning through to all Apple product lines inc ipods, Mac). The nano and shuffle will be merged into a gesture based touch device.

Sep 2009 event
2 ipod models:
'nanoshuffle' - 16gb $89, 32gb $149
iPod- 64gb $249, 128gb $349 (loses touch name)

Plus- iPod headphones (needs a name)- headphones that have a tiny control system, can be docked to the computer. Basically iPod inside the headphones. 2gb. Used for sport, replacement for the original shuffle. New nike+ perhaps. $49

2 phone models:
iPhone - 64gb $289, 128gb $399
iPhone nano- 16gb $199, 32gb $249

The fewer ipod models will be a sign of the transition from mainly ipods to mainly phones, it's the way the market is heading.

edit- I really believe this is where we are headed, however I might be too ambitious with the capacities so maybe instead of Sep 2009 we might see that event June 2010.
 
You're right. Until we see an SDK, this unit is much more limited than a modern PDA.
The question is: does Apple really want to control the market for software for these devices the way many of us think they do? I still wonder is a SDK is coming. Right now it could go either way.

The thing that most biases me to believing that a SDK is coming is the way Apple promotes that these units are running OS/X.
Every full-fledged PDA on the market today (or for the last several years for that matter) has the potential to deliver multimedia, so that cannot be what sets this device apart.
There is deliver and then there is DELIVER. None of the device I know about have multimedia as a primary focus nor do they have the memory space to support media. To me it is a bit of a stretch to compare a any of Apples iPods to a common PDA, as a Media device, especially with respect to ease of use.
On the Palm side, you can at least view photos on every Palm PDA. Once you step above the bottom-of-the-line Z22, you'll find that every current Palm PDA can also playback audio and full-screen video.

On the Windows Mobile side, every Windows Mobile device has Windows Media Player built in. You can also easily add support for a wide variety of non-Windows Media formats. Either way, that implies playback of audio and full-screen video.
Yes in each case though do they have the user interface to support media as strongly as Apple does. The point is the Apple devices have a primary task of being a media player none of the PDA's do. Playing media can take up much more of a units time than any collection of PDA functions.

The reason PDA's are dieing is that these seldom used functions can now be easily incorporated into a device that will get a lot more use and be judged a better value. Thus a media player like the touch may have a small percentage of its time in use applied to things like E-Mail and surfing the web. Even the iPhone is focused on Cell and music. Teh PDA functionality is just something that is along for the ride.
Sure. But with the facilities provided through Windows CE APIs, the same potential exists in conventional PDAs. (Haters might like to deny it. But the truth is, the Windows CE API really is quite rich.)
Win CE is an interesting product we have machine tools with it embedded in. For a handheld device though the apps are what will make of break it in the long run. There is a lack of satisfaction with respect to these devices. I'm willing to wager that part of the problem is the installation of apps that really don't transfer well to the hand held environment.
The fact is, so far that potential hasn't caught on to spark a revolution of handheld computer applications. Maybe in the long run, the iPhone / iPod Touch will succeed where other handhelds have failed.

Well if you are going to carry a computing device around in your pocket it has to meet a few needs. PDA's tried to meet that need but quickly go eclipsed by other technology. The other technology being the cell phone. Not just any cell phone but a smart cell phone. The simple reality is that most people don't even want a Cell phone in their pocket but put up with it due necessity. The minute smart phones could replace enough of the PDA's functionality, the PDA business started having trouble. Not only do people not want to carry a bunch of computing devices around with them they have learned over time what is important to have on their body. Most people don't need a crappy version of word or excel. They do need access to corporate E-Mail (hint to lurking Apple execs), the web, contacts, and such. A device that delivers these sorts of functions as an auxiliary to the devices primary functionality is very handy to have for many people. Sort of like buying a car with a trailer hitch, you may not use it often but having it there can solve problems from time to time. In the same vain I have CAD software installed on my Linux PC, CAD is not the PC's primary purpose but every once and a while it is very useful to have.

So PDA's don't sell well because other devices with different focuses get better utilization.


Dave
 
The "touch" is the new "classic" and it is supposed to appeal to the same people the iPod classic is supposed to appeal to, but due to the amount of storage, or lack there of, it seems to be a 'white elephant in the line up'.
I don't buy the white elephant BS at all. The touch is a unique device that is the first of its generation. The Flash allotment could be an issue for some there is no doubt there. On the other hand it is close to (is) leading edge capacity for such a device. The fact that this device came out first does not imply that it will never be versioned into a unit supporting a hard disk.

Lets face it Apple delivered a completely new lineup of iPods, the Touch being a small portion of that debut. Think of it as a new direction for the platform not a elephant of any kind.
As NAND flash memory gets cheaper the iPod touch will get larger capacities until it catches up to and replaces the iPod classic. It has started out with 8/16GB models, but they will move to 16/32GB then 32/64GB then, well, you get the picture, and best of all, the prices will stay the same or drop.
Yes the Touch will get updated with larger memory allotments but the question is when. I suspect that it will happen early next year.

That however does not imply catching up with a hard disk based unit. I suspect that disk based machines will have an advantage for the foreseeable future.

When discussing storage on a media device it is very interesting the spread in needs. Some can get by with a few gigs and others need the largest device they can find. Apple could put two disk drives into a Touch variant and still not satisfy everybody.
While adding "classic" to the original iPod gives consistency to the lineup, I think it has more to do with the iPod classic taking its first steps into hardware history. Due to the storage issue, 16GB for the "touch" vs. 160GB for the "classic" Apple has to sell both, but you can be sure they want to EOL the iPod classic ASAP. For this reason I do not think we will see any more hardware updates for the iPod classic.
I'm not sure you can justify theses positions. The classic will sell as long as there is demand. Even if Apple comes out with an HD based Touch you will still have people preferring one over the other.
When the iPod touch get a 64GB model then the 80GB iPod classic will get dropped, and when the iPod touch gets a 128GB model the iPod classic will be but a memory.

I just don't think it is going to be that easy. The classic has its place just as the Shuffle and the Nano do.

Dave
 
Who else thinks that the iPod touch and the iPhone are exactly the same hardware with only a firmware change to disable features? I think its very likely. Its probably cheaper for apple to produce only one version of the hardware rather than redesign the thing. I know video card companies do this all the time. If this is so it leads to the possibility of unlocking the phone capabilities with some software/hardware modifications.

As mentioned, it's a different size in both thickness and length, so no, definitely not the same hardware.

apple really did release amazing products yesterday. too bad some had to ruin all the good news with their B-eye-chin and complaining.Congratulations Apple, you sure do know how to make some kick-ass stuff.
It's nice stuff, but it has obvious flaws, which is what people are pointing out.
: 9-5-07 : Only time in the history of the world people have complained because something is cheaper than it was before.
People complain about price drops ALL THE TIME. Not just with Apple, either. A price drop on a video game console that comes right after a ton of people bought it, for example, always makes people complain.

But that is not the best way to check you mail, do you use webmail on your desktop, I think not!

I do. I use GMail at home, although I do access it with Mailplane from my desktop. It's very handy to have all my mail accessable from anywhere, not to mention immune to local system failures. I switched my entire office to Gmail business apps recently - that's about 30 people, and I'm not the first to do it. They have an amazing web interface and the search is of course fantastic.

What I want in a mail app from the Touch is a GMail integrated service (which isn't all that far fetched, since Apple and Google have been tight lately) that senses when the touch is online, and downloads any new messages from my GMail account to the Touch locally. The touch just needs to store unread messages locally, along with recently read messages (even if it wasn't recently received - just anything I've read in the last week), and any messages with a specific label (say, an iPod label). Messages I send are saved locally until it can get online and send them, which happens automatically when the Touch goes online.

It doesn't NEED to be a full mail application, for me. Just a way to quickly read new messages, send mail, and store a few key/new messages for offline browsing. The interface should be Gmail-esque, but simplified and designed around the touch screen/keyboardless access. You always have the option to go to GMail when you are online, so it doesn't need to have access to all the GMail features.

I'm hoping that Apple will either open up the Touch or someone will come up with a fairly simple way to install third party apps. Adding a mail client like that, along with a couple other small things like a notes app and a document viewer, would get me much more interested in the Touch. I'm pretty impressed as it is, but 8gb isn't big enough for me, and I'm not $400 interested. I'll wait for a 32gb version to be released, which should push the price of a refurb 16gb to about $250. Hopefully by that point the above features will be available and at that price it'll be a great bargain.
 
This is almost the product I've been lusting over for so long!

One thing that would be cool to do with the cover flow view and the movement sensors is to tilt the iPod to a side and have the covers cycle that way.

Do the iPod games work on this? Does it come with sudoku too??
 
This is almost the product I've been lusting over for so long!

One thing that would be cool to do with the cover flow view and the movement sensors is to tilt the iPod to a side and have the covers cycle that way.

Do the iPod games work on this? Does it come with sudoku too??


two finger pinch, tap and drag and hold and flick, tilt and rotate, hold the buttton and click the button, drag to unlock and drag to shut down ...

and you want tilt to make the albums 'flow' as well? heh .. why not :)

shake to shuffle (yes I know I know .. sansa), slap to play/pause, hit your head to skipforward hit your bum to rewind, lick to lock screen and bite to turn off ...

people would spot you from a mile away, "oh here comes an iPod touch user, careful now kids that gentleman can get a little frisky towards the end of the song"
 
You should really look at the iPhone objectively, respectfully a lot of your assumptions may be influenced by the bogus and uninformed mainstream media reports

Ok, can you please not start a comment like this with what's effectively an insult?

honestly I was in the same boat as you when I was deciding on an iPhone. With your current carrier, you are most likely locked in for 2 years anyway, same with the iPhone so what's the diff?

Actually, I'm not. And my choice of carrier and desire to be able to pick carriers has nothing to do with contracts.

I use T-Mobile because, in this area, T-Mobile is good and AT&T isn't. AT&T's network appears to be oversubscribed and as such the quality of the network is so low it's often unusable. I base this on experience of both networks, and carry an AT&T GoPhone SIM around as a spare for those (increasingly rare) occasions that I can't get a T-Mobile signal and can get AT&T. I was on AT&T on a standard plan until about two years ago.

A one bar T-Mobile signal here in Martin County, Florida, is usable. You can hear what the other guy's saying. A one bar AT&T signal, using the same physical phone, isn't. I have to assume AT&T is using the half rate codecs (probably AMR-HR) which degrade very badly compared to the full rate codecs.

So you saying that there's no difference because of contract length is really not covering major issues that are serious to me. As far as I'm concerned, contract length is an issue, but a usable network is even more important. In some areas AT&T is good and T-Mobile is bad. Not here. And even if the reverse was true, I'd still like to decide for myself which network to use, not be forced to tie my hardware to a particular carrier.

Having the iPhone play music does not really take up that much battery juice. Even if it did, chances are that you are near a charger nearly all the time - wall plug, car, etc. And to be honest the charging is very fast, much faster than my clumpy ole 30gig video iPod!

That's good, though it's still not something I want to trade off one for the other, especially given my experience of iPod batteries, which after a year or so seem to plummet in life. I've been through the iPod battery self replacement process before, it's something I thought would be easy before I did it, and I added my name to the list of apologists on the subject. Then I did it. There's a reason why my current iPod still has a 2-3 hour battery life - I'm dreading replacing the battery, and actually considering buying a whole new MP3 player instead.

Keyboard is way better than you think it is.

If I'd said "Teh iPhone's keyboard sucks, I'd rather type "733442777pause777444" than "peharri" it's so much easier", then yeah, you'd have a point, but I'm talking about physical feedback, when you're holding the phone and dialing with one hand. If I'm using something as a phone, I want it to be a good phone. The iPhone's requirement to use a touch screen to dial out is a compromise that helps the non-phone functionality at the expense of the phone functionality, it isn't an improvement. It means hand eye coordination is a requirement.

Voice recognition seems more like a nice-to-have than a must-have feature. Cool yes, required probably not.

It seriously affects how usable the phone is. I consider it a must-have even if it isn't for you. I live in an area in which you can't get from A to B without driving. With a decent hands-free kit and voice recognition, the phone is usable, without one or the other you're another dangerous lunatic on the road if you so much as touch the phone.

MMS can be done via hack apps, hacks are now super simple to do, especially with iBricker and iFuntastic, ignore the mainstream press about the 20 pages of instructions, it's simply not true anymore.

If hacks weren't an issue, the initial complaint about the phone being locked wouldn't be either. I do not want to buy a device relying upon functionality being present that can be wiped out with a software update. It is not clear at this stage what Apple's plans are with iPhone, but they've previously given every indication that they consider it a closed platform. I can see iPod Touch being immune from deliberate tampering to disable hacks, if only because there's no carrier out there to enforce updates. But iPhone?

One last thing, try to think of the iPhone/iPodT's as a pocket computer. They run Mac OS X have a very powerful CPU a file system, input and output, etc...software possibilities are endless, bend your mind, it's a freakin mico-mac, man!

But that's not what Apple wants you to think, and with Apple's history of wanting control over the whole widget and whole user experience, it's not clear that either device will ever function as a "full computer" with Apple's blessing. (And it's no different to iPod in that respect anyway - my iPod has a full version of GNU/Linux installed. As such it's as much a full computer as iPod Touch with OS X) iPod Touch is exciting (or would be) because there's no risk of it being permanently tied to Apple, like iPod, and unlike iPod it has significantly better hardware.

But there's no Bluetooth. So I'm not going to be able to use it in the way I want to use it, as a portable Internet/Multimedia device. Sure, some people will. People who live in large cities with a Starbucks on every corner will love it. Good for them. I'm not really living in that kind of environment, so at the end of the day I have to look at it as a cool looking iPod with some gimmicks that'll be useful from time to time but I'll never really be able to rely upon. Is it better than an iPod classic? For me, probably not. Is it more useful than my current iPod? For me, in terms of the features it offers, it's probably worse save for the temporary fix to my battery problem (which we'll replay in 12-18 months...)

Certainly, if I'm to look objectively, I would be better off getting an iPod classic (cheaper, more storage, USB storage mode right off the bat), or waiting for SD cards to get to a decent enough size and then get a Nokia N800.

But if Apple were to add Bluetooth to the iPod Touch, and it was clear enough OS X functionality was there to make it possible to set up a PPP over Bluetooth connection to a phone that supports GPRS/EDGE/whatever-the-CDMA2000-equivalent-is, I'd definitely take a second look.
 
'Lugging' is a bit of an overstatement, don't you think?

Well, I have limited pocket space. My wallet is in one, my phone and BT headset are in the other, and my iPod, if I carry it, is generally uncomfortable squeeze. For the longest time I just left it at work every day except when I knew I had updates for it at home.

Besides, it's just a bonus feature to its main purpose- play music and movies.

I know, but that's the point really. Even if you restrict yourself to Apple's line up, it's competing against three other iPod models which are, in their own way, superior in most senses except for the browsing gimmick. The iPod nano is cheaper though the capacity is an issue, and the iPod classic - well, there's no contest really. iPod Touch - cool looking and with a gimmick I'll rarely use so cannot see as a compelling reason to get it. iPod Classic - ten times the capacity of iPod Touch for $50 less and does everything else it does except the gimmick.

Unless internet access is implemented in a way useful to me, I have no reason to get the Touch. Which is where we come full circle. Now, I'd like Internet access, so it could be a selling feature, I'm just saying the way it's implemented now means it isn't, for me.
 
Ummm...maybe you should just take your iPod touch to Orlando with you and leave the laptop at home!

Unless you have some specific need for heavier computing, I rather 'lug' the iPod over the laptop...

I'm not planning on walking the 150-200 miles or so from here to Orlando!

The laptop has a bigger screen, has more capacity, can do things other than browse the web and play music, and both are equally portable given I'm taking a car anyway. Browsing the web is being done on a large screen that supports windowing and on browsers that support tabs. The laptop also has a real keyboard. What, exactly, is the advantage of the iPod here?

Taking an iPod to a hotel instead of a laptop because it's smaller is like buying shorts instead of trousers because you can fit more pairs of shorts in your large, oversized, walk-in closet.
 
Unless internet access is implemented in a way useful to me, I have no reason to get the Touch. Which is where we come full circle. Now, I'd like Internet access, so it could be a selling feature, I'm just saying the way it's implemented now means it isn't, for me.
How could internet access possibly be improved on the Touch without making it a phone (with the possible exception of adding Flash support)? Browsing on a wireless G network is THE feature that makes me interested in the Touch. Mind you, I have a family of 6 competing for my MacBook, so any additional browsing device would be welcome.

That said, I will likely wait until at least a 32 GB model comes out before I purchase one, or possibly a 64 GB model.
 
I hope it doesn't take too long to get it to 32 GB. I have a feeling we could be waiting a little while.
 
I would be surprised to see that fast acceleration.

Last 3 years running its been one update a year, so I think whilst the phone will likely see 3G model and 16GB, the iPods could easily remain static until Sept 2008
Unlikely. Competing flash-based MP3 players will offer 32 GB models in early 2008.

Recently, updates have been slow due to a lack of compelling hardware to base those upgrades on. With the pending release of 32 GB flash cards, that will change.
 
Tethering to a 3.5G phone (liek the N95) via bluetooth? That would be killer.
If you're going to do that, why not just make it a phone? Anyway, that would be much slower than wireless G. And besides, Apple wants us to buy the iPhone, not someone else's phone, so this will never happen.
 
If you're going to do that, why not just make it a phone?

When Apple sell an HSDPA iPhone....until then.

Anyway, that would be much slower than wireless G. And besides, Apple wants us to buy the iPhone, not someone else's phone, so this will never happen.

Wireless G is not available on most trains or outside very small areas inside towns. Moving around isn't particularly well handled compared with HSDPA.

I agree that the lack of bluetooth is deliberate to leverage the iphone.
 
I agree that the lack of bluetooth is deliberate to leverage the iphone.
Exactly. Apple doesn't want you to buy the Touch and someone else's phone. If the Touch could be tethered to a phone via BT, this is exactly what ppl would do, at least until Apple offers a 3G iPhone. This would significantly impair Apple's entry into the cellphone market.

The other problem with Bluetooth is its effect on battery life. I know that when I turn BT on with my MB, my battery life is reduced by about 25%.
 
Well, I have limited pocket space. My wallet is in one, my phone and BT headset are in the other, and my iPod, if I carry it, is generally uncomfortable squeeze. For the longest time I just left it at work every day except when I knew I had updates for it at home.

True, I have the same issue. Although at 8mm thick it's too much of a squeeze. ;) I would never put it in the same pocket as my keys or anything though. I tend to always have my iPod with me anyway.

I know, but that's the point really. Even if you restrict yourself to Apple's line up, it's competing against three other iPod models which are, in their own way, superior in most senses except for the browsing gimmick. The iPod nano is cheaper though the capacity is an issue, and the iPod classic - well, there's no contest really. iPod Touch - cool looking and with a gimmick I'll rarely use so cannot see as a compelling reason to get it. iPod Classic - ten times the capacity of iPod Touch for $50 less and does everything else it does except the gimmick.

Unless internet access is implemented in a way useful to me, I have no reason to get the Touch. Which is where we come full circle. Now, I'd like Internet access, so it could be a selling feature, I'm just saying the way it's implemented now means it isn't, for me.

I still want the Touch because of the bigger screen. I have a LARGE collection of music, but with my experience with previous iPods and Shuffles, carrying my entire collection is less important to me than having a bigger screen for movies. For me, 16GB is enough to store around 10-12 movies and still have half the space for music.

The wifi and other potential functionalities are a bonus to me. Not the core feature, but a useful extra that is more than just a gimmick to me (although I understand that will differ for different people.)

I don't consider the Touch to be the 'best' iPod, it just fills the line out nicely IMO. The Touch clearly is the first step in a revolution of these devices, not just the iPod but the entire category. At the same time, I don't see Apple killing the Classic line anytime soon, because it does fill a clear niche as well- people who value maximum capacity first.
 
Exactly. Apple doesn't want you to buy the Touch and someone else's phone. If the Touch could be tethered to a phone via BT, this is exactly what ppl would do, at least until Apple offers a 3G iPhone. This would significantly impair Apple's entry into the cellphone market.

The other problem with Bluetooth is its effect on battery life. I know that when I turn BT on with my MB, my battery life is reduced by about 25%.

Aye, true. The 8mm thickness is probably only achievable by having a smaller battery than the iPhone.

I think BT could still be a feature but will only be turned on when the iPhone is 3G.

The money from the the iPod Touch is all Apple's not shared with AT&T. This calls for opposing strategies for the two devices. A very interesting situation to watch.
 
Aye, true. The 8mm thickness is probably only achievable by having a smaller battery than the iPhone.

I think BT could still be a feature but will only be turned on when the iPhone is 3G.

The money from the the iPod Touch is all Apple's not shared with AT&T. This calls for opposing strategies for the two devices. A very interesting situation to watch.
I think that Apple would rather sell an iPhone than an iPod Touch. There is ongoing revenue (shared as you stated) from the iPhone, and besides, Apple already dominates the MP3 market, and wants to establish itself in the much larger cell phone market.
 
I think that Apple would rather sell an iPhone than an iPod Touch. There is ongoing revenue (shared as you stated) from the iPhone, and besides, Apple already dominates the MP3 market, and wants to establish itself in the much larger cell phone market.

Exactly. However the once thought of dead PDA market is now Apple's for the taking if they're clever with how limited they make the device.

It is conceivable that these kind of devices are the new computer market....Apple know's this very well.
 
Wireless G is not available on most trains or outside very small areas inside towns. Moving around isn't particularly well handled compared with HSDPA.

Well the wave of the future is already happening. Hot spot cities, the city of South Pittsburg, TN has become a city wide hot spot. This town of only 3133 people had really stepped it up. If a city of this size can accomplish this then why can't many other cities take this step. Yes I understand it will cost more in the larger cities but its not like there isn't money being spent on something that is not going to benefit the town like city wide WIFI would.

Christopher
 
Well the wave of the future is already happening. Hot spot cities, the city of South Pittsburg, TN has become a city wide hot spot. This town of only 3133 people had really stepped it up. If a city of this size can accomplish this then why can't many other cities take this step. Yes I understand it will cost more in the larger cities but its not like there isn't money being spent on something that is not going to benefit the town like city wide WIFI would.

It's interesting to note SE and Nokia's strategy to deal with this.

I still think HSDPA is a better bet than wifi. The roaming and not having to sign on the wifi networks means HSDPA just works better than wifi (currently).
 
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