Moyapilot

macrumors regular
Aug 14, 2015
224
215
MacRumors didn't have any idea about the 11% larger battery capacity. And quite frankly, not all editors have a good understanding of technology.

Mini LED is significantly thinner/smaller than traditional LED. So it doesn't make sense for it to be thicker.

Let me defer to someone who has been in the industry over a decade:

"Kuo added that the Mini-LED backlit displays will allow for thinner and lighter product designs, while offering many of the same benefits of OLED displays used on the latest iPhones, including good wide color gamut performance, high contrast and dynamic range, and local dimming for truer blacks."

Okay, I’m not trying to be difficult, so don’t take offense. For the sake of discussion…could the extra power requirement of MiniLED be a reason for a larger battery? Its not the M1, as the 11” pro is the same thickness as previous versions.

I still think though that MiniLED does require a thicker panel. Apple during the unveiling went on for some time explaining how difficult it was to get the thickness of the 12.9 display down to a manageable degree. They compared it to the relatively thick XDR display.
 
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tazdevl

macrumors regular
Jul 6, 2010
199
128
Folks need to go to the gym if 40g is a material difference in weight for them and get past device spec OCD. 0.5mm wouldn’t ever be noticed if it wasnt called out. The number is academic in this instance. My understanding it’s thicker due to the display, not a bigger battery. Iirc mini-LED is more power efficient that the previous IPS display.
 
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Digitalguy

macrumors 68000
Apr 15, 2019
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Folks need to go to the gym if 40g is a material difference in weight for them and get past device spec OCD. 0.5mm wouldn’t ever be noticed if it wasnt called out. The number is academic in this instance. My understanding it’s thicker due to the display, not a bigger battery.
Mmh, I guess not many people go to the gym then, since people were all very happy with the lighter iPad pro 2018, that lost those same 40gr from the previous gen...
 
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Aetherhole

macrumors regular
Nov 11, 2009
114
48
Tustin, CA
And thats probably why the rumors of OLED coming to ipads makes sense. OLED would allow the ipad to become even thinner, not thicker. Reduced weight and even better picture (although not as blindingly bright). Not sure thought if the Pro line will get the OLED screens, or just the regular ones. Seems backwards if thats the case.
Don't get me wrong, I love the OLED technology, but each of the techs have their limitations. I have an LG 65" OLED, plus the iPhone X -> iPhone 11 Pro Max (and likely iPhone 13 next), but there's certainly a place for mini LED. The 1000-1600nit brightness does not equate a brighter average picture level. Those touted numbers aren't making it a "blindingly bright" image. In fact, the average picture levels should be the same, with the caveat that the HDR highlights are not going to be limited to 600-750nits as is the case with OLED. This has been shown to create a more accurate image because there is much less tone mapping done to the image (or none at all).

Also, 2500 zones is nothing to balk at. Yes it's not pixel-level control like plasma, OLED, and eventually micro-LED, but I am having a hard time imagining 2500 zones on a 12.9 screen being subpar or mediocre. I am looking forward to getting my 12.9 IPP to see how well it all works since right now we are ALL simply theorizing and speculating.
 
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JPack

macrumors 604
Mar 27, 2017
7,251
12,271
Okay, I’m not trying to be difficult, so don’t take offense. For the sake of discussion…could the extra power requirement of MiniLED be a reason for a larger battery? Its not the M1, as the 11” pro is the same thickness as previous versions.

I still think though that MiniLED does require a thicker panel. Apple during the unveiling went on for some time explaining how difficult it was to get the thickness of the 12.9 display down to a manageable degree. They compared it to the relatively thick XDR display.

Yes, I think the larger battery helps enable the display to reach 1,000/1,600 nits while maintaining the same runtime.

Keep in mind the Pro Display XDR is not a mini LED device. It's a traditional LED with a bunch of expensive filters and timing logic to achieve near mini LED performance. The monitor has two fans and a large air cooled chassis because it uses big, heat-dense LEDs. The new iPad Pro has a five-fold increase in dimming zones and achieves the same 1,000 nits full screen. The XDR monitor is supercharged old technology while iPad Pro is a true mini LED device.
 
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Unregistered 4U

macrumors 68040
Jul 22, 2002
3,629
2,422
Holding the iPad as I would horizontally, I loaded it with 5 presidential dollars at 8 grams each. No discernible increase in the amount of effort required to continue to hold it horizontally. The delta would have to be closer to 20% to be fairly guaranteed that most every human could feel the difference.
 
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Digitalguy

macrumors 68000
Apr 15, 2019
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Holding the iPad as I would horizontally, I loaded it with 5 presidential dollars at 8 grams each. No discernible increase in the amount of effort required to continue to hold it horizontally. The delta would have to be closer to 20% to be fairly guaranteed that most every human could feel the difference.
I tried the same thing with an empty airpods case (40 gr) on my 11 pro and on my mini. Can I feel the difference? Yes. Does it make a difference? Not really, it's not a big deal.
 
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playtech1

macrumors 6502
Oct 10, 2014
285
242
I have a small fleet of iPads at the moment, the Mini 5, 2017 10.5 Pro, 2018 11 Pro and the 2018 12.9 Pro. I used to have the 1st gen 12.9 Pro.

The Mini's size and weight means I can hold it as long as I need to without thinking about it. It's great.

The 10.5 vs 11 comfort is foxing me a bit. The 11 is objectively smaller and lighter, but I am finding the 10.5 is actually more comfortable to hold for longer periods. Something about the curved sides makes it nestle more comfortably in the hand and subjectively make it look thinner (it's not).

The 1st gen 12.9 iPad Pro was a similar story - the more comfortable (for me) old-style shape made up for the extra weight when holding in the hand compared to the 2018 shape.

Lots of reasons why the 11 and 12.9 are better than their predecessors (and they are amazing devices), but a further reduction in weight would be high on my list as an area for further improvements, or a more comfortable design. For me I would have bought a materially lighter 12.9 in a heartbeat, whereas the improved screen isn't quite enough to make me upgrade.

I think rounded edges are out of favour (they probably don't work well with the Magic Keyboard concept), but a new model with some sort of fancy lightweight alloy (magnesium?) housing plus a more efficient screen / processor permitting a smaller battery might be a way forward to cut this down. The size/weight changes with the 2021 model are small, but they are going the wrong way!
 
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rui no onna

Contributor
Oct 25, 2013
10,870
7,433
The size/weight changes with the 2021 model are small, but they are going the wrong way!

This has happened before (iPad 2 -> iPad 3/4) but a year later, we got the drastically lighter iPad Air.

I'm sure Apple will try to make it lighter again when technology allows for it.
 
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Digitalguy

macrumors 68000
Apr 15, 2019
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This has happened before (iPad 2 -> iPad 3/4) but a year later, we got the drastically lighter iPad Air.

I'm sure Apple will try to make it lighter again when technology allows for it.
If they ever choose to go with OLED at some point they can have a lighter device. The Tab S7+ is not only much thinner than the LCD tab S7 (since it does not require back-lighting), but it's only 60 gr heavier (560gr for the 12.4in vs 500gr for the 11in).
 
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rui no onna

Contributor
Oct 25, 2013
10,870
7,433
If they ever choose to go with OLED at some point they can have a lighter device. The Tab S7+ is not only much thinner than the LCD tab S7 (since it does not require back-lighting), but it's only 60 gr heavier (560gr for the 12.4in vs 500gr for the 11in).

If they do, I hope they fix the PWM issue. My iPhone 12 mini is pretty much an overpriced hotspot since it gives me a headache within 30 minutes of onscreen use.
 
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ericwn

macrumors G3
Apr 24, 2016
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So, the battery is sticking out of the outer shell or how can you say something that is not logical?

The frame/overall thickness is thicker (8% or so) so it will be sturdier. It probably won't be much but it will be sturdier.
Battery has nothing to do with anything. Its the frame that counts and the frame is thicker.

A taller box doesn’t necessarily seem sturdier to me.
 
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ericwn

macrumors G3
Apr 24, 2016
8,416
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I couldn't care less about the thickness. I do care about the weight. It was easy to tell the difference when they reduced weight from the 2nd-gen to 3rd-gen 12.9", and now they have gone and added that weight back on. 40 grams may not sound like a lot but to me it's easily perceivable on a unwieldy large tablet that you're trying to hold in one hand.

I doubt most will hold any iPad for long periods of time. Sure that applies to teachers and certain other tasks but over the last decade with iPads my realisation is that it will sit flush on a table, live in a stand or case with stand.
 
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Digitalguy

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Apr 15, 2019
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If they do, I hope they fix the PWM issue. My iPhone 12 mini is pretty much an overpriced hotspot since it gives me a headache within 30 minutes of onscreen use.
I have no experience with OLED iPhones but no PWM issue with my S10e... but maybe not everyone is sensitive to PWM....
 
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Never mind

macrumors 65816
Oct 25, 2018
1,046
1,150
Dunedin, Florida
Folks need to go to the gym if 40g is a material difference in weight for them and get past device spec OCD. 0.5mm wouldn’t ever be noticed if it wasnt called out. The number is academic in this instance. My understanding it’s thicker due to the display, not a bigger battery. Iirc mini-LED is more power efficient that the previous IPS display.

Mmh, I guess not many people go to the gym then, since people were all very happy with the lighter iPad pro 2018, that lost those same 40gr from the previous gen...
I’m 76 years old and I don’t know what’s wrong with these younger people that can’t lift a little iPad Pro 12.9 inch. They are now laughable if they have to complain about this on a forum. 🤪
 
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Digitalguy

macrumors 68000
Apr 15, 2019
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I’m 76 years old and I don’t know what’s wrong with these younger people that can’t lift a little iPad Pro 12.9 inch. They are now laughable if they have to complain about this on a forum. 🤪
Right now I am going to the gym and lift 20 kg in each hand many times 😂
When I hold an iPad in my hand for reading for a while I want it as comfortable as it can be... 😉
 
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maflynn

Moderator
Staff member
May 3, 2009
68,057
35,613
Boston
’m 76 years old and I don’t know what’s wrong with these younger people that can’t lift a little iPad Pro 12.9 inch. They are now laughable if they have to complain about this on a forum. 🤪
I think most of the complaints about weight are due to arm/hand fatigue from using the iPad over extended periods of time by holding it.

I take karate, and sometimes we're told to grab some dumbbells - in the course of the class we'll invariably need to hold our arms out straight (at 9:00 and 3 o'clock if t makes sense). Even with 4lbs weights those get heavy after 2 minutes of just holding your arms out straight.

Similarly holding up a 12.9" iPad can induce fatigue a lot sooner then a smaller one
 
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MauiPa

macrumors 68020
Apr 18, 2018
2,032
2,829
I am not bothered by thickness but a bit by the additional weight. The weight is basically the same as the second gen pro (the one with larger bezels).
As for thicker=sturdier I don't think so, at all. The extra half a millimeter, probably mainly due the additional battery to ensure 10 hours despite the miniled screen will very likely make no difference since based on the information known so far the case will be exactly as thin. And if you have ever seen these batteries you know that they are bend almost like paper....
So no, it will be just as fragile as before. Zach from Jerryrigeverything will let us known soon enough.

PS the reason why the weight bothers me is that I sometimes use it to read pdf or word files in portrait mode, holding it sometimes when doing that, other than that I don't mind
you are right and you are wrong. the thickness is widely reported as the mini LED display, they are just thicker. the weight is 40 grams more or 1.4 oz. it is funny anyone would complain about that at all, ever
 
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MauiPa

macrumors 68020
Apr 18, 2018
2,032
2,829
People complained when apple made the iPads thinner, now they're complaining they're thicker? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

If anything it should hopefully provide a bit more rigidity and less risk of bending
come on people, don't sit on your iPads. do I really have to keep repeating myself?
 
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