Is anyone here staying with Montery and not upgrading to Ventura

[Yebubbleman]

Hiya Y,


Many thanks for the fleet admin perspective! Really good insight.


Is Ventura getting to the point where its ok to load onto your fleet of Macs?

I'm waiting until at least the new year before considering it - We don't want any hassles over xmas break.

The M1 MBA and M1 iMac are running fine at the moment, used for fairly light main stream home use mostly.


I'm trying to be a bit more timely on my future upgrades. I.e. I stayed on Big Sur on the MBA until very late into Monterey's year.... perhaps too long, and I endured an annoying bluetooth crash issue for ages until I finally did the upgrade to Monterey.



Hope you can advise
Martin

Hi Martin!

I think the answer to your question is largely subjective and highly dependent on what all is in your environment and what particular incompatibilities you might have with software. With our software, I do not anticipate any incompatibilities that aren't outright resolved by merely updating the installers we push for things. Not too bad. The more challenging stuff really comes with System Preferences being replaced by System Settings and with additional popups and notifications that users will surely get needlessly alarmed by (triggering an influx of Helpdesk calls). That and the default behavior of Ventura on Apple Silicon Macs to ask for users to enter in their passwords when attaching USB devices. None of that is insurmountable, but it's just work that has to be done and we've all been too busy to do it. It's otherwise likely stable for prime time. I use it at home and have had much better mileage with it than I did with macOS Monterey.

unless you are having issues with your current setup, updating "one year behind" is actually a good solution, as you probably won't find more mature macOSes than their "finalized forms", since the new ones will come with their own new sets of problems.

Monterey wasn't exactly glitch free either when it came out, but it came installed on my systems and i'm reading too many issues with Ventura to even consider installing it yet.

This is actually the best answer to the 2013-Present era question of "When should my company move to the latest macOS release?". Upgrading to the latest release when the next release is announced in June is usually my preference. However, the only caveat to that is that you need to stock up on hardware compatible with your older release. So, right now (and I've said this to my boss and co-workers profusely), we need to build a stockpile of the config of MacBook Pro (14-inch, 2021) that is the standard issue at my company while we still can (as, if rumors about its replacement coming out in the next month or so are to be believed, we only have that long to be able to buy macOS Monterey compatible 14-inch MacBook Pros). But, if you're able to make sure that you have hardware compatible with the OS you want to keep deploying, then this is a very good strategy that maximizes the chances of always having your users on stable releases.

That all being said, when it comes to me personally, I have multiple categories of Macs. I have MacBook Airs that I strictly use for testing, consulting/side-project purposes, and then, in my personal arsenal, I have a group of MacBook Pros that I only will upgrade when things are validated as stable, with a secondary iMac that I will guinea pig my personal environment on when major releases of macOS first come out. The idea is that I'm comfortable testing things with my iMac (with many wipes and re-wipes) after having beta tested the OSes over the summer on the MacBook Airs. Once everything is copacetic, it goes to the MacBook Pros. And, sadly, as far as the first year on an Apple OS goes, our mileage will always vary when it comes to acceptable degrees of stability.

 

[Marty_Macfly]

Hi Martin!

I think the answer to your question is largely subjective and highly dependent on what all is in your environment and what particular incompatibilities you might have with software. With our software, I do not anticipate any incompatibilities that aren't outright resolved by merely updating the installers we push for things. Not too bad. The more challenging stuff really comes with System Preferences being replaced by System Settings and with additional popups and notifications that users will surely get needlessly alarmed by (triggering an influx of Helpdesk calls). That and the default behavior of Ventura on Apple Silicon Macs to ask for users to enter in their passwords when attaching USB devices. None of that is insurmountable, but it's just work that has to be done and we've all been too busy to do it. It's otherwise likely stable for prime time. I use it at home and have had much better mileage with it than I did with macOS Monterey.


This is actually the best answer to the 2013-Present era question of "When should my company move to the latest macOS release?". Upgrading to the latest release when the next release is announced in June is usually my preference. However, the only caveat to that is that you need to stock up on hardware compatible with your older release. So, right now (and I've said this to my boss and co-workers profusely), we need to build a stockpile of the config of MacBook Pro (14-inch, 2021) that is the standard issue at my company while we still can (as, if rumors about its replacement coming out in the next month or so are to be believed, we only have that long to be able to buy macOS Monterey compatible 14-inch MacBook Pros). But, if you're able to make sure that you have hardware compatible with the OS you want to keep deploying, then this is a very good strategy that maximizes the chances of always having your users on stable releases.

That all being said, when it comes to me personally, I have multiple categories of Macs. I have MacBook Airs that I strictly use for testing, consulting/side-project purposes, and then, in my personal arsenal, I have a group of MacBook Pros that I only will upgrade when things are validated as stable, with a secondary iMac that I will guinea pig my personal environment on when major releases of macOS first come out. The idea is that I'm comfortable testing things with my iMac (with many wipes and re-wipes) after having beta tested the OSes over the summer on the MacBook Airs. Once everything is copacetic, it goes to the MacBook Pros. And, sadly, as far as the first year on an Apple OS goes, our mileage will always vary when it comes to acceptable degrees of stability.

Hi Mr Y,

Many thanks for the info, much appreciated.

Happy New Year to you! Hope you had a nice Christmas as well

Roll on 2023 😊

 

[MBAir2010]

This is a nice question,
just asking if that "hidden email" works with Monterey?
thank you.

 

[Royksöpp]

I’ve noticed many bugs that I have not seen in Monterey. I’m using 13.1 on an M1 Pro. So far I’m not impressed. There are no new features that I can’t live without. I tried it out for a couple of weeks, and now I’m going back Monterey.

. Slight lag with launchpad and an overall delay in responsiveness.
. Files on an external drive take a while to load. Very inconvenient when I need to access something quickly.
. Startup animations no longer show up on Studio Display. Black screen when Mac starts up. I have to press the keyboard before picture shows up.
. Keyboard function keys will not work at times. I will either have to turn off the keyboard, or restart the computer.
. Weather App sometimes can’t access location.
. Stage Manager is just as laggy as on iPad OS.
. Screenshots take more time to save to desktop.

Not bugs, but more inconveniences:

. System Settings (obviously).
. Share menu must now use a separate menu to access menu. (Something else that takes unnecessary time)
. Print dialog box is too large.

So I decided to try to stick with it, but I am continuing to notice bugs. It's starting to get annoying now.

. Zooming with trackpad randomly stops working. (I have to turn off and turn it back on)
. Rewinding and Fast-forwarding in Quicktime using Force Touch causes severe lagging when released (Never an issue Monterey)
. Transmission freezes up when quitting and will not open again unless I restart the Mac. (Once again not in Monterey)
. Podcast App lag.
. iOS apps icons do not bounce when opening up.
. Files on external SSD still take a minute to load.
. External SSD icon on desktop flashes when copying files.
. There have been a few times when I wake up the Mac from sleep and find that the External SSD Icon moves to a different location.
. Photo-stream stopped updating. (Had to disable and re-enable on iPhone and Mac)
. Wallpaper resets to Ventura default after shutdown/restart.

I have never used a version of macOS this buggy. I've used Apple Silicon Macs on Big Sur and Monterey and both were smooth, even from the beginning. I didn't try Ventura at launch, buy I can only imagine how terrible it must have been. The only reason I haven't downgraded is that Sidecar performance has been the one thing that has been solid and reliable thus far.

 

[Ifti]

My M1 Max MBP16 came with Monterey, and that's how it will stay until I am forced to upgrade, or until I purchase a new system that comes with a newer OS. I've been burned before - never again.

 

[Royksöpp]

Done and done.

 

[MBAir2010]

I prefer Monterey over Ventura because the overall feel is more fluid
and the system presences are easier.

 

[SeenJeen]

Zero plans to upgrading to Ventura. I usually only upgrade to every other OS, and even then I'll wait for a .3 release or if I'm forced to because of a new hardware upgrade.

Monterey has been rock solid for me and is my favorite version of macOS, even more so than Snow Leopard or Mavericks.

 

[mikelets456]

I have a 2015 MacBook Pro quad core that I bought used about a month ago…I’ve been wanting to make the full change over from Windows to a Mac. I also have a 2009 MacBook Pro that was lying idle in a closet that was brought back to life with an SSD and more ram.
Both have OCLP and one with Monterrey (2009) and the other with Ventura. So far both run very well with their respective OS. However, I feel both are equally stable for what I need it for…
If I had to choose I’d stay with Ventura. It works better with iCloud and my other devices but that’s about the only real advantage I’ve seen so far.

12.6 Monterrey
13.1 Ventura

Both on OCLP 0.5.3

 

[MBAir2010]

Both have OCLP and one with Monterrey (2009) and the other with Ventura. So far both run very well with their respective OS. However, I feel both are equally stable for what I need it for…

wow, nice story
a 2009 MBP running 2021 OS!
apple should have designed this, but their lawyers probably stopped them.

me, I just started having problems since upgrading last week from a blank ssd drive.
The 2012 MacBook Pro is now stuttering with OCLP Monterey, 12.6.2 were Firefox just now shut down sports game i was streaming and typing in Safari is not responsive, there is a 4 word delay, which is cool fan the norm or 1986.
My stupid butt is getting a SSD caddie replacing the dvd player this week so I can run Mojave, and now probably Catalina. Monterey is great but wont run as it should on the MBP'12 anymore, unless I install a earlier Monterey?

well ,have fun with your "new" MacBooks!

 

[mikelets456]

wow, nice story
a 2009 MBP running 2021 OS!
apple should have designed this, but their lawyers probably stopped them.

me, I just started having problems since upgrading last week from a blank ssd drive.
The 2012 MacBook Pro is now stuttering with OCLP Monterey, 12.6.2 were Firefox just now shut down sports game i was streaming and typing in Safari is not responsive, there is a 4 word delay, which is cool fan the norm or 1986.
My stupid butt is getting a SSD caddie replacing the dvd player this week so I can run Mojave, and now probably Catalina. Monterey is great but wont run as it should on the MBP'12 anymore, unless I install a earlier Monterey?

well ,have fun with your "new" MacBooks!
View attachment 2140370

Did you reinstall the root patches, etc after updating? I'm sure you did, but had to ask...sounds like what I went through after updating to Big Sur on my 2009. Then reinstalled OCLP and all was good.

 

[MBAir2010]

Did you reinstall the root patches, etc after updating? I'm sure you did, but had to ask...sounds like what I went through after updating to Big Sur on my 2009. Then reinstalled OCLP and all was good.

yes, and even reset the pram daily.

things went sour after the 12.6.2 update Friday while 12.new was great mon-thurs!
I even installed Oracle java which helped a little Saturday.
I'm curently doing a huge video project on this and should be finished tomorrow
so I will look "under the hood" and see if something is wrong with safari.
Hopefully, I should have a dual ssd set up by then, Mojave is my main OS on that MBP.
I do love Monterey, more than Ventura.

thank you for the reply!

 

[mikelets456]

yes, and even reset the pram daily.

things went sour after the 12.6.2 update Friday while 12.new was great mon-thurs!
I even installed Oracle java which helped a little Saturday.
I'm curently doing a huge video project on this and should be finished tomorrow
so I will look "under the hood" and see if something is wrong with safari.
Hopefully, I should have a dual ssd set up by then, Mojave is my main OS on that MBP.
I do love Monterey, more than Ventura.

thank you for the reply!

Good luck. I’m new to all this but just want to help in any way. I’m more of a “hardware” guy but love trying to figure this stuff out.

 

[mikelets456]

wow, nice story
a 2009 MBP running 2021 OS!
apple should have designed this, but their lawyers probably stopped them.

me, I just started having problems since upgrading last week from a blank ssd drive.
The 2012 MacBook Pro is now stuttering with OCLP Monterey, 12.6.2 were Firefox just now shut down sports game i was streaming and typing in Safari is not responsive, there is a 4 word delay, which is cool fan the norm or 1986.
My stupid butt is getting a SSD caddie replacing the dvd player this week so I can run Mojave, and now probably Catalina. Monterey is great but wont run as it should on the MBP'12 anymore, unless I install a earlier Monterey?

well ,have fun with your "new" MacBooks!
View attachment 2140370

I meant to ask. What type and brand SSD? Did you use OWC or get an adapter? Or is this a standard SSD (hard drive). Check the HD cable and make sure it didn’t get damaged or pinched.

Nvidia or Intel graphics?

 

[MBAir2010]

I meant to ask. What type and brand SSD? Did you use OWC or get an adapter?

a Western digital blue 500GB straight to the innards of the MacBook pro, I7 16GB ram.
I had/have a green 256 WD that ran Monterey 12.6.1 perfect inside a macMini 2012 I might swap instead.

the reason why all the trouble is I use adobe CS4 still and need that because im slow and frigidity with Affinity design.
and Monterey' iMovie is great!

do you have a newer M# MacBook?

 

[mikelets456]

a Western digital blue 500GB straight to the innards of the MacBook pro, I7 16GB ram.
I had/have a green 256 WD that ran Monterey 12.6.1 perfect inside a macMini 2012 I might swap instead.

the reason why all the trouble is I use adobe CS4 still and need that because im slow and frigidity with Affinity design.
and Monterey' iMovie is great!

do you have a newer M# MacBook?

Nope. Just a 2015 quad core I7 Pro. I replaced the Nvme with an adapter but had a similar problem with the adapter.

Also, see my revised post above.

Could/did you roll back to a known working Version of Monterrey?

 

[Spotlighter9]

Just curious about Ventura System Settings (old System Preferences) changes. Does Ventura also use the same horrendous iOS UI (vertical layout, toggle switches) when selecting "preferences" in specific apps (safari, mail, calendar, etc)? Are in-app preferences now similarly labeled as "settings"?

 

[MBAir2010]

Just curious about Ventura System Settings (old System Preferences) changes. Does Ventura also use the same horrendous iOS UI (vertical layout, toggle switches) when selecting "preferences" in specific apps (safari, mail, calendar, etc)? Are in-app preferences now similarly labeled as "settings"?

yes, most Sys Set. options are controlled by a toggle, which i never gave a second thought

 

[deebinem]

Just curious about Ventura System Settings (old System Preferences) changes. Does Ventura also use the same horrendous iOS UI (vertical layout, toggle switches) when selecting "preferences" in specific apps (safari, mail, calendar, etc)? Are in-app preferences now similarly labeled as "settings"?

Let me guess, you lamented the change from pinstripes to brushed metal, and then again when it shifted to gradient? Or how about when the Dock went from 2D to a shelf and then back again?

Sidenote: when the hell did we lose the ability to change the traffic lights to all one color like back in the graphite days?

 

[Spotlighter9]

Actually, I am still using Monterey and simply want to know if in Ventura when you are in an App like Mac Calendar and you select "preferences" from the "Calendar" drop down menu (assuming its still called "preferences" in the Calendar App)...has the UI changed to one like in the new Systems Settings App or is the UI the same as it was Monterey?

 

[MBAir2010]

Actually, I am still using Monterey and simply want to know if in Ventura when you are in an App like Mac Calendar and you select "preferences" from the "Calendar" drop down menu (assuming its still called "preferences" in the Calendar App)...has the UI changed to one like in the new Systems Settings App or is the UI the same as it was Monterey?

monterey:


Ventura:

 

[MBAir2010]

Did you reinstall the root patches, etc after updating? I'm sure you did, but had to ask...sounds like what I went through after updating to Big Sur on my 2009. Then reinstalled OCLP and all was good.

well I reinstalled the root packages just 10 minutes ago after having a bad slow typing experience this morning.
sure enough, that seemed to do the trick!
thanks!

 

[Spotlighter9]

monterey:
View attachment 2140791

Ventura:
View attachment 2140792

Thank you!!! It is a relief to see that at least Apple hasn't mucked with the UI in individual App preferences in Ventura, as I use these a lot more than System Preferences (now "Settings"). For all the talk about the changed "System Settings," I saw no talk about what if anything changed about in app Preferences.

BTW: I love your schedule for today!!

 

[MBAir2010]

Thank you!!! It is a relief to see that at least Apple hasn't mucked with the UI in individual App preferences in Ventura, as I use these a lot more than System Preferences (now "Settings"). For all the talk about the changed "System Settings," I saw no talk about what if anything changed about in app Preferences.

Your welcome, I thought I was over-doing my post
but a photo says 1000 words!

I was external skeptical about Ventura being an iPod last summer, but the OS is great!
personally I do prefer Monterey over Ventura, which is why in using Monterey now on the MBP'12
the Operating system is easier to use and more responsive for me.
an di got his working perfectly I hope!

 

[cyberstudio]

I do not use iPhone at all, started out with Mavericks 10.9, but I prefer the Ventura UI to Monterey's. In terms of stability there is not much of a difference because Ventura changes (especially the breaking ones) are often pushed to Monterey's security updates. They are equally bad or equally good depending on your perspective.