Is Apple 2-Factor Authentication a Roadway to Hell

Discussion in 'Apple Music, Apple Pay, iCloud, Apple Services' started by dwmreg, Aug 22, 2015.

  1. dwmreg macrumors member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2007
    #1
    All:

    I've had absolutely nothing but problems with iMessages on my iPad since May of this year. The problem seems to be tied to two-factor authentication and app specific passwords. It doesn't help that OS X and iOS often behave differently too. I think it's a complete train wreck since I'm unable to use Messages reliably on my iPad now. I've tried various things on iOS 8.4, 8.4.1 and finally iOS 9 beta. Messages will work for a short period of time up to several days and then completely stop working again for a the same time frame. I've tried literally everything and finally I wrote to Tim Cook and I have specific support now that just isn't getting me anywhere.

    So my question is - is anyone else in iMessages hell on their devices? Did you ever find a solution?
     
  2. Rigby macrumors 601

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2008
    Location:
    San Jose, CA
    #2
    I use 2-step authentication and have no problems with iMessage. Your symptoms sound more like some kind of connectivity issue. I also don't see how application passwords would have anything to do with it, since they are not needed for iMessage.
     
  3. dwmreg thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2007
    #3
    They are if you turn on 2-factor authentication. Eventually you'll be prompted to add an App Specific password for Messages and FaceTime. It's a completely confusing cluster ****.
     
  4. Rigby macrumors 601

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2008
    Location:
    San Jose, CA
    #4
    But only on the Mac. Why would that affect iMessages on your iPad?
     
  5. dwmreg thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2007
    #5
    Well once you've turned on 2-factor your iOS devices are supposed to prompt you to setup an application specific password for iMessage and FaceTime. This is where the confusion sets in - once that password is set up do you need to use it on OS X too? Or just iOS or both? I've been able to login with either this password or my Apple ID password on some devices, but not on all of them. Hence the confusion. Now for some reason for more than several days my iPad cannot login using either password. It won't even login with another Apple ID - although trying to do that while logged in with another one in iCloud may have caused this. Still experimenting and loath to turn off the primary Apple ID for iCloud on the iPad since that part works.
     
  6. Rigby macrumors 601

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2008
    Location:
    San Jose, CA
    #6
    You shouldn't need application passwords on iOS 8 or later.
    Have you tried logging out everywhere and logging back in with a single Apple ID? I wouldn't be surprised if trying to use multiple Apple IDs confuses the system.
     
  7. Primejimbo macrumors 68040

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2008
    Location:
    Around
    #7
    Yes you do need it, I have one for my iPhone, iPad, and MacBook. Here is a picture of what it looks like when it asks you to set it up.

    No issues what so ever. While I don't like how they use app specific passwords, it works fine.
     

    Attached Files:

  8. Rigby, Aug 23, 2015
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2015

    Rigby macrumors 601

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2008
    Location:
    San Jose, CA
    #8
    I use Facetime and iMessage on my iPhone and iPad and never even generated an application password.

    EDIT: OK, I just checked and I'm actually only using them on the iPhone, with my phone number as the address. In that case you don't have to enter an app-specific password. You do if you want to be reachable by Apple ID.

    This requirement should go away in iOS 9 (which is aware of 2-step authentication system-wide). Sorry for the confusion!
     
  9. Richdmoore macrumors 68000

    Richdmoore

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2007
    Location:
    Troutdale, OR
    #9
    I use 2 factor as well, when I restore iOS or OS X systems I always need to mess with it. After that, however I have never had to reset it again (unless I change something.)

    For now I am living with it, as I rarely need to wipe a computer/iOS device. I then will generate a new password (older passwords saved to the notepad app don't work, not sure why, are they are time sensitive?)

    I think the real solution is to upgrade to OS X/iOS next versions that work systemwide with the 2 factor.
     
  10. dwmreg thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2007
    #10
    All I know is that my experience with it is a complete train wreck. I'm an experienced user and not a noob.
     
  11. Tech198, Aug 26, 2015
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2015

    Tech198 macrumors G4

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2011
    Location:
    Australia, Perth
    #11
    The way Apple does their two factor is 'unique' and not how i would have implemented it..

    U need to set up a 'trusted device' with Find m iPhone.....Why ? i just want 2 factor..

    Google doesn't enforce this step, and the single most bad solution that prevents me from using it...

    I'm sure Apple does it good once done, but i refuse to set up a trusted device just to switch of something for which i have no use in using find my iphone..... Yes i can remove it afterwards, but why is is there if i do not need it ?

    I don't use iMessage, because it bugs me every time i run out of credit on prepaid with "Trasnaction failed" iPhone sends text over cellular network to Apple in order to verify phone number... since their is no credit, because i only use data preitty much i get a bounce back which i take as spam. (a lot of sms's per minute).

    so, i disable iMessage, since i am not topping up credit because i'll never use it.
     
  12. Primejimbo macrumors 68040

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2008
    Location:
    Around
    #12
    2 step verification going away in iOS 9? That doesn't make sense
     
  13. Rigby macrumors 601

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2008
    Location:
    San Jose, CA
    #13
    It's also not what I wrote.
     
  14. dwmreg thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2007
    #14
    Well my problem is that it will work for a period of time on my iPad. Then it stops and then the cycle starts over again. I think the problem is that I had devices on iOS 8.xxx and iOS 9.xx. The iPad was on the latter and my iPhone on the former. I also had a mac running the beta of El Cap 10.11. Apple has told me that the expected behavior on iOS 9 is to use your Apple ID password and login. I'm only using one pair of those I'm not mixing anything. I think this is yet another example of how Apple sucks with Cloud services. The problem is on the back end. I'm really hating Apple this weekend in a big way. I've been dealing with this problem since May!!!!
     
  15. zorinlynx macrumors 601

    zorinlynx

    Joined:
    May 31, 2007
    Location:
    Florida, USA
    #15
    You should probably talk to your provider about this. It sounds like they need to whitelist the number Apple uses for iMessage verification, to always allow sending no matter what if the account is active.
     
  16. zorinlynx macrumors 601

    zorinlynx

    Joined:
    May 31, 2007
    Location:
    Florida, USA
    #16
    My big problem with 2-step is that it gets in the way all the time. It's not something that's implemented in the typical Apple manner of "easy to use".

    For instance, once a device has been verified with 2-Step, it shouldn't ask you to verify again. Yet it does. I find myself verifying with 2-Step every time I log into icloud.com from my computer even though I already verified. Is it that hard to save a cookie?

    I often feel like just turning it off, but I like the added security it provides. I just wish they'd make the experience more seamless.
     
  17. Weaselboy Moderator

    Weaselboy

    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2005
    Location:
    California
    #17
    I wonder if you are deleting Safari local storage data for iCloud and that is why you have to reenter all the time. I never have this issue with Safari.
     
  18. dwmreg thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2007
    #18
    Here's an update - I'm still having intermittent issues logging into and keeping Messages logged in on my iPad air 2. I've been on the phone, emails, etc. with Apple now for a long time. I've had enough. There have been zero problems - so far - thank goodness on all of my devices except the iPad. So there has to be something tied to my particular iPad air 2. So today I decided I've had enough since the device isn't working again. I've asked them to replace it. I didn't have problems logging into Messages (or FaceTime the two are related) on an iPad air at work.
     
  19. Tech198 macrumors G4

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2011
    Location:
    Australia, Perth
    #19
    The way Apple implements it by a "trust" of needing an app like Find my iPhone and/or logged into icloud just to set it up is beyond me.

    u would like a text to your phone only would just work...... But i could not get my get sms'd every time i try and set it up.

    I'm not gonna use iMessage or iCloud just because Apple "asks" me to just to enable something, only to turn it off later...


    Apple has their way of dealing with security, and so do I :p
     
  20. dwmreg thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2007
    #20
    Update!

    As of October 19th I'm now at a point where the following is true:

    1) I cannot log into Messages or FaceTime on my iPad air 2. I have had intermittent access since April, but not I cannot use either service on my iPad. This is the longest time ever for it not to work at all - nearly three weeks.
    2) I can take my Apple ID and log into another iPad with no issues.
    3) An Apple supplied test account cannot log into my iPad, but it can log into another iPad I've tried.
    4) Turning off Two Factor authentication doesn't help.
    5) My iPad Air 2 never prompts for the device to send the four digit pin to when two factor authentication is on, but the prompt appears on other iPads. This is one of the three reasons (#2, #3 and #5) I believe my device needs to be replaced.

    All signs point to the iPad air 2 I have being the problem. Yet Apple continues to refuse to replace it. The one year warranty is almost up and I've got AppleCare+ so that extended it. However, I've waited seven months for a fix and i've gotten no where. Apple is close mouthed and keeps me in the dark about what they are doing. Working with their Exec Team isn't getting me anywhere. I'm now faced with the only thing left to me - filing a civil lawsuit in small claims court to recoup the cost of my iPad Air 2, accessories and AppleCare+ as well as the cost of the time I've spent troubleshooting for them. What ticks me off is that they could capture my device and test to their hearts content, but they continue to refuse to replace the device which seems like the logical thing to do.

    It looks like my situation hasn't happened to anyone else I've talked to yet.
     
  21. High Above Texas macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2016
    #21
    It totally sucks. It's a train wreck and the Titannic all rolled into one and I bet Steve Jobs is rolling in his grave wondering why current leadership at Apple is no longer making a computer "for the rest of us" as was their advertising/marketing effort long ago that lead me to my first Apple product called a LISA (before the Mac.)
     
  22. Peepo macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2009
    #22
    I've never had a problem with 2 factor and I use an iPad, iPhone, iMac, and MacBook Pro. I use FaceTime and iMessage in all devices and everything syncs. I have my phone number and Apple ID enabled also. If I use a different computer or browser I can send a code to my sms or iPad and then choose the device as trusted for future logins. I also have the recovery code printed out in a safe place if I ever lose both my phone and iPad (pretty difficult to lose my phone number permanently though). Reading this thread surprises me because I never experienced anything at all like this.
     
  23. fivenotrump macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2009
    Location:
    Central England
    #23
    This discussion surprises me, as I've no problems with the newer two-factor thing. I cannot speak about the previous two-step method. Perhaps worth switching?
     
  24. bruinsrme macrumors 601

    bruinsrme

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2008
    #24
    I use it.
    When a code comes in Windows on my screen pop up and things start chiming.
    Feels like I hit a slot in Vegas
     
  25. kalsta macrumors 68000

    kalsta

    Joined:
    May 17, 2010
    Location:
    Australia
    #25
    This has been my experience with two-factor authentication too. The documentation suggests that it should only ask for a code when you 'sign in to a new device for the first time', but every time I turn around I'm getting asked for an authentication code. People in my Family Sharing can't do anything without it asking for my permission either, and sometimes we're not in the same location so it's ridiculously inconvenient. Once my kids were just trying to update an app or something, and I get a message saying that an iPad in another city (some 300+ km away from where the iPad actually was) was trying to log into my account.

    But this one has to take the cake… When I was using the Apple ID site tonight on my Mac to try and turn the damned thing off, I got asked for a code and then the code got displayed on the very same Mac—right in front of where I was supposed to be entering the code. Yup, that sure makes me confident in Apple's security!

    I'm glad to hear it's working for some people, but for me two-factor authentication is as buggy as hell—like so much of my experience with all things Apple in recent years sadly.
     

Share This Page