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Is it just me, or is the real purpose of Genius..

F

FJR

macrumors regular
Original poster
Jul 21, 2008
204
0
to get play info. So apple can better run the iTunes store. And make more money.

Package it as a "feature" and they can get all kinds of valuable info on things like "how many people listen to the beatles?" "What percentage of users have only part of the beatles catalog and would thus seem to be likely customers if we got the beatles?" etc. I am sure this info, even if it is sent anonmously, is extremely valuable.
 
Well, it is optional, and they say the data is sent anonymously, which means it shouldn't be linked to any personal data that could identify who is listening to what.

But then AT&T also said it wasn't spying on its customers, and we know that was a big fat lie.
 
I think it more for them to get an idea of what you are listening to so they can direct you to that kind of music in itunes hoping you will buy.
 
FJR said:
to get play info. So apple can better run the app store. And make more money.

Package it as a "feature" and they can get all kinds of valuable info on things like "how many people listen to the beatles?" "What percentage of users have only part of the beatles catalog and would thus seem to be likely customers if we got the beatles?" etc. I am sure this info, even if it is sent anonmously, is extremely valuable.
Click to expand...

Well, yeah - obviously.

You know those "How'd we do?" cards at restaurants? Yup, you got it - just trying to get INFO from you to BETTER run their STORES!

Oh, the humanity.
 
Of course its sole purpose is to make money, just like the sole purpose of the iTunes store by itself is to sell! It's already got me on one song that I bought just because it popped up on the sidebar :p I'm liking the fact that it's giving recommendations on songs that I would have never thought of, or even haven't heard that I might like.
 
Just what I was thinking, tageted sales adverts are just around the corner...

'Complete your collection of "Oops I did it again" singles...'

Also possibly some 'pay per play' pricing analysis ready for that rented music we are all looking forward too.

Anyway, it's valuable data for sure, hope they are paying for it ;)
 
I didn't mean this as a criticism. Its smart, obviously.

TO the person who asked how knowing your listening habits helps them make money. You have to be kidding? Knowing what every single person who listens to iTunes is listening to, what they rate it, how often they listen to it, etc is EXTREMELY valuable. For everything from what to charge for certain albums, when to put certain albums on sale, how prominently to feature them on the iTunes store front page. And that's not even looking at the obvious of "genius recommendations".

I don't know that apple would do it, but I also imagine they could sell this info to record labels so they could know better how to market their artists. Radio stations would probably like to know what people WANT to hear, what they listen to on their personal computers, etc.
 
WannaApple? said:
Of course its sole purpose is to make money, just like the sole purpose of the iTunes store by itself is to sell! It's already got me on one song that I bought just because it popped up on the sidebar :p I'm liking the fact that it's giving recommendations on songs that I would have never thought of, or even haven't heard that I might like.
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I am only really getting recommendations from the same artist. Very few "you might like" recommendations.

I like the playlist its generated thus from shakermaker (by oasis). Next song was Tender by Blur (kind of obvious, but I have kinda forgotten how much I like this songs).

Just wish it would expand an entire playlist instead of just one song.

Say for instance I have a playlist of 10 songs. Instead of just taking one song and making a playlist from that, it takes the whole playlist and teases out links between the songs and also expands on each song to form a shuffling playlist that can be arbitrarily long. It could basically take the place of "party shuffle". Party shuffle is great, except for its propensity to play crappy songs repeatedly.
 
FJR said:
TO the person who asked how knowing your listening habits helps them make money. You have to be kidding?
Click to expand...

I assume you are talking to me.

You said app store. That was my only reason for commenting. The app store has nothing to do with Genius.
 
FJR said:
I don't know that apple would do it, but I also imagine they could sell this info to record labels so they could know better how to market their artists. Radio stations would probably like to know what people WANT to hear, what they listen to on their personal computers, etc.
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Billboard, TRL, SoundScan, and so forth do this already, pretty much.

Besides, I'm pretty sure Record Execs only care about sales ... not who's actually musically gifted ;)
 
cellocello said:
Billboard, TRL, SoundScan, and so forth do this already, pretty much.

Besides, I'm pretty sure Record Execs only care about sales ... not who's actually musically gifted ;)
Click to expand...

yeah, but each of those have their limitations. Say Rhino wants to know what the market is for a new Miles Davis compilation. They can get pretty amazing figures from Apple on how much people have played Miles Davis recently, how many people have a little Miles Davis or similar artists, but not enough such that a compilation would be redundant, etc.

They can also get information on how disappointed users have been with certain purchases (apple sends your ratings and play info). Say Virgin is deciding on whether or not to renew an artists contract, they can take into account that even though a lot of people bought the last record, not that many liked it (rated it poorly and didn't replay it very much), and thus might be cold to a new album.
 
WannaApple? said:
Of course its sole purpose is to make money.
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Precisely. You can't get any more 'targeted advertising' than this. Trust Apple to wrap it up in "this is a good thing for the consumer". :) It is, in a way. But just trust them to spin it a thousand miles away from its real purpose - ie. to generate more revenue.

It's nothing new. Amazon has been doing it for donkey's years. Apple are VERY late to the party.
 
I figured this thread was going to say: ... to collect information on people who aren't paying for their music and selling them out to the authorities .
 
I'd also like to know if genius is sending info about the formats used and if the music was purchased or ripped... Also if id3 tags info was sent, they could get an estimate of pirated music...

This might worry some...;)
 
ictiosapiens said:
I'd also like to know if genius is sending info about the formats used and if the music was purchased or ripped... Also if id3 tags info was sent, they could get an estimate of pirated music...

This might worry some...;)
Click to expand...

Ok...so an id3 tag is going to tell someone that you ripped your OWN CD's that you bought and paid for to listen to on your own system and the CD that you borrowed from Joe Snuffy down the block and ripped cause you didn't own it and the Lime Wire download that you truly did steal....all in .mp3 format....hmmm :confused:

I am not worried in the least...every song I own, I paid for!!!
 
SFC Archer said:
Ok...so an id3 tag is going to tell someone that you ripped your OWN CD's that you bought and paid for to listen to on your own system and the CD that you borrowed from Joe Snuffy down the block and ripped cause you didn't own it and the Lime Wire download that you truly did steal....all in .mp3 format....hmmm :confused:

I am not worried in the least...every song I own, I paid for!!!
Click to expand...

Friendly post...

As it happens, often pirates like to brag about how much music they publish, so they write the ripper's name or website on the id3... You may also notice that some pirated mp3s tend not to have very accurate info on their id3... When the average Joe rips his cds with itunes, chances are itunes will get the album info and fill the id3 for him... And like I said, this can easily give apple an estimate of how much of your music is truly yours...
 
ictiosapiens said:
Friendly post...

As it happens, often pirates like to brag about how much music they publish, so they write the ripper's name or website on the id3... You may also notice that some pirated mp3s tend not to have very accurate info on their id3... When the average Joe rips his cds with itunes, chances are itunes will get the album info and fill the id3 for him... And like I said, this can easily give apple an estimate of how much of your music is truly yours...
Click to expand...

And its just a friendly reply...not bashing your post at all...just asking questions:)

I would not know about the first part of this reply as I have never pirated or taken any music/videos off of the net. I used to buy through Windows Media Store and only changed to iTunes last year when I purchased the iPhone. If idiots are putting their own tags on songs they pirate/offer to public then they ALL deserve to get caught and burned.

But my question still stands...its perfectly fine for me to use MY CD's however I decide for MY own use. If I "Borrow" a CD from family, friend or acquaintance and rip it then how can the id3 tag tell the difference if they are all ripped from my library, borrowed and ripped, stolen and ripped, etc. :confused:
 
SFC Archer said:
...But my question still stands...its perfectly fine for me to use MY CD's however I decide for MY own use. If I "Borrow" a CD from family, friend or acquaintance and rip it then how can the id3 tag tell the difference if they are all ripped from my library, borrowed and ripped, stolen and ripped, etc. :confused:
Click to expand...

No, it can't tell the difference... But more blatant piracy can easily be detected...
 
ictiosapiens said:
No, it can't tell the difference... But more blatant piracy can easily be detected...
Click to expand...

That's what I thought, therefore I think that your original post is something that is not being tracked or monitored and thus should not be a concern to anyone because it is impossible to prove the piracy through just the id3 tag and would have no merit in court.

I also do not think that Apple has the time to track, store and then turn over to the music labels for prosecution. It would also take a court order to get data from Apple by a Music label for prosecution of such data and Apple has their own problems with law suits right now.

At the most, the Genius is another way for Apple to sell music by telling you what is missing from your Genius created playlist. If it drives people to buy more music then its more money for Apple and they track the numbers of songs downloaded since....(date).... so that at the next Mac World they have new numbers to brag about and say how much better they are doing then Wal Mart and Amazon.
 
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