AusMacFan

macrumors member
Original poster
Jul 31, 2010
42
24
So, I don't mean to beat a dead horse, but with with the retina mbp refresh I have been considering getting the retina 13".

Coming from an early 2010 15" mbp (dual core i7), portability is a big issue form me. I'm sick of lugging around a lare/heavy computer and look forward to having something a bit more manageable.

However, with the discussion about a possible Haswell upgrade in Q3 or Q4 2013, it begs the question, are the 13" Ivy Bridge models sufficient powerful for a smooth experience?

I want to be able to use it on the highest or second highest scaling option, and my understanding is that those options impact performance. Also, there's been a bit of back and forth on whether the machine suffers from scroll lag or not. Is it possible to run it at 1680*1050 scaling without scroll lag in safari (or webkit) and native apps?

I don't want to end up with a computer that feels half baked, but if the Ivy Bridge models are sufficient enough than I might just bite the bullet and buy now instead of waiting for an August/September Haswell refresh.
 

KPOM

macrumors P6
Oct 23, 2010
16,149
4,963
I have the 2.5GHz version and like it a lot. Today's price drop and spec bump just make it that much better. You can get a 3.0GHz i7 model now for just $20 more than what I paid back in December (after a reseller discount) for a 2.5GHz i5. Haswell will be focused more on battery life, and while the GPU improvements will be nice, it will still be an IGP. But for most people integrated graphics is just fine. It will be a step up from your 2010.

BTW, the next version of Safari should improve the scrolling. People who download the nightly Webkit builds have noticed an improvement over the past few weeks. It's a software, not a hardware issue.
 

AusMacFan

macrumors member
Original poster
Jul 31, 2010
42
24
It's a software, not a hardware issue.

That's good news, hopefully 10.9 development focuses on retina optimisation. Also, what scaling option do you run it on, and is there any performance/screen quality hits for the higher options?
 

KPOM

macrumors P6
Oct 23, 2010
16,149
4,963
That's good news, hopefully 10.9 development focuses on retina optimisation. Also, what scaling option do you run it on, and is there any performance/screen quality hits for the higher options?

Usually I run it at Best for Retina (1280x800) but I've run it at 1440x900 and haven't noticed a performance hit.
 

ncrypt

macrumors 6502
May 16, 2012
343
240
UK
I have been considering getting the retina 13".

I'd be interested to know what you have decided?

I'm in a pretty similar situation to you where I'd rather not wait (you don't even want to know what kinda machine I'm stuck with right now..), but yet I need this machine to be good as it'll be my primary computer throughout uni.
 

Davmeister

macrumors 6502
May 7, 2009
331
87
London
I have the 2.5GHz version and like it a lot. Today's price drop and spec bump just make it that much better. You can get a 3.0GHz i7 model now for just $20 more than what I paid back in December (after a reseller discount) for a 2.5GHz i5. Haswell will be focused more on battery life, and while the GPU improvements will be nice, it will still be an IGP. But for most people integrated graphics is just fine. It will be a step up from your 2010.

BTW, the next version of Safari should improve the scrolling. People who download the nightly Webkit builds have noticed an improvement over the past few weeks. It's a software, not a hardware issue.

How long till this version of Safari? I've just started using the Webkit builds and made it as safari like as possible with the same icon and the FPS is amazing...why is it taking them so long to build this kit into Safari? Been out since December 4th 2012...
 

chrisrosemusic1

macrumors 6502a
Jan 31, 2012
693
21
Northamptonshire, England
I love mine. It runs beautifully smooth using multiple plugins on Ableton running at max resolution (more space mode).

I have base configuration and I've come from an i7 2.8 MBP.

Also, the form factor and weight make the old style MacBook look archaic and ugly. It's simply the most beautiful laptop I've ever owned.

Just to let you know also, that the HD4000 is running at 768mb of Video RAM which is 256mb more than my HD3000 was with 8GB RAM. I think that'll be more than enough for day to day use..

Haswell will probably bring 1GB of GPU power but again, it's integrated. I'm not worried about it.
 

LachlanH

macrumors regular
Oct 5, 2011
158
7
In regards to Haswell, the Macbook Pro line won't see much CPU increase.
Probably around 10% performance gain is all you can expect on the CPU side.

The CPU's used in the Pro's won't even see that much battery benefit. The huge improvements in battery life that Haswell will bring are all to do with the Ultra Low Voltage CPU's that will work their way into tablets and Macbook Air's.

Really the only real tangible benefit Haswell will bring to the 13" line will be regarding the GT3 graphics instead of the HD4000 of Ivy Bridge.

However again, GT3, while an improvement on HD4000, won't be an epic boost. For that, you need the GT3E CPU's, which have the embeded DRAM. This is rumoured to add a significant cost to the CPU's so it's quite likely they won't be the default CPU's chosen by Apple to go into the Macbook Pro/Air's. Possibly they will show up as a BTO option, but at this stage we really don't know, and certainly cannot count it as a certainty.

In other words, If you need a new laptop and are considering a Macbook Pro, buy now, otherwise you have a long wait ahead.
 

vatter69

macrumors 6502a
Feb 4, 2013
539
494
Get the new 3.0 i7 , it also has 200 mhz on the GPU clock compared to the i5 stock model. (Might be true for the old 2.9 i7 too, not sure).

That's as fast as it currently gets and as others pointed out, using Webkit instead of Safari (looks exactly the same) will eliminate scrolling lag, which was only really visible on a handful of bad designed web sites (yes 500 high res gfx on the front page is bad design imo, not everyone has 100m connections).

As far as resolution goes - i went to the Apple store, loaded up 20 tabs with various websites, had a full hd movie downloaded from apple/trailers and had it played in Quicktime - watched Avatar 1080p video on Youtube while browsing photos in iPhoto.

I then checked various resolutions up to 1650x1050 and didnt really notice anything beside bigger real estate and slighly less retina beauty (still tons better than every other screen in the world save for the big 15" brother).

It was still a very beautiful and fast experience. That got me sold and i no longer care for this UI/Haswell talk. I ordered. Your move Apple!
 

chrise2

macrumors 6502
Sep 17, 2012
454
10
I have the 13" retina and its awesome. All these Haswell talkers will never buy a laptop as they will always be waiting for the next thing that's coming out. It will be a little faster. The graphics will be a little smoother. 3D games will probably run at a slightly less useless rate of 12 fps instead of 8 fps. Who cares? Not I.
 

eljimberino

macrumors member
Feb 13, 2013
38
0
Get the new 3.0 i7 , it also has 200 mhz on the GPU clock compared to the i5 stock model. (Might be true for the old 2.9 i7 too, not sure).

That's as fast as it currently gets and as others pointed out, using Webkit instead of Safari (looks exactly the same) will eliminate scrolling lag, which was only really visible on a handful of bad designed web sites (yes 500 high res gfx on the front page is bad design imo, not everyone has 100m connections).

As far as resolution goes - i went to the Apple store, loaded up 20 tabs with various websites, had a full hd movie downloaded from apple/trailers and had it played in Quicktime - watched Avatar 1080p video on Youtube while browsing photos in iPhoto.

I then checked various resolutions up to 1650x1050 and didnt really notice anything beside bigger real estate and slighly less retina beauty (still tons better than every other screen in the world save for the big 15" brother).

It was still a very beautiful and fast experience. That got me sold and i no longer care for this UI/Haswell talk. I ordered. Your move Apple!


WOW. You really think the 3.0 is worth that much more than the 2.5? $550AUD?
 

eljimberino

macrumors member
Feb 13, 2013
38
0
OK. But you think they are definately worth the extra? I'm going to bite the bullet in the next few days...

But I agree, waiting seems pointless.
 

KPOM

macrumors P6
Oct 23, 2010
16,149
4,963
How long till this version of Safari? I've just started using the Webkit builds and made it as safari like as possible with the same icon and the FPS is amazing...why is it taking them so long to build this kit into Safari? Been out since December 4th 2012...

I'm guessing it's coming with 10.8.3, which is in its later development builds according to the Mac Blog here.
 

vatter69

macrumors 6502a
Feb 4, 2013
539
494
If i had to pay that much for the upgrade to the i7 i would probably wait a bit before the first reviews come out for the new CPU.

Then you can still make up your mind.
 

vatter69

macrumors 6502a
Feb 4, 2013
539
494
The 2.9 i7 also has the higher gpu clock, only 1250 though ;) So if you just were to get the base model with 128 GB SSD, then the upgrade price would be similar, like close to 200. Im not sure if it has any effect on real world performance though - just saying, if you want to max it out - that's the way to go.

Again, i did all my testing on 2.5 stock unit and everything was fine as it is.

http://ark.intel.com/products/64893/Intel-Core-i7-3520M-Processor-4M-Cache-up-to-3_60-GHz
 

Modernape

macrumors regular
Jun 21, 2010
224
36
They're about to release 10.8.3, with graphics driver updates and a new version of Safari (no doubt), so that will be the real point at which to make a decision. Mine is a 2.5 i5 and most of the time it works smoothly, but maybe once or twice a day it stutters on a website scroll. Not a big deal really, but if they can fix it with the update, then I'll be 100% happy with this machine.
 

eljimberino

macrumors member
Feb 13, 2013
38
0
Well, as the pricing set up would like you to be seduced:

You want a 256G SSD so you look at the 2.6 because that's cheaper than upgrading the SSD on the 2.5.

Then you're like, may aswell upgrade the CPU as I'm going to have the computer for a few years.

Way I look at it; if you're buying a computer once every 3-4 years. Go the top and forget about it.

Or, that's why I'm on this forum, get the base model because it makes very little difference. Spend the difference on a ipad mini.
 

Modernape

macrumors regular
Jun 21, 2010
224
36
Whatever you buy, whenever you buy it, there will be a refresh six months later which will be better, then a significant spec shift a year later which will be better still, and then further improvements the year after that which will make you consider upgrading. There is rarely a 'best time to buy' - so buy the best right now and upgrade when you can afford to, that's all you need to know.
 

mtntrance

macrumors member
May 2, 2008
68
0
Palm Desert, CA
I am thinking I will go for the base 256 ssd i5 2.5. The cost difference for the i7 2.9 is $316 more. In addition I am getting AppleCare bundled on the i5 and not on the i7 with that same price difference. I just don't think the performance difference will be worth it for me. If go for the i7 I might as well get a base 15.4. I like the form factor of the 13 and I am stepping down from a early 2011 17 with upgraded ram of 8. With i7 or i5 I am going to have a performance drop.
 

kgeier82

macrumors 65816
Feb 18, 2008
1,014
0
Baltimore, MD
I am thinking I will go for the base 256 ssd i5 2.5. The cost difference for the i7 2.9 is $316 more. In addition I am getting AppleCare bundled on the i5 and not on the i7 with that same price difference. I just don't think the performance difference will be worth it for me. If go for the i7 I might as well get a base 15.4. I like the form factor of the 13 and I am stepping down from a early 2011 17 with upgraded ram of 8. With i7 or i5 I am going to have a performance drop.

Did the same. Bye bye 17. Hello new sexy lol
 

kgeier82

macrumors 65816
Feb 18, 2008
1,014
0
Baltimore, MD
I have both a 13 and loaded 15. The 13 is awesome and small. But the 15 is power just having fan issues.

13 with a 256 refurbed was awesome deal.
 

richorlin

macrumors regular
Sep 19, 2007
103
1
Base 13" rMBP

Price is an issue for me, so as soon as the price drops were announced, I opted for a refurbished 13" rMBP base model for $1359. Couldn't be more happier. Small, light AND powerful.
 
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