Is Touch Bar that bad?

[Nugget]

The Touch Bar is nice to have but not a necessity. I don’t think Apple will get rid of it, though. If they were, they likely wouldn’t have added it to the base 13” Pro.

They didn’t add it to the base 13” Pro, it’s always been available on that model for as long as the Touch Bar has existed. What they did do recently is discontinue the non-touchbar version of the 13” mbp.

None of the new machines that Apple have released since the 2016 debut of the touchbar have had one. It remains limited to just the current form factor of MacBook Pro.

None of the desktops got it, and the only other laptop — the air — didn’t get it.

Apple don’t seem to have a lot of enthusiasm for it, or confidence in it.

 

[MacNut]

The Touch Bar is what it is. It doesn't bother me but I also would not care if it never existed.

 

[MrMister111]

The Touch Bar is what it is. It doesn't bother me but I also would not care if it never existed.

I think that’s a lot of people’s opinion. Some do, some don’t....

The Touch Bar is nice to have but not a necessity. I don’t think Apple will get rid of it, though. If they were, they likely wouldn’t have added it to the base 13” Pro.

Think it may stay as a “Pro” addition as all have it now. It can be developed further, with rapid feedback etc.

I honestly bought it because it intrigued me and just looked "awesome." The technology is basically an Apple Watch 0 crammed into a laptop. That mesmerized me at day 1. However, now the ONLY thing I use it for is adjusting volume or scrolling thru a video on YouTube.

The Siri button is nice....and the TouchID is used CONSTANTLY though.

I understand what you’re saying, it must be great on day 1, and then wears off a bit.

But I imagine that there is shortcuts in certain programs that are handy, and apart from volume and brightness, the other function keys for a lot of people aren’t used anyway, so surely it’s a bonus in some ways as it also seems quite customisable

 

[phas3]

using BetterTouchTool definitely makes my touchbar more useful. The fact alone that I can have a button on the touchbar to instantly put my MBP to sleep is very useful for me.

 

[MrMister111]

using BetterTouchTool definitely makes my touchbar more useful. The fact alone that I can have a button on the touchbar to instantly put my MBP to sleep is very useful for me.

In what is this tool better than what Apple allow please? I’ve seen on sites that you can modify, add/remove/move buttons via the settings anyway?

Thanks

 

[casperes1996]

They didn’t add it to the base 13” Pro, it’s always been available on that model for as long as the Touch Bar has existed. What they did do recently is discontinue the non-touchbar version of the 13” mbp.

Incorrect. There were more physical differences between the base and TB models than the TB. The entry level MBP keeps the baseline's speakers and cooling system but adds the TB, making it an addition of TB to the base, rather than moving the whole range up the stack.
In any case it's a semantic difference, the end result is the same.

 

[Nugget]

Incorrect. There were more physical differences between the base and TB models than the TB. The entry level MBP keeps the baseline's speakers and cooling system but adds the TB, making it an addition of TB to the base, rather than moving the whole range up the stack.
In any case it's a semantic difference, the end result is the same.

None of what you said here is related to what I said. Apple have not added the TouchBar to any Mac since the debut of the TouchBar in 2016. TouchBar was initially offered on the 13" MBP and the 15" MBP and that remains the case today.

KPOM is perhaps confused by the news from this past July where the non-TB 13" MBP was discontinued.

Edit: You know what? You're right and I'm totally wrong here, sorry. I never realized that they did add the TouchBar to the low-end two port 13". For some reason I was thinking that they'd dropped that model entirely when they dumped the NTB version. Mea Culpa.

Related, they have since released several major updates and new products (MacBook Air, iMac Pro, new generation Mac Mini) and have declined to include the TouchBar on those major product launches. I think on the whole, we can infer that Apple do not have a lot of enthusiasm for the TouchBar since they've chosen not to include it beyond the initial 2016 launch on the MBP line.

I'm curious to see if it survives the inevitable MacBook Pro redesign, whenever that ends up happening.

 

[KPOM]

Incorrect. There were more physical differences between the base and TB models than the TB. The entry level MBP keeps the baseline's speakers and cooling system but adds the TB, making it an addition of TB to the base, rather than moving the whole range up the stack.
In any case it's a semantic difference, the end result is the same.

Also, the base has 2 Thunderbolt ports instead of 4.

 

[MrMister111]

Also, the base has 2 Thunderbolt ports instead of 4.

This spec difference is this between the new 13” 2019 2 thunderbolt version as well?

Can you tell me what the differences are between the 13” 2019 2 thunderbolt and others please

 

[casperes1996]

Related, they have since released several major updates and new products (MacBook Air, iMac Pro, new generation Mac Mini) and have declined to include the TouchBar on those major product launches. I think on the whole, we can infer that Apple do not have a lot of enthusiasm for the TouchBar since they've chosen not to include it beyond the initial 2016 launch on the MBP line.

I'm curious to see if it survives the inevitable MacBook Pro redesign, whenever that ends up happening.

And also the not released, but announced, Mac Pro tower. It's keyboard is a new Apple Extended Magic Keyboard with number pad... And what do you know, 19 F keys just like we used to have on the extended keyboards... I love those 19 F keys. So many programmable keys...

Don't know though. They did add a form of "Touch Bar" to sidecar on iPad working as a second display for a Mac. And all the code that interacts with the TouchBar and the frameworks to allow developers to interact with it and such has been really well crafted. I struggle to see them just abandoning all that in a way. And leaving it a thing where it's only on SideCar... I don't know about you but if I were developing an app I wouldn't bother with it then. Now that it's so prominent on MacBook Pro, even though the TB equipped models may be a relatively small part of the market, I'd want to make my app work with it, because it's so glaring if it doesn't. If Apple kills the TouchBar, they don't just kill it for future hardware. They kill it for future software, which would really suck for those invested in the current hardware. But by that same token I suppose, better do it early than drag it out if it's gonna die anyway. Minimise the number of people who'll have the TouchBar if it gets relegated to nothing more than touch screen F keys, as nothing but Apple software codes for it.

Personally I do think it'll stick around though. I don't think it'll be on desktops, ever. But I do think that the MacBook Air will get it one day. And all future MacBook Pro models.
Reason I don't think desktops will get it, is the distance from display to keyboard is greater, making the experience of looking down at the bar an even bigger inconvenience. And strapping it to the chin of a display instead fixes the eye issue, but raises a hand issue (pun intended). That's why touch screen Macs aren't a thing

 

[MacGizmo]

I think the Touchbar is awesome, I just don't use it all that much. And Apple has done no favors to anyone by completely ignoring it and not making it MUCH more customizable. But it is a very cool piece of tech.

If Apple had ADDED the Touchbar above instead of REPLACING the F-Key row, people would probably love it.

 

[MrMister111]

And Apple has done no favors to anyone by completely ignoring it and not making it MUCH more customizable. But it is a very cool piece of tech.

I thought it was customisable though, looking at Apple YT videos seems you can drag and drop buttons and rearrange?

If Apple had ADDED the Touchbar above instead of REPLACING the F-Key row, people would probably love it.

looking at rumours they’ve maybe listened about a physical escape key, and separate TouchID.

 

[MacGizmo]

I thought it was customisable though, looking at Apple YT videos seems you can drag and drop buttons and rearrange?

looking at rumours they’ve maybe listened about a physical escape key, and separate TouchID.

You can drag & drop a select few things that Apple has chosen to allow you to do. It's basically untouchable by default. There are, however, hacks out there that can make it much more useful. I think BetterTouch Tool is one of them.

As far as the rumors go, I hope that is true - I see the picture in the resource files in Catalina... but it only shows one side of the keyboard (the touch id side) and the rest is speculation until Apple releases something. I'm hopeful that a 16" MBP is released soon, as I really need a laptop (for tax write-off purposes) this year—but I'm not willing to spend big money on two-year-old tech at this point.

I'm probably going to end up getting an 11" iPad Pro with keyboard & pencil if they don't release the laptops soon.

 

[Lakersfan74]

Just got mine. Haven’t used the touch bar much but don’t mind it. I would be ok with or without it.

 

[MrMister111]

Just got mine. Haven’t used the touch bar much but don’t mind it. I would be ok with or without it.

Which model and spec out of interest? Are you missing the physical keys as a lot seem to? How often are the F physical used, can’t think I do much tbh

 

[chrono1081]

The Touch Bar is great. It's likely most people bitching about it haven't used it or tried it for a split second in the store. This is very obvious when you see peoples gripes about it, gripes like "There's no more F keys!/Escape key!" Yes, there is. You can set the Touch Bar however you want.

It's super useful when apps take advantage of it and can save a lot of time moving from keyboard to mouse. Xcode is one example, instead of memorizing a million different keyboard commands for different features of the iOS simulator, they're all in the Touch Bar and I just tap the one I want.

 

[Nugget]

. . .save a lot of time moving from keyboard to mouse. . .

Why do you use a mouse when you have a trackpad much closer to the keyboard? When you figure out the answer to that you may begin to understand why people don't find the touch bar to be a suitable replacement for a physical Esc key. For people who actually use the Esc key, it's a terrible alternative.

 

[pshufd]

Why do you use a mouse when you have a trackpad much closer to the keyboard? When you figure out the answer to that you may begin to understand why people don't find the touch bar to be a suitable replacement for a physical Esc key. For people who actually use the Esc key, it's a terrible alternative.

A mouse is more accurate and it's more useful if you have to move or select things across a long scaled distance.

 

[Nugget]

A mouse is more accurate and it's more useful if you have to move or select things across a long scaled distance.

Perhaps chrono1081 might say "People bitching about about the track pad haven't used it or tried it for a split second in the store."

 

[benshive]

I had very little exposure to the Touch Bar until recently when my sister got a new MacBook with it. I used it for awhile and both her and I love it and it actually kind of makes me want to upgrade. Funny enough she also commented how much she loves the keyboard.

 

[Lakersfan74]

Which model and spec out of interest? Are you missing the physical keys as a lot seem to? How often are the F physical used, can’t think I do much tbh

I got the base model 13 from Costco yesterday all I do is surf the internet, watch movies and listen to music. So far mainly use it to turn off the speakers with a tap haven’t really messed with it much

 

[pshufd]

I spend a lot of time in emacs so I want a physical escape key. I would imagine that software engineers at Apple are similar. My favorite keyboards have Cherry MX Blue keys which require an activation force of 50 grams and have key travel of 5 mm. There is another switch that requires 80 grams of force and I might like that better but keyboards with those keys are hard to come by.

BTW, my keyboards make a fair amount of noise when I use them. These keyboards provide excellent feedback and feel.

 

[jackietreeh0rn]

I was initially apprehensive coming from a non TB MacBook Pro to a 13" 2018 MBP, but have gotten used to it now, so no real complaints. As far as the keyboard goes, I think I've been lucky not to have encountered any of the widely documented problems, but would have preferred the scissor mechanism just for the extra key travel if not for anything else.

 

[casperes1996]

I spend a lot of time in emacs so I want a physical escape key. I would imagine that software engineers at Apple are similar. My favorite keyboards have Cherry MX Blue keys which require an activation force of 50 grams and have key travel of 5 mm. There is another switch that requires 80 grams of force and I might like that better but keyboards with those keys are hard to come by.

BTW, my keyboards make a fair amount of noise when I use them. These keyboards provide excellent feedback and feel.

I pretty much agree... But I just wanted to say Vi(iMproved) for the win...

 

[pshufd]

I pretty much agree... But I just wanted to say Vi(iMproved) for the win...

I have to use vi from time to time but I prefer emacs. There are a lot of people where I work that use vi first and other things second.