is unified 16gb = 16gb on intel mac?

[donleon]

Friends,

Please see the following screenshots of current memory usage.

If I upgrade my machine to an M1 Pro, will the 16gb of unified improve the performance or do I need to jump to 32gb?

Currently using a 2020 mbp / 16gb. I make it go slow (relatively) often and end up retarting every few days to get it crispy again (which works). I still make the fans come on frequently. I run 4 chrome profiles at once — work related. I do A LOT on Chrome (sad, I know). Swap memory is almost always at +10gb (was at 19gb last night).

attaching my istats from last 30 days and my dock (main apps in use at once).

p.s. the battery on this machine suckssss.

big thanks in advance.

 

[dallegre]

I'm not an expert on MacOS memory use, but my understanding is that swap memory is for relatively idle RAM use. It looks like your memory pressure isn't too bad, so going with 32GB likely wouldn't improve your performance too much vs 16GB, and if the system is deeming this swap memory as idle or inactive, it may behave similarly even if you have 32GB ram. That said, with more available RAM, the system may not move as much to swap.

You will certainly see pretty major CPU / heat / battery performance gains with any 2021 config.

It might make sense to opt for an 8/14/32GB config vs a 10/16/16 config if budget is a major concern.

 

[chabig]

16GB seems to be working well for you. I'm sure a new machine with 16GB will work just as well.

 

[sumarlidason]

32GB is a no brainer from me; the screenshot "Screen Shot 2022-01-06 at 8.40.12 AM.png" is a bit confusing w/ purple representing compressed memory in the chart, but reading `0KB` in the side panel. Is that a bug? This compression may be the "slow down" you see as more of your stale applications are compressed. Today you may not be able to justify 32GB, but how long will you keep this machine?

 

[fa8362]

32GB is a no brainer from me; the screenshot "Screen Shot 2022-01-06 at 8.40.12 AM.png" is a bit confusing w/ purple representing compressed memory in the chart, but reading `0KB` in the side panel. Is that a bug? This compression may be the "slow down" you see as more of your stale applications are compressed. Today you may not be able to justify 32GB, but how long will you keep this machine?

Even if he keeps it 10 years, he still won't need more than 16GB.

 

[sumarlidason]

Even if he keeps it 10 years, he still won't need more than 16GB.

what kind of time machine you got?

 

[donleon]

32GB is a no brainer from me; the screenshot "Screen Shot 2022-01-06 at 8.40.12 AM.png" is a bit confusing w/ purple representing compressed memory in the chart, but reading `0KB` in the side panel. Is that a bug? This compression may be the "slow down" you see as more of your stale applications are compressed. Today you may not be able to justify 32GB, but how long will you keep this machine?

that's showing the 30day chart of Memory usage. took the screenshot after restarting.
would probably keep the machine at least 3 years. thx for your input

 

[white7561]

that's showing the 30day chart of Memory usage. took the screenshot after restarting.
would probably keep the machine at least 3 years. thx for your input

What you need to monitor is probably your SSD lifetime and or TBW. Since you're using huge swaps .. it's good to monitor the SSD

 

[donleon]

What you need to monitor is probably your SSD lifetime and or TBW. Since you're using huge swaps .. it's good to monitor the SSD

thx for input. How would I monitor that and in this case should I upgrade the storage?

 

[white7561]

thx for input. How would I monitor that and in this case should I upgrade the storage?

Usually u can use Smartmontools . Install it with homebrew and it works out of the box. But if you want a good GUI with more monitoring features. U can get DriveDx . Supports monitoring SMART data from external stuff too if it supports it..

And for storage is this for the new MacBook? If yes then yeah. The higher the storage the higher the endurance. But don't buy the storage tier that's too big just because of the endurance.

 

[Fishrrman]

Ayn Rand:
"A=A"

Fishrrman:
"RAM=RAM"

 

[wilberforce]

Partly depends what software you are using. Some software, such as some Adobe apps, use much more RAM on M1 than on Intel.

 

[Sanpete]

what kind of time machine you got?

Same kind as you. You both speculated on what will be needed in the future.

 

[Technerd108]

Unified memory does work more efficiently than socketed memory. Also the M1 cpu is much more powerful, will not throttle, fans will barely come on as well.

Get an M1 Mac and the 16" base might just be perfect!! If you want to future proof and can afford the expensive ram upgrade it may be worth it.

 

[mashoutposse]

Just buy for today. Tech gets cheaper so quickly that it makes no sense to buy ahead of time. All of the additional options will be quickly devalued over time as RAM/storage/etc get dramatically cheaper, plus whatever you buy today will still be bolted to your 3+ year old "future-proofed" machine.

Instead of trying to make the machine last a couple of extra years, put your future-proofing dollars towards your next machine. Bonus, you end up buying much cheaper (yet much better) future tech with inflated 2025 dollars instead of more valuable 2022 dollars.

"Future-proofing" is not smart.

 

[bsmr]

Just buy for today. Tech gets cheaper so quickly that it makes no sense to buy ahead of time. All of the additional options will be quickly devalued over time as RAM/storage/etc get dramatically cheaper, plus whatever you buy today will still be bolted to your 3+ year old "future-proofed" machine.

In case of RAM pricing apple did get much more expensive, than it was before. In 2013 I bought a max 16GB RAM Model - if I would go from 16GB (which is base) to max 64GB I could have bought another notebook in 2013 ?

 

[mashoutposse]

In case of RAM pricing apple did get much more expensive, than it was before. In 2013 I bought a max 16GB RAM Model - if I would go from 16GB (which is base) to max 64GB I could have bought another notebook in 2013 ?

Right. Base is perfectly fine this time around. Massive bandwidth + new unified architecture means the 16GB in the new hardware goes further than ever before.

Paying $400 for 16GB upgrade (or $1200 to get to 64GB) makes absolutely no sense if you don't need it today. Better to get a base today for $2500-2700 and another base in 2-3 years for $2500-2700 (and sell your first machine for $1500 or so) than to spend $4,000+ today with 2022 dollars and roll with that for 5 years and end up with something practically worthless at the end. You'll enjoy a much higher average performance level with the former plan, and it will probably be cheaper in the long run.

 

[Technerd108]

I agree future proofing is a fools errand but the idea that spending more expensive dollars today and thinking that prices will be static in the future is also a bit of a fools errand. Inflation will devalue the money true but products will also cost more. In two years a base Model 16" will be $3500 or maybe even more! Depends how the economy goes but with supply chain constraints that will be here for a while and Inflation the cost of goods will most certainly go up. So sure buy a base model and sell for $1500 but if price goes up $1000 or more then you are back to square one. All the while you had a machine that was good enough but always wondered what it would have been like with the extra ram or gpu cores etc.

So don't future proof but be really happy with the specs you have! In my personal opinion the base model is fine but I am buying a serious Pro machine and spending good money for it so spending a few hundred more on a base $2500 machine doesn't seem crazy to me. Furthermore the ram in these machines is similar to ddr5 and is unified so it is a lot more expensive to add unlike cheap socketed ram.

I mean I think buying a Maxed out MBP 16" is a waste of money for 99.9% of people. However 32gb ram is not unreasonable and if it keeps you from having ANY bottlenecks for the life of the machine it is probably worth it. I 3 years are you going to care that you spent the $400 or are you going to care about what it would have been like with 32gb ram the whole time you own the machine??

Only you know what is best for you but don't buy based on future proofing or inflation, etc but what you need now and having a bit of headroom for the future. I like to shoot for the middle. Buying base in my opinion is fine but always leaves me wanting something more. Buying to future proof with the most expensive everything also leaves me with a hole in my pocket and an antiquated machine in 3 years or so. BUT buying in the middle 32gb ram, 512gb ssd or 1tb, M1 Max with 24 gpu cores is the sweet spot. You aren't getting ripped off on stuff you will never use-looking at you64gb ram!!-but you are getting some extras that make the machine more enjoyable when you have it and when you go to sell you don't lose too much money and have some extras to entice people to buy!

 

[ctjack]

Furthermore the ram in these machines is similar to ddr5 and is unified so it is a lot more expensive to add unlike cheap socketed ram.

True. This time $400 is more or less justifiable, since it is like ddr5 and unified... so the cost is really high. 512Gb is fine, but you also have to think about performance of ssd mechanics. When full 80% it gets low on speed and you basically write a hole in that thing if you have only 10-20% free space. SSDs like to be full only by 60%, so 512gb only leaves you with 310GB of usable space.
I had 128gb mbp 13, which was always full by 99%. You can only imagine what kind of a hole is in that 5gb, which i rewrote million times.
Overall +$600(32ram and 1tb ssd) will get you 50% of value back when trade-in with apple. Second hand market also praise this configs at 50% discount, so you can expect to get +300 over the base model sellers.
If not to sell at all, well then you did enjoy seamless experience for years to come without thinking about cleaning ssd and lagging because of swap ram. $600 divided into 3 years of useful life is like 54 cents per day, $16 a month for the peace of mind and extra cushion.

Buying base with Apple is like buying base with BMW - you get 2liter 4 banger equal to camry, but you think you drive real BMW. Things get changed when you choose the middle as the top specs are almost twice the price of the base model. Sweet spot is BMW 535I(used to be 530i) as long as it has v6 3l turbo in it.

 

[donleon]

I agree future proofing is a fools errand but the idea that spending more expensive dollars today and thinking that prices will be static in the future is also a bit of a fools errand. Inflation will devalue the money true but products will also cost more. In two years a base Model 16" will be $3500 or maybe even more! Depends how the economy goes but with supply chain constraints that will be here for a while and Inflation the cost of goods will most certainly go up. So sure buy a base model and sell for $1500 but if price goes up $1000 or more then you are back to square one. All the while you had a machine that was good enough but always wondered what it would have been like with the extra ram or gpu cores etc.

So don't future proof but be really happy with the specs you have! In my personal opinion the base model is fine but I am buying a serious Pro machine and spending good money for it so spending a few hundred more on a base $2500 machine doesn't seem crazy to me. Furthermore the ram in these machines is similar to ddr5 and is unified so it is a lot more expensive to add unlike cheap socketed ram.

I mean I think buying a Maxed out MBP 16" is a waste of money for 99.9% of people. However 32gb ram is not unreasonable and if it keeps you from having ANY bottlenecks for the life of the machine it is probably worth it. I 3 years are you going to care that you spent the $400 or are you going to care about what it would have been like with 32gb ram the whole time you own the machine??

Only you know what is best for you but don't buy based on future proofing or inflation, etc but what you need now and having a bit of headroom for the future. I like to shoot for the middle. Buying base in my opinion is fine but always leaves me wanting something more. Buying to future proof with the most expensive everything also leaves me with a hole in my pocket and an antiquated machine in 3 years or so. BUT buying in the middle 32gb ram, 512gb ssd or 1tb, M1 Max with 24 gpu cores is the sweet spot. You aren't getting ripped off on stuff you will never use-looking at you64gb ram!!-but you are getting some extras that make the machine more enjoyable when you have it and when you go to sell you don't lose too much money and have some extras to entice people to buy!

this was excellent. thank you

 

[donleon]

True. This time $400 is more or less justifiable, since it is like ddr5 and unified... so the cost is really high. 512Gb is fine, but you also have to think about performance of ssd mechanics. When full 80% it gets low on speed and you basically write a hole in that thing if you have only 10-20% free space. SSDs like to be full only by 60%, so 512gb only leaves you with 310GB of usable space.
I had 128gb mbp 13, which was always full by 99%. You can only imagine what kind of a hole is in that 5gb, which i rewrote million times.
Overall +$600(32ram and 1tb ssd) will get you 50% of value back when trade-in with apple. Second hand market also praise this configs at 50% discount, so you can expect to get +300 over the base model sellers.
If not to sell at all, well then you did enjoy seamless experience for years to come without thinking about cleaning ssd and lagging because of swap ram. $600 divided into 3 years of useful life is like 54 cents per day, $16 a month for the peace of mind and extra cushion.

Buying base with Apple is like buying base with BMW - you get 2liter 4 banger equal to camry, but you think you drive real BMW. Things get changed when you choose the middle as the top specs are almost twice the price of the base model. Sweet spot is BMW 535I(used to be 530i) as long as it has v6 3l turbo in it.

thanks for this.