It's sad what kids are doing these days

[bousozoku]

Originally posted by neut
apathetic parents can be just as bad as those who set a bad example. they need to talk to each other. parents also need to be truthful with their children. when they find out the truth they act out in defiance with their new found knowledge. these guys are taking out something they are hiding on this poor girl... and why did it take this long for someone to notice? children should not fear their parents.


peace.

Children should fear all adults as far as a deterrent to doing the wrong thing. That's certainly what stopped those in my generation from doing wrong. Those whose parents didn't care got away with everything. My mum would have been fine with an adult who knew me yelling at me and calling her, if I was doing something wrong. Even as my mum was an adult, her mum kept her in line.

Parents should talk with their children but it's not necessary for them to negotiate anything.

 

[neut]

Originally posted by bousozoku
Children should fear all adults as far as a deterrent to doing the wrong thing. That's certainly what stopped those in my generation from doing wrong. Those whose parents didn't care got away with everything. My mum would have been fine with an adult who knew me yelling at me and calling her, if I was doing something wrong. Even as my mum was an adult, her mum kept her in line.

Parents should talk with their children but it's not necessary for them to negotiate anything.

seems to me it's the other way around. adults fear the children. why do they see that they are in the right? adults are tainted by the world we live in and thus produce children who act like their parents before them... a vicious cycle that has led to the state we all live in (a society afraid to talk to each other without guilt and without contempt).

if yelling at another adult isn't the right answer; than neither is yelling at a child. they are not pets that obey every dominant command – they are you... just smaller.

explaining "why" is always the best course of action. it makes you question your own actions and the purpose behind them. when children see you learn with them it lets them know that it's ok to not know the correct answer for everything, but that it's more important to seek the truth about every situation.

if parents don't tell their kids the truth... someone else will.



peace.

 

[Kid Red]

Originally posted by jayscheuerle
My daughter is 7 and has been taking karate since she was 3. Girls gotta protect themselves these days. Seriously protect themselves...

Mine's 2 1/2 and can't wait till she's old enough to take Kung Fu. So 3 is the minimum age? After that 11 girl last week, kids have to worry about everyone now. Very discerning times to be a parent.

 

[Dippo]

Don't these kids have parents??? Where's a beating when you need one!

 

[Awimoway]

Originally posted by neut
seems to me it's the other way around. adults fear the children. why do they see that they are in the right? adults are tainted by the world we live in and thus produce children who act like their parents before them... a vicious cycle that has led to the state we all live in (a society afraid to talk to each other without guilt and without contempt).

if yelling at another adult isn't the right answer; than neither is yelling at a child. they are not pets that obey every dominant command – they are you... just smaller.

explaining "why" is always the best course of action. it makes you question your own actions and the purpose behind them. when children see you learn with them it lets them know that it's ok to not know the correct answer for everything, but that it's more important to seek the truth about every situation.

if parents don't tell their kids the truth... someone else will.



peace.

Very well said. And, as a parent, I must say that it's amazing how well-listened to I am when I do more than just say no. No with an explanation why nearly always gets good results.

Now if only I could teach my kids to ask before they undertake stupid things that I have to tell them to stop doing and explain why.

 

[neut]

Originally posted by Awimoway
Very well said. And, as a parent, I must say that it's amazing how well-listened to I am when I do more than just say no. No with an explanation why nearly always gets good results.

Now if only I could teach my kids to ask before they undertake stupid things that I have to tell them to stop doing and explain why.

try getting your kids to take a scientific approach to curiosity... meaning question and test everything before actually doing it. learning the how and why (ie. science) before doing anything can make for a better time; you don't have to worry about anything before engaging in the activity – you already know the how and whys and can appreciate the subtle nuances (ie. art) that makes everyday life beautiful.

... but these things must be taught at an early age; unless the child can discover these things on their own (but don't bet on it).

my seven yr. old daughter (first grade) is doing well with this outlook on life. i hope she carries it with her.


peace.

 

[TimDaddy]

Originally posted by Awimoway
Very well said. And, as a parent, I must say that it's amazing how well-listened to I am when I do more than just say no. No with an explanation why nearly always gets good results.

Now if only I could teach my kids to ask before they undertake stupid things that I have to tell them to stop doing and explain why.

Another thing a lot of parents refuse to do is admit when they are wrong, themselves. For example, my six year old caught me flipping a guy the bird in traffic. I didn't realize he had seen me, and I shouldn't have done it in the first place. He said "Cool, I'm gonna do that next time a jerk makes me mad!" My mother would've said something along the lines of "You better not!" I thought for a moment and said "No, let's not do that. That is trashy and could've made that guy madder and want to fight or shoot us! How about I'll try not to do that any more, and if I do you can remind me that I am being trashy. And how about you don't get in the habit in the first place." He agreed, and I haven't caught him doing it so far. I still have to kick myself though, because that is one more bit of his innocence that is gone forever, and I have myself to blame. Innocence is good in children, as long as you don't keep them naive to the dangers that are out there. That's a thin line, though.

 

[bousozoku]

Originally posted by neut
seems to me it's the other way around. adults fear the children. why do they see that they are in the right? adults are tainted by the world we live in and thus produce children who act like their parents before them... a vicious cycle that has led to the state we all live in (a society afraid to talk to each other without guilt and without contempt).

if yelling at another adult isn't the right answer; than neither is yelling at a child. they are not pets that obey every dominant command – they are you... just smaller.

explaining "why" is always the best course of action. it makes you question your own actions and the purpose behind them. when children see you learn with them it lets them know that it's ok to not know the correct answer for everything, but that it's more important to seek the truth about every situation.

if parents don't tell their kids the truth... someone else will.



peace.

I think you missed the should in the first part of what i was saying.

After reading what you've said, I can certainly see how some adult yelling "Hey! Stop that! I'm going to call your mother!" would scar a family for generations.

I don't think that you are, but I just hope you're not one of the parents I've seen in public places who continually says "Please don't touch that. Daddy says don't touch that. Daddy doesn't want you to touch that." It's not just a Floriduh thing, but it certainly happens here a lot. Is passive parenting an answer to anything?

 

[neut]

Originally posted by bousozoku
I think you missed the should in the first part of what i was saying.

After reading what you've said, I can certainly see how some adult yelling "Hey! Stop that! I'm going to call your mother!" would scar a family for generations.

I don't think that you are, but I just hope you're not one of the parents I've seen in public places who continually says "Please don't touch that. Daddy says don't touch that. Daddy doesn't want you to touch that." It's not just a Floriduh thing, but it certainly happens here a lot. Is passive parenting an answer to anything?

?

still not clear on what you mean. thanks for the insult though...

there is a place for yelling at a child; if you can't get their attention it may be necessary, but if used too often a child will become used to this kind of treatment and will fail to learn anything ; by turning themselves off everytime they are yelled. why should they listen to you? this is what they should learn... not to fear you. or realize that your just taking out your insecurities on them.

btw- people who refer to themselves in the third person are psycho.



peace.

 

[rueyeet]

Originally posted by neut
they are not pets that obey every dominant command – they are you... just smaller.

explaining "why" is always the best course of action.

Not always. Like you say, sometimes it becomes necessary to raise your voice to get the child's attention. And children should be conditioned to obey their elders, because adults not only know more than children, there are certain things children are not yet capable of understaning even if you explain it to them. They're NOT just "you, but smaller"--there are very real differences in cognitive, emotional, and moral functioning between a child and an adult. Not that you shouldn't explain and explore with your kids instead of just ordering them around, but there are times that a kid just needs to OBEY.

My parents have a joke, that I could be standing in the road oblivious to an oncoming truck, and when they yelled "GET OUT OF THE ROAD!!" I'd just ask, "Why?" *splat* Sometimes obedience, not explanation, is called for.

Originally posted by G4scott
Your child is not your friend. Your child is your child. They are supposed to love you until about 6, and then they should start to hate you more and more, because you tell them what they can and can not do.

True, but you better start by the time they're six, or it's too late.

Originally posted by coolsoldier
The issue at hand is whether they've learned to care about morality.....Basically, things like this happen because we try to teach kids morality instead of teaching them to care about morality.

There are a frightening number of adults that only know right from wrong in an intellectual sense, too. But that's not the whole story. I had a friend that worked in a juvenile offender facility--basically, a kids' prison. Rapists and murderers at age 12, or sometimes younger. Those kids used to brag to each other about how many girls they'd gotten pregnant, because the more babies they'd fathered, the more of a man they were. They were a product of the kind of homes TimDaddy was talking about earlier in the thread, except with the addition of drugs, alcohol, and poverty. Of course, if your parents are peddling you out for their next fix, you do learn about sex a bit earlier.

Now that's some scary messed-up stuff.

 

[mactastic]

Originally posted by neut
btw- people who refer to themselves in the third person are psycho.

Notice, that Bob Dole often speaks about himself in the third person. "Bob Dole will win this election." "Bob Dole will eat his spleen." "Bob Dole will cut taxes." "Bob Dole is cranky without his nap."

SNL made a lot of jokes about this at the time too...

 

[neut]

Originally posted by rueyeet
And children should be conditioned to obey their elders, because adults not only know more than children, there are certain things children are not yet capable of understaning even if you explain it to them. They're NOT just "you, but smaller"--there are very real differences in cognitive, emotional, and moral functioning between a child and an adult.

i trust my seven yr old daughter more than i do most adults. most people are complete morons. they think they know more than children because "that's the way it is". usually what parents do is unlearn their children; we come out understanding the world innocently — what we teach are children is the way our modern society works. no one ever questions wether this society is correct (good) in the way it exists. we teach our children to learn like we do and that some things just work a certain way and there is nothing you can do to change it.

as a child i was angered that every adult i talked to seemed alien to me. none of them cared about what really was going on around them.the truth was hard to find. i still feel the same way.

a child who questions is good. a child who knows when to question is better. teach them how a road works before the ask "why" when you yell at them to, "get out of the way!"


peace.

 

[Awimoway]

Originally posted by rueyeet
My parents have a joke, that I could be standing in the road oblivious to an oncoming truck, and when they yelled "GET OUT OF THE ROAD!!" I'd just ask, "Why?" *splat* Sometimes obedience, not explanation, is called for.

Yes, but the point of your parents' joke is that it will never happen. Obedience without an explanation rarely if ever exists.

There's a world of difference between what should happen and what does happen.