Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.

Z28McCrory

macrumors regular
Original poster
Jan 20, 2014
117
54
Indiana
My 7,1 arrived a few hours ago. 16 Core/580X/32GB RAM/2TB

Since launch day on the 10th, I've been heavily debating on whether I should order with the Vega II, or save some money and add a pair of VIIs instead (and potentially have GPU power approaching a Vega II duo for 1/5th the upgrade price).

I ended up going the VII route. It all fits fine and there doesn't seem to be any issues with power. I spaced them out a bit to allow sufficient airflow.

IMG_9426.jpg


So far I've barely had a chance to try anything out. Unfortunately my 3rd party RAM didn't arrive today (I have 6x32GB Micron DIMMS that will be here tomorrow).

I'm doing my best to try some benchmarks that people with Vega IIs have tried. I've tried the Unigen Heaven "Extreme" preset, and was pretty happy how it compared to the Vega II that Max Tech tried last week. I'll note that the 2nd VII was completely idle for this test, so this is only one of them at work. Its also interesting to note that the single VII was only using about 20% of its memory throughout the test (but spiked to 100% processor use at times).

VII - Score: 2351
Max Tech's Vega II - Score - 2936

As far as the Geekbench 5.1 Tests go, I'm getting the following
VII #1 - 63749 Metal
VII #2 - 63169 Metal

The 16 Core scores in Geekbench 5.1
1167 Single
14095 Multi

Based on the GB5 GPU tests I'm pretty happy with my decision to go the VII route. The performance seems to be knocking on the door of the Vega II.

I'd love to find a few benchmarks that utilize both GPUs. I've never really been one to run benchmarks on anything, so I'm open to any suggestions on some things to try.

This is the most high end computer that I've ever owned. Once I get all the "new system benchmarks" out of my mind, I'll be putting it to use with video editing in Davinci Resolve and Premiere. I'm confident it'll serve me well for many years to come. Very excited to do some real work with it (and will be glad to not have to think about another computer purchase for many years!)

UPDATE 12/30/19:

As I noted lated on in this thread, there is currently (Catalina 10.15.2) as issue with the fans on the VII when the computer goes into sleep mode. Basically if the computer goes to sleep, the fans on the VIIs ramp up to full speed until you wake the computer.

My fix was simply to go into the Energy Saver settings and make sure the computer never goes to sleep. I instead just have it shut the displays off when its idle, and I shut it down when I'm finished using it for the day. It's a small inconvenience, but in the grand scheme of things I think the VIIs are still very much worth using given their compute performance at such a tremendous cost savings over the MPX Vega II.

I'll also make a small note about the GB5.1 Single and Multi scores. Adding more RAM (switching from the factory 4x 8GB strips, to Micro 6x 32GB strips) showed a score increase.

The new scores with 192GB:
1175 Single
15891 Multi
 

Attachments

  • Screen Shot 2019-12-26 at 6.54.08 PM.jpg
    Screen Shot 2019-12-26 at 6.54.08 PM.jpg
    65.8 KB · Views: 327
Last edited:
Nice build!

Can you swap the position of the lower Radeon VII (the one in Slot 3) with the 580X?

If you move one Radeon VII to Slot 1 (at the bottom), then move the 580x to Slot 3, you can then move your top Radeon VII down to Slot 4 (since the 580x doesn't exhaust hot air upwards, but outwards), and then that will free up Slot 6 (an x8 slot) since it will no longer be blocked by the Radeon VII.
 
Nice build!

Can you swap the position of the lower Radeon VII (the one in Slot 3) with the 580X?

If you move one Radeon VII to Slot 1 (at the bottom), then move the 580x to Slot 3, you can then move your top Radeon VII down to Slot 4 (since the 580x doesn't exhaust hot air upwards, but outwards), and then that will free up Slot 6 (an x8 slot) since it will no longer be blocked by the Radeon VII.

I'll give that a try sometime soon.

As an experiment, I removed the 580X about an hour ago. It seemed like it was actually slowing things down. When I was watching the iStat Menus in Capture One 20, it seemed like it was trying to split the load 3 ways (all 3 cards had relatively equal memory usage) instead of prioritizing the much faster VIIs.

After I removed it, the two VIIs seem like they're both using about the same amount of memory and processor under load now (in Capture One). The same group of batch adjustments and preview re-generations seemed noticeably quicker, but I admittedly didn't do a scientific test and time it.

I currently have 3 displays plugged into one of the VIIs, and none in the 2nd VII. At idle (browsing websites, running office applications, etc) the first VII is using around 12% of its memory and 0% processor, and the 2nd one isn't doing anything. Under load (batch adjusting around two hundred 51 Megapixel images with multiple layers) the main VII gets up to around 50% memory usage, and the 2nd stays around 35%. The processor is always very low on both of them, but it seems to distribute the work reasonably even.

This round of ~200 images, with multiple layers/adjustments, did indeed eat up all of the 32GB of Ram I currently have installed (was using over 50GB total, and had to create a swap file to make up the difference). Hopefully the 192 GB I ordered will arrive tomorrow.

Admittedly this first "real world" test doesn't even begin to test this setup (it just so happened to be the first thing I needed to work on).
 
Great to know that real pros are enjoying this machine and use the expandability to have more horsepower with less dollars (dyi 3rd party hw)
 
  • Like
Reactions: Average Pro
It genuinely warms my heart to see threads like this. Mac configuration is interesting again!

What's the noise like under load?

Yep this has been a great experience. Every Mac I've owned has been self contained and non-expandable (2012 iMac, 2013 rMBP, and late 2013 6,1 Mac Pro). This computer definitely brings back fond memories of my self-built PC days.

The only time I've heard it at all is when I was running the Unigen Heaven benchmark. It was definitely audible then, but nothing terrible.

I have a Synology 1817 NAS sitting on my desk (and 7,1 is on the floor beside the desk). The Synology is always the loudest thing in the room (when everything is under load).
[automerge]1577422189[/automerge]
Great to know that real pros are enjoying this machine and use the expandability to have more horsepower with less dollars (dyi 3rd party hw)
Yeah this computer was on the edge of my budget, so I hoped this would all work the way I was thinking (throw some video cards in myself and save some $$$). I'm definitely happy.
 
  • Like
Reactions: JohnnyGo
Ugh... just when I thought it was all butterflies and rainbows...

I let the computer go to sleep and left the room (was headed to bed for the night). I happened to walk back into my office for something, and noticed the fans were full blast. It sounds like its the fans on one or both of the VIIs.

I never expected this to happen INSIDE a Mac Pro (I had heard of this issues with eGPU enclosures and the VII early on, but had heard of many success stories with VIIs in 5,1 Mac Pros).

So it looks like the VIIs spin up to 100% fan speed as soon as the 7,1 goes into sleep mode. I can recreate the issue over and over. As soon as I touch the mouse or keyboard, the fans instantly spin down.

As much as I love Apple, this is exactly what I had dreaded. OSX is such a closed ecosystem that when there IS a problem, there's nothing you can do about it (not like I can go get new drivers, etc). I really hope this isn't intentional on Apples part (them making sure that if you try to use your own parts, you'll have problems).

Looks like they honeymoon phase is over.

Anyone have any ideas?
 
  • Like
Reactions: rxs0
Can you just shut it down instead of putting it to sleep? How long is the boot time?

Yes that’s what I ended up doing. It’s not a workaround I expected to have to deal with out of a $10k+ system though. I get OCD over little quirks like this (especially since I’ve never fully shut down my Macs in the 7 years since I switched from windows...I always go to the switch user screen and then let it sleep on it’s own... or on my rMBP I simply close it to let it sleep)

I tried moving PCIe slots (to where both VIIs are in the same slots as the MPX connections), just to try something with the hopes that perhaps it’s an early bug where only certain PCIe slots support sleep, but that didn’t change anything.
 
That's painful. One of the joys of being an early-adopter/guinea pig I suppose.

Hopefully something will happen to improve the drivers for the Radeon VIIs down the road, but since they're now discontinued, there's no certainty of it.

I guess there was always going to be a caveat for getting the same GPU horsepower for 25% of the price.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Graham King
That's painful. One of the joys of being an early-adopter/guinea pig I suppose.

Hopefully something will happen to improve the drivers for the Radeon VIIs down the road, but since they're now discontinued, there's no certainty of it.

I guess there was always going to be a caveat for getting the same GPU horsepower for 25% of the price.

Yeah I’m sitting here trying to think of anything.

None of the 3rd party fan control apps seem to be able to even see anything about the VIIs (downloaded a couple to see if there was any chance of finding a setting in there that could help).

I love the performance, but this was a real punch in the stomach when I realized what was happening (after spending the entire day getting everything transferred over, setup, etc). Things were going so smooth that I didn’t think of this as a possibility (I didn’t even unopen the 2nd VII until after I had checked everything I could think of with the first one, just in case I had to return both or one of them... so that I wouldn’t be charged restocking fees)

I figure since Apple chose to use a Vega II as their official BTO upgrade card, that the Radeon VII would be a safe alternative (since the Vega II is essentially a VII with more VRAM).

Time to get some sleep and try to continue forward with this tomorrow.
 
  • Sad
Reactions: chfilm
Unlikely this is related, but I found this on AMD forums. Someone was having full speed fan problems with Radeon VII in his PC :

Problem solved without RMA, the cooling connector on the GPU was not connected fully.

While I do feel a bit silly for checking on the GPU so late, I wouldn't expect something on it not to be fully functional right out of the box. I would certainly expect me not installing the GPU correctly, but that was ruled out long ago.



So if anyone has similar issues, check the bottom-right corner of the GPU (while facing the fans) and push down on the wired connector. This is not supposed to move or be removed at any point in time but due to shipping it might dislodge slightly.



This thread can be closed.

https://community.amd.com/thread/238432
 
  • Like
Reactions: Z28McCrory
I don't believe there is any method of controlling the fan speed of a GPU with macOS , so you might just have to suffer with this unfortunately .

In the future , if you are experiencing performance issues with your Radeons rendering , keep in mind all those attached displays will steal processing cycles from the attached GPU . Rendering will be faster with the UI display(s) usage kept to a minimum .
 
The 650 requirement is due to the PSU, which the MP7,1 should be able to EASILY handle. The fan issue has been repeatedly reported on multiple configs in macOS. Believe there are some with MP5,1 power mods also running into the same issue. Certainly appears from Sonnet’s note this will not be fixed in the OS.
 
Yeah I’m sitting here trying to think of anything.

None of the 3rd party fan control apps seem to be able to even see anything about the VIIs (downloaded a couple to see if there was any chance of finding a setting in there that could help).

I love the performance, but this was a real punch in the stomach when I realized what was happening (after spending the entire day getting everything transferred over, setup, etc). Things were going so smooth that I didn’t think of this as a possibility (I didn’t even unopen the 2nd VII until after I had checked everything I could think of with the first one, just in case I had to return both or one of them... so that I wouldn’t be charged restocking fees)

I figure since Apple chose to use a Vega II as their official BTO upgrade card, that the Radeon VII would be a safe alternative (since the Vega II is essentially a VII with more VRAM).

Time to get some sleep and try to continue forward with this tomorrow.

Congrats on getting the machine!

It's unfortunate this is happening to you. I don't know if I've lucked out, but the current Radeon VII in my cMP does not exhibit this fan issue and sleeps properly. I'm currently using the Sapphire Radeon VII. Which brand did you get?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Passingby
Congrats on getting the machine!

It's unfortunate this is happening to you. I don't know if I've lucked out, but the current Radeon VII in my cMP does not exhibit this fan issue and sleeps properly. I'm currently using the Sapphire Radeon VII. Which brand did you get?

Thanks Mike.

I have the XFX Radeon VIIs (they were the only ones I could find readily available).

Now that I’ve slept on it (was kinda exhausted by the time I posted the fan issue last night), I don’t feel as defeated by it. If the worst case scenario leads to me simply needing to power it off every time, then it’s an inconvenience, but it was still worth it to save ~$4k buying a pair of Vega IIs.

My main worry is “forgetting” about the issue due to old habits, and letting it go to sleep, then leaving home with fans spinning at full blast for hours... not sure if the fans would simply fail after some time or if it could damage something else in the process.

Once my RAM comes later today, I’ll open it back up and experiment some more. Maybe there is a chance that putting the MPX 580X back in place will cause the VIIs to behave.
 
If the worst case scenario leads to me simply needing to power it off every time, then it’s an inconvenience, but it was still worth it to save ~$4k buying a pair of Vega IIs.
Why not simply go in System Preferences and disable sleep altogether for the Mac (but not the monitor)? Modern Intel platform and HBM GPUs should not use much power when idling with the screen off.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Blair Paulsen
Maybe there will be a fix for it in the next Catalina update........ 🤞

Does the 580 need to be in for boot screens, the fan issue may not be present if this is removed (So just the VII’s), just a thought, clutching for straws here... 😜
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.