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iTunes Europe Next Month?
- Thread starter MacRumors
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Can people stop *moaning* about the Euro and US$ exchange range when it comes to music pricing.
Europeans are NOT buying their online music from US based music companies... but from the European based music companies... Europe pays far more for music than the US does, and that isn't based on exchange rate.
SOOOO why on earth do you think your going to get the US equivilent prices on iTMS?!!!!!???? yes its iTMS, but it makes no difference.. do you complain that you don't get straight $US to Euro when you buy a CD from Sony Music? No.
Europeans are NOT buying their online music from US based music companies... but from the European based music companies... Europe pays far more for music than the US does, and that isn't based on exchange rate.
SOOOO why on earth do you think your going to get the US equivilent prices on iTMS?!!!!!???? yes its iTMS, but it makes no difference.. do you complain that you don't get straight $US to Euro when you buy a CD from Sony Music? No.
eric67 said:
cdburrows said:still wondering what will happen in the UK... will we be paying in Euro? with constantly changing rates or what ?
You can only pay by credit card, and those companies have their own rates at which they will charge you irrespective of where you are domiciled.
You've also got to remember that a significant number of Apple's customers are already using the Euro, so rate changes will mean squat to them.
can't say i'm too impressed with the price tag of 1.29e/song, but i sure am glad if the service will indeed launch in europe next month.. so voting positive on this.
The point is: go to amazon.de, amazon.fr, amzon.uk or whatever... here in Germany, you will find most new releases at 12,99, old ones for as low as 7,99 (that is, per album). Now look at the 1,29 price-tag. In the US, it's 0,99$ a track, 9,99$ an album (at the lowest, we know that has changed)... most likely, an album will be 12,99. Oh, wait, didn't we see that price before? Yes, on amazon.xx, for a physical objekt, with booklet and lyrics, superior quality, no DRM... I know which one I prefer.Stella said:
Stella said:
Sadly, over here people actully do make those complaints
Personally I don't, but I think that's because I've been blessed with a reasonable grip on reality.
Apple has no control over pricing
Come on. Costs for regular CDs are usually higher in the E.U. However, in many instances for catalogue material E.U. CDs contain more songs then the U.S. counterpart. Also recordings up through 1953 are now in the public domain in the E.U. Neither artists or their heirs get money from the sale. Only music publishers still get paid (if the song hasn't gone into the public domain). An example. You can obtain a Frank Sinatra CD from the original copyright holder, Columbia (Sony) or get a similar version of the album from a re-issue company. That company doesn't pay Columbia (Sony) any fees for using the music. They simply have to obtain the recording from an original source (old LP, 78rpm or 45 rpm) record and put it on the new CD. Usually the sound quality is not as good, but the price is much lower. If iTMS uses these lower-priced but inferior versions of the recordings would you buy them? It's a problem that I believe Apple will circumvent by simply not going to the reissue labels but sticking to the original labels where the quality of the recordings are superior.
One other thing. There were reports a few weeks ago that Apple was secretly testing the iTMS in Europe.
Come on. Costs for regular CDs are usually higher in the E.U. However, in many instances for catalogue material E.U. CDs contain more songs then the U.S. counterpart. Also recordings up through 1953 are now in the public domain in the E.U. Neither artists or their heirs get money from the sale. Only music publishers still get paid (if the song hasn't gone into the public domain). An example. You can obtain a Frank Sinatra CD from the original copyright holder, Columbia (Sony) or get a similar version of the album from a re-issue company. That company doesn't pay Columbia (Sony) any fees for using the music. They simply have to obtain the recording from an original source (old LP, 78rpm or 45 rpm) record and put it on the new CD. Usually the sound quality is not as good, but the price is much lower. If iTMS uses these lower-priced but inferior versions of the recordings would you buy them? It's a problem that I believe Apple will circumvent by simply not going to the reissue labels but sticking to the original labels where the quality of the recordings are superior.
One other thing. There were reports a few weeks ago that Apple was secretly testing the iTMS in Europe.
I think you missed the point
so why should we pay big price in Europe??
at 1.29 Euro/track the price difference between a full album from iTMS and a standard CD album is small, really small...
the only advantage of iTMS is that you can play it on a computer and transfer it to your iPod...something which will become more and more difficult with the proctected music CD.
I really think that you forgot that most of the Music Major are NOT american...and lot of them are European (Universal Music, EMI, ...)Stella said:
so why should we pay big price in Europe??
at 1.29 Euro/track the price difference between a full album from iTMS and a standard CD album is small, really small...
the only advantage of iTMS is that you can play it on a computer and transfer it to your iPod...something which will become more and more difficult with the proctected music CD.
Macrumors said:
!.29 is really expensive, giveing that the Euro is worth more than the dollar, not less.
All that matters to me is that Apple release iTMS for Europe soon, and have an ad blitz that follows, Also Apple needs to Get Canada ITMS, its just unacceptable that other companies are beating Apple to Canada.
You really didn't get my point -at no stage did I suggest what companies where what nationality (which is irrevelent for iTMS anyway), so I shall say it again.
Americans buy their music from music companies based in the States... Europeans buy their music companies based in Europe...
Why then on iTMS would you expect Europeans to buy music that is based on straight forward currency conversion from the US dollar.... like what people are saying..
When you buy CDs, you buy at the locally set price... so why would you expect anything different from iTMS - it will never be a straight conversion from dollar to Euro... and no one should have ever expected it.
Clearer?
Americans buy their music from music companies based in the States... Europeans buy their music companies based in Europe...
Why then on iTMS would you expect Europeans to buy music that is based on straight forward currency conversion from the US dollar.... like what people are saying..
When you buy CDs, you buy at the locally set price... so why would you expect anything different from iTMS - it will never be a straight conversion from dollar to Euro... and no one should have ever expected it.
Clearer?
eric67 said:
johnnyjibbs said:
haven't i done the math a million times already? ok, once more. and this math ASSUMES that everyone will play fair, in other words, that both the record companies and our beloved apple are satisfied for having the same amount of money from europeans as they are satisfied for having from americans. that means simply that the taxfree us price can be converted into euros and add tax to it.
so here it goes. 0.99 dollars equals 0.825 euros. that should be the european taxfree price. let's say that ON AVERAGE we have a 20% sales tax (value added tax as they call it), that puts the final price at 0.99 euros.
to summarize and to repeat myself: everything above 0.99 euros per song is highway robbery. probably pure greed on behalf of the record companies.
or apple.
Napster UK have only had radio talk and tabloid newspapers interest...
Now when iTunes reaches Europe's shores they need to make a big splash, talking full ad campaign on t.v., radio, and print...
Apple often fails to pursue an AD campaign fully especially in the UK, a few ads every now and again is a waste of money... Come On! Spend some $/£/!!!!!! thats what it takes - you know i am really surprised that anyone in the UK recognises the iPod... in fact the only reason people know anything about it is due to music videos >> then magazines caught it >>> then the general public began to become aware of its existance!!!
Now when iTunes reaches Europe's shores they need to make a big splash, talking full ad campaign on t.v., radio, and print...
Apple often fails to pursue an AD campaign fully especially in the UK, a few ads every now and again is a waste of money... Come On! Spend some $/£/!!!!!! thats what it takes - you know i am really surprised that anyone in the UK recognises the iPod... in fact the only reason people know anything about it is due to music videos >> then magazines caught it >>> then the general public began to become aware of its existance!!!
cdburrows said:Napster UK have only had radio talk and tabloid newspapers interest...
Now when iTunes reaches Europe's shores they need to make a big splash, talking full ad campaign on t.v., radio, and print...
Apple often fails to pursue an AD campaign fully especially in the UK, a few ads every now and again is a waste of money... Come On! Spend some $/£/!!!!!! thats what it takes - you know i am really surprised that anyone in the UK recognises the iPod... in fact the only reason people know anything about it is due to music videos >> then magazines caught it >>> then the general public began to become aware of its existance!!!
I agree on this point. Apple could certainly benefit from investing more in advertising.
This is a good question given that the UK still (stupidly in my opinion) insists on using the pound. I bet they will just establish a second pricing structure for the UK.cdburrows said:still wondering what will happen in the UK... will we be paying in Euro? with constantly changing rates or what ?
yes but
correct, except that marketing wise it would be better to sell 0.99Euro/track, knowing that with such a price, it will already be 20% more expensive than in the US, which is usually what we see when co;paring the pruice between US and Europe for different goods... do you understand my point now??
eventhough Euro is stronger than the US$, we usually see 20% in euro for a graphic card 9for example
0 when compared to US price, and this is mainly due to VAT which is really high in Europe...
Stella said:
correct, except that marketing wise it would be better to sell 0.99Euro/track, knowing that with such a price, it will already be 20% more expensive than in the US, which is usually what we see when co;paring the pruice between US and Europe for different goods... do you understand my point now??
eventhough Euro is stronger than the US$, we usually see 20% in euro for a graphic card 9for example
0 when compared to US price, and this is mainly due to VAT which is really high in Europe...
absolutely right
if 1.29 euro/track, than it is definitely not going to apple's pocket but rather to the music majors pockets...probably to cover the smaller margin they make with the Us iTMS...
JFreak said:
if 1.29 euro/track, than it is definitely not going to apple's pocket but rather to the music majors pockets...probably to cover the smaller margin they make with the Us iTMS...
Stella said:
Actually we do. This has been a complaint over here in Europe for quite some time. It used to be easy just to blame the record companies. All of them, not just Sony. Now the waters are somewhat murkier, that's all.
Time and time again, EVEN WHEN VAT RATES are taken into account, we pay over the odds for many things, compared with the States. So as we are just downloading the same files you migh possibly see why we tend to get irritated when it looks like it will cost us noticeably more for the "privilege"
CmdrLaForge said:
indeed. what we have to look into right now is the fact that in europe apple isn't even near to the popularity it has in the states. if every tenth (?) computer in US is an apple, in europe the same number is somewhere in 1/50 i think.
i believe macintosh users are much more likely to buy music from the itms than pc users (because most pc users still seem to think apple sucks). hence, the service will be a failure if it comes with a price tag of 1.29e a track (tax included).
Here is a comparative table of how much a single track sells for on average online. (Currency conversions as at 05/27/04)
US ....... $0.99 ....... (0.99 USD) [iTMS, Napster]
UK ....... £1.09 ....... (2.00 USD) [Napster]
CAN ..... $1.19 ....... (0.88 USD) [Napster]
EUR ..... 1.29 Euro .. (1.58 USD) [Rumored iTMS]
About Value:
Best selling track from iTMS this week: The Reason (Hoobastank)
Best selling some comes from this album: The Reason
Price of this album on Amazon (US): $10.99 USD
Price of this album on amazon (UK): $ 22.02 USD (£11.99)
Price of this album on Amazon (CAN): $11.05 USD ($14.99 CAN)
Price of this album on Amazon (FR): $23.46 USD (19.12 Euro)
There is 12 tracks on this album so...
US album price per track: $0.92 USD
UK album price per track: $1.84 USD
Can album price per track: $0.92 USD
Euro album price per track: $1.96 USD
Comparaison of online price VS "real thing" price
(I know UK is in the Euro but Napster seems to think differently )
US: 7% more expensive when bought online.
UK: 9% more expensive when bought online.
Can: 20% LESS!!! expensive when bought online.
Euro: 20% LESS!!! expensive when bought online.
Ok ^_^ with only one album, I guess this is not very representative. Also, that album might be considered an "import" in europe explaining the high price.
The only definitive convlusion I can make... Canadians will have the sweetest deal if iTMS is ever released in Canada AND want to stay competitive with Napster.
US ....... $0.99 ....... (0.99 USD) [iTMS, Napster]
UK ....... £1.09 ....... (2.00 USD) [Napster]
CAN ..... $1.19 ....... (0.88 USD) [Napster]
EUR ..... 1.29 Euro .. (1.58 USD) [Rumored iTMS]
About Value:
Best selling track from iTMS this week: The Reason (Hoobastank)
Best selling some comes from this album: The Reason
Price of this album on Amazon (US): $10.99 USD
Price of this album on amazon (UK): $ 22.02 USD (£11.99)
Price of this album on Amazon (CAN): $11.05 USD ($14.99 CAN)
Price of this album on Amazon (FR): $23.46 USD (19.12 Euro)
There is 12 tracks on this album so...
US album price per track: $0.92 USD
UK album price per track: $1.84 USD
Can album price per track: $0.92 USD
Euro album price per track: $1.96 USD
Comparaison of online price VS "real thing" price
(I know UK is in the Euro but Napster seems to think differently
)US: 7% more expensive when bought online.
UK: 9% more expensive when bought online.
Can: 20% LESS!!! expensive when bought online.
Euro: 20% LESS!!! expensive when bought online.
Ok ^_^ with only one album, I guess this is not very representative. Also, that album might be considered an "import" in europe explaining the high price.
The only definitive convlusion I can make... Canadians will have the sweetest deal if iTMS is ever released in Canada AND want to stay competitive with Napster.