iTunes to Windows

[e-coli]

Originally posted by bertagert
Remember, its not Apple against buymusic/napster/etc. It's Apple against MS.

I would argue it's none of the above. It's consumer vs. RIAA. And Apple has come up with an innovative way to mediate between the two. The other music services don't pitch equally between the two parties. They play right into the wishes of the record companies at the expense of the consumer.

 

[tizza]

Re: MusicMatch is coming too

Originally posted by jaykk
According to Macobserver , musicmatch is going to be a real competitor to iTMS. hurry up, apple.

"MusicMatch, the company that currently provides Apple with the software that allows Windows users to sync their iPods, said Monday that it plans to add a music store to its Jukebox software by the end of the year"
"We think generally people want to own music," Musicmatch senior vice president Bob Ohlweiler said Monday. "An a la carte service has a lot more to offer to the masses, and the potential for a much higher adoption rate."

If you read all the ipod forums, MusicMatch sounds like it has more problems than it's worth for windows ipod users (not that I've personally experienced using it). Maybe they've finally solved all the probs if they think they are goign to give iTMS for Windows a run for their money.

 

[Phil Of Mac]

Originally posted by Computer_Phreak
yep, this is turning out to be another classic example of "lets copy apple and gain huge market share!"'

Except, in true Microsoft fashion, they can't even do it as well as Apple

Originally posted by vrapan
Gates about MS music store:
"Downloading might be something your platform has to offer but it is not a money maker"

See? If this is true, MS isn't interested, because it won't make them enough money to be worthwhile. Apple doesn't really care about that, they want to change the world and make a nice profit on the side. Obviously, though, a music store like that will be immensely profitable for whoever runs it, especially if all the mainstream artists ditch their labels and go indie on iTMS, because that'll mean more money for artists and more money for Apple.

 

[Snowy_River]

Re: Re: MusicMatch is coming too

Originally posted by tizza
If you read all the ipod forums, MusicMatch sounds like it has more problems than it's worth for windows ipod users (not that I've personally experienced using it). Maybe they've finally solved all the probs if they think they are goign to give iTMS for Windows a run for their money.

First, let me say that I've never even launched MusicMatch, so all I know about it is what I've read. However, base on articles like this one I seriously doubt that MusicMatch will be serious competition for iTMS for Windows.

 

[vrapan]

Musicmatch

In my PC days - till February this year - after that I bought a cute little PowerBook and got hooked to Apple big time MusicMatch was my music jukebox of choice. It is not bad software but:

1. It is not match for the elegance of iTunes not even close. in iTunes I had categorised and fixed my 1000+ songs in a couple of hours. In musicmatch I had kinda given up.

2. All the first major releases and the next two or three minor updates are unstable big time. I mean I started using it since 5.00 till the 5.2 no kidding it was crashing several times a day. Things got much better on 5.5 i think. Then the same with 6 - 6.2 and 7-7.2 and then now 8 my bro that still has a PC says it is crashing on him quite often. Never used it with a Windows iPod but after this sort of experience I am not sure I want to.

 

[MrMacMan]

Wow good news, if they have the same restrictions as the Mac Version, I and everyone else will be VERY, VERY pleased.

All we need to hear now is its coming sooner then expected.!

 

[bertagert]

Originally posted by Phil Of Mac
See? If this is true, MS isn't interested, because it won't make them enough money to be worthwhile.

If that were true, Microsoft wouldn't be putting any money into DRM for audio or trying to get everybody to use its player. Don't let his quote fool you. There's a ton of money to be made, especially if your the one that controls how the music is played.

I would argue it's none of the above. It's consumer vs. RIAA. And Apple has come up with an innovative way to mediate between the two. The other music services don't pitch equally between the two parties. They play right into the wishes of the record companies at the expense of the consumer.

Apple isn't doing this to be mr. nice guy. They want money, and lots of it. Plus they don't want MS to have control over which format is used.

The RIAA is not some evil giant. They're just trying to make money like everyone else. If they make more than some other type of business, I'm happy for them. I buy 20 - 30 cd's a year ($300.00 or so). I get to listen and enjoy that music when ever or where ever I'd like for the rest of my life. I spend twice as much going skiing every year. How come no one bitches about the skiing industry?

 

[Phil Of Mac]

Originally posted by bertagert
The RIAA is not some evil giant. They're just trying to make money like everyone else. If they make more than some other type of business, I'm happy for them. I buy 20 - 30 cd's a year ($300.00 or so). I get to listen and enjoy that music when ever or where ever I'd like for the rest of my life. I spend twice as much going skiing every year. How come no one bitches about the skiing industry?

Because you can't get free skiing through piracy?

 

[Snowy_River]

Originally posted by bertagert
...Don't let his quote fool you. There's a ton of money to be made, especially if your the one that controls how the music is played...

Well, yes, there is, but most of the money is not in being a service provider for downloaded songs. Some money may be there to be made, but you can be sure that the labels are making a lot more than the service providers.

Apple isn't doing this to be mr. nice guy. They want money, and lots of it...

Well, yes, and a big part of how they win from this deal is the iPod. Make it easier to get music to your computer, and you want to be able to take it with you. Presto! More iPod sales. I don't think that Apple is making much money, net, from iTMS itself.

However, they are better able to make money when they keep their customers happy, and one of the best ways to do this is to be Mr. Nice Guy, as much as possible. They might be able to make more money off of iTMS if they weren't so nice about it.

The RIAA is not some evil giant. They're just trying to make money like everyone else. If they make more than some other type of business, I'm happy for them...

Even if they are making that money through illegal business practices? It's fairly well known (and there's even been a case or two about it) that the RIAA is guilty of price fixing when it comes to CDs. So, please forgive me if I have little sympathy for the 'Big Five'.

 

[Docrjm]

Free Skiing

Originally posted by Phil Of Mac
Because you can't get free skiing through piracy?

Actually by hiking half way up a hill with midmountain lifts you can. Reason, mountains rarely check lift passes halfway up.

 

[gwangung]

Originally posted by Snowy_River
It's fairly well known (and there's even been a case or two about it) that the RIAA is guilty of price fixing when it comes to CDs. So, please forgive me if I have little sympathy for the 'Big Five'.

I wouldn't shed too many tears if the power of the RIAA is broken...but, in principle, I'd have to agree that piracy is not something to promote. And if the Music Store can start shifting the balance of power so that the labels have less power, and the artists more, I'm all for that.

But, in all likelihood, the RIAA, like the big media companies, will still be influential once things settle down. It's just that they're going to have to share some of that power....

 

[Phil Of Mac]

Re: Free Skiing

Originally posted by doc_mac
Actually by hiking half way up a hill with midmountain lifts you can. Reason, mountains rarely check lift passes halfway up.

Thanks for the tip!

Just kidding

 

[Phil Of Mac]

Originally posted by Snowy_River
Well, yes, there is, but most of the money is not in being a service provider for downloaded songs. Some money may be there to be made, but you can be sure that the labels are making a lot more than the service providers.

Yeah, until Britney Spears' contract with her label runs out and she ditches the label and signs on independently with iTMS (very plausible, if iTMS replaces conventional record stores 5 years from now). Apple and Britney split the savings. Now you're talking profit.

Originally posted by Snowy_River
Well, yes, and a big part of how they win from this deal is the iPod. Make it easier to get music to your computer, and you want to be able to take it with you. Presto! More iPod sales. I don't think that Apple is making much money, net, from iTMS itself.

And the iPod will come with iTunes for Windows once it's out, resulting in more iTMS users, more iTMS sales while the resultant market forces close down some record stores, forcing more people to choose iTMS, so more iPods, etc. It's a cascading effect that will conquer the world.

Originally posted by Snowy_River
Even if they are making that money through illegal business practices? It's fairly well known (and there's even been a case or two about it) that the RIAA is guilty of price fixing when it comes to CDs. So, please forgive me if I have little sympathy for the 'Big Five'.

I don't think condemning the RIAA is worthwhile. They're dead now anyway, thanks to iTMS. The only thing saving this venture is that the labels are too dumb to know it.

 

[macnews]

Re: MusicMatch is coming too

Originally posted by jaykk
According to Macobserver , musicmatch is going to be a real competitor to iTMS. hurry up, apple.

Both are due out at year end so Apple should be fine so long as they meet the deadline and come out just before musicmatch.

Apple will also have almost 9 months of press and reputation to play on where Musicmatch won't be quit as established (in terms of an online download service).

 

[Snowy_River]

Originally posted by gwangung
I wouldn't shed too many tears if the power of the RIAA is broken...but, in principle, I'd have to agree that piracy is not something to promote. And if the Music Store can start shifting the balance of power so that the labels have less power, and the artists more, I'm all for that.

Forgive me, I didn't mean to sound like I was condoning piracy. In general, I am very against it. (Yes, I have downloaded songs, but a total of maybe a dozen. And of those, only a few were 'keepers', and, in general, those inspired me to buy the albums that they were on... used. )

I actually got into quite a discussion about iTMS vs illegal downloading with a friend of mine over this last weekend. She said that she wouldn't pay $.99 for a song that she could download for free. That's an attitude that I don't agree with, but I guess it's her risk to take...

But, in all likelihood, the RIAA, like the big media companies, will still be influential once things settle down. It's just that they're going to have to share some of that power....

Oh, I'm sure that they will be, but they will also be a changed power. They won't have the absolute reign that they mostly have now.

It will be a good day, when it comes...

 

[tduality]

Re: Down to the wire

Originally posted by jaedreth

Keep in mind that this isn't simply a music player. It keeps track of your computer being *authorized* to play music by your ethernet hardware address.

Everyone, before you send your machines in for repair, de-authorize your computer. If they replace the mlb, Apple can't give you that authorization back that you will lose.

Jaedreth

The 'mlb' Sorry to ask as stupid question: What's the 'mlb'?

The computer is authorized by the ethernet hardware addess? Could I 'authorize' another computer by plugging in this ethernet card. This would deauthorize the other one so its not worth the trouble, just asking.

tduality

 

[tduality]

Originally posted by snahabed
Am I the only one who sees the "certainly intend to have broad rights" language as foreshadowing the failure of this intention?

Clearly Apple is having difficulty obtaining the same rights on the Windows version. This quote seems to imply that they may have to make concessions, but they still want to keep the rights broader than buymusic, for example.

I think the record execs would be utter morons not to realize that the liberal DRM is what makes iTMS so popular.

You're not the only one.

Following the discussions on this site and others I have some evidence that some people might indeed think that the possibility exists that the record execs could possibly be what you choose to call 'morons'. So expect the worst.

 

[vrapan]

Piracy......

I spend twice as much going skiing every year. How come no one bitches about the skiing industry?

Well you will pay at least 10 times that a year for a car but you won't bitch for a car either.

Let me give you an example. A few years back in UK car prices were sky high many models selling for as much as 75% higher than the same car in Europe. People went on and bought them form Europe. That was majorly inconvenient (had to find a dealer, have to have the cash for the car, deal with the steering wheel being on the opposite side than UK cars deal with customs and so on.) People went on with that though because they could save a lot of money. Point: people were "bitching" about hugely expensive cars and they found an inconvenient way to circumvent the price fixing and they went ahead. It was an abused market and someone had to do something about it.

The records market is just as abused. 20$ for a new CD no matter which. 20$ regardless if there is one song worth listening and 9 fillers or there are 9 good songs and one that you may not like. Have the record industry been less greedy and offered to people cheaper music, easier access to hits or compilations on the spot, more one song CDs and the price among CDs reflected their value things would be a lot different. Why would you want to waste time to find one song that someone ripped on his computer which has clicks and pops and sounds horrible on your stereo when you have an acceptable alternative? Sure some people might still prefer the free but with a well thought campaign against it and good service it would have been kept to a minimum. It is not like they dont have enough money to invest in such schemes it is that they were stubborn and greedy and hate change and want to play it tough. That does not do anything for their image and does not help to convert from freeto paying.

 

[instantypo]

Originally posted by Phil Of Mac
Apple and Britney

Please ... some integrity ;-)

And the iPod will come with iTunes for Windows once it's out, resulting in more iTMS users, more iTMS sales

Now that's a great thought. Indeed, which winuser would refrain from installing a free application knowing that it's supposed to be quite good? Even though they normally settle for mediocre stuff, they'll get hooked once they install winTunes ...

 

[ewinemiller]

Re: Down to the wire

Originally posted by jaedreth
Keep in mind that this isn't simply a music player. It keeps track of your computer being *authorized* to play music by your ethernet hardware address.

Everyone, before you send your machines in for repair, de-authorize your computer. If they replace the mlb, Apple can't give you that authorization back that you will lose.

This may be an issue on PCs as well, when iTMS hits Windows.

Jaedreth

I think it's something different than MAC address (the ethernet hardware address), or maybe some combination of things. I have Jaguar and 10.1 installed, if I reboot into the 10.1 install and try to play anything I've bought it won't saying I have to authorize that machine. If it was simply MAC address it would work because it's the same network card.

 

[jayscheuerle]

I'm guessing that Apple's had a Windows version of iTunes and the iStore ready to go from day one, they just haven't been allowed to release it yet.

How could they not? It's not like they came up with this overnight and just decided that "Hey, it's doing so well, let's release it to the other 90% of home users out there!".

It's sitting in the can, waiting for the green light.

- j

 

[jaykk]

iTunes for Windows is not ready

I think apple won't be ready for windows till the end of year for 2 reasons. They are still negotiating with labels for a similar contract. I also doubt that windows version of itunes is nearly done.If iTunes for windows was ready why didn't they ship it instead of music match when they released windows version of iPod. Apple should have sold more iPods if they had iTunes ready to ship with them.

 

[hayesk]

Re: Re: Down to the wire

Originally posted by tduality
The 'mlb' Sorry to ask as stupid question: What's the 'mlb'?

Main Logic Board. In most Macs, the ethernet card is on there.

 

[Capt Underpants]

Great news that it is still on track. Maybe it will come out before Christmas and I will get an iPod. That would be great! Well I ca nt wait for iTMS for windows. Apple needs to get a wider targetted audience.

 

[Neotronik]

Apple has been on the right track with the itunes music store.
For one; Itunes is a blast. It's incredible; I love it. I'm a dj/remixer/producer and use both mac and pee cee's. Well; partially; My mac experience has only been on the titanium g4 powerbook; but what an experience it's been; sad to say; I have to replace the logic board; someone tripped over the powercoard and the neckbone was connected to the backbone; yada., yada, yada, so while it's getting replaced; The hobbyist inside me prompted me to build a so called monster pee cee a few weeks ago; I ordered the abit at7max2 motherboard
with an amd 2800+xp processor One and a half gigs of pc 2700 ddr. Seagate 120 serial ata hard drive; and a western digital 80 gig (8mb cache) just for win xp pro OS and app installs. ati radeon 9700 pro; Sony 52x cdrw; All housed in the blue Thermaltake xaser III 2000 (the one with the window on the side)
I must tell you that the performance of this system was shocking.
AMD WOW!!!!!! I actually respected windows xp pro as an os.
Back to the topic at hand:
I needed some tunes in my ipod so; I downloaded music match; sadly updated the firmware in my ipod and had my first pee cee nightmare; Musicmatch IS HORRIBLE; it is nothing like Itunes and couldn't come close. File managment is horrible. I did manage to get my songs into the ipod; but my files and song genres; NOPE!!!
ITUNES is so advanced that it actually works the way a logical human being would. I can't begin to tell you how i miss the itunes experience. MusicMatch is terrible and poses no threat to apples itunes should it come out for windows.
I do think that apple should again think differently when crossing over to this dangerous murky os/computing platform. CHOICE!!!! Choice is key; itunes for windows should allow the user a choice of going to the Itunes music store or buymusic.com or napster 2 (when it comes out) to buy your music. People love choices not restrictions. If you chose the wmf format as your preferred format; after the rest of us finish gagging Itunes will direct you to buymusic.com a/k/a buymusic.com/acompleteitunesmusicstorerippoff. This would make it the ultimate software of choice for enjoying music.
Sadly; I regret to inform you that when plugging in my camcorder to the firewire port on the thermaltake case (top) which connected to the internal firewire pins on the abit motherboard; it froze; i rebooted; there wasn't even a POST. it was the last time I saw my pee cee working; switched graphics card to another motherboard and it was fine; this sucker died on me. I plugged this camcorder into my powerbook; used imovie and final cut with no problems and 0 configuration and 0 crashes. I was frustrated; I sent all the components back to where I bought them; crying; because i really do like AMD; again WOW!!!!! Anyhow I absorbed 140 dollars in restocking fees and went to www.apple.com and ordered a dual 2ghz g5 with a 17 inch apple display and apple care (i didn't purchase applecare with my powerbook and am suffering dearly) Anyhow the G5 will ship on or before october 2nd. So now I await my powerbook g4 500 to be resurrected and the g5 will soon be joining us with itunes and it's music store less musicmatch and systematic destruction when plugging in a firewire camcorder. Oddly; my pee cee solution which is still a workhorse is my original Micron Millenia Max pc pentium II 400 with ultra wide scsi controller, hd, cd-rom,external scsi cdrw running windows 98 se tweaked to death. Once AMD introduces the amd 64 I am going to attempt to build another monster and hopefully itunes for windows will be out!!!!! That's my choice hands down over all this other crap that's coming.

Apple for Life Baby!!!!!!!!!