iWeb Site for Graphic Design - Please Critique

Discussion in 'Design and Graphics' started by SeanAppleDude, Jun 23, 2010.

  1. SeanAppleDude macrumors member

    SeanAppleDude

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2009
    Location:
    Philadelphia, PA
    #1
    Hey Guys,
    I’ve been working on this site for a few weeks now, and I have yet to get any feedback from anyone else other than myself.
    Let me know what you think about the overall look and the usability of the site.
    (try not to critique my design work in the portfolio :/)
    The site’s not done yet, and some links are not finished, but the address is -
    www.SeanWalshDesigns.com
    Thanks :)
     
  2. Jason Beck macrumors 68000

    Jason Beck

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2009
    Location:
    Cedar City, Utah
    #2
    It's okay but your alignment is off. One of the rules of design is alignment. Your cloud should be uniformly placed over your textboxes. I would make your site logo 5% larger to make it the focal point of your design, and make the text pop out more by maybe using a different type. Other than the alignment thing I think its okay for a start. Thanks for sharing it!
     
  3. NXTMIKE macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2008
    Location:
    Canada
    #3
    What you've done with your cloud is great! I like how that looks with your logo and everything, however it really breaks up the "flow" once you look down at the text content below. As with the alignment issue, I'd have the content box extend to the right and left edges of the cloud, and then play around with the colours, and alignment of the text inside it, as the text just isn't doing it with me.
     
  4. THX1139 macrumors 68000

    THX1139

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2006
    #4
    I bit off topic, but is that price list correct or FPO? You're willing to design a logo with unlimited revisions for $29? Seriously?

    By the way... if you're going to do quotes, you really should identify who said it. For all we know, the quotes could have come from your mom.
     
  5. Deepshade macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2010
    #5
    Your are obviously not making a living out of this.
    A bit of text in an awkwardly shaped cloud.
    Poor typography.
    Grey can be beautiful. This is just plain ugly.
    Little understanding of space, proportion.

    Are any of the logos for real clients?
    BTW - An identity is not just a logo!
    Frankly its a bit insulting to designers.
    Especially if you think publishing it here is going to get you work.

    If you ever go out into the real world and pay a mortgage with what you are doing you'll find you need to have a greater understanding of what it means to offer design as a service. My guess - early teen - living at home - all the bills paid - looking to be a designer or earn some pocket money.

    Its not about knocking out a logo thrown together in Illustrator for the price of a KFC bargain bucket.
    What do you say to a client who gets a nice $29 logo and finds it doesn't work in one color? or doesn't reproduce small. Or the color you've chosen is reproduceable in CMYK? How does it look in situation x,y,z.....this list is vast. There no way on earth you can cover an identity for that kind of pricepoint.

    And that's the sort of critique you'll get at art college if you try to fake it.

    In the eyes of clients who don't know any better this sort of faux design really devalues of the work of real Designers.

    Go to art college. Then try again when you understand what you are doing.
     
  6. howmanytimes macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2010
    #6
    No offence mate... But leave it to us professionals. We have a hard enough time as it is correcting bad "designers" mistakes and trying to persuade companies with bad images to spend the time and money re-branding their business to make them look professional and unique.
     
  7. likeavaliant macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2006
    #7
    You're obviously a young kid that is fascinated by graphic design and the culture. For that, I commend you. It's a fun and challenging field to be involved in. With that said, I suggest you keep building your portfolio and learning how to code a bit better before trying to sell your services. An iWeb site does nothing to show that you know what you are doing, but I understand the desire to gain notoriety and page views. I suggest building website after website after websites and doing as much design work as you can and follow as many online tutorials as you can. When all this has happened and you have grown in age, seek schooling and go for it. When i was young I built fan pages for bands. They didn't serve any real purpose, but it was an awesome exercise in design. Keep it up dude you'll figure things out soon enough.
     
  8. lionheartednyhc macrumors 65816

    lionheartednyhc

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2009
    #8
    It loads REALLY slowly. And my safari is pretty snappy.
     
  9. THX1139 macrumors 68000

    THX1139

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2006
    #9
    I'm kind of on the fence on this one (but lean towards thinking this is a bad thing). On one hand, while I think some 15 year old kids are talented, I don't think they can have the professional experience it takes to make money doing design. It undermines and devalues the profession- it is a classic example of why the design industry needs certification to prove they have learned the disciplines of design and not just how to make pretty pictures. How many times have you heard the story about a designer who didn't get a job because the client "got the boss's son" or "the next door neighbor's kid" to do the work for $29 bucks? Then someone else hears about that and suddenly they think that is what a logo should cost. They don't stop to realize that a 15 year old kid doesn't have a family to raise, nor has invested in years of experience or school. They don't see the difference between a well-researched and thought-out solution, vs a Photoshop hack job. They just need a logo and love the idea of getting one for $29!

    Which leads me to my second point. Maybe I shouldn't care? If a client wants to take advantage of a kid and hire him instead of you or I... why does that matter other than the world is polluted with more bad design? I probably wouldn't want to work with someone who has such low expectations, or is such a tight-wad that they think their Brand is not worth investing in. Or maybe they don't need a developed brand? Joe's post hole digging services probably doesn't need to spend thousands of dollars on brand development. That might be a good opportunity for a young "designer" to get some experience. However, our young Padwan who started this thread is not after this market. He is clearly marketing to whomever will pay him his dirt cheap fee. But my main problem is that he is also trying to sell himself as a professional designer; he is not saying, "Hey- I'm only 15 years old, so I am willing to do your design for the experience and some pocket change". By doing that, he isn't being dishonest with potential clients... and he's perpetuating the illusion that logo development (with unlimited revisions!) is only worth $29. The irony is that he is undermining the very industry he hopes to make a living at doing.


    For additional information, an how cheap design is changing the industry:

    http://www.no-spec.com/
    http://www.stepinsidedesign.com/STEPMagazine/Article/28481/
     
  10. snickelfritz macrumors 65816

    snickelfritz

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2003
    Location:
    Tucson AZ
    #10
    iWeb is for grandmothers and techno-phobes.
    Sorry, but it really is the wrong tool for building commercial websites.

    WordPress is good for creating a clean website with plenty of features.
    Lots of good clean templates available.
    Keep it clean and simple; you want feedback on your work, not the website.
     
  11. mofunk macrumors 68000

    mofunk

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2009
    Location:
    Americas
    #11
    Ouch such harsh criticism. If you guys are professional then why are you so hard on this kid? He just asked for help. Which imo he is doing the right thing. Most kids will go half azz at a project. smh


    @Sean When designing you want your lines to be clean and centered. You are putting out a project that everyone will see. Its a design. Take the advice from those who stated what needs to be changed. iWeb is good start. You can change a lot around. Also when you want to move to the industry standard you can incorporate the two. Adding to the other comments... contrast colors that work. I like the red, so maybe that could be another color besides grey and white. Look to your environment to find inspiration.
     
  12. jonnysods macrumors 603

    jonnysods

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2006
    Location:
    There & Back Again
    #12
    Wow, I jumped in to a pretty nasty thread that was just asking for an opinion on his site.

    Guys you are talking like he is stealing huge clients out of your pockets. There are 6 billion people on this planet. This guy isn't taking food out of your mouths, if a person is looking for a $29 logo, do you think you want that person as your client when you tell them you charge $70+ an hour?

    And saying that designers need to be certified is crazy. I know lots of incredibly talented designers that haven't been to school for it. That's slamming the door in the face of talent.

    If he nets $29 customers let him keep them. There is plenty of business out there for all of us!
     
  13. mikes63737 macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2005
    #13
    You should not have any ads on a page you are using to try to get work. On the downloads page, there are two ads and I think this comes across as being desperate to make a penny.

    Get rid of the Made on a Mac logo. It screams "Made in iWeb" which is a very bad thing. Same with the "free" tag on Downloads.

    Remember that when you're linking to work you've done on other sites (such as Twitter), make sure the link opens in a new window (<a target="_blank" href="url goes here">). Many users will automatically close the window after they see the sample, and that could mean they never come back. And unless you are managing the Twitter page and the user has no access (unlikely), you should keep a copy of your work on your server because the user could always change the background without telling you.

    The site is also very slow. You can get much better hosting from about $4 per month.

    I think it's great that you are showing ambition unlike most kids. I'm 18 so I've seen this lack of motivation firsthand. People looking for low-price logos wouldn't even consider paying $70+ per hour, so you're not stealing work from any of these people complaining... just from "the neighbor's kid". I hope my comments help. :)
     
  14. RuSirius macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2010
    #14
    my critique

    for those who suggest the criticism is harsh..while it may seem harsh, it is the sort of real-world criticism this individual is going to receive if/when he chooses to go to school for design. If he doesn't receive it verbally, then it is what potential clients will be thinking.

    in this vein - A top-notch prof. isn't going to coddle his/her students. S/he is going to push, push, push them to evoke their talent. At least, I would hope so. I'd rather my school environment be somewhat like Hell's Kitchen rather than a pleasant 2 or 3 years of partying.

    my criticism is: those quotes, while they may be genuine, look as though they were written by you. I suggest that because (as someone else mentioned) there are no names/links associated with them. Also, the grammar/verbiage seems remarkably similar between them....thus, implying to me, the same author.

    Also, the 2nd page of your site does load very slowly.

    Overall, the entire design of your site is uninspiring and flat. Very, very basic. Not cool-basic, not chic-simple...just - boring. If this is your first site ever, then it's cool you made one and keep banging away at it.

    If this is your best effort after months or years of design, then you might want to consider moving on.

    I also think that dirt-cheap work is a very bad thing for ANY industry. People deserve to get paid what they are worth. When too many people in any field start dropping their rates to rock bottom, and especially if they have talent in that field...as a whole, people then develop expectations of paying nothing for a lot.

    This is a fact, not opinion. For instance, in the insurance industry, medical billing is paid out at what most people in that specialty are charging. If people billing out for, say, dental work begin to drop their rates...the insurance industry responds by lowering their maximum payments...thus reducing (eventually) the spectrum of practitioners to mega-corps who, in turn, pay their dentists very little.

    Kid, go to school, or work on some mad skillz and get paid what you or any potential good designer is worth.

    fwiw: i never went to school and was earning $100/hour at the height of my design career before the crash in the early 2000s.

    edit: you made the "energy smart buildings" logo? You should bring some of that dynamism into your web site design. While I'm not fond of the text in that logo (looks like it was just "stuck" in there..it doesn't merge with or flow from the nice outline of the bulb - plug it into the plug, if you will!), overall the outline of the light with the plug is clever.

    You seem as though you are uncertain of what to do with text...I get a late 90s feel from what you do with it. Treat text not was words, but as ideas to evoke and inspire with. Think of words as images, not just flat things sitting on a page. Words are art, and powerful art at that. Treat them as such. Look what talented graffiti artists do....
     
  15. citizenzen Suspended

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2010
    #15
    If you're looking for a critique, then you'd better be prepared for some negative feedback.


    If you're looking for hugs... ask your moms.
     
  16. McDughf macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2007
    Location:
    Great Britain
    #16
    Mother always said : if you can't say anything good, don't say anything at all"...

    Hi Sean
    First, I would like to say that you have done some nice logo's. I especially liked the Odyssey, Hot Domains, EZ-Bet And Jardins Ones.
    Not so keen on your backgrounds, I felt they were a little plain to be honest, and the purple YouTube one was a little too busy for my liking , but keep at it and you will get there.

    One thought about your overall presentation that struck me though is this:
    I feel that your approach is off; The monotones, which would work great on a Noir / Melancholy piece, doesn't really work with the phrase "I can make you stand out" - For me this is a bit of a contradiction.
    You may want to rethink your colour scheme.

    I do like your cloud, and for me the menu bar is nice. Perhaps space the home page out a little as I felt it was a bit tight.

    "When Are You going to get your logo design" - I needed to read this sentence a few times before I could get the gist of what you were trying to convey. Not good. Selling yourself needs to be snappy and straight to the point.
    Your clients are not stupid, so I think you should drop the "When you need a logo, or other graphics designed, check out my portfolio and then contact me" - Its obvious what they should do, and they probably do it hundreds of times a day.

    Infact, drop everything from that box , and just leave it at : "My name is Sean. I make you stand out"
    drop the "can", it evokes uncertainty.



    In this profession, like all artistic professions ( I work in films ) you are bound to get Criticism which is not constructive, saying how crap you are and dammed you for trying.
    One of the first things you need to develop is a thick skin. People are afraid you will steal their jobs and earnings. They are the ones who complain that there are no jobs and they never have contracts.
    But get this - there are thousands of jobs Big and small going every day!

    The complainers would just spend time feeling sorry for themselves instead of going the extra 500% needed to get the contract ( and if you thought there was only 100%, you're not trying hard enough ;P ).

    If you are good, then people will hire you.
    You get good by asking for help.
    I Always go out of my way to help people, because at the end of the day I Know I am good.
    People Pay for good.
    I won't loose my talent or ability by helping others.
    If you copy me and someone buys your work, great - they own a one off, they are not buying my thinking.
    And tomorrow I will have though of something new, different and far better than todays thought.
    You'll still be working on yesterdays news.

    Sadly, people don't think like this any more, and bite when you ask for a bit of help.

    Go for Gold kid, you can only get better.
    And when you hit the top, remember how you got there and help those reaching up for the ropes.

    Barney
     
  17. Consultant macrumors G5

    Consultant

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2007
    #17
    The automated resized images are problematic.

    It doesn't scream iweb though.
     
  18. citizenzen Suspended

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2010
    #18
    +1

    -1

    +1

    But be honest. It doesn't help to give hugs merely for the sake of sparing someones feelings.
     
  19. ezekielrage_99 macrumors 68040

    ezekielrage_99

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2005
    #19
    I'm not going to "cut down" someone who is interested in a career in design but from what I've seen from the site it screams "I have an interest in design therefore I am going to freelance".

    It just doesn't work that way, good (and for that matter the best designers) have a mix of EXPERIENCE, TALENT and LEARNED SKILL. From what I can see you have one of those aspects but you really need to harness the rest, learn about design not just the software.

    With regards to the actual site, it looks very eclectic and amateurish, element although design wise looks ok don't seem to "gel" together (lack of consistent typography). But with that said most of the logos do have potential and would look awesome if presented in the right way.

    $50 for a logo? The last identity I did cost the company near $30K, identity is more than just an icon with text it's about solid research, colour theory and typography. $50 would really undercut yourself IMO with hardware/software cost I do logos on the site and charge $150p.h. and make around 20% to 30% on ROI.

    Despite what people think design is hard, 99% of my time as a Creative Director is spent dealing with inanely stupid feedback like "make it more webbish", "my wife doesn't like the blue" and "I am after nice graphics, you know where people look at them and say wow those are nice graphics" (and yes they were client feedbacks).

    I've added some food for thought here, the following link it to the best portfolio sites out there, it might give you ideas of where to focus on and give you some direction.

    Smashing Top 50 Portfolios

    Good luck!
     
  20. bluetooth macrumors 6502a

    bluetooth

    Joined:
    May 1, 2007
    Location:
    Toronto
    #20
    ^What he said...:p

    In all seriousness though, to the OP, there is some good advice amongst some of the harsher comments. While I do not encourage destructive criticism, truth be told, you are going to need to have thick skin in any design industry and develop the ability to separate the constructive comments from the destructive comments. You will benefit greatly from the constructive.

    I think the gist of what most are getting at here is that you need to learn the craft before you can perfect the art. In other words, you need to study art/design and the specific niches or medias that you are interested in. No one is saying you need to go to college this coming fall, but the web is a great online tool and library to learn about design. Books are also great for learning design principles and fundamentals. Amazon.com has good deals on some that are used but still in order.

    There is a sticky at the top of the forum on books and links;

    http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=929418

    start there as well as the link listed in the post above mine. There is nothing wrong with getting your feet wet so to speak but I, among others, would strongly advise that you learn and perfect your skills before putting yourself "out there"

    I will echo in saying, "Good Luck". :cool:
     
  21. THX1139 macrumors 68000

    THX1139

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2006
    #21
    Are you guys still giving advice to this kid? He's long gone. Or, at least he never stuck around beyond his first post. Another sign of non-professionalism. Yeah... I know, it's a public forum. But when someone asks a question or wants a critique, they should at least have the decency to participate in the discussion. His post and run is typical of a teenager and the reason he should not be trying to work as a professional. Most are flaky (not all!) and don't have any sense of responsibility to others when it comes to being reliable. I had a colleague call me for some emergency Flash work awhile back. He needed it right away and was in a panic. Seems the kid (he was 18) he hired to do the Flash project decided to take off to go camping with his friends instead of staying home to finish the job he promised to do.

    Anyway... I'm sorry if I come across as harsh in my comments, but when someone tries to pawn themselves off as professional, when they are clearly not, it offends me. Why? It devalues the business I work hard in, and it lessens the perceived quality that people should expect from professionals. If you sell $29 dollar logos, it makes other people wonder why all designers can't do that. Well, we don't have parents paying our room and board. And some of us actually have families to support. And those of us who charge top dollar actually put the time and resources into developing the best mark we can do for our clients. And that takes time. I don't care about the cheap design market. But I do care about protecting the professional standards of the industry.

    The kid who opened this thread would have done much better to say he was an amateur, or student in design school trying to learn the ropes... and then stuck around to participate in the conversation. My attitude would have been more cordial and I would have gladly helped him. But in this case, I don't care if someone is "only" 17. If he's old enough to have his own website, and try to make money off his work, then he's old enough to face any criticism he asked for.
     
  22. SeanAppleDude thread starter macrumors member

    SeanAppleDude

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2009
    Location:
    Philadelphia, PA
    #22
    Reply

    I’m still reading the posts. I didn’t feel I needed to respond to any.
    Everyone should know, I am not looking to make any money at all, or even get people on the site; It’s not like i’m advertising or trying to find jobs. I am simple trying out different things to see what I like.
    I’m only 15.

    Hope some of you feel better after your [destructive] posts. :)
     
  23. bjarkovic macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2004
    Location:
    Reykjavik, Iceland
    #23
    Nobody should feel bad about their responses, Sean - especially you. Your topic says please critique, not please tell me it's great.

    The fact is that a lot of the advice in these posts is really good. You obviously have a feel for what you're doing, and kind of remind me of myself at the same age. I did a lot of stuff that I can look back on and say I did it a pretty good job for my age, but that it didn't really gel together.

    My career did sway away from design and into filmmaking, which I do today, but for any creative career I can happily tell you that you have a long way to go, but at least you have talent to base it on. Don't be angry at the people who are commenting. Read their comments. Understand them. Even research them. You're not about to get into art school just yet, but that doesn't meen you can't read and learn already. Keep it up.

    B.
     
  24. nonameowns macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2010
    #24
    if you are still in HS, ask around if anyone need some graphics/logos. You could get some money for it, but in the real world, I'll suggest for you to go to college to understand everything. :D
     

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