Jaguar on newer 'unsupported' hardware

Discussion in 'PowerPC Macs' started by Amethyst1, Feb 2, 2018.

  1. Amethyst1 macrumors 6502

    Amethyst1

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2015
    Location:
    Germany
    #1
    (this is an updated version of this post I made in 2016.)

    Thought I'd post my experience trying to run Jaguar on Macs that originally shipped with Panther. :)

    Why Jaguar? It was the first version of Mac OS X I ever used and I do kinda prefer its look and feel to the somewhat more subdued look introduced with Panther. The Jaguar partition I deployed was set up in Mac-on-Linux and updated to 10.2.8.


    12" PowerBook G4/1.5GHz (2005) | Model: PowerBook6,8 | Official minimum OS: 10.3.7

    Working

    - Keyboard
    - NVidia GeForce FX Go5200: colour depth/resolution switching, Quartz Extreme, dual display support
    - Display brightness adjustment on internal display and an ADC Cinema Display using slider in Monitors pref. pane and function keys
    - USB (at 1.1 speeds): a mouse works
    - FireWire: recognised in System Profiler
    - AirPort Extreme: can see available networks, didn't try connecting due to no WPA2 support
    - Bluetooth: pairing with mobile phone works
    - Ethernet: recognised in System Profiler/Network pref. pane
    - Modem: recognised in Network pref. pane
    - CD/DVD reading
    - Battery charging and monitoring

    Not Working

    - Trackpad (the 2005 PowerBooks dropped the ADB keyboard and trackpad for USB ones)
    - CPU clock speed scaling (?)
    - Sound
    - Sleep (never wakes up again)
    - Clamshell mode with external display: System freezes at the login window when I boot with the lid closed or close it while it's running
    - Disc burning in Finder: "not supported" in System Profiler


    12" PowerBook G4/1.33GHz (2004) | Model: PowerBook6,4 | Official minimum OS: 10.3.3

    Working

    - Keyboard
    - Trackpad
    - Sound including volume adjustment using function keys
    - NVidia GeForce FX Go5200: colour depth/resolution switching, Quartz Extreme, dual display support
    - Display brightness adjustment on internal display using slider in Monitors pref. pane and function keys
    - USB (at 1.1 speeds): a mouse works
    - FireWire: recognised in System Profiler
    - AirPort Extreme: can see available networks, didn't try connecting due to no WPA2 support
    - Bluetooth: pairing with mobile phone works
    - Ethernet: recognised in System Profiler/Network pref. pane
    - Modem: recognised in Network pref. pane
    - CD/DVD reading
    - Battery charging and monitoring

    Not Working

    - CPU clock speed scaling (?)
    - Sleep (never wakes up again)
    - Disc burning in Finder: "not supported" in System Profiler


    12" iBook G4/800MHz (2003) | Model: PowerBook6,3 | Official minimum OS: 10.3

    Working

    - Keyboard
    - Trackpad
    - ATI Mobility Radeon 9200: colour depth/resolution switching, Quartz Extreme (dual display support not tested)
    - Display brightness adjustment using slider in Monitors pref. pane and function keys
    - USB (at 1.1 speeds): a mouse works
    - FireWire: recognised in System Profiler
    - AirPort Extreme: can see available networks, didn't try connecting due to no WPA2 support
    - Ethernet: recognised in System Profiler/Network pref. pane
    - Modem: recognised in Network pref. pane
    - CD/DVD reading
    - Disc burning in Finder: supported
    - Battery charging and monitoring
    - Sleep
    - Sound including volume adjustment using function keys

    Not Working

    - CPU clock speed scaling (?)

    I am surprised that this machine runs Jaguar almost perfectly, especially the Mobility Radeon 9200 which was not available in any Mac that came with Jaguar. (I know that the Radeon 9200 Mac Edition has drivers for 10.2.8. I did not install them. The original ATIRadeon8500.kext v1.2.26 is used.)


    Mac mini G4/1.42GHz (2005) | Model: PowerMac10,2 | Official minimum OS: 10.3.7

    Working

    - USB (at 1.1 speeds): keyboard and mouse work
    - FireWire: recognised in System Profiler
    - Bluetooth: pairing with mobile phone works
    - Ethernet: recognised in System Profiler/Network pref. pane
    - Modem: recognised in Network pref. pane
    - CD/DVD reading

    Not Working

    - ATI Radeon 9200: no colour depth/resolution switching, no Quartz Extreme
    - Brightness adjustment on an ADC Cinema Display
    - AirPort Extreme
    - Sound
    - Sleep
    - Disc burning in Finder: "not supported" in System Profiler

    I was surprised that Jaguar boots at all on a Mac mini... It keeps the colour depth and screen resolution set in a 'supported' version of Mac OS X so the graphics department basically boils down to having no acceleration or Quartz Extreme. I have tried adding the 9200's device ID (0x59621002) to 10.2.8's version of ATIRadeon8500.kext which results in the extension being loaded but I still can't switch colour depth or resolution, it still reports an "Unknown Display" and Quartz Extreme is unavailable. The drivers for the Radeon 9200 Mac Edition install a newer version of the kext so I also tried adding the device ID to that one but the result is the same as with the original version of the kext.

    Does anyone have a pointer how I might persuade the mini's 9200 to work in Jaguar? [​IMG]
     
  2. redheeler macrumors 604

    redheeler

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2014
    #2
    The newest hardware I've had Jaguar running on is a Power Mac G5 7,2 (dual-processor 2.0 GHz). Mine was manufactured in 2004 based on the serial number (meaning it shipped with 10.3 Panther originally) and is unsupported by the retail / normal version of Jaguar, but works fine with the special G5 build that only came on gray restore disks.

    [​IMG]

    As far as I know none of the newer / more powerful G5s will run it, so this is as good as it gets for Jaguar with the classic pinstriped Aqua look.
     
  3. MagicBoy macrumors 68040

    MagicBoy

    Joined:
    May 28, 2006
    Location:
    Manchester, UK
    #3
    10.2.8 is hilariously quick on a 7,2 with an SSD! ;)
     
  4. LightBulbFun macrumors 68000

    LightBulbFun

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2013
    Location:
    London UK
    #4
    very cool :)

    I too have played with running various Mac OSs on newer Hardware then they where made for (I got 10.3.9 booting on a DLSD and Mac OS 8.6 on a Dual 1.42Ghz MDD for example on the same MDD I even booted 10.1.5 :) )

    in terms of OS X versions 10.2.8 and lower, they have the advantage that they wlll boot on an unknown PowerPC CPU instead of just halting, (note this does not apply to the G5 build of 10.2.8 as that is when the bail on unknown CPU thing was added)

    im not sure if you have noticed but click on about this mac on one of your 7447A Macs running jag and you will see it just says "PowerPC" no mention of type as it treats the 7447A the same way it treads 603/604s since it has no idea what they are just like it has no idea what a 7447A is. 10.2.8 will only recognise CPUs properly up to the regular 7447 (or the G5 970)

    I have booted 10.2.8 on my iBook G4 (1.33Ghz 14 inch 2004) and was also surprised to find the Graphics card was supported properly. seeing as you used an 800Mhz iBook those use 7450s IIRC and that CPU is supported fully under 10.2.8 so you should have full speed control there.

    the reason the Mac minis card does not work is because without getting into too many details is because, the Drivers included in 10.2.8 dont support the Mac minis video port layout (those funny names you sometimes see like ATY,RockHoper or ATY,Tracer play quite an important role but thats for an explanation for another time LOL) I have also booted 10.2.8 on my Mac mini G4 and have played with it a bit :)

    Some PowerMac7,3 models shipped with PowerPC 970 CPUs (not 970FXs) and as such can boot the 10.2.8 G5 build but fan control does not work and as such the fans race to max, my 2Ghz June 2004 is one such model with regular 970s that will happily boot 10.2.8 G5 :)
     
  5. air78, Mar 8, 2018
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2018

    air78 macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2018
    #5
    I am trying to find gray disks of 10.2.7 6R55, because the retail build taken from the PearPC disk image updated to 10.2.8 hangs OS X on classic mode.
     
  6. MagicBoy macrumors 68040

    MagicBoy

    Joined:
    May 28, 2006
    Location:
    Manchester, UK
    #6
    Have a look on Macintosh Garden. There's a person there who posts most restore media from that period on request.
     
  7. air78 macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2018
    #7
    Yes, i was looked macintoshgarden. There is only Powermac G5 and Imac G4 flat panel build, which i am not shure that will run on my powerbook. But in general the situation is the same like wrote topic starter, retail build Jaguar work almost fine except classic environment which is need the special gray disks for Powerbook FW800.
     
  8. weckart macrumors 601

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2004
    #8
    There is someone on the MG forum who has a ton of system disks, which he uploads to MG on request. Might be worth looking there to see if he has what you need.
     
  9. MagicBoy macrumors 68040

    MagicBoy

    Joined:
    May 28, 2006
    Location:
    Manchester, UK
    #9
    Yeah, he obviously hasn't found the post. I saw the list and got him to upload the DLSD recovery media for me. The 10.2.7 media was on the list ... I've seen it!

    I can't post a straight link here as I really don't fancy a ban. ;)
     
  10. weckart macrumors 601

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2004
    #10
    You could have asked me for that. I have the DLSD discs. ;)
     

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9 February 2, 2018