Jobs on Mac Netbooks: Not Yet, But...

[marcg007]

netbook vs MBA

I agree. I don't see the market for people needing something between an iPhone and the Macbook Air. Seriously, are there those of you out there that need something like that?

As someone with serious back problems and many heavy books to take to school every day, I need something small and light. The MBA covers the light part but the footprint is just too big to fit in my bag with my school books. I need something with the footprint of my 12 inch Powerbook or smaller in the weight class of the MBA. Also, the MBA needs to support more than 2GBs of RAM. As far as the iPod touch or iPhone goes, give me the ability to use my bluetooth keyboard and mouse, and it might work for at least some of my needs for a while but I really need a slightly bigger screen to avoid making my eye sight any worse.

 

[I WAS the one]

Thanx God I Bought An Ubuntu Netbook G Meso From Sylvania At 3 Hundred! Brand New And Its Ubuntu The Most Mac-alike Os Aout There That Feels Good Using It!

 

[tssfulk]

dual screen

I have a nice LCD (hooked up to my ancient iBook). I want an iMac not a mini. Why? Dual screens are awesome for people with lots of windows/documents open.

Nor can a cheaper iMac... There is a significant group of users who already have their LCD's and want a desktop computer to go with it that doesn't start at > $2K

 

[Abstract]

thats awesome... but what does it say when the only full size laptops in the top 20 being sold are apple ones.

It's not really fair to give Apple credit for this though. Apple has around 6 notebook models to sell right now, or 7 if you include the white plastic MacBook.


Sony, Lenovo, HP, etc, have dozens of different laptop types, each with 2 or 3 variants. Chances are, one particular model won't outsell a MacBook, but then again, they have so many models that they're not too fussed.


Apple isn't THAT good. The results just looked heavily weighted to Apple because they don't sell many models.

 

[Spades]

The MacBook Air (which is definitely not a netbook) is very portable but at the same time has a big screen and big keyboard.

It's more portable than a MacBook, but anything that still needs its own bag doesn't cut it. That's what's so great about my Eee. I can toss it into my electronics bag with all the cables and other small devices I carry. Something with the footprint of a 13" notebook wouldn't even fit in that bag, let alone leave room for everything else I carry.

A problem with many ultraportables is that while they are thin and light, they compromise on keyboard, screen size, and power.

"Compromising" on screen size is unavoidable with an ultraportable device. Apple just needs to get over that. OK, maybe they're working on making OS X work on a 10" screen without any usability compromises, but it would be usable as is anyways.

The power of netbooks is increasingly rapidly. Soon there will be no "compromising", at least compared to the Air as it is now. The MSI Wind uses a 1.6 GHz Atom processor. The Air uses a 1.6 GHz Core 2 Duo. As soon as netbooks use dual-core Atom processors, they will be pretty close to what the Air has now. (Still not there, what with the slower bus. But close.) Even if it is slower, I haven't seen any complaints about performance from people using the Wind as a hackintosh.

Im actually not sure what apple could offer besides looks that would make it any different from another netbook. If it was too different it wouldnt be a netbook now would it?

OS X of course.

 

[Kwill]

Jobs also suggested that the iPhone was an Apple answer to Netbooks. With productivity apps such as Mocha VNC and Briefcase (both offer free "lite" versions) and reference apps like Color Expert that rival Pantone ColorMunki software, I agree iPhone is becoming more about portable personal computing.

 

[rtdunham]

Look at the top 25 computers being sold by Amazon....

That is compelling statistical evidence that the market Steve's waiting for is here, now. I hadn't realized...

I know Amazon's sales aren't necessarily representative of the universe of sales, but you know it's significant. Only one of the non-Apple computers on that top 25 sales list costs more than $700. the average appears to be about $450. And there are more of those units selling at Amazon than apple's laptops. That means the netbook market's already bigger than the apple laptop market. Not nascent: now.

If apple entered the arena, it would get only its share of those sales. But suppose it achieved the same market share in netbooks that it has in U.S. laptop sales--what is it most recently, 20+ percent?--then that apple netbook would absolutely be a reasonable product and a profit center. Almost certainly whatever netbook models apple released would earn sales sufficient to get them on that top 25 list.

Issues of concern: Would an apple netbook take market share from the existing laptops? Or would those sales come from people not buying macs now, because of the prices? Would many owners of 15 and 17 inch apple laptops add a netbook to their hardware, for convenience (imagine if apple introduced innovative, effective docking-and-syncing technologies)? Would the entry level machine lure more switchers into the apple world, leading to incremental sales gains for all apple products?

 

[pmpknetr21]

anyway, when he said this I took it hes not updating the mini everyone so much wants an update to...as well as the fact he had a slip, as he is calling his own computer crap. (thought it was funny)

Peace

dAlen

That was strange, wasn't it...

On a related note, I don't see what's wrong with the mini; or maybe what others see as being wrong with the mini. I get that it's limited in what it can do, but I thought that was the point? A Mac for people who can't afford or choose not to spend $1299 or more on an iMac? My mom has a mini and LOVES it. Got a couple nephews that have one and love it. It's great as a cost-saving family machine... It does exactly what it's supposed to do... At least that's how I see it.

Am I off the mark?

 

[rtdunham]

I think you are wrong about a divice between an iPhone and an AIR. But that device won't be a NetBook but rather a tablet about the size of a Newton or a little larger. The device would still run mobile OS and hopefully network as well.

Yes. It needs to run a full OS though.

If it's not gonna have its own (real, not virtual) keyboard then it's gotta either work with the little apple bluetooth keyboard, a new specially made (smaller or foldable) kbd, or have a USB port for hooking up a kbd. Imho, that's essential to bridge the tablet/netbook markets.

 

[flottenheimer]

I'd buy a small, fun, inexpensive* portable MiniMac instantly if it was released. Being able to give one to each of the kids would be very nice too. So maybe 3 for me

*not going to happen.

 

[sterlingindigo]

Jobs also suggested that the iPhone was an Apple answer to Netbooks. With productivity apps such as Mocha VNC and Briefcase (both offer free "lite" versions) and reference apps like Color Expert that rival Pantone ColorMunki software, I agree iPhone is becoming more about portable personal computing.

As a netbook replacement it is a very good point. Aside from cut n paste, and maybe flash, it's a very nice piece of technology which also happens to include a camera phone and mp3 player in a very small touch-screen package.

Of course it's not a small word processor or able to run Adobe products in the field.

 

[Spades]

(imagine if apple introduced innovative, effective docking-and-syncing technologies)?

That is, if anything, what I think they're waiting for. One role for a netbook is a secondary computer. That means it does not carry all of your data. I used a PowerBook as secondary computer and found it too cumbersome to transfer things back to my main computer. I had already transferred pictures from my camera to the PowerBook, modified them, created albums and published galleries. When I got back home and went to move everything to iPhoto on my main computer I found there was no easy way to do it. I would have had to redo all of the work I had already done on the road.

It would also be nice to be able to sync a part of your iTunes library to the notebook. This isn't a huge deal since we have iPods, but if for some reason I want music on my notebook, I don't want it all. 60 gigs on a 1.5 TB drive is a drop in the bucket. 60 gigs on a 120 gig netbook? Way too much.

Syncing is the piece that would make an Apple netbook really stand out.

 

[kingtj]

No doubt.....

The ASUS eeePC is a neat little "toy computer". (I bought one, so I should know something about it.) But realistically, it's something people are generally more impressed with BEFORE they own it a little while.

For starters, the small keyboards on them are difficult to type on without making lots of mistakes, (and I don't even have big hands or fingers). Some keys are even in really awkward places, like the right-hand SHIFT key in the far right-hand corner of the thing. To top it off, they don't have very good key-feel either, and I've already seen reports of some keys getting really "mushy" compared to the rest of them. (Apparently, a rubber spacer under the key-cap gets worn and tears.)

Battery life is another big issue with them. Suspend mode is practically unusable on my eeePC 701 model because even with the latest (of about 5 or 6) BIOS updates, it still rapidly drains the battery while suspended. ASUS says "We recommend just powering it off instead of suspending it.", as a "solution". Nice, huh?

Their Xandros customized Linux OS they offer for them is pretty nicely put together, to their credit, but it has some issues too. A Chinese "hack" of the original ASUS restore DVD called the "XEPC" OS is by FAR superior, as the author has gone to a lot of trouble to update and enhance what ASUS originally included. Problem is, it defaults to Mandarin Chinese so you have to jump through a few hoops after installing it to get it back to an English display, if you're like me and can't read Chinese!

You really do "get what you pay for", and compared to an Apple notebook product, the eeePC line is quite frankly "junk", just as Jobs said of "under $500 computers".

I'd rather they didnt water down the product to suit to someone that has asus price and wants apple quality. "you get what you pay for?"

 

[knightlie]

I agree. I don't see the market for people needing something between an iPhone and the Macbook Air. Seriously, are there those of you out there that need something like that?

Yes. Not need, perhaps, but want, and can make use of. I have an Asus which is more convenient for couch-based web browsing than my MacBook, which currently serves as a bedroom computer. The only limitation of the Asus is Linux, which is a pain in the arse.

I don't consider the Air for this kind of purpose at all, it's way too expensive to buy just for browsing in front of the TV.

 

[heisetax]

Asus serves Apple!

I'd rather they didnt water down the product to suit to someone that has asus price and wants apple quality. "you get what you pay for?"

But another post on a Mac site has said that Asus is one of the manufacturers of Apple mother boards. Does this mean that the Mac products with Asus motherboards are junk & we should stay away from them or we should in all reality purchase an Asus motherboard & produce a Mac Clone or as they are now called a "Hackintosh?"

 

[.Chris]

latly steves been doing a bit of microsoft "we wont do that because its not cool enough"

With this, blu-ray lower clost MBP etc. He may be rich but he needs to know not everyone is. Yes, I can could afford a 2 grand MBP but it would be niice to get it at 1699 at least. I know the MB has the same specs but some actully want a larger screen

dont get me started on blu-ray, does steve actully think everyone has a super fast internet connection to download his movies. Now I have fiber optic internet, but some want the physical media.... people need to know physicalmedia wont go away. go outside and play in traffic.

As for the main topic, its good to hear there might be a chance, but come on, the enco. is such bad shape it makes sence to do one at a low price. may be if apple does it the netbook world will boast..... apple may be the key to making it happen..

 

[heisetax]

Software or Hardware?

That is, if anything, what I think they're waiting for. One role for a netbook is a secondary computer. That means it does not carry all of your data. I used a PowerBook as secondary computer and found it too cumbersome to transfer things back to my main computer. I had already transferred pictures from my camera to the PowerBook, modified them, created albums and published galleries. When I got back home and went to move everything to iPhoto on my main computer I found there was no easy way to do it. I would have had to redo all of the work I had already done on the road.

It would also be nice to be able to sync a part of your iTunes library to the notebook. This isn't a huge deal since we have iPods, but if for some reason I want music on my notebook, I don't want it all. 60 gigs on a 1.5 TB drive is a drop in the bucket. 60 gigs on a 120 gig netbook? Way too much.

Syncing is the piece that would make an Apple netbook really stand out.

Are your problems iPhoto & iTUnes restrictions or a lack of comparable ports on your home Mac compared to your away PowerBook? FW800 or Gigabit Ethernet transfers are very fast for me & my son between a PowerBook & G5 or Intel PowerMac.

 

[farmboy]

Riiight.

i honestly doubt photographers will be able to use a mac much longer. the glossy mbp 17" is horrible and the new 15" are worse. way to much glare even when calibrated and set to maximum brightness to assess or compare photos.

as a consumer device the new mb and mbp with glass display are astounding, beautiful and a charm to work/play with.

let's see how it goes...

Did you actually calibrate and use the new 15", or are you just spreading FUD?

I guess I'm just a little tired of these photogs and their whining--and it is whining, because the machines they have now did not stop working all of a sudden. A glossy screen is supposed to ruin everything?

Photographers use different temperature lights, lots of different fill and key lights, light filters, lenses, lens filters, reflectors, hoods, camera settings, different film qualities and speeds (for non-digital), post production manipulation software, print production manipulation, lithographic manipulation, different paper stocks, etc. All these adjustments available for your work and you can't handle looking through a piece of glass? The halftone screens used for print work even in glossy magazines (no irony there) appear to be way less than your screen resolution, so how crucial and valid is your on-screen photo examination? And readers only spend a few seconds looking at your work anyhow---sorry but you know it's true. So lighten up.

 

[Spades]

Are your problems iPhoto & iTUnes restrictions or a lack of comparable ports on your home Mac compared to your away PowerBook? FW800 or Gigabit Ethernet transfers are very fast for me & my son between a PowerBook & G5 or Intel PowerMac.

The problem is iPhoto has no method of copying the events, albums, and pictures (including both the original and changes) from one computer to another. With iTunes, although it's easy to copy files, you lose metadata and it's not easy to copy playlists.

 

[Bubba Satori]

I'd rather they didnt water down the product to suit to someone that has asus price and wants apple quality. "you get what you pay for?"

Let them eat cake. Only the well off should have computers, anyway. No unwashed masses in the smug club. We are a cool and special few who are entitled to thin, precious bling that only we can afford.

 

[Urenstaat]

It won't be cheap. A Sony 11-inch VAIO TT will set you back 2000 dollar (2700 dollar for Blue Ray or SSD model). I'm sure Apple will position theirs against the Vaio rather than against an Asus or other 400 dollar netbook.. Plus, you're lucky if you'll get just one USB port

 

[Phrasikleia]

...He may be rich but he needs to know not everyone is. Yes, I can could afford a 2 grand MBP but it would be niice to get it at 1699 at least....does steve actully think everyone has a super fast internet connection to download his movies...it makes sence to do one at a low price.

Steve Jobs was explicit about serving a certain segment of the market: the one that has lots of disposable income.

 

[corinhorn]

Steve Jobs was explicit about serving a certain segment of the market: the one that has lots of disposable income.

Yes. during the Q4 Q & A, he said that there are consumer segments that they ignore. If you want a computer for $500 or less, Apple isn't targeting to you.

 

[iMacmatician]

They'll either come out w/ one at MacWorld and are just trying to keep it off the radar or else they're afraid it will cut into MacBook sales and are avoiding it.

That's what I'm thinking too. Apple's said something and done the reverse not long after several times before.

All Apple needs to do to fill that netbook lacuna in their lineup is put bluetooth in the iPod touch and encourage a third party to develop a keyboard driver for it. Something along these lines:

A modular system like this, with a foldable, portable keyboard, means you can have something that fits in your pocket most of the time. When you need to do some real typing, you throw the keyboard in your bag too.

A bigger display would be good.

I might be wrong... but normally Apple doesnt like compromising performance and software. I cant see them making a "lite" OS X for a notebook.. Even Iphone OS X is fully fledged OS.

iPhone OS is the "lite" version of Mac OS X (are you talking about something even lighter?). And I would expect Mac OS X to perform worse, both in specs and in usability, for a small device than iPhone OS. And that's why the MacBook Air emphasizes a "full-size" display and "standard" CPU above most other areas.

 

[Vulpinemac]

Except apple did license their OS for about half a year and it was an absolute fiscal disaster for them. You must not be old enough to remember that

Actually, Apple Computer, Inc. licensed four companies to build to their specifications back in the early to middle 90s... roughly 4 to 5 years. All that happened was that Apple's hardware sales went through the floor while the OS penetration into the general market remained stable at just about 4%. It wasn't until Apple revoked all those licenses in '98 and released the first iMac (itself a stylized throwback to the original AiO Macs) that sales started to grow and they started to eat into the Windows market share.