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Rogifan

macrumors Penryn
Original poster
Nov 14, 2011
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The crux of his review is iPad Pro is just meant to be a nicer, or deluxe iPad. I don’t get the second paragraph though. Most people who use iPads probably don’t have a clue about the operating system. To them the iPad is just a big iPhone. The ones who do care are the ones saying iPadOS needs to get better. But they’re not arguing for it to get worse for everyone else. It’s possible to make improvements to iPadOS for pro users that doesn’t degrade the experience for casual users.

Also, go back and listen to some of Gruber’s podcasts when ‘pro’ iPhones were rumored. His argument then was Apple should go all the way in making them devices for professionals. Now he’s saying ‘pro’ iPads are meant to be like a ceramic Apple Watch and that’s totally fine. Of course it’s totally fine for him because his main computer will always be a Mac and he can afford to own an Mac and an iPad Pro if he chooses.


IMG_1437.jpeg
 
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turbineseaplane

macrumors Pentium
Mar 19, 2008
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Now he’s saying

You've just learned why I stopped listening to him years and years ago now

He's really just running PR in defense of Apple and it's covered with a thin veneer of "informed and objective takes" (largely not true)

He always has been

I give him credit -- he's made an entire career of pontificating on Apple from his guest bedroom (sorry, office)

If one enjoys his nonsense and long winded talk, by all means, indulge - just know what you're getting.
 

giggles

macrumors 65816
Dec 15, 2012
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1,275
The footnote at the end is the most telling part about the current capabilities of iPadOS: you need a Mac to fill the gaps.

The Yogi Berra quote is misplaced irony given the not-so-stellar iPad sales in recent times.

But I kinda agree with the sentiment of "let us luxury tablet drivers do our weird thing, just assume the base iPad or the Air are the default product for most people". A luxury version of the iPad Air, aka the iPad Pro, has every right to exist in this world without people signing petitions like we're talking human rights. It's up to Apple to shape the direction of the product based on what they deem better for their bottomline. Would any of us buy iPads more frequently if they had Mac-like capabilities? It's debatable. Would it be cool? Sure, but the devil is in the details.
 
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Rogifan

macrumors Penryn
Original poster
Nov 14, 2011
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You've just learned why I stopped listening to him years and years ago now

He's really just running PR in defense of Apple and it's covered with a thin veneer of "informed and objective takes" (largely not true)

He always has been

I give him credit -- he's made an entire career of pontificating on Apple from his guest bedroom (sorry, office)

If one enjoys his nonsense and long winded talk, by all means, indulge - just know what you're getting.
Makes me wonder how much he believes what he wrote here. I don’t remember him defending the Apple Watch Edition or Apple offering a better level of service for those who bought a more expensive Watch. Also I’d love to see the stats on how many of those who use iPad for productivity are really happy with iPadOS.
 

Ludatyk

macrumors 603
May 27, 2012
5,533
4,550
Texas
The crux of his review is iPad Pro is just meant to be a nicer, or deluxe iPad. I don’t get the second paragraph though. Most people who use iPads probably don’t have a clue about the operating system. To them the iPad is just a big iPhone. The ones who do care are the ones saying iPadOS needs to get better. But they’re not arguing for it to get worse for everyone else. It’s possible to make improvements to iPadOS for pro users that doesn’t degrade the experience for casual users.
The second paragraph explained what you posted yesterday in regard to the iPad lineup.

Please, remove the "Pro" moniker... since I think it likely confuses critics. Call it iPad Ultra or iPad Plus... whatever you want to call it. The iPad Pro is as Gruber stated "premium tier" of the iPad lineup. The Lexus vs Toyota analogy is to describe the iPad Pro to the base iPad.

And the ending of that second paragraph is attempting to explain... even if you criticize iPadOS, it shouldn't be some referendum against the iPad Pro existence. Which I think is the root of the issue... critics look at the price of the iPad Pro and then compare it to the MBA.

When Apple has stated repeatedly, these are two different devices. However, the public regularly try to compare the two... when they have two different operating systems. And critics act as if Apple has halted the development of iPadOS and it won't receive any more improvements.
 

turbineseaplane

macrumors Pentium
Mar 19, 2008
15,014
32,192
Makes me wonder how much he believes what he wrote here. I don’t remember him defending the Apple Watch Edition or Apple offering a better level of service for those who bought a more expensive Watch. Also I’d love to see the stats on how many of those who use iPad for productivity are really happy with iPadOS.

I think he does and says and justifies things in whatever way he needs to ... to keep doing what he does and keep the access he has.

At this point, it's probably almost unconscious for him
It's a sweet gig - I don't even blame him

I just don't waste my time consuming anything he puts out

I hate talking like this about anyone, as I'm sure he's a great guy ... but he's just not useful as an objective commenter on Apple
 

Rogifan

macrumors Penryn
Original poster
Nov 14, 2011
24,336
31,469
The footnote at the end is the most telling part about the current capabilities of iPadOS: you need a Mac to fill the gaps.

The Yogi Berra quote is misplaced irony given the not-so-stellar iPad sales in recent times.

But I kinda agree with the sentiment of "let use luxury tablet drivers do our weird thing, just assume the base iPad or the Air are the default product for most people". A luxury version of the iPad Air, aka the iPad Pro, has every right to exist in this world without people signing petitions like we're talking human rights. It's up to Apple to shape the direction of the product based on what they deem better for their bottomline. Would any of us buy iPads more frequently if they had Mac-like capabilities? It's debatable. Would it be cool? Sure, but the devil is in the details.
Tech analysts Benedict Evans posted something on Threads about iPad software being fine for 90% of iPad users. I’d be curious to know of those who buy an iPad Pro, what percent are buying it because it’s a nicer iPad vs the percent buying it because they would like it to be their main computer for productivity. Maybe the 10% who want more from iPad software are mostly iPad Pro users.
 

Rogifan

macrumors Penryn
Original poster
Nov 14, 2011
24,336
31,469
The second paragraph explained what you posted yesterday in regard to the iPad lineup.

Please, remove the "Pro" moniker... since I think it likely confuses critics. Call it iPad Ultra or iPad Plus... whatever you want to call it. The iPad Pro is as Gruber stated "premium tier" of the iPad lineup. The Lexus vs Toyota analogy is to describe the iPad Pro to the base iPad.

And the ending of that second paragraph is attempting to explain... even if you criticize iPadOS, it shouldn't be some referendum against the iPad Pro existence. Which I think is the root of the issue... critics look at the price of the iPad Pro and then compare it to the MBA.

When Apple has stated repeatedly, these are two different devices. However, the public regularly try to compare the two... when they have two different operating systems. And critics act as if Apple has halted the development of iPadOS and it won't receive any more improvements.
If Apple thinks of the iPad Pro as nothing more than a luxury iPad then they should call it iPad Edition or something. The Pro moniker comes across as being able to do more vs it just being more luxury.
 

GDF

macrumors 65816
Jun 7, 2010
1,380
1,370
I could care less of it not having Mac OS on it. Getting so tired of reviewers mentioning that. I use it just fine for work/travel and personal 95% of the time. Rarely do I use my macbook pro o mac mini that use Studio Displays. If I could only have one, it would be my iPad Pro 12.9 or now 13.
 

Ludatyk

macrumors 603
May 27, 2012
5,533
4,550
Texas
If Apple thinks of the iPad Pro as nothing more than a luxury iPad then they should call it iPad Edition or something. The Pro moniker comes across as being able to do more vs it just being more luxury.
So, I suppose... you want Apple to remove Pro from the iPhone as well?

I personally don't see how the name is the issue... look at the MacBook Air vs MacBook Pro, it's all to signify the premium selection that Apple offers. Maybe you want Apple to remove Pro from the AirPods too?
 

Rogifan

macrumors Penryn
Original poster
Nov 14, 2011
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I think he does and says and justifies things in whatever way he needs to ... to keep doing what he does and keep the access he has.

At this point, it's probably almost unconscious for him
It's a sweet gig - I don't even blame him

I just don't waste my time consuming anything he puts out

I hate talking like this about anyone, as I'm sure he's a great guy ... but he's just not useful as an objective commenter on Apple
He’s a Mac guy and will never be an iPad guy. But what’s amusing about this review is you can find podcast episodes where he gets very angry about iPadOS, multitasking on iPad etc. There’s no way in hell he’d ever use iPad as his main computer. Now he’s saying there are people who love iPadOS and they shouldn’t be denied a luxury iPad? I’d love to know who these lovers of iPadOS (as it exists today) are. My mom loves her iPad but she wouldn’t know the first thing about the software running it.
 

Ludatyk

macrumors 603
May 27, 2012
5,533
4,550
Texas
Jim used to be as in the bag for Apple as Gruber..
Now that he's retired, look at where he's at!


View attachment 2378417

(kudos to him for keeping it real! - from this morning)
Never really cared for him or his opinions. I stopped caring for Gruber as well... he's way too biased for me.

And we all have our biases, but he's gone off the deep end (imo).
 

turbineseaplane

macrumors Pentium
Mar 19, 2008
15,014
32,192
I’d love to know who these lovers of iPadOS (as it exists today) are. My mom loves her iPad but she wouldn’t know the first thing about the software running it.

Same

If anything I wish I could revert a bunch of features that constantly annoy me (like inadvertent multi-tasking)
 
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turbineseaplane

macrumors Pentium
Mar 19, 2008
15,014
32,192
Never really cared for him or his opinions. I stopped caring for Gruber as well... he's way too biased for me.

And we all have our biases, but he's gone off the deep end (imo).

The point I was making is that ... now that he needs no access and doesn't cover Apple ... suddenly his honesty about the realities of many Apple products is exceptionally clear and open.

I appreciate that at least
 

Rogifan

macrumors Penryn
Original poster
Nov 14, 2011
24,336
31,469
So, I suppose... you want Apple to remove Pro from the iPhone as well?

I personally don't see how the name is the issue... look at the MacBook Air vs MacBook Pro, it's all to signify the premium selection that Apple offers. Maybe you want Apple to remove Pro from the AirPods too?
Yeah, actually I would. When I think of ‘pro’ I think of ‘professional’ not ‘luxury’.
 

rui no onna

Contributor
Oct 25, 2013
14,584
12,703
Tech analysts Benedict Evans posted something on Threads about iPad software being fine for 90% of iPad users. I’d be curious to know of those who buy an iPad Pro, what percent are buying it because it’s a nicer iPad vs the percent buying it because they would like it to be their main computer for productivity. Maybe the 10% who want more from iPad software are mostly iPad Pro users.

I’ve always bought the iPad Pro not so much because it’s nicer but because I can’t get 512GB-1TB storage on lower end models. I realize it’s basically a luxury/deluxe iPad and I’m fine with that.

Of course, now that there’s up to 1TB on the Air, there’s less reason for me to go Pro now.
 

Ludatyk

macrumors 603
May 27, 2012
5,533
4,550
Texas
Now he’s saying there are people who love iPadOS and they shouldn’t be denied a luxury iPad? I’d love to know who these lovers of iPadOS (as it exists today) are. My mom loves her iPad but she wouldn’t know the first thing about the software running it.
Do I love iPadOS as it exist now? Nope... because there are flaws, it's not perfect. And I'm sure most iPad users will share that same sentiment. However, I much prefer iPad hardware to the Mac.

Yeah, actually I would. When I think of ‘pro’ I think of ‘professional’ not ‘luxury’.
I respect that. At least your consistent across the board.
 

Rogifan

macrumors Penryn
Original poster
Nov 14, 2011
24,336
31,469
The point I was making is that ... now that he needs no access and doesn't cover Apple ... suddenly his honesty about the realities of many Apple products is exceptionally clear and open.

I appreciate that at least
To be fair he’s been complaining about Apple Music for a long time. If I remember correctly he was even invited to Apple to work through his issues with iCloud Music Library or whatever it was. I doubt anyone at Apple listens to him now though.
 
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