I ask this question then: if there had been a warning on the bat, what would the kid have been done differently? What would the batter have done differently? Answer to both: Nothing.
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Jury: Baseball bat manufacturer responsible for death by batted ball
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I ask this question then: if there had been a warning on the bat, what would the kid have been done differently? What would the batter have done differently? Answer to both: Nothing.
No difference here with this pathetic jury for athletic bat mishandling than like juries that have held car manufacturers responsible for deaths by vehicle mishandling or holding firearm manufacturers responsible for deaths by firearm mishandling. Prosecutors are able to shift guilt from personal responsibility to some assumed responsibility on the part of manufacturers, of bats, or vehicles, or firearms. Defendants, whether they be sports manufacturers, or car manufacturers, or firearm manufacturers, find unsympathetic juries in our rather idiotic criminal justice system where justice is hard to be found. Sad.
Changing the rules in our criminal justice system is a far better solution, and that includes dismissing such reckless suits and claims such as this before they are even considered by legal professionals. Trial lawyers who bring such frivolous suits as this should be disbarred, immediately. That way we can "minimize" the risk to society - to address your concern.
If you get beaned in the skull by an object moving over 60 mph, expect massive trauma regardless of what the hell made it move that fast. THAT is common sense.
Hard object moving fast causes damage <--- Stupidest headline imaginable, but completely applicable to the situation. A two year old can tell you that your gonna get hurt if hit by a baseball, regardless of what hit it.
Apparently this country has no common sense anymore.
A jury suffering from the great American disease, the lack of personal responsibility.
And juries are always right; OJ never hacked off his ex-wife's head.
So, because it made it to court, that validates the case? This is AMERICA, where you can get away with suing people over hot coffee.
Not really? Its happened more than once before, with wooden bats involved. It doesn't take a genius to realize getting hit in the HEAD with some HARD and MOVING FAST can cause death.
Actually there are indeed prosecutors in civil cases and these prosecutors allow trial lawyers who bring such frivolous suits to the court's attention; they are called judges in such civil cases, and they are equally as bad. This case should have been initially dismissed by the judge as without foundation.
It's amazing to me we live in a litigious society where self responsibility is no where to be found and folks like to blame their own stupidity on others.
No; you're wrong. Not all businesses are huge and many small businesses have been bankrupted through no fault of their own in our litigious society that is inhabited by ruthless trial lawyers and judges with no common sense or backbone. Even huge businesses (corporations) deserve protections from trial lawyers anxious to blame business for something that is clearly a personal responsibility matter....
It should have been dismissed had the judge any backbone whatsoever.
Let's move that bar to 99% and get all but 1% dismissed for a better society.
As I said above...
Despite holding a baseball bat manufacture liable? Please...
We have far too many lunatic judges!
That's a far better assessment here!
"because a bat caused"
"a ball to behave"
"exceeded the expected limits"
Note the weasel words of the trial lawyer to impinge upon the manufacturer some assumed guilt.
The bat performed as it was designed to do. It hit the ball with a force to propel it.
The ball performed as it was designed to do. It moved away from the bat when hit.
The fact that an accident occurred is not the fault of the manufacturer.
Never was. Never is.
Regardless of what Ahmed "knows," the stick and ball sports are the most dangerous. During my tenure in an Emergency Room setting I learned that more children and young adults present with injuries during baseball/softball season than any other sport. This is a fact that can be easily verified if you desire. The injuries can be quite severe and yes, life threatening. Pitchers in particular have it rough because they are in the path of the ball more frequently. Head injuries are not the most deadly for pitchers: impact injuries to the chest are the most frequent cause of death in baseball. A hard line drive hits a young person in the sternum and it compresses the heart, which more often than not stops beating. Punctures to the heart and lungs also are a common result of being hit in the chest. A person of normal intelligence can deduce the threat of being hit simply by thinking about how the game is played and the equipment used. Lastly, the difference in velocity of a struck ball from a wooden or aluminum bat is not all that great. The other variables involved in ball velocity play a much larger role. I can put about three times the velocity on a ball with a wooden bat as my nephew can with an aluminum one.
For a jury to have found H&R liable for this young man's death is just an example of "Jack Pot Justice" as practiced here in the US. The members of the jury should be ashamed.
For a jury to have found H&R liable for this young man's death is just an example of "Jack Pot Justice" as practiced here in the US. The members of the jury should be ashamed.
Ahmed, would you have a limit on strength allowed by a batter? Wouldn't a ball hit by a particularly good player have a much faster path to the pitcher, reducing his reaction time, and potentially causing death? Maybe the strongest players on the team should have a large 'Warning!' patch on their jersey, so the other team can be prepared.
Also, given that the incoming ball speed has quite a bit to do with the batted ball speed, maybe baseball should be reduced to underhand soft toss.
Also, given that the incoming ball speed has quite a bit to do with the batted ball speed, maybe baseball should be reduced to underhand soft toss.
Standard object? An aluminum bat is the standard object! Your wikipedia article even says so:
The standard of "common sense" ruled quite nicely for many years in our criminal justice system. It is a long-term standard that held and holds the public to rules of personal responsibility quite nicely. Only recently has this standard been ditched by trial lawyers seeking to blame everything on someone else (those with money of course) when instead personal responsibility should simply accept that accidents quite often happen! Not everyone need be blamed and millions changed hands (often only into trial lawyers pockets)!
Good... wasn't Pfizer's fault anyway... FDA should have accepted blame for its own liability here (in that case) in not approving drugs faster. FDA has its own faults but that's a topic for another thread. Pfizer's saved thousands and thousands of lives with its advanced medical and pharmaceutical research and development in medicines. Great company.
Whether or not it has $ potential you mean.
Merit never enters the Trial Lawyers lexicon.
Let's tell the truth here okay?
Again, trial lawyers consider $ only and not merit. You think the trial lawyer has any concern for the "kid" you mention that died? They could care less! They are concerned only of potential of finding a jury of fools sympathetic to the lies they tell about the manufacturer so they can get a good settlement.
Merit! What a laugh!
No one said anything about not holding corporations liable for their mistakes. They made a lawful product, that was used in a lawful manner. It was an accident. Nothing more.
AhmedFaisal said:
I get it now. Corporations are evil and must be taken down!
Then what was the purpose of this lawsuit?
And you know this how?
If anything, the parents of the kid, the coaching staff and the organizers of the match tournament that allowed use of the alu bat and the kid that hit the ball, should be more responsible than the manufacturer. In that order.
i would also add the pitcher but apparently that was the kid himself.
this is not a new product with poorly understood characteristics or underestimated performance. And it's not being used in ways that were not anticipated.
It is a product being used in the proper way and settings, performing as expected (and frequently advertised). The increased performance (and relate risk) is a well established and well known aspect of the product, and it has been for many years by anyone who has ever played baseball, even if just in their backyard.
there is a reason why low-speed, low-impact variants are used, from nerf gear, to whiffle ball, and including softball: the danger of the actual thing is well known.
I am sorry for the kid and his parents, but assuming that they really didn't know of the increased performance of aluminum bats (which i find a little hard to believe with the parents of an habitual player, the pitcher of the team, infact), they should take to the organizers of the games for allowing them. or with themsleves for allowing their kid to participate to an intrinsically dangerous game.
i would also add the pitcher but apparently that was the kid himself.
this is not a new product with poorly understood characteristics or underestimated performance. And it's not being used in ways that were not anticipated.
It is a product being used in the proper way and settings, performing as expected (and frequently advertised). The increased performance (and relate risk) is a well established and well known aspect of the product, and it has been for many years by anyone who has ever played baseball, even if just in their backyard.
there is a reason why low-speed, low-impact variants are used, from nerf gear, to whiffle ball, and including softball: the danger of the actual thing is well known.
I am sorry for the kid and his parents, but assuming that they really didn't know of the increased performance of aluminum bats (which i find a little hard to believe with the parents of an habitual player, the pitcher of the team, infact), they should take to the organizers of the games for allowing them. or with themsleves for allowing their kid to participate to an intrinsically dangerous game.
My wife, who's in insurance, was just talking about how expensive everything is, from healthcare to food to cars to dish detergent, etc., because of one profession and one profession alone... lawyers. Because lawyers insist people have no common sense, and through this (ahem) loophole can sue the living crap out of anyone for anything, therefore making the cost of living that much more, and the world a more stupid place.
To quote Don Henley "kill all the lawyers... kill them tonight," would be a good start.
Agreed. I just listened to the song those lyrics came from Get Over It, and boy do they describe many people in this country today.
We've already established that the risk with a wooden bat is death since it has happened. That means there is an expectation that death can occur from a ball hit from any kind of officially used baseball bat. So anyone getting onto a baseball field has assumed the risk of possible death.
A warning on the bat would not help the pitcher, since at no time in a baseball game is a pitcher expected to be in possession of an opponent hitter's bat. By your logic, the warning needs to be on the ball since that is the piece of the equation where there is an expectation that a pitcher will be in possession of it and able to read the warning.
i'd think that most people would agree that metal bats hit harder and faster than wooden bats. but that's exactly why the company shouldn't be held responsible: everyone on that field knew that.
baseball is an inherently dangerous sport.
with or without metal bats.
lot's of people have been killed by balls batted by wooden bats.
heck, people have been killed and maimed in large numbers even by pitches. it's the reason batters wears helmets.
baseball is an inherently dangerous sport.
with or without metal bats.
lot's of people have been killed by balls batted by wooden bats.
heck, people have been killed and maimed in large numbers even by pitches. it's the reason batters wears helmets.
The Admad guy is an idiot about baseball.
He won't play a baseball game that involves aluminum bats? Then unless you're a professional baseball player, you won't be playing any ball games. Aluminum bats are used from tball to college ball. Deal with it.
John Olerud played his entire major league career with a helmet in the field. He was at risk from a head injury and knew that baseball was a dangerous sport, so he had to protect himself. Even while in the field.
How can anyone not think baseball is a dangerous sport? Pitchers throw over 90 miles an hour from 60 feet away. Balls coming off the bats travel at speeds even higher than that. The pitcher is the closest to the batter. First and third basemen are a mere 30 feet further away.
If this guy can't understand the very basic fundamentals of baseball and how the ball travels around, then he has no business speaking up in this thread. Ignorance is no substitute for an informed perspective.
Baseball rules will not be changed due to the chance of injury. If you don't want to risk injury, play chess.
He won't play a baseball game that involves aluminum bats? Then unless you're a professional baseball player, you won't be playing any ball games. Aluminum bats are used from tball to college ball. Deal with it.
John Olerud played his entire major league career with a helmet in the field. He was at risk from a head injury and knew that baseball was a dangerous sport, so he had to protect himself. Even while in the field.
How can anyone not think baseball is a dangerous sport? Pitchers throw over 90 miles an hour from 60 feet away. Balls coming off the bats travel at speeds even higher than that. The pitcher is the closest to the batter. First and third basemen are a mere 30 feet further away.
If this guy can't understand the very basic fundamentals of baseball and how the ball travels around, then he has no business speaking up in this thread. Ignorance is no substitute for an informed perspective.
Baseball rules will not be changed due to the chance of injury. If you don't want to risk injury, play chess.
A good sentiment to be sure, but it was the bard Shakespeare that holds the authorship of that quote:
"The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers.."
Henry The Sixth, Part 2 Act 4, scene 2, 71–78
Indeed, spare us all the faux concern you and trial lawyers have for the "kid" (child) here since dollar value of judgments and percentage to legal firms is the only desire here on your part...
Insurance is expensive for a variety of reasons but primarily not due to what you allege but rather the government regulation that bears upon it, that insurance companies have no choice but to pass on to policy holders.
We better get busy putting these warnings on...
tennis balls, raquets
soccer/footballs of all types
table tennis balls.. just in case you swallow one
table tennis bats
bikes of all types
skateboards
roller skates
roller blades
cricket bats & balls
every piece of sporting equipment better have one actually because you never know when a pesky piece of equipment might jump out at you and trip you down the stairs.
Really... honestly... how stupid. If baseball was a "safe" sport you wouldn't need to wear a helmet when batting, the umpire wears lots of padding... the catcher at homeplate has lots of padding... the coaches standing at first & third base wear helmets.....
baseball like many sports is inherrently dangerous, but you cannot protect all players from all possible situations. The loss of life in the case is in indeed tragic & regretable but there is no fault on behalf of the manufacturer of the bat. At most the issue sits between the family of the deceased, the player who hit the ball & the league they played in that allows aluminium bats if indeed they are so dangerous, and I say that as a stretch. There was no intent from either party, no malice etc. It is an unfortunate accident where fault (in the sense of court cases) cannot be placed on any person or entity.
ooo ooo ooo.... I forgot... they need to put up BIG HUGE signs around all the fences on the baseball fields to remind players that running into them at full speed might cause injury.