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Kuo: Apple to Accelerate Adoption of Mini-LED Displays in iPad and Mac Notebook Lineups

Victor Mortimer

macrumors 6502
Apr 17, 2016
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it will never come to the iphone, because mini-led is an inferior display tech compared to todays oled
maybe you refer/or thought this is about micro-led, if that is the case, then yes...micro-led should and will come to the iphones, but we have to wait years

No, OLED is an inferior technology. Sure, it's emissive on its own, but it's got burn-in and lifespan problems. Micro-LED will likely someday be a suitable replacement for LCD, but OLED is not.
 
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ksec

macrumors 65816
Dec 23, 2015
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I believe you are right. MicroLED would need to compete vs a mature oled technology and it will be expensive af. OLEDs biggest drawback is and has always been lifetime, but with a generation cycle of 2-4 years it really doesn't matter (won't matter when actual competition hits) anymore.

I expect MicroLED to never make it into phones in a bigger scale, but only used for screens in tablets/tvs etc. There it will be competitive pricewise and longevity actually matters with many buying a tv every ten years...

I think you nailed it with the word "Mature". I need to remember this word next time I tried to describe it.

I really really really really do hope I am wrong though. I seriously dislike OLED.
 
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Aston441

macrumors 68000
Sep 16, 2014
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LCD can yellow over time. Our iPhone 5 has yellowed at the edges.

Maybe heat exposure? My 5s had screen on more or less continuously for 7 years (always plugged into charger at home, in car, at work, screen permenantly on) and had zero yellowing.

Same with my MBA on continuously for 9 years.
 
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EugW

macrumors G3
Jun 18, 2017
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Maybe heat exposure? My 5s had screen on more or less continuously for 7 years (always plugged into charger at home, in car, at work, screen permenantly on) and had zero yellowing.

Same with my MBA on continuously for 9 years.
Yes, heat related, but it's a common finding with old iPhones.
 
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FilmIndustryGuy

macrumors 6502
May 12, 2015
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Manhattan Beach, CA
and again, this mini-led tech, will come to apple displays that are currently using lcd and not Oled tech
So dont expect mini-led to come into the watch or phones

Micro-led will come eventually in everything with display...it will be the next big thing...cars, tv, laptops, monitors, watch, tablets, lab monitors etc. Like lcd was so spread, this will be also...because has only benefits with almost no drawbacks
Hey baby, you are the hottest forum user on here. Didn't know such babes are into tech.
 
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Crow_Servo

macrumors 6502
Feb 17, 2018
256
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America
I have mentioned that too before, and I would definitely be down for a 12" iPad Pro.

However, Kuo Ming-Chi's rumours consistently say 12.9" iPad Pro. Not 11", not 12", and not 14".
Yes, and the Mini is said to be getting a redesign with a larger screen, but when mentioned in this article, it’s referred to as 7.9”. I’d take some of these rumors with a grain of salt.
 
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cmaier

macrumors Core
Jul 25, 2007
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California
It is obvious that in 2021 Macs will be redesigned (thin bezels) and during this occasion Apple is going to change a display to do not be behind competitors and still be on the top. People love to hear obvious things from leakers that in fact want to be FAMOUS to live from such leaks.
I meant about san'an.
 
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Zdigital2015

macrumors 68030
Jul 14, 2015
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I have mentioned that too before, and I would definitely be down for a 12" iPad Pro.

However, Kuo Ming-Chi's rumours consistently say 12.9" iPad Pro. Not 11", not 12", and not 14".

Kuo could be wrong, or a larger size is being held closely to the vest...which is possible, despite the leaky supply chain. My argument is that Apple wants more than one size of iPad Pro now, based on customer demand and won’t go back down to one size. So, the 11” iPad Pro could still be forthcoming, and I’m all wet or Apple is going 12.9” solo for a few months before introducing a larger model and iOS versions of Logic Pro X and Final Cut Pro X along with iOS 15 at WWDC 2021. I think that’s the earliest we’ll see iOS versions of any of Apple‘s Pro apps. Either way, Apple is keeping things in a state of flux regarding future iPad Pros, which is good and bad. The A12Z model is certainly a fine system, but hardware dev cycles are all jumbled up right now, IMHO. Perhaps an A14X/Z refresh this year minus mini-LED is not completely insane or it is considering all the work Apple has ahead of it for Apple Silicon Macs rolling out soon.
 
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Brandon916

macrumors member
Feb 26, 2018
90
175
I don't see this coming for another few years. It's too expensive so far. Plus the technology isn't refine yet and Apple is known to only apply non bleeding tech. Mini LED can't be made to 8k because the lights are too far apart. The best they can do is 4k but on a 100 inch screen.
 
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deconstruct60

macrumors G3
Mar 10, 2009
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...

With that being said, I feel it could make room for a larger 15” or 16” iPad Pro with bigger Magic Keyboard.

This would similarly match Apples MacBook lineup:
- Macbook 12” (if it returns) = iPad (8th Gen)
- Macbook Air 13” = iPad Air (4th Gen)
- Macbook Pro 13”/14” = iPad Pro 12.9”
- Macbook Pro 16” = *new* iPad Pro 15”/16”

So just like how theres a MacBook for everyone, there would be an iPad for everyone.

The pragmatically of the 16" iPad Pro is what? 12.9" is already somewhat unwieldy to handle standing up with one hand. Two hands marginal . 16" is only going to increase the weight and make it even harder to handle with one hand for a larger group of the population.

If it is so big and heavy that have to put it onto a desktop to use it then it would really more so be a laptop (without a keyboard) than a tablet. If the projected intent that 70+ % of the folks who buy one also buy a "even bigger keyboard". That is even more in the range of it really being a laptop rather than tablet.

This is kind of a "monkey see , monkey do" track of pairing up iPad screens to Mac laptop screens. They are not meant to cover the same workloads. Yes, more than very high overlap in mainstream tasks ( browsing , email , messaging , video watching , writing documents , basic spreadsheets , basic photo editing, etc.) , but different.

If Apple wanted to do a iPad OS powered laptop then just bring back the "iBook" and just boot into iPad OS instead of macOS. They could use the same basic chassis (which would get you matching screens ).

Far more likely that the 10.2 mini led being projected here is a 'curve ball' thrown by Apple to either track rumor leaks or to do a prototype or a bit of both. Especially after the iPad Air moved up to 10.9. The only thing close to 10.2" now is the "super discount edu" iPad. Unlikely Apple is going to be pushing the iPad Pro toward that chassis restrictions.



Pretty decent chance that Apple won't get rid of the mainstream LED MacBook and iPad Pro models. Depending upon costs Apple could kick out a 'XDR' ( or perhaps less hyped 'HDR' ) line up of even more expensive alternatives. Similar to how Apple rolled out the "Retina" screens at first where bulk volume was regular and a subset of users paid a very healthy premium to move to "Retina" screens. A Pro Mini , Pro 11" , Pro 12.9" is track where Apple could crank up average system selling cost along the full iPad line up but not have to do very high volume manufacturing of mini-LEDs to it.


Same thing with the MBP. 14" ( still 13" hanging around for those on a budget) and extra-deluxe 16". Throw the 27" mini-LED at the iMac Pro to "segmentation gap" it from the iMacs.
 
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Crow_Servo

macrumors 6502
Feb 17, 2018
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iPad Mini Pro please. Bring it on. I wonder if a Mini Pro with Mini LED would be $600. As long as it has a base storage of 128GB, I’m game.
 
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limo79

macrumors 6502
Jan 9, 2009
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I meant about san'an.
Possibly it is wishful thinking that so many % will go to the secondary LED chip supplier from China (just coincidence?). I cannot believe that Apple will take such risk especially that they can use parts from Taiwan or Japan with higher price but also better lifespan.
 
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EugW

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Jun 18, 2017
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Possibly it is wishful thinking that so many % will go to the secondary LED chip supplier from China (just coincidence?). I cannot believe that Apple will take such risk especially that they can use parts from Taiwan or Japan with higher price but also better lifespan.
A lot of parts already come from China. China can produce parts at whatever quality level companies want. If a company wants bargain basement, China will produce it. If a company wants top of the time, China will produce that too, but a substantially higher cost.
 
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limo79

macrumors 6502
Jan 9, 2009
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A lot of parts already come from China. China can produce parts at whatever quality level companies want. If a company wants bargain basement, China will produce it. If a company wants top of the time, China will produce that too, but a substantially higher cost.
Yes, a lot of japanese and korean factories are now in China, but it is still a different story when you sign a contract with Japan or South Korea based company that manufacture in China than with company that it is located fully in China. There is no such "whatever quality" term or it could be only created in China - quality is limited by tooling, technology and R&D potential incl. manufacturing and engineering staff. If China can make "whatever customer like" SoC why Apple did not chose to design and manufacture it at MediaTek?
 
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cmaier

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Jul 25, 2007
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California
Possibly it is wishful thinking that so many % will go to the secondary LED chip supplier from China (just coincidence?). I cannot believe that Apple will take such risk especially that they can use parts from Taiwan or Japan with higher price but also better lifespan.
You thinking epistar?
 
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EugW

macrumors G3
Jun 18, 2017
9,161
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Yes, a lot of japanese and korean factories are now in China, but it is still a different story when you sign a contract with Japan or South Korea based company that manufacture in China than with company that it is located fully in China. There is no such "whatever quality" term or it could be only created in China - quality is limited by tooling, technology and R&D potential incl. manufacturing and engineering staff. If China can make "whatever customer like" SoC why Apple did not chose to design and manufacture it at MediaTek?
? MediaTek is a not a mainland Chinese company. It's a Taiwanese company.

And if we're talking Taiwanese companies, TSMC is one, and TSMC is Apple's choice for SoC manufacturing. They are the best in the world. Not even the US-based Intel can match TSMC. And even if they could match TSMC, they wouldn't be able to match their pricing at this time. This type of cutting edge technology happens to be important for Apple's product strategy, so it's necessary in this case.

However, when we are talking about stuff like mini-LED, we don't necessarily need absolute bleeding edge technology. What we need is a certain level of quality sufficient for an iPhone, at high volume, and appears that some mainland Chinese companies can do it these days. Remember, mini-LED is a transitional technology. This is not micro-LED we are talking about. This is FALD but finer grained, an extension of stuff Chinese companies have been doing for a long time now.
 
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smulji

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Feb 21, 2011
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Perhaps an A14X/Z refresh this year minus mini-LED is not completely insane
Now that you mention it, I wouldn't be surprised at all if Apple does this. Especially if they feel mini-LED won't be ready till 2H of 2021.
 
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Aston441

macrumors 68000
Sep 16, 2014
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Yes, heat related, but it's a common finding with old iPhones.

oh. i was just guessing. i know that heat destroys the battery, but I'm good a replacing those. I'll be extra careful to not leave iPhone in a hot car from now on.
 
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Hyperchaotic

macrumors regular
Feb 19, 2005
112
111
I really think the 11” iPad Pro is dead come the next round of updates. I think they’ll back down to a 12” iPad Pro and add a 14” iPad Pro to the mix while raising prices slightly, to $899 and $1099 for the bases models (128GB). I have no special insider knowledge, and I certainly could be wrong, but it seems like a very Apple thing to do, especially after the iPad Air 4 intro last week. Just my 2¢.

For me I really hope not. I'm looking to upgrade an Air 2 that's struggling with too little RAM for multitasking and being slow for a number of things.
The touchID on the new air would be very difficult for me to use due to my paralyzed hands and the Pro 12.9 is too big. So I decided to wait for an upgraded Pro 11 with FaceID next year. More RAM (this would be the second time I upgrade because of too little RAM, so I want a lot), A14(x) and ProMotion would be a nice bonus.

It would suck to wait that long for nothing. I'd then have to buy the air or a used Pro 11.
 
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Hyperchaotic

macrumors regular
Feb 19, 2005
112
111
Now that you mention it, I wouldn't be surprised at all if Apple does this. Especially if they feel mini-LED won't be ready till 2H of 2021.

Well, according to rumours (so feel free to disregard everything), TSMC is starting up A14X production in Q4. Now at 5000-6000 wafers a month that’ll amount to a total of (waves hand) some 1,000,000 A10X SoCs per month. If they want to introduce a new MacBook Air before the end of the year the question would be: how many MacBooks do they want to make and how many chips would that leave for an iPad Pro refresh‽ Assuming they use the A14X for the MacBook Air.

So my speculation and multiple unfounded assumptions aside; I am also awaiting an iPad Pro refresh but I’m worried it’ll be next year. It might depend upon TMSC capacity and what they put in the MBA - A14X or AS Mystery Chip and my thoughts leave me none the wiser.
 
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Voyageur

macrumors regular
Mar 22, 2019
201
190
Moscow, Russia
micro-LED won’t hit iPads/macs until 2030, so to me it’s not relevant - I don’t get excited about tech that’s 10 years out, sorry. OLED is great except it burns in and doesn’t last very long. Mini-LED is trash, but might make it into Apple products over the next couple of year... although I don’t get why I should be excited, since apparently it’s trash supposedly. Did I get it right?

But honestly? I find today’s iPad Pro and Mac screens quite adequate for my needs, so I wonder if I need to concern myself overmuch with all this screen hullabaloo. Maybe that makes me a square who is not with it?

Can someone please shed some light on this for dummies like me? Thanks!
mini Led is not trash, that's all you need to know.
 
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PickUrPoison

macrumors G3
Sep 12, 2017
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10,397
Sunnyvale, CA
The products include a 12.9-inch ‌iPad Pro‌, a 27-inch iMac Pro, a 14.1-inch MacBook Pro, a 16-inch ‌‌MacBook Pro‌‌, a 10.2.-inch ‌iPad‌, and a 7.9-inch ‌‌iPad‌‌ mini.

Surprised not to see iPad Air and iPad Pro 11” in this list. I can see how Apple may want to use mini-LED to increase the cheapest iPads value, but still...
Those are the products Kuo knows about, there could be others. Those might be in the first wave. But as good as his info typically is wrt supply chain matters, he doesn’t always get the timing right.
 
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