Late 2008 MBP Black level test

[integrat.ethis]

I think it's funny that the prevailing opinion for awhile was that the 9C84 was far superior, but the tables seemed to have turned.

For the record, I have a 9C85, and the blacks are deep and beautiful. They fade a bit off angle, but remain impressively constant until a little past 45 degrees. Never seen a 9C84 though.

 

[7even]

I think it's funny that the prevailing opinion for awhile was that the 9C84 was far superior, but the tables seemed to have turned.

For the record, I have a 9C85, and the blacks are deep and beautiful. They fade a bit off angle, but remain impressively constant until a little past 45 degrees. Never seen a 9C84 though.

Something about the 9C85 just seemed unnatural to me. My 9C84 is pleasing to look at... When I was comparing them in-store, the 85 did seem to have better contrast though. Meh. In the end, pick whatever looks better to you.

 

[Kevenly]

I have a 9C84 presently, and I thought it was absolutely beautiful from the moment I first started it up. Compared to my Titanium Powerbook G4 it's a whole other world.

From extreme horizontal angles the color is almost completely yellow.

I have to keep it on the lowest brightness setting or it's like staring into the sun.

Overall though the viewing angle seems amazing. I have to get basically perpendicular to the machine to see yellow, but all other angles seem perfect on the lowest brightness setting.

On the TiBook this is replacing, you couldn't see even colors across the display from ANY angle, contrast was horrible, everything looked overly airbrushed compared to this new machine, and the backlighting was badly uneven. So looking at these two next to each other, it's hard to see anything wrong with the new machine.

 

[EngenZerO]

my 9C84 produces blacks that look like ink and whites that are just bright (no yellow). color also looks awesome and i got great shadow detail.

im definitely happy with my 9C84 screen.

i assume there is some variance between the screens (9C84 vs 9C85). also i would go out on a limb and say there are probably some 9C85s that also have issues...

 

[integrat.ethis]

I have a 9C84 presently, and I thought it was absolutely beautiful from the moment I first started it up. Compared to my Titanium Powerbook G4 it's a whole other world.

From extreme horizontal angles the color is almost completely yellow.

I have to keep it on the lowest brightness setting or it's like staring into the sun.

Overall though the viewing angle seems amazing. I have to get basically perpendicular to the machine to see yellow, but all other angles seem perfect on the lowest brightness setting.

On the TiBook this is replacing, you couldn't see even colors across the display from ANY angle, contrast was horrible, everything looked overly airbrushed compared to this new machine, and the backlighting was badly uneven. So looking at these two next to each other, it's hard to see anything wrong with the new machine.

Are your colors constant vertically down the screen? One good way to tell is to open up iTunes and make it fill the screen. On my 9C85, the alternating blue lines are quite blue at the top, but fade to a pale almost-white at the bottom. I'd really like to know if there are any MBPs that don't have this behavior.

 

[jachiho]

I just did more tests comparing my 9C84 MBP with my MB Air (the new SSD). The different is night and day. The MBP looks fine by itself, but when compared with the Air, its very noticeable. I really dont understand why some people say that the MBP has a better screen than the Air. And the Pro's glass didn't help either. I spoke to Apple about it, but they wouldn't do anything about it apart from having it looked at at the service centres (No apple stores here). I really don't know what to do. While there are many improvements on the new Macbook, i really cant see much improvements on the Pro. FW400 is gone, the screen got worse, the glass, the battery got worse, the added size and weight. What I got was a better made body, slight performance increase, and a better trackpad.

I wonder how I can be sure I can get a 9C85 next time round, if there is a next time.

 

[jjahshik32]

This is very interesting my first 2.4ghz mbp was a 9c84 and it was very very vivid with deep blacks. Then I exchanged it for a 2.5ghz mbp and I received another 9c84 but this time it was just like the op's washed out 9c84.

Thankfully it had a small dent on the unibody and I exchanged it hoping for a 9c85 but this 3rd mbp is a 9c84 but its very very vivid with a very deep blacks as well and not washed out at all.

I've been through 3 9c84 and the first and third mbp's with the 9c84 screens are very vivid with deep blacks but the second 9c84 was very washed out just like the one on the photo that the OP had posted of his 9c84.

This leads me to believe that the manufacturing of the lcd has no affect and maybe its the actual backlighting implemented on each different manufactured screen that makes the difference. I think each lcd manufacturer LG and Chi Mei uses 2 different types of backlighting. Thats what I really believe.

I've also heard many others rave about the 9c84 screens and that 9c85 being washed out and vice versa. Very interesting.

 

[jsavage21]

I have noticed the same problem being discussed as well. My first Macbook Pro arrived with what appeared to be a couple dead pixels, but were really a couple specks of dirt underneath the glass. I returned it and apple sent me another one. This one seems to lack contrast as the first one did. The colors appear somewhat flat and it doesn't have the punch that I have heard others describe. It also has some interesting backlight bleeding on a black screen.
The backlight patterns do not appear at all during normal use. Just when watching a movie with letterbox.

My model is the 9C85.
I didn't check to see what model the first one was.I am a photographer and I am not very excited about the screen on this thing. It does however have good viewing angles and bright whites, but the flat color and backlight bleeding are a real turn off. Especially when I payed $2500 for a machine that's supposed to be top notch.

 

[ivinho]

I have noticed the same problem being discussed as well. My first Macbook Pro arrived with what appeared to be a couple dead pixels, but were really a couple specks of dirt underneath the glass. I returned it and apple sent me another one. This one seems to lack contrast as the first one did. The colors appear somewhat flat and it doesn't have the punch that I have heard others describe. It also has some interesting backlight bleeding on a black screen.
The backlight patterns do not appear at all during normal use. Just when watching a movie with letterbox.

My model is the 9C85.
I didn't check to see what model the first one was.I am a photographer and I am not very excited about the screen on this thing. It does however have good viewing angles and bright whites, but the flat color and backlight bleeding are a real turn off. Especially when I payed $2500 for a machine that's supposed to be top notch.

do you notice reflections when watching movies during a dark scene?

 

[sammy2066]

How aggravating are these differences? As long as 9C84 is not anywhere close to being bad as the screens on the MB, I can live with it.

 

[LemmycautioN]

Well I don't really want to confuse this issue anymore than it already is, but I just got a new MBP and it's the 84. The one I currently have is the 85 and the 84 that I just got has a better screen. Blacker blacks, richer colors, more contrast. It looks like the OP's photo but it's the opposite models. I was so surprised I had to check the model numbers a few times. The really weird thing is that I took the 85 into the apple store and compared it to the other MBP's and my 85 had a better screen than all of the 84's. I'm going to go into the apple store tomorrow to see if the 84 I have is better than the 85's that they have. Basically, it seems to me that this issue is not as simple as 84 vs 85

 

[masse]

my LG screen is very good and doesn't at all look washed out or have bad black levels.

I was under the impression the LG screens were generally better...but I really dont' care.

 

[melchior]

'Some random company'? chimei manufacturers lcd panels for a large proportion of hardware brands. they're top notch.

Just like the MBs, the LG screens are in fact pieces of ****. It is truly unfortunate that the two better screens on both the MB and the MBPs are in fact made by some random company that is probably not nearly as well known as LG.

 

[sk47]

upon my personal testing, my (85) definitely had worse blacks than my brother's (84) mbp screen. I'm really surprised that the OP had the exact opposite experience because for me, the off-viewing angle distortion in color and blacks is night and day with mine and my brothers (lucky bastard... i was initially hoping that I would get the 84 and HE would get the 85 so i can rub it in his face lol). LG screen was definitely superior.

 

[Azagar]

Question when you ran this test you were using the color LCD profile correct? I just tried this too since I have a 84 display, only thing is I use the Adobe 98 profile just because the color LCD one is so yellow. I switched it and did notice the blacks a bit off, but it was not as apparent when using the adobe profile.
I'm nit picking when I say this but I want nice blacks on my screen.

 

[Taccano]

I have a LG (09c84) display. I am very content with it. Good contrast and exact blacks. But the topic starter's photos made me suspicious about my display's quality. The third photo (the Golden Palace desktop picture) has a clear blue sky at the topleft of the image. In my display I get a white sky. No trace of blue . I have checked with a CRT monitor of a friends Mac Pro. He is a professional editor. And in his Mac Pro the image has also a white sky. He told me that the photos in the topic starter could have been photoshopped.
Could you verify if the sky in your displays also white?
Should I ask to my Apple Reseller a change?

 

[darngooddesign]

I hope my screen never looks like the OP's right one as the sky in the Golden Palace photo is supposed to be white. Unless Apple is using different photos, which I doubt, that means that the screen that the OP likes has some serious blue cast issues.

The black in the middle photo is not supposed to be solid black, but rather a dark grey.

Further more I could care less what the screens look like from such an off angle. I only care what they look like straight on. Different panels will look different at an extreme angle which is not indicative of what they look like at a regular angle.

So while I'd like to see more color tests, there OP's original photos do not help beyond proving that both displays look bad at extreme angles.

 

[integrat.ethis]

The blue sky appears when you look at the monitor at a sharp angle from above.

Now, a viewing angle test that I concocted:
Check out the attachment, and zoom all the way in on it so that it fills the screen (ctrl-scroll in). When viewed head on, a horrible gradient reveals itself - it's almost black on the top, but moderately grey at the bottom.

Anyone else get this?

 

[bcaslis]

Question when you ran this test you were using the color LCD profile correct? I just tried this too since I have a 84 display, only thing is I use the Adobe 98 profile just because the color LCD one is so yellow. I switched it and did notice the blacks a bit off, but it was not as apparent when using the adobe profile.
I'm nit picking when I say this but I want nice blacks on my screen.

Adobe 98 is not a display profile. You are guaranteed to have some very serious inaccuracies with this, it's a profile for using in tools like Photoshop.

To get anything reasonable, you need a profile generated for the display. This means the apple Color LCD profile, a profile generated by someone else for the display, or one you generated using the proper hardware/software.

 

[darngooddesign]

Anyone else get this?

My 9C84 looks fine.

 

[bcaslis]

The blue sky appears when you look at the monitor at a sharp angle from above.

Now, a viewing angle test that I concocted:
Check out the attachment, and zoom all the way in on it so that it fills the screen (ctrl-scroll in). When viewed head on, a horrible gradient reveals itself - it's almost black on the top, but moderately grey at the bottom.

Anyone else get this?

It would be a lot easier if you included a larger picture or file.

However to answer, no "horrible gradient". But keep in mind every laptop display will be darker at the top and lighter at the bottom due to the location of the backlight. No LCD, even good desktops are perfect in this regard.

 

[integrat.ethis]

It would be a lot easier if you included a larger picture or file.

However to answer, no "horrible gradient". But keep in mind every laptop display will be darker at the top and lighter at the bottom due to the location of the backlight. No LCD, even good desktops are perfect in this regard.

I didn't think the size of the image mattered if you could just zoom all the way in on it. It's definitely not a backlight thing here - it's just the fact that I'm seeing higher contrast when viewed from below, lower contrast when viewed from above, but the viewing angle is so narrow that I can see this contrast gradient when viewed head on.

I have access to two other laptops in this apartment (both Dells) and neither exhibit this issue, so it's not just some inherent deficiency in laptop screens.

Another explanation of how the issue affects me in every day use - in dark rooms while playing Fallout 3, I routinely won't be able to make out any detail on the ceiling. I'll have to make my character look up to move the image closer to the center of the screen. I don't know, that doesn't seem acceptable to me.

 

[LemmycautioN]

The chi mei is on the left, the LG is on the right. I took this photo to see the backlighting issues more than the black levels, but all this "color accuracy" stuff is much less important, that's what display calibrations are for. Also, the pagoda photo has a white sky on both of my machines with Srgb, Abode 98, and color LCD.

Personally I think there are a ton of inconsistencies from model to model, the other LG screen I tested was darker than either of these one's - too bad it was covered with dead pixels .

In any case I'd say neither of these screens are very good and I have yet to see any MBP with a really good screen. My girlfriend's $800 POS dell ispiron has darker blacks and less bleeding

 

[PDE]

In any case I'd say neither of these screens are very good and I have yet to see any MBP with a really good screen. My girlfriend's $800 POS dell ispiron has darker blacks and less bleeding :mad:[/QUOTE]


Agreed. I just can't quite get my head around why this is the case. I mean, when I look at the cheapest PC laptops LCDs in the stores, most of them look better than the one on my MBP: evenly illuminated (though not as bright usually), crisp whites, little tints when viewing from sides etc....how can that be? I can't imagine Apple is buying the worst screens.

 

[glxyjones]

Ok, I just bought a brand new 2.5 mbp from Amazon. I plan on it replacing my iMac but so far I'm a little upset about the display.

I have the 9C84 display and I'm comparing it to my late 07 iMac display. Unless, I'm missing something, the MBP's screen is ridiculously inferior to the iMac's. No matter how many times I try to calibrate or load another MBP owners calibration profile, I can't get it to match the iMac's.

The biggest difference I notice is the brightness of the colors on the iMac vs the MBP. The colors are so much more vibrant on the iMac while the MBP just seems washed out. Should this be the case? Are the iMac's displays just naturally superior to a laptop's display like the MBP? If they are not, I'm afraid I have received one of the "crappy" displays I've been hearing so much around here.

If I do have to return it, do I go through Apple or through Amazon? Should I just take it to a local Apple store and ask for a replacement (I could also compare it to the other MBP screens on display)?

Any help or hints on how to help my display would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!!!

Here are some pictures comparing the two, I think the first pic illustrates what I'm talking about best.