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If Apple wanted to disrupt the credit industry they would apply a discount to purchases at point of sale. That way sales tax would be lowered as well. Maybe offer an option for tip matching as well (since tips are rarely refunded and many people still prefer tipping with cash).
 
I'm sure it's because the physical card is intended as a backup for places that can't accept contactless. If they can, you'd want to use Apple Pay on your iPhone or Watch and get the 2% cash back.

Any use of the physical card would net 1% cash back, and if it were contactless, I suspect would still be the same. Apple wants this card to be primarily used with Apple Pay.

Follow up question, does Apple Pay work without internet? Never tried.
 
A good way to drop your credit length history. Never good to close a credit card due to that reason unless it has a annual fee!

Ehh that’s actually not that big of a deal. Bureaus can look at what your longest open account is, not just your average length. Closing my Chase Freedom didn’t hurt me at all.

Follow up question, does Apple Pay work without internet? Never tried.

You don’t need an Internet connection because it uses NFC. The card info is stored on the Secure Enclave and already has been authenticated via the Internet. Payment info is sent to the payment terminal via NFC.
 
Ok let’s discuss.

What exactly do you want to talk about regarding the cards release?
Do try to keep up, majority of posters seem not to know that metal cards, and some without account numbers, have been available for sometime. I was poking fun at them.
 
What about when a merchant needs to manually enter the card number? I've had times where they entered the number manually on the front of the card; either because the swiper is down or for other reasons.

I'd never trust a merchant to manually enter the number. In cases where that's required that's what the Wallet App would provide ... a temporary digitized number.
 
This card should be a total flop. There's literally not one good reason to get it unless you constantly shop at the Apple Store. Just get the Citi Double Cash for 2% on Apple Pay and everything else, and get some other cards to fill in for everything else. Travel a lot, Chase Sapphire Reserve, use Amazon a lot, Amazon Prime card. It's a cool idea with some unique features, but at the end of the day, there's no reason to have a credit card that isn't going to get you decent rewards in a world filled with those that do.
 
This card should be a total flop. There's literally not one good reason to get it unless you constantly shop at the Apple Store. Just get the Citi Double Cash for 2% on Apple Pay and everything else, and get some other cards to fill in for everything else. Travel a lot, Chase Sapphire Reserve, use Amazon a lot, Amazon Prime card. It's a cool idea with some unique features, but at the end of the day, there's no reason to have a credit card that isn't going to get you decent rewards in a world filled with those that do.

If you're primarily using it with Apple Pay, it's going to be almost as good as the few 2% cards out there for at least that purpose and beat the 1.5% cards that just about everyone seems to offer. Depending on who you ask, Citi is either good or frustrating and the alternative 2% options (PayPal MC, Fidelity Visa) have their own quirks. Obviously, some folks will get it for the oooh-shiny-it's-Apple standpoint, but I can see the value in a toolkit of a few cards as an "everything else" if you're in a place that you can use Apple Pay a lot.

There's also the no-foreign-transaction-fees aspect which is kind of rare on no annual fee cards (Capital One and the various Amazon cards seem to be the few that come to mind). Obviously, if you're doing a lot of international travel, a travel rewards cards would make more sense, but for someone that buys things online or crosses the border to Mexico or Canada every once in awhile, this could be a nice addition.

And for bigger Apple Store purchases, I'd probably still use a card with good extended warranty features (Mastercard is dropping it from their network-based features, so individual banks may still offer it) - Citi wins at that, but Amex and a few others could also work.
 
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On numerous travel blogs and forums, it seems that a chip+signature card (where signature isn't even required anymore) will work fine in most chip+PIN readers overseas without requiring a PIN—the ones that come up are automated ticket vending machines. If so, Apple Card is probably going to be no different than metal chip+signature cards from Amex, Chase, or Capital One from a usability/travel perspective.

I can confirm that. I went to several countries in Europe the last two years. If the store didn't take Apple Pay I had zero problems with using my chip+signature credit cards. I did read that warning about using them with ticket machines in train stations so I avoided those and just went to a ticket counter.
 
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I can confirm that. I went to several countries in Europe the last two years. If the store didn't take Apple Pay I had zero problems with using my chip+signature credit cards. I did read that warning about using them with ticket machines in train stations so I avoided those and just went to a ticket counter.

Vending machines in the EU are now required to accept cards without pins, I can confirm this is being enforced at least in Germany.
 
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What about when a merchant needs to manually enter the card number? I've had times where they entered the number manually on the front of the card; either because the swiper is down or for other reasons.
That information will be available for you in the wallet app, both for the situation you describe and for online purchases, where, unless you’re using apple pay, you also have to enter the full card number, expiration date, security code, etc.

I wonder, though, if the transaction list will provide a way to distinguish whether a payment was made using apple pay or the titanium Apple Card. Chase Bank used to distinguish by placing a contactless symbol on the statement next to NFC contactless transactions (which they call blink transactions), but stopped doing it a few months ago.
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Are cards still swiped? I thought that ended decades ago. In fact for less expensive purchases chip and pin’s been pretty much superseded by contactless transactions.
Swiping is still widely used in the US to this day. They also don’t do PIN on credit cards, only on debit. For credit cards there it’s either chip and signature or chip and that’s it, but americans never do PIN on a credit card.
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I am conflicted because I really like the idea of this but do not want another card in my wallet
I believe the physical card is optional. You get the apple card on your iphone immediately upon applying, and then you have the option to request the physical card if you ever want it. If you don’t want the physical card, you can simply continue to just use your iphone or apple watch anywhere NFC contactless is accepted.
 
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Apple doesn't support chip and PIN, they want you to use Apple Pay or swipe to make sure they get maximum processing fees
Apple does support chip, look at the physical Apple card. It does have a chip on it. They just don’t support PIN because PIN authorization is not at all supported by any bank in the US for credit cards. It’s either chip and signature or chip and nothing else, but they just don’t do PIN for credit cards (though they do for debit cards). Of course, they do encourage the use of apple pay by offering more cash return for those purchases than when using the physical card.
 
That's a legal requirement. Apple had no choice. They did have a choice to not allow authorisation by PIN but signature only, whilst simultaneously not allowing for a signature or CVV to be displayed on the physical card. So enjoy opening your app and copying down numbers when Apple Pay isn't supported, or carrying a second card as backup.
No they didn’t have that choice. PIN Authorization DOES NOT yet exist in the US yet for credit cards, it only exists for debit cards. (and I can tell you’re not american because of the way you spelled authorisation instead of authorization. That spelling is used in UK or maybe AUstralia but not in the US).
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Also, how does one securely dispose of this (or any other metal) credit card when it expires? I can stick a plastic card in my shredder at home.

Call me paranoid, but I feel safer knowing that someone can't fish my old card out of the trash, guess at the new expiration date and run up some charges online.

I know I can dispute them, but I'd still rather avoid the situation if at all possible.
This card has no information printed on it other than your name, as opposed to standard cards, so there’d be no need to worry about if you don’t shred it.
 
PIN authorization is not at all supported by any bank in the US for credit cards

My Diners Club Mastercard and UNFCU Visa cards disagree. The more accurate statement is that the US is de facto chip and signature because the vast majority of banks have decided against adopting PIN authentication.

(BTW, said Diners Club MC will decline if the terminal asks for PIN and I/the cashier attempts to bypass. This has caused issues on multiple occasions due to bad training/terminal placement.)
 
With PINs.

Which Apple forbids. Hence you will be asked for alternative payment.
It’s not Apple it’s the US banking system. No credit card in the US ever uses PIN authorization, only debit cards do. Credit cards were Chip and signature until recently. Now the signature is being phased out by the card networks, but without replacing it by a PIN (i.e., now it’s chip and nothing else).
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Wrong. People have told you multiple times. There is no requirement to collect a signature at all on a signature card or transaction. For Mastercard, as the Apple card is, this is a global policy.
But outside the US, the issuing banks do require their customers to set a PIN for authorization. Even on mastercard cards.
 
I wonder if it has contactless....
It doesn’t. The idea is that if there is contactless, you use the iphone or apple watch. The card is only for places that don’t have contactless at all (rare to find in other countries, but still common in the US).
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cards are still swiped every day. I've never been to a gass station that didn't only have a swipe with no other option and there are still plenty of merchants with swipe as well
It’s surprising that I can use apple pay to pay for gas in Mexico, where apple pay hasn’t even launched, and I can’t in the US, where apple pay has existed for five years already. And the same goes for sit down restaurants in each of the two countries.
 
But outside the US, the issuing banks do require their customers to set a PIN for authorization. Even on mastercard cards.

That's if they choose to implement PIN CVM. And "outside the US" is wrong, it's a falsehood spread by the media. Banks in the EU require PINs because customer-unfriendly laws there let banks shift fraud liability to the customer.

Most of Asia, including Japan, Taiwan, South Korea, and parts of South America, like Peru, do not use PINs. If you take a Chip and Pin card there, you'll have issues because they often don't have the pinpad hardware.
 
That's if they choose to implement PIN CVM. And "outside the US" is wrong, it's a falsehood spread by the media. Banks in the EU require PINs because customer-unfriendly laws there let banks shift fraud liability to the customer.

Legal liability is a different issue. IMO, I believe it's possible to mandate PIN and still keep the banks liable for fraudulent charges. In fact, I examined the cardholder agreements for the two PIN preferring credit cards that I have and I didn't see anything that would imply that I could be held liable for any fraud that happens.

Most of Asia, including Japan, Taiwan, South Korea, and parts of South America, like Peru, do not use PINs. If you take a Chip and Pin card there, you'll have issues because they often don't have the pinpad hardware.

The issue is likely more terminal placement/training, much like it is in the US, though I don't have any personal experience using such cards in Asia. If there's no PIN pad at all, they're supposed to disable PIN support altogether at the terminal level and default to signature. YMMV, of course, as to which of those charges your bank will allow to go through.
 
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ApplePay displays only the last 4 digits of your actual card. You could have a problem if the number required.
Not with the Apple Card, it won’t be a problem. For that particular card, the wallet app will provide the entire card number, expiration date, etc, as opposed to all other bank cards stored in there.
 
Legal liability is a different issue. IMO, I believe it's possible to mandate PIN and still keep the banks liable for fraudulent charges. In fact, I examined the cardholder agreements for the two PIN preferring credit cards that I have and I didn't see anything that would imply that I could be held liable for any fraud that happens.

PIN incurs a cost, especially because you need a terminal, like an ATM, to change PINs. (EMV doesn't implement the PIN offset system ATM cards do because the PIN was designed for offline operation). This is a major issue in the US because retail banks and credit card banks often do not overlap geographically. That is, credit cards are nationwide but due to state regulation of banks, there is no 50-state retail bank. Then you have abandoned transactions when people forget PINs.

In the US, the law prevents this fraud shift, but in the EU, fraud claims with a valid PIN are regularly denied. In particular, many of their cardholder agreements say its your fault if you write down your PIN. If you didn't write it down, then the transaction must be authorized, according to their logic. The issue is real, just read about the claims their banks deny.
 
Follow up question, does Apple Pay work without internet? Never tried.
Yes it does. Payment info is stored directly on your iphone or apple watch, so no internet connection is required on your end (you might not get the push notification afterwards, but payment will definitely work).
 
Yes it does. Payment info is stored directly on your iphone or apple watch, so no internet connection is required on your end (you might not get the push notification afterwards, but payment will definitely work).

Thanks. So basically the iPhone is like a battery powered credit card.
 
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