Leaving Final Cut

[the vj]

Today I was talking to a college of another TV station. Between all the things we shared we spoke about Final Cut.

At his station they are going to switch to Avid now. Is amazing, he was talking about his station and was like listening him talking about mine, the same problems.

He told me that it was very hard to get all the systems to work with the same version of FCP 7 because it take ages for the owners to approve a budged. Now with the change of FCP X we look like fools.

Owners and bosses do not care about technological problems, they care about you wasting their money into something you should know it wont work.

in my station we had the same problem with Final Cut Server, it was not a server, it was a content administrator/librarian and a very bad one. We never manged to work after a few months and Apple never actually help.

So... on my side, I believe that by the end of the year or early next, we will be switching to Adobe Premiere because is cheaper than Avid but always better than Final Cut Studio and of course... X.

 

[grooveattack]

so, what your saying is "something didnt work for us. we're not using it anymore"

well, ummmm, congratulations?

 

[the vj]

Apple didn't work for us.

When you work in a professional field you do not spend $1,000 in a software, usually it all comes as part of chucks of $30,000 during the whole year.

TV stations are upgrading all the time, we need to speed up process, we are creating new material, we enhanced the old material (backward compatibility is a must). FCP X failed in all that.

Maybe amateurs who does not have a professional environment, who are not competitive and FCP X is an extension of iMovie are fine. But trust me, universities relies in the industry experience and if the industry (me, us) does not trust a product we wont encourage anybody else to use it.

I am talking to people and 100% are looking into migrating to other platforms since FCP is not reliable anymore.

That is why Apple is giving it away for $300, something valuable has a price, something that does not have a value you should sell it cheap.

Next year you will be applying to work in a decent post production studio and your employer will tell you: sorry, we changed platform last year, we are not using FCP any more, we are into a more robust software like Avid or Premiere.

Imagine you were dating this girl who was very hot and you wanted her as a girlfriend, you adored her. And you go to a party and you see her making out with a guy she was actually complaining about last week. Ok... no problem... laid with her, have her around for when you feel horny if you want but that is it.

That is the general feeling about FCP X, I may have it install it in 1 out of my 10 machines just to play around a bit but I know Apple betrays and has different objectives rather than being a reliable video post production software developer. They can change their mind at any time without consulting you.

 

[smokescreen76]

Unless Apple make some pretty drastic upgrades to Final Cut Pro X in the next 6 months or so I can't see my company upgrading to it.

We currently have a dozen or so FCP 7 systems running on the latest Mac Pro's with Apple Cinema Displays and AJA cards and everything else that makes for a fully professional FCP system (we also have the same amount of Avid systems).

We work with a mixture of tapeless and tape based media and FCP X just does not fit into anything like how we work.

We will be looking into migrating all of our FCP systems to Avid over the next few years so we will be a fully Avid based facility.

 

[the vj]

Yeap, and again, kids today will be entering into a new market where Final Cut does not exist anymore.

I remember back in 2005 I was using FCP because it was professional and easy, I used to work with Premiere but there was not support for the Mac any more.

When I was applying to work at post houses, all of them had Avid. I took an Avid training and even the software was amazing I needed to have the Avid hardware, those $2500 of that Avid training lost still hurt.

But is a fact in the industry that professional people uses Avid. FCP have been expanding slowly and taking terrain but with FCP X... they blew it!

I am glad I am more into Motion Graphics and I am not 100% editor even I use FCP every day still. But for those who editing is their life... what a problem.

 

[grooveattack]

"I remember back in 2005 I was using FCP because it was professional and easy"

so it took how many years of releases for it to get to that stage? final cut started in '99.

we have now with 'X' year dot, zero, 1.0, etc. This is a completely new program. The only similarity is the name.

It has been out less than a month and companies and users are saying they will never use it and hate it. That kind of close minded attitude will not help you.

"Unless Apple make some pretty drastic upgrades to Final Cut Pro X in the next 6 months or so I can't see my company upgrading to it."

You dont start a new program with it being perfect. you think avid and adobe have just released perfect programs first time? HELL NO! it has taken adobe 22 updates, new releases and 20 years to get to where it is today.

Apple, with final cut pro 7, simply said "this is not working, building on foundations 10 years old is not working. back to basics" and did you know while its rebuilding final cut from the ground up, the old one still works!! best of all worlds there.

Stop your whining and evolve. be part of something rather than push against it. feed back and help apple develop this completely new program.

 

[elisedriver]

Any an industry that takes a version 1.0 as their core suite product is asking for failure.

If your business has so many machines on FCP 7 (and interesting you said this rather than FCS 3 ) , then why the uber urgent need to upgrade to FCP X ? It's not like Pro 7 is becoming unsupported tomorrow ?

Bosses need to manage risks against costs. Any boss who right now sees the need to have the latest version of software has a) too much budget b) hasn't had enough training or experience to be that boss.

Any 1.0 product needs to mature before a business can seriously mitigate the adoption risks. In the windblows world this often means Service Pack 1 - or in the OSX world, usually the first Pro Pack Upgrade.

Businesses are not 0-day.warez - it isn't about what software you own - it's how stable your business is to be efficient and meet your customers needs.

 

[smokescreen76]

I use the term FCP 7 because we don't really use the rest of the studio applications. Okay - we use Compressor a lot. And DVD Studio Pro a little. And Cinema Tools a little.

We don't use Motion and Soundtrack Pro because After Effects and ProTools are better.


Apple haven't marketed this as a version 1 application - this is the new Final Cut Pro. I have transitioned from FCP 3 to 4 with no problems. I remember going from 4 to 5 very easily. 5 to 6 was easy too. 6 to 7 we did last year. Why would this be any different? They should have called it something else and kept Final Cut Studio 3 on the shelves.

 

[evil_santa]

we have been on FCP for 5 or 6 years, replacing avid & Qunatel systems, i can't see FCP X working for us in the near future , so i think we well be on Premiere when we in a position to upgrade.

 

[aristobrat]

6 to 7 we did last year. Why would this be any different? They should have called it something else and kept Final Cut Studio 3 on the shelves.

I agree that if they had done that, there would have been a lot less hysteria, but realistically, everyone would still be in the same position that they're in now.

Perhaps what Apple should have done was not release Final Cut X until it had feature parity with the old one. That'd probably only take them another year or two to achieve.

 

[mBox]

Unless Apple make some pretty drastic upgrades to Final Cut Pro X in the next 6 months or so I can't see my company upgrading to it.

Its sad to see everyone go but them such is life. If Apple didnt bother to continue the story would be the same but not the media attention it got. Were an Avid house with a slew of CS Master/Production. Our few FCS licenses were easy to upgrade (is it really an upgrade?).
Again its too bad not all can enjoy this new app.
I sure am

 

[Alucardx03]

Any an industry that takes a version 1.0 as their core suite product is asking for failure.

If your business has so many machines on FCP 7 (and interesting you said this rather than FCS 3 ) , then why the uber urgent need to upgrade to FCP X ? It's not like Pro 7 is becoming unsupported tomorrow ?

Bosses need to manage risks against costs. Any boss who right now sees the need to have the latest version of software has a) too much budget b) hasn't had enough training or experience to be that boss.

Any 1.0 product needs to mature before a business can seriously mitigate the adoption risks. In the windblows world this often means Service Pack 1 - or in the OSX world, usually the first Pro Pack Upgrade.

Businesses are not 0-day.warez - it isn't about what software you own - it's how stable your business is to be efficient and meet your customers needs.

Very well said. Couldn't agree more.

 

[Simplicated]

"I remember back in 2005 I was using FCP because it was professional and easy"

so it took how many years of releases for it to get to that stage? final cut started in '99.

we have now with 'X' year dot, zero, 1.0, etc. This is a completely new program. The only similarity is the name.

It has been out less than a month and companies and users are saying they will never use it and hate it. That kind of close minded attitude will not help you.

"Unless Apple make some pretty drastic upgrades to Final Cut Pro X in the next 6 months or so I can't see my company upgrading to it."

You dont start a new program with it being perfect. you think avid and adobe have just released perfect programs first time? HELL NO! it has taken adobe 22 updates, new releases and 20 years to get to where it is today.

Apple, with final cut pro 7, simply said "this is not working, building on foundations 10 years old is not working. back to basics" and did you know while its rebuilding final cut from the ground up, the old one still works!! best of all worlds there.

Stop your whining and evolve. be part of something rather than push against it. feed back and help apple develop this completely new program.

It's funny, when you launch Final Cut Pro X it says Version 10.0 and not 1.0. It's amusing to see how many ill-formed comments for Final Cut Pro X are there on MacRumors.

 

[aristobrat]

It's funny, when you launch Final Cut Pro X it says Version 10.0 and not 1.0. It's amusing to see how many ill-formed comments for Final Cut Pro X are there on MacRumors.

Regardless of what version number it says, it's version 1. A total re-write. Even if had feature parity with Final Cut Pro 9, it'd still be unproven software. It's something you'd put on a test box and dick around with, not immediately upgrade your entire production studio with.

 

[the vj]

Any an industry that takes a version 1.0 as their core suite product is asking for failure.

If your business has so many machines on FCP 7 (and interesting you said this rather than FCS 3 ) , then why the uber urgent need to upgrade to FCP X ? It's not like Pro 7 is becoming unsupported tomorrow ?

Bosses need to manage risks against costs. Any boss who right now sees the need to have the latest version of software has a) too much budget b) hasn't had enough training or experience to be that boss.

Any 1.0 product needs to mature before a business can seriously mitigate the adoption risks. In the windblows world this often means Service Pack 1 - or in the OSX world, usually the first Pro Pack Upgrade.

Businesses are not 0-day.warez - it isn't about what software you own - it's how stable your business is to be efficient and meet your customers needs.

Pro 7 became unsupported last week.

FC Studio 3 needs a lot of work still. For example, when you run Compressor in a cluster you can not make it talk to FCP 7 anymore.

The features of FCP X were good IF I was able to implement them on my actual projects.

Again, Premiere have been always better than FCP but we trusted Apple and we were fine until now.

 

[chrono1081]

Anyone else here smell a troll thread? I do...

Sorry OP that you cannot adapt to changing software. Sure FCX may be missing features right now but any professional should know that this happens with first versions of software that change, not to mention read the released info about what Apple will be adding. FCX was redone completely, hence why some stuff has changed. I have a feeling it will be a great piece of software after a few iterations.

If FCX isn't for you, who cares? Just dont upgrade. Its simple. It costs a lot more to switch software packages, get new license, and implement training.

 

[grooveattack]

It's funny, when you launch Final Cut Pro X it says Version 10.0 and not 1.0. It's amusing to see how many ill-formed comments for Final Cut Pro X are there on MacRumors.

from apple.com: "Rebuilt from the ground up" "Completely redesigned" "New architecture"

10.0 coming from 7.0.3?
10.0 is a new start under the same project title. an update would be 8.0

It's amusing to see how many ill-formed comments for Final Cut Pro X are there on MacRumors

 

[thejadedmonkey]

I'm glad to hear that I made the correct gamble.. About a week before FCP X came out, I gambled that "pros" would leave en-mass. I said to myself "this is my last year in school, I can get a brand new Dell, the complete Adobe suite, and still spend less than a MacBook."

I'm glad to see I made the right choice, I wish the best of luck to all the prosumers who upgrade to iMovie Pro though.

 

[aristobrat]

Again, Premiere have been always better than FCP but we trusted Apple and we were fine until now.

I think everyone can agree that Apple could have managed this launch better. Leave FC7 on the shelves, market this is a new FCE or something like that until they hit a release that had more feature parity, etc, etc, etc.

Having said that, even though this version is obviously nowhere ready to be used in some environments, you've got to see why Apple re-wrote it from scratch, and where they're going with it.

 

[MovieCutter]

I'm glad to hear that I made the correct gamble.. About a week before FCP X came out, I gambled that "pros" would leave en-mass. I said to myself "this is my last year in school, I can get a brand new Dell, the complete Adobe suite, and still spend less than a MacBook."

I'm glad to see I made the right choice, I wish the best of luck to all the prosumers who upgrade to iMovie Pro though.

Well this is where the real pain is isn't it...the fact that professional houses, news groups, etc aren't moving to FCP X when the kids coming into this field think that FCP X is the second coming. Nobody with the amount of investment in their gear at a high end pro level is going to take you seriously unless you know Avid, Adobe, Grass Valley, etc...it might actually help us pros out instead of diluting the market.

 

[mBox]

Well this is where the real pain is isn't it...the fact that professional houses, news groups, etc aren't moving to FCP X when the kids coming into this field think that FCP X is the second coming. Nobody with the amount of investment in their gear at a high end pro level is going to take you seriously unless you know Avid, Adobe, Grass Valley, etc...it might actually help us pros out instead of diluting the market.

I want to agree but I still believe that most "real" learners will take it to the next level and study all of them.
My days it was imperative that I learn all the apps no matter what the cost.
I went from Swivel3D, Infini-D, Strata, formZ, EIAS all the way up to Maya.
Same with Motion Design, DAW and NLE.
Im not going to tell the kiddies out there to stop learning.
Learn what you can but be prepared when you really needed.

 

[yoak]

I'm glad to hear that I made the correct gamble.. About a week before FCP X came out, I gambled that "pros" would leave en-mass. I said to myself "this is my last year in school, I can get a brand new Dell, the complete Adobe suite, and still spend less than a MacBook."

I'm glad to see I made the right choice, I wish the best of luck to all the prosumers who upgrade to iMovie Pro though.

If you had got avid you might have made the right choice. At least in this country it's either FC or Avid if you want to work in a post house.
If you are a one man show on the other hand...
But then you could as well use FCX

 

[iphonepiephone]

There should be a rule about more FCP/FCPX whining/complaining/re-treading worn ground posts. This post has no personality, nothing different or worth responding to... its' "just another FCPX thread", slightly different in wording, but predictably sameish and pointless...

 

[Nostromo]

There should be a rule about more FCP/FCPX whining/complaining/re-treading worn ground posts. This post has no personality, nothing different or worth responding to... its' "just another FCPX thread", slightly different in wording, but predictably sameish and pointless...

Consider it psychotherapy.

There you talk a lot about what bothers you - and it doesn't help you, either.

 

[THX1139]

With Apple starting over with FCX, they just fell way behind the pack. People say to give FCX a chance and eventually it will evolve to be a great program. Well, that may be... but while Apple plays catch-up, Adobe and AVID won't be sitting still. They will have several more point releases on established software. It could be argued that once FCX catches up, it could easily surpass Adobe and AVID due to the new architecture. Well, that's all fine and dandy, but professional post houses can't afford to wait for Apple to get it together, especially when Apple won't detail a road map for future development. So, by the time Apple gets going... the pros are going to be mostly gone and that will kill any reason to add more professional features. I doubt Apple will get them back. It took too many years to win them over with Final Cut Pro and they blew it. If they lose the pros, they will also begin to lose the Macpro market and you'll see a trickle down effect. Of course, that might make Apple happy because they can finalize their transition to post-PC market. The way it stands now, it's looking like my next computer is going to be a windows box. I sort of threw up in my mouth as I wrote that.