Legal downloads of legacy OS X?

bobreborn

macrumors member
Original poster
Jan 30, 2014
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0
I am putting together a g5 mac pro and for some dumb reason I threw out my leopard dvd when I moved thinking I wouldn't need it. Sure enough...

So I'm curious if its legal to download it? Is it considered free like Mavericks is?

NOT ASKING ABOUT PIRATING SOFTWARE! I don't know and failed to find an answer to if it's considered free now. Thanks!
 

Gregg2

macrumors 603
May 22, 2008
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Milwaukee, WI
No, not for OS X. Specifically, not Leopard. You can find it on eBay, and the price has come down a bit; used to be close to $100
 

bobreborn

macrumors member
Original poster
Jan 30, 2014
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0
holy cow I threw away 100$ @___@

jeebs. Seems a strange policy to offer the new OS free and still make it illegal to host a download on someplace like cnet =/ Thanks for the quick reply!
 

GGJstudios

macrumors Westmere
May 16, 2008
44,360
701
I am putting together a g5 mac pro and for some dumb reason I threw out my leopard dvd when I moved thinking I wouldn't need it. Sure enough...

So I'm curious if its legal to download it? Is it considered free like Mavericks is?

NOT ASKING ABOUT PIRATING SOFTWARE! I don't know and failed to find an answer to if it's considered free now. Thanks!
If you threw away your grey installation disks, you can order replacements directly from Apple for around $20.
 

bobreborn

macrumors member
Original poster
Jan 30, 2014
61
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No I had upgraded from 10.4 so I bought the full install dvd... =/

edit - wait, can't I just get the grey's from apple still? What's the verification process for them?
 

Altemose

macrumors G3
Mar 26, 2013
9,089
444
Elkton, Maryland
I am putting together a g5 mac pro and for some dumb reason I threw out my leopard dvd when I moved thinking I wouldn't need it. Sure enough...

So I'm curious if its legal to download it? Is it considered free like Mavericks is?

NOT ASKING ABOUT PIRATING SOFTWARE! I don't know and failed to find an answer to if it's considered free now. Thanks!
If you were a paying Apple Developer you would have access.
If you threw away your grey installation disks, you can order replacements directly from Apple for around $20.
To my knowledge, Apple doesn't stock restore disks as of 2014 for PowerPC Macs.
 

Altemose

macrumors G3
Mar 26, 2013
9,089
444
Elkton, Maryland
what about previously paying apple dev? like 3 years ago previous...
I don't think so. By the way, if you need any other help with this G5 you can post in the PowerPC Macs section. Very good people can help there.

Your choices are ordering Leopard off eBay or seeing if Apple somehow still has disks for your Mac which they did not for my G5.
 

bobreborn

macrumors member
Original poster
Jan 30, 2014
61
0
thanks I hadn't thought to post in the g5 forum. I will head that way I'm sure as I'm trying to setup a Logic node to offload whatever processing I can from my dying Laptop until I can afford a Mac Pro 3,1 (ironically it'll be replacing a MBP 3,1)

Thanks!
 

Altemose

macrumors G3
Mar 26, 2013
9,089
444
Elkton, Maryland
thanks I hadn't thought to post in the g5 forum. I will head that way I'm sure as I'm trying to setup a Logic node to offload whatever processing I can from my dying Laptop until I can afford a Mac Pro 3,1 (ironically it'll be replacing a MBP 3,1)

Thanks!
A lot of the members there are much more knowledgable in this area then me.
 

bobreborn

macrumors member
Original poster
Jan 30, 2014
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0
HIYAAAa!!!!!! Turns out my inanity for backing things up saves me! I have an external RAID array that I keep lots of app images on and thought I may as well give it a whirl since I keep the Windows/Mavericks/Snow Leopard images there that I've turned into USB drives. BINGO!!!! :D

Here's the situation though. I don't have any working optical drives. The superdrive in my laptop was dead when I bought it used and this Mac Pro G5 that my buddy is lending me he isn't sure the drive in there works either.

It definitely needs a HDD, which I have next to me. I have a SATA-to-USB connector that will allow me access the SATA HDD I'm going to install Leopard on. I've already Partitioned it as an APM, but I can't figure out how to, while in Mavericks, Install Leopard onto the drive using the image I made years ago.

Ideas?
 

Altemose

macrumors G3
Mar 26, 2013
9,089
444
Elkton, Maryland
HIYAAAa!!!!!! Turns out my inanity for backing things up saves me! I have an external RAID array that I keep lots of app images on and thought I may as well give it a whirl since I keep the Windows/Mavericks/Snow Leopard images there that I've turned into USB drives. BINGO!!!! :D



Here's the situation though. I don't have any working optical drives. The superdrive in my laptop was dead when I bought it used and this Mac Pro G5 that my buddy is lending me he isn't sure the drive in there works either.



It definitely needs a HDD, which I have next to me. I have a SATA-to-USB connector that will allow me access the SATA HDD I'm going to install Leopard on. I've already Partitioned it as an APM, but I can't figure out how to, while in Mavericks, Install Leopard onto the drive using the image I made years ago.



Ideas?

How old is the MacBook? You could try creating a 10 GB partition called " OS X Install DVD" and restore your legal Leopard image to that partition. Then you simply install Leopard like any other machine!
 

bobreborn

macrumors member
Original poster
Jan 30, 2014
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0
Unsurprisingly it failed on my laptop BUT I used the same theory to make another partition on the external (10GB) and am currently restoring it using the legal image.

Hope this works. Thanks!
 

eyoungren

macrumors Core
Aug 31, 2011
21,164
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First off, speaking to legality…

It's a licensing issue. Apple still holds the licenses for OS X so they can decide if they want to charge money for it. However, even Apple surrenders on this sometimes.

Everything from System 7.5.5 and below is legally downloadable and installable. Apple even hosts all the floppy disk images for that. But from 7.6.1 to 10.9.4, Apple has NOT released for public download.

I suspect that even though ML and Mavericks are free you would still be paying somewhere. Either in a new Mac or having to buy Snow Leopard to get access to the Apple store to download ML or Mavericks.

Next. No offense, but a Mac Pro G5 is not a model. You either have a Mac Pro, or you have a PowerMac G5. There is no combination of the two because it does not exist. One is Intel, the other is PowerPC.

Which one do you have? And Altemose mentions a MacBook? That's an Intel Mac as well.

If you do have a G5 though you can try restoring the disk image to a USB stick and then booting from the USB stick to install. It may involve using Open Firmware commands to boot from the USB stick.
 

Altemose

macrumors G3
Mar 26, 2013
9,089
444
Elkton, Maryland
Unsurprisingly it failed on my laptop BUT I used the same theory to make another partition on the external (10GB) and am currently restoring it using the legal image.



Hope this works. Thanks!

I hope it works.

First off, speaking to legality…

It's a licensing issue. Apple still holds the licenses for OS X so they can decide if they want to charge money for it. However, even Apple surrenders on this sometimes.

Everything from System 7.5.5 and below is legally downloadable and installable. Apple even hosts all the floppy disk images for that. But from 7.6.1 to 10.9.4, Apple has NOT released for public download.

I suspect that even though ML and Mavericks are free you would still be paying somewhere. Either in a new Mac or having to buy Snow Leopard to get access to the Apple store to download ML or Mavericks.

Next. No offense, but a Mac Pro G5 is not a model. You either have a Mac Pro, or you have a G5. There is no combination of the two. One is Intel, the other is PowerPC.

Which one do you have? And Altemose mentions a MacBook? That's an Intel Mac as well.

If you do have a G5 though you can try restoring the disk image to a USB stick and then booting from the USB stick to install. It may involve using Open Firmware commands to boot from the USB stick.

Mountain Lion was $19.99 to upgrade to. Mavericks and so on brought the free upgrade license. I was asking about the MacBook so he could throw the G5 into TDM and install it off the MacBook if it was old enough.
 

bobreborn

macrumors member
Original poster
Jan 30, 2014
61
0
I hope it works.




Mountain Lion was $19.99 to upgrade to. Mavericks and so on brought the free upgrade license. I was asking about the MacBook so he could throw the G5 into TDM and install it off the MacBook if it was old enough.
Sorry about the hardware confusion! I hadn't realized they had a different name before the Intel switch. Also on legality - it's an image that I made in case the original was damaged, in this case being thrown away. Isn't that why we make backups?

SO! The laptop is a Macbook Pro 3,1. The tower is apparently a PowerMac G5 (same case appearance as the Mac Pro).

I am intrigued by the TDM mode of installation because at the moment, this happens:

1) I change the startup disc to the Leopard Install image (I'm actually unsure if it's the opened Image on my desktop or the partitioned and restored image but it boots into it and let's me start the install process).
2) I get to the install and go to select the destination and the External partition ("The Geezy" - get it? ^_^) and it tells me I have to have it as a GUID partition in order to install.

I did find this post - http://everythingapple.blogspot.com/2007/11/create-leopard-boot-drive-for-powerpc.html - and it appears I've actually done that. I think. I get lost at step 3 though - not enough explanation for me.

So now it sounds like if I can figure out his step 3 or your suggested TDM installation I might get this working?
 

Altemose

macrumors G3
Mar 26, 2013
9,089
444
Elkton, Maryland
Sorry about the hardware confusion! I hadn't realized they had a different name before the Intel switch. Also on legality - it's an image that I made in case the original was damaged, in this case being thrown away. Isn't that why we make backups?

SO! The laptop is a Macbook Pro 3,1. The tower is apparently a PowerMac G5 (same case appearance as the Mac Pro).

I am intrigued by the TDM mode of installation because at the moment, this happens:

1) I change the startup disc to the Leopard Install image (I'm actually unsure if it's the opened Image on my desktop or the partitioned and restored image but it boots into it and let's me start the install process).
2) I get to the install and go to select the destination and the External partition ("The Geezy" - get it? ^_^) and it tells me I have to have it as a GUID partition in order to install.

I did find this post - http://everythingapple.blogspot.com/2007/11/create-leopard-boot-drive-for-powerpc.html - and it appears I've actually done that. I think. I get lost at step 3 though - not enough explanation for me.

So now it sounds like if I can figure out his step 3 or your suggested TDM installation I might get this working?

You need Apple Partition Map (APM) for a PPC Mac to boot.
 

bobreborn

macrumors member
Original poster
Jan 30, 2014
61
0
That's what the main 140GB partition is right now. The other 10GB is the Install image. When I boot to the install it won't let me put Leopard onto the APM because it says it has to be GUID.
 

eyoungren

macrumors Core
Aug 31, 2011
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Yeah, that may be because the installer is running off the MBP so it's assuming you are making an Intel install to the disk via TDM.

I don't know any way around that.

P.S. No worries, on legality from me. I was just explaining what Apple has and has not released into the public domain.

P.P.S. As to name changes, yeah, Apple did that to differentiate the new Intel Models from the old PowerPC Models. There was a reason Apple named Macs with PowerPC chips, PowerBooks and PowerMacs. :D
 
Last edited:

weckart

macrumors 601
Nov 7, 2004
4,665
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Get an 8GB USB drive, format it as one APM partition and restore your image to it. Boot from the USB from OF to install. I created such a drive on Mavericks and used it to install Leopard on my PowerBook G4.
 

bse5150

macrumors 6502
Jan 12, 2014
264
110
P.S. No worries, on legality from me. I was just explaining what Apple has and has not released into the public domain.
Apple hasn't released anything into the public domain. Apple retains the copyright and reserves all rights to software it makes available for free download.
 

bobreborn

macrumors member
Original poster
Jan 30, 2014
61
0
Get an 8GB USB drive, format it as one APM partition and restore your image to it. Boot from the USB from OF to install. I created such a drive on Mavericks and used it to install Leopard on my PowerBook G4.
What does "boot from the USB from OF to install." mean?
 

eyoungren

macrumors Core
Aug 31, 2011
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Apple hasn't released anything into the public domain. Apple retains the copyright and reserves all rights to software it makes available for free download.
OK, bad choice of words. I don't know what to call it. It's legal to download it and install it and use it, but not to reverse engineer or claim as your own. There's probably some legal term for that but it slips my mind right now.

----------

What does "boot from the USB from OF to install." mean?
This may help.

Also note that Intel Macs use EFI. PowerPC Macs use Open Firmware. Yet another difference between the two.
 

weckart

macrumors 601
Nov 7, 2004
4,665
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OK, bad choice of words. I don't know what to call it. It's legal to download it and install it and use it, but not to reverse engineer or claim as your own. There's probably some legal term for that but it slips my mind right now.
Distribute is the magic word that gets the lawyers all excited, especially where money is concerned. That is why Apple came down hard on Psystar. Not because it was selling hackintoshes but because it was distributing OSX as part of the package. Had Psystar limited itself to the hardware and the necessary self written kexts and instructions to install your own, Apple would have left it alone.