Leopard 64bit - everyday advantage?

Discussion in 'macOS' started by l33r0y, Sep 3, 2007.

  1. l33r0y macrumors 6502

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    #1
    We all know Leopard will run 64bit specific applications (science/tech/computational) on compatible hardware (core 2 duo and xeon), but will there be core programs within the operating system toolset that are able to take advantage everyday?

    e.g. perhaps Core image/audio/video/animation would be written in both a 32 and 64bit friendly version?

    Perhaps iLife 08s applications would run better on Leopard if there is some extra 64bit code waiting...
     
  2. clevin macrumors G3

    clevin

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  3. flopticalcube macrumors G4

    flopticalcube

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    #3
    Why?
     
  4. Fearless Leader macrumors 68020

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    #4
    no, 64 bit doesn't help 99% of users.

    most people don't even have more than 4gb of ram to begin with.

    and all 64bit gives you is more ram.

    because there isn't an advantage to be made.
     
  5. flopticalcube macrumors G4

    flopticalcube

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    #5
    Whoa! Incorrect in the most fundamental way. 64-bit gives improved integer arithmetic which is used in many applications.
     
  6. Fearless Leader macrumors 68020

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    #6
    go on
     
  7. flopticalcube macrumors G4

    flopticalcube

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    #7
    When working on data, 64-bit CPUs can work on twice as much data in the same clock cycle (as opposed to 32-bit CPUs).
     
  8. Fearless Leader macrumors 68020

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    #8
    ... whoa! incorrect in the most fundamental way. 64bits (2^64) does not equal 32bits (2^32) times 2.

    2^64 (64bits) addressing is 2^32 (4294967296) times larger than 2^32 (32bits). And it doesn't work on twice as much data.
     
  9. flopticalcube macrumors G4

    flopticalcube

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    #9
    You are confusing addressing with bus width. 64-bit (besides memory addressing) brings 64-bit wide registers to work on 64-bits of data at once.
     
  10. clevin macrumors G3

    clevin

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    #10
    we are talking about day to day apps like iTunes, ichat, adium, browsers, ical, QS, etc...

    its like hitting a fly with a missile, can it kill it? sure, would it make a difference by using a rock? no.
     
  11. BoyBach macrumors 68040

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  12. flopticalcube macrumors G4

    flopticalcube

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    #12
    I use iLife apps almost everyday and these should benefit from 64-bit wide registers.
     
  13. Fearless Leader macrumors 68020

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    #13
    I'm still confused on how every 64bit processor with its set up achieves exactly 2 times the performance as its 32bit counterpart. Can you give me a source?

    edit: i see what you are talking about now.

    but it does take bigger bites but it takes longer to chew each bite. because we still have the same amount of processing power.
     
  14. clevin macrumors G3

    clevin

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    #14
    i highly doubt it, but I have the patience for the test once leopard lands.

    oh, sorry, I made a mistake, if you mean garageband, iMovie, iDVD, maybe you are right. But I highly doubt those are most peole's day-2-day apps.
     
  15. flopticalcube macrumors G4

    flopticalcube

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    #15
    I don't use garageband everyday as I'm an old fart. But I do use iMovie and iDVD a lot.
     
  16. l33r0y thread starter macrumors 6502

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    #16
    Editing uncompressed digital video in iMovie would surely benefit from 64bit code when dealing with that amount of data?
     
  17. Fearless Leader macrumors 68020

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    #17
    umm no not really, we never go above 24bit (floating point) in the audio/visual world and you wouldn't upload a video into memory to work on it.
     
  18. flopticalcube macrumors G4

    flopticalcube

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    #18
    No, you have double the processing power. On a 64-bit CPU all the internal data paths are double in width. If it takes 1 clock cycle to add two 32-bit registers (4 bytes) together on a 32-bit CPU, it will take 1 clock cycle to add two 64-bit registers (8 bytes) together on a 64-bit CPU. Double the amount of data processed. This won't apply to all apps but those that process large amounts of integer data, like iMovie/iDVD/GarageBand/database engines/speadsheets will see a huge improvement (but not double as overhead gets in the way).
     
  19. clevin macrumors G3

    clevin

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    #19
    i think we listed enough information for OP to decide if his "day-2-day apps" will see difference with 64bit.

    PS. I don't understand how spreadsheet can be on the list?

    PS2. apps need to be written for 64bit to take full advantages, and Im not sure how many of the apps will have a 64 bit version.
     
  20. flopticalcube macrumors G4

    flopticalcube

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    #20
    iLife was mention in the OP.

    Speadsheets: Large integer arithmetic, given that won't be many.

    Yes, applications will have to be rewritten or at the very least recompiled. iLife, as Apple's flagship suite, will hopefully be one of the first.
     
  21. knelto macrumors regular

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    #21
    Well, who makes the iLife/iWork suites? Apple
    Who's making Leopard? Apple

    I would expect Apple to have updates or something that would make their apps 64 bit. It would be pretty dumb not to. But that's just me.
     
  22. clevin macrumors G3

    clevin

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    #22
    Im sure apple will make their own stuff 64-bit compatible.

    I have low expectation for apple's coding strength, will have to wait and see the result.

    I still don't think spreadsheet will perform differently with 64bit, its neither CPU intense, nor memory hog. the difference, even if any, will hardly be noticed.
     
  23. flopticalcube macrumors G4

    flopticalcube

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    #23
    Depends on your spreadsheet. I have had Excel sheets in the past that could take ten or fifteen minutes to calc even on decent machines. In the finance world, 32-bit integers are too restrictive (only goes to $4billion ;) ).
     
  24. clevin macrumors G3

    clevin

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    #24
    ok, guess your spreadsheet is at different level as mine...

    another question, do you expect M$ deliver a 64bit excel for mac?
     
  25. flopticalcube macrumors G4

    flopticalcube

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    #25
    I would hope so, but expect them to deliver it for Windows first and then maybe 3 or 4 years later for the Mac. Shame really.
     

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