Loading Large web pages in safari

Discussion in 'iPad' started by mossme89, Apr 3, 2010.

  1. mossme89 macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2009
    #1
    For those of you who have an iPad, how do large web pages load? I know one of the things the iPhone choked on was loading a long page like in a forum. By choking I mean it either checkerboards a lot of freezes.

    How does this page load?
    http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread468933/pg1

    Note: I have no opinion on the content. I found this via a quick google search and my iPhone chokes on this. It takes forever to load and constantly checkerboards.
     
  2. tkermit macrumors 68030

    tkermit

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2004
    #2
    quick google search for what ?:eek:
     
  3. al256 macrumors 6502a

    al256

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2001
    #3
    Safari still doesn't handle as well as it should. On larger pages, if I open a link that starts a new window, the previous page will need to be reloaded. No other pages are open but the two mentioned. With the iPad's specs, I can't think of a reason that it keeps dumping the memory for a previously opened page.
     
  4. mossme89 thread starter macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2009
    #4
    That stinks. But does it still load at a reasonable speed with little/no checkerboarding?

    Um... "Large page forum" I skipped ahead to page like 50 because I saw the others before
     
  5. dduttonnc macrumors member

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2011
    #5
    This is still a problem in 2016 even with an iPad with 2 GB of memory and an iPhone 6s Plus with 2 GB of memory ...there are many complex websites out there, and I can better examine them on my PC with the memory to that for just one tab for one website can take up to a gigabyte of memory – including the small amount of memory the browser Safari uses on my Windows PC, but I can take the base usage and subtracted from the amount uses from loading a website to get the actual mem used by the website

    Apple made a critical error by never making a page or swapfile on their devices. Claimed in doing so would ruin the life of the NAND storage memory. That is true, but also not relevant because the amount of life do used by doing this does not exceed the life of the device – meaning your device will fail or be obsolete by the time your storage runs out from constant reading and writing – and a page file doesn't mean Constant reading and writing… And for a long time iOS have the ability to handle a page file , And when you put a 512 MB page file onto 512 MB device, a lot of your tabs didn't disappear, it would take 1-2 seconds to load it from the page file but that's not. Course you have to jailbreak a device to do this, and page files no longer work starting with iOS 7 or later.. The system file to run the page file system is still there but it hasn't been updated by Apple in years, and if you try to use it you'll be stuck in a blue screen loop and be forced to hard reset your system and restore from by reinstalling iOS and your backup

    I still have this problem on my iPad Pro which has 4 GB of memory. Granted I can keep a lot more tabs open, but iOS 9 is really really really GREEDY. When you first food up and iPad Pro you have approximately 2.5 GB of RAM – even if you don't load or run single app or program and leave it in launch mode, within a few hours you will only have 1.2 GB free – ranted iOS 9 does something different than other versions, it only does this on the iPad Pro where creates basically a hard drive cache. Is not a big deal as it is the first thing to be erased as memory is needed Dash it basically has no priority

    But, the instant an app search using around 2 GB of memory on the iPad Pro, iOS will start to terminate apps or browser tabs. This shows that Apple is not prioritizing which system services need to be unloaded and have less priority then user Apps... If iOS 9 can be shrunken down to run on 1 GB devices, then an app should fully be able to use 3 GB on the iPad Pro


    Now I did solve this issue temporarily when I jailbroke my iPad air two and my iPad pro a while back ago

    There were several memory priorities that you can set, or if they don't exist you can set them for almost every system service , and once I set them to unload any time memory was "under pressure", they would unload with a priority less than user applications ... It's actually resulted in me being able to use up to 3.5 GB on my pro and up to 1.5 on my iPad air two and 1.5 on my iPhone 6s Plus

    But still, a page file would solve everything… Almost every android tablet and phone on the market has a page file and it has not and do the harm their devices. I've seen a friend with an android tablet and iPhone with only 2 GB of memory have 20 browser tabs open and never loses their data , tabs, suffer from termites apps because the is can swap,system and user apps out that are idle.

    Both devices would currently be jailbroken but I required the most current version of iOS to run some of the apps that I run, and as far as I know there is no untethered jailbreak for iOS 9 .3 .1 for the iPad Pro or air2 otherwise both devices would currently be jailbroken.

    iOS has a fantastic memory management system because most operating system simply cannot get away without a page file. People claim windows can do it but it makes windows and stable and people claim OS X can do it but when you do it it makes OSX unstable...because various programs – most of them actually expect a paging file to be there as well as the operating system – the only reason why they give you the auction to turn it off is some people crammed mass amounts of memory into their PC – and when I mean PC I mean a Windows or an osx 6 system because they are now hardware identical. iOS has been completely designed as you would think to not use a page file but every IOS device does has one if you look at the right utility but it's not using the system service to create it – I think it's part of the kernel now. I think it's required to keep the OS stable but here is how ridiculously small it is – 16 kB in size...not megabytes kilobytes

    It truly didn't have a page file then a utility could not record page in pages out and hard faults, Believe me they exist in your device and the number of pages and pages outs and faults is absolutely astronomical because of the teeny tiny page file. I rebooted my iPad pro about four hours ago and these are some of the memories to sticks already:
    1.1M page ins
    100K plate outs

    ... Showing whatever 16 K is being paged out is being paged in quite often to a factor of 10 times more often ...

    53MMILLION FAULTS
    200K cow faults
    Page lookups are virtually identical to pay page ins, just 100K more

    .... And there's many more memories to sticks and this is from a standard Apple Store app, and Apple allows these values to be read without jailbreaking the device ...same program has sort of a hidden feature – it's a feature Apple really doesn't like but they seem to allow it to slip through. Even though all the data you are seeing is displayed and changed it real time, if you hit the refresh button, the App start beginning to use memory to free up memory for other apps, but it has its limitations – on a 1 GB iOS 9 device it will only free up about 300 MB, on a 2 GB device it will only free up about 500 to 600 MB, and on a 4 GB device – the iPad Pro only it will only leave you with 1.4 GB free – this is because the app has not been updated since the pro came out ...personally the app should just keep using more and more and more memory, norming all the low memory warnings from the device, until I was forced terminates it and that way you will get the most memory free, but the app will never pass the app store that way as an app is required to free memory when they get the low memory warning, if he gets a critical memory warming, the app is supposed to take severe measures to reduce memory usage or gracefully shut down before data is lost – or is your game shuts down and you have it saved in the past 20 minutes


    It's in unfortunate the page file does not work, reason why is this 16 Kilobyte go by page file seems to be built in to the kernel and you can't have two things dealing with the paging system. In my opening in the best way is the pressure Apple to putting true page files on these machines and leave them up to the user decide if they want 128, 256, 512, 1 GB, add up to a 4 GB maximum. However, of 4 GB page file on a 1 GB device would be counterproductive , as you would almost always be swapping to and fro and you would actually slow your machine down ...for iOS with a page file, it seems to operate at peak efficiency when the swapfile is anywhere between half the size of the physical memory to no more than double the physical memory. So on an iPad Pro, you would want to 4-8GB of page file size, and on a newer iPhone with 2 GB of RAM you would want one to 4 GB page file space

    Apples "famous memory management system" on the iOS device really does not give the device any extra speed and performance over the android devices on the market. In fact it's a great hindrance and a real pain in the ass to programmers. Apple could do a lot more on these devices if they had page files because they would knew they would have more physical memory to work with because all of the operating system could be paged out except for wired memory.

    InStead of having this convoluted memory management system or an app constantly watching for low memory warnings, developers could feel free to code their programs for each device knowing the maximum amount of memory they could use... And for very memory intensive applications, the user could simply going to settings and temporarily increase their page 5 – the only thing you have to make sure is that an active program is not taking up so much memory that it's active memory is being paged out as that results in negative performance… Also can't have too much of the operating system paged out because part of it is needed and you don't want it constantly being paged out. And that's where apples configuration files for memory priorities come in the place. They could easily set services so they never can be paged out – basically by putting them in the wired pool... While most other parts of iOS can b page

    I was six was the last time you could use a true page file with an iOS device, and it sent the performance of the device through the roof ...granted with my iPad pro I often get that same type of performance – but Apple does not put a Enough ram on their devices for proper usage- specially on the phones ... Even 2 GB is not enough for the standard iPad line. Every single iPad should be released with 4 GB of memory, and future iPad Pro should have 8
    --- Post Merged, May 12, 2016 ---
    Also if you use iCabMobile it has memory savings mode's where it does it's own memory paging so to speak. If memory runs low and you have it in memory savings mode, and it receives a low memory warning it will swap various tabs out to a temporary file in its application Folder.. Or it's documents folder in the newer iOS system is where they split the two

    And when you need them, it just pulls them back out of the datafile

    Developers to do this as well and this would also illuminate the need for a page file on iOS... You're playing a game for example and they game got a low memory warning, your game could swap out game data that it had been used in a while, and then just swap it back in. It's not true blue page file memory operations. It's more like the game making a temporary save file to hold data Data , loading it back in when needed. Apps also have this ability, if programmed, To suspend the memory to disk and when iOS tells the app it's going to kill it, the app can tell iOS "wait a second and give me a few seconds to save my state to disk"...Ios then terminates the program, and when you go to started up, the program checks for a suspension file, and if it exists it resumes application where you left off

    Granted this is not as optimal as an actual page file where the app doesn't get terminated and just sits idle with most of the data in the page file. This way an app could run in the background and use location data and minor networking data while keeping 90% of its code on the page file because it doesn't need it .... It's the same exact way in windows and OS X ...no matter how much memory you have - even if you have one terabyte physical memory....idlememory automatically get swapped to disk...this usually doesn't even impact performance at all


    You could run a windows, UNIX, Linux, OS X server with as much memory as you want, but if you kill the page file system you will end up having problems – correction with you next like operating systems as long as there's enough physical memory they can handle no page ...OS X foundation is based on UNIX like operating systems – it just happens to have the best you why have any type of UNIX like operating system around ..people who made Linux actually came together and made a decent G why that didn't wire the user to have to go to a command prompt to change various things and make it difficult to change various things Linux would've caught on a long time ago. That's the only reason why Apple got away with making OS X a UNIX-based or UNIX flavored operating system is they put on a virtual flawless use her in the face so people did not even realize it was you UNIX underneath that because it was all easy to use and can figure

    Windows no longer has that luxury there is no textbased interface with a gui on top, Windows requires a GUI – unless it's a very special version of a server and even then the GUI elements are there because when you access it remotely, you get a GUI Windows requires a GUI – unless it's a very special version of a server and even then the GUI elements are there because when you access it remotely, you get a GUI
     
  6. jamesrick80 macrumors 68000

    jamesrick80

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2014
    #6
    Use UC HD browser and you won't see this issue with loading large Web pages. I still prefer safari though and rarely see this issue on the larger ipad pro, when I do notice it I simply exit the tab and open up a new tab voila problem fixed....
     
  7. Krevnik macrumors 68040

    Krevnik

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2003
    #7
    False. Page ins and page outs can happen without a page file. I can page in data from memory mapped files, which includes the code for the application. I can page out things that don't even need to be written to disk, such as code, or unmodified memory pages (which I know I can just page back in or "recreate" later). In the case of a modified page in a memory mapped file, I can write it back out to the file it came from as I page it out.

    These all happen on iOS.

    Oh, and page file size has zero impact on how frequently you page. It's entirely a function of RAM size, and what you are doing. Page ins in particular are a terrible metric because they include loading code and other static data from disk that you need in order to run the application. They would happen no matter how much RAM you have. Page outs are more interesting, but sometimes can be innocuous too if they happen to be related to certain activity by the app (memory mapped files). It's more troubling if there is a high rate of page swaps, as doing it more frequently while interacting with an app can lead to slowdown (although iOS is a bit better here since it doesn't page active data to disk, which is slower). On iOS, if you are getting a high frequency of page outs due to memory pressure, that will be a cost paid at some point. Either when you switch an app and have to reload data, or hit a bit of code in the app that needs to be read back from disk. But this is still all part of the design. With the same physical RAM, you'd be paying this cost with a swap file too.

    Citation needed. There are certainly certain applications where this can be true, but if Apple is looking at the data, this number is quite a bit smaller than you seem to imply. Browsers are easily one of the more RAM hungry apps on these devices. And yes, a page file would cut down on tab reloading, but reloading data that you can just refetch is sometimes a valid design decision. It isn't when there is data that is entered on forms though that is lost in the refetch.

    The post is interesting, but it shows that you know enough to be dangerous, but not enough to fully understand the realities of what virtual memory management really encompasses, which taints your conclusions.
     
  8. xmichaelp macrumors 68000

    xmichaelp

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2012
    #8
    "Apples "famous memory management system" on the iOS device really does not give the device any extra speed and performance over the android devices on the market. In fact it's a great hindrance and a real pain in the ass to programmers."

    I remember a youtube video showing a 1GB iPhone being better at reloading apps than a 3GB galaxy. Stop lying.
     
  9. JasonHB macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2010
    Location:
    Warwickshire, UK
    #9
    That page loads instantly on my 12.9 iPP, it is a stunning device

    Jason
     
  10. alecgold macrumors 6502a

    alecgold

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2007
    Location:
    NLD
    #10
    +1 for me, I love this thing :)
     

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