M1 16 inch MacBook Pro failure after 18 months

[mecloud]

The other day I experienced a strange problem with my 16 inch M1 MacBook Pro. It was the high-end CPU configuration, and had 64gb RAM and 4TB internal SSD. I had purchased it one day short of 18 months ago and, until several days ago, had never experienced any issues with it. It was running Mac OS 12.6, with the most recent OS update to 12.6 having been done several days previous. I had used the MBP quite a lot after doing that last OS update, so I tend to think that doesn’t factor into what happened. ***(EDIT 11/14/23 it was actually 12.7 that I had recently installed at the time of this post)***

The other day, I worked with that MacBook Pro without any issues for several hours. About 30 minutes later, I powered it back up and…got just an Apple logo for a few seconds followed by a black screen. It was not bootable into “recovery” mode. I *did* successfully connect to it in DFU mode running Apple’s ”Configurator” from another Mac, but my numerous attempts to “revive” it were unsuccessful. I brought it to the Apple Store the following day, and they *were* able to do a restore (meaning that all data on the drive was lost of course). Not a huge deal, since I’m pretty good about keeping backups. But, having no idea why the computer had basically killed everything on its internal drive to the point of “recovery mode” not even being accessible, and considering that it still had considerable trade-in value in “working order” but none at all if “dead”, I made the decision to trade it then and there and get an M2 MBP.

I’ve read some reports of the M1 16 inch MBP’s experiencing catastrophic failures that basically destroy the internal SSD, and have watched the rather dramatic Louis Rossmann YouTube video on that subject. But this was apparently something different, as the Apple Store Genius Bar was able to “Restore” it.

Has anyone else experienced, or heard of, any other such failures?

 

[TinyMito]

Bring it to Apple genius bar. If you have Apple Care+ that would be great - I hope you do for that money spent on that config. I even have it on my 14" M1 Pro.

 

[mecloud]

Bring it to Apple genius bar. If you have Apple Care+ that would be great - I hope you do for that money spent on that config. I even have it on my 14" M1 Pro.

I in fact brought it to the Apple Genius Bar, and the details of what happened there are in my original post.

 

[ps866mker]

IMO, the only thing that matters is having a backup. I'm a sysadmin by trade and have many machines fielded and at the end of the day, failure cause doesn't really matter as long as you have a backup and of course the money to replace it or insurance. Both of which you do. These are very complicated machines that have integrated parts - can't pull out one part and replace with a working one. Once its dead, its dead. Its the norm, and gotta prepare for it.

 

[mecloud]

Just to be clear, my purpose in posting this report here was to see if others had experienced anything similar. The points about backups and warranties are quite secondary to that purpose.

The fact of an 18-month-old MacBook Pro suddenly “dropping dead” with no prior warning signs of any kind seems rather odd…especially since it was “recoverable” (although losing all data on it). I’ve been using Macs since 1991, and this particular experience was unique.

 

[GMShadow]

It is odd. I haven't seen a rash of reports on it - and given that every little software fart gets headline coverage these days, I'm inclined to say it's rare. Rossman being dramatic is par for the course - he's a sensationalist repairman posing as an expert engineer.

Do you run something like iStat Menus that can show you the SSD's current health?

 

[buran-energia]

I’ve read some reports of the M1 16 inch MBP’s experiencing catastrophic failures that basically destroy the internal SSD, and have watched the rather dramatic Louis Rossmann YouTube video on that subject. But this was apparently something different, as the Apple Store Genius Bar was able to “Restore” it.

Rossman had 16-inch 2019 model, not M1. He said the model number at the start of the video.

 

[Fishrrman]

If it's back to normal now -- as if "nothing had happened" -- I'd just keep using it, but keep a good backup.

There seem to be "dark areas" (for lack of a better term) in the Apple hardware/software design of the new m-series Macs that are vulnerable to failures (like yours) for unspecified or otherwise esoteric reasons.

In other words, you may never discover just WHY the MBP "went dark" on you.
All that can be done is be thankful that Apple has its (again, mysterious) "revival tools" that are incorporated into Apple Configurator 2 ...

 

[mecloud]

If it's back to normal now -- as if "nothing had happened" -- I'd just keep using it, but keep a good backup.

There seem to be "dark areas" (for lack of a better term) in the Apple hardware/software design of the new m-series Macs that are vulnerable to failures (like yours) for unspecified or otherwise esoteric reasons.

Given, as you say, that there are ”dark areas in the design” and that causality may never be discovered, my response to this bizarre event was that I’d never trust that computer again. In non-working order, it would have had a trade-in value of zero. ”Restored” by the Genius Bar, it ended up having a trade-in value of $1545. Not knowing if the event I experienced was some fluke singularity or a portent of more trouble to come, BUT knowing that the value would be zero if there was a future unrecoverable failure, I think taking the $1545 trade value toward a new M2 MBP was the most rational thing to do.

What I didn’t mention in the original message (since it was already getting to be a lengthy post, and the point didn’t seem terribly relevant), is that my main use for the MBP is DJ-ing with music videos. Naturally the idea of a computer committing suicide in front of a live audience is not a very appealing one, so I’m probably more sensitive than the average user to the real-time consequences of hardware failure. At least this one had the decency to wait until I got home.

I guess one lesson learned is that I won’t be spending the huge “Apple Profit Premiums” for more internal storage again…a USB-C/Thunderbolt connected external SSD is more than fast enough for my needs.

 

[ps866mker]

Murphy’s law. If it’s that critical to you or your livelihood, get a backup machine.

 

[mecloud]

While I do appreciate the advice about backups (and I do, in fact, always have an equivalent backup MBP on hand just in case of a failure, and numerous other backups), that’s really not the point of my posting.

The point was:

1) to see if any other M1 16-inch MacBook Pro users (or, really any other recent-generation MacBook Pro users) had experienced any similar failures, and if so…

2) attempt to determine any reasons for said failures.

Most of the time I’ve been using Macs, since 1991 on a IIci, I’ve seen overall improvements in reliability. There’s been the occasional back step, like the flaming dumpster fire that was Mac OS 7.5.X, a strange ATA bus design defect on the early 1999 blue-and-white G3 towers, and most recently the horrible thermal performance and “butterfly keyboards” that plagued the 2016-2019 Intel MacBook Pros. But overall, things are much better now, and the M1/M2 MacBook Pros seem in general to be huge improvements from their Intel predecessors in every way. So this “dropping dead after 18 months” was a bit of a shock, and I’m hoping to eventually get some insight as to why it happened.

 

[ColdCase]

I had a 2020 vintage air that wouldn't boot about 6 weeks after Applecare expired. No Apple good will for me. The mother board was replaced and all was well except for an intermittent crash/restart. It came back from repair with Ventura installed and they tell me there is no going back. So I spent a few hours of my life, that I'm not getting back, migrating from the Monterey based backup (failed twice). I elected to trade it in for an M2 MBP 13 instead of sending it back for another motherboard.

Anyway, during informal discussion with a couple techs and sales I gather the M1 laptops, regardless of model, have a tendency to corrupt themselves or worse when battery power is low, especially when they shut off due to low battery. Sometimes recoverable, sometimes not. The M2 MBP versions have been solid, however.

 

[mecloud]

I had a 2020 vintage air that wouldn't boot about 6 weeks after Applecare expired. No Apple good will for me. The mother board was replaced and all was well except for an intermittent crash/restart. It came back from repair with Ventura installed and they tell me there is no going back. So I spent a few hours of my life I'm not getting back upgrading the Monterey based backup (failed twice). I elected to trade it in for an M2 MBP 13 instead of sending it back for another motherboard.

Anyway, during informal discussion with a couple techs and sales I gather the M1 laptops, regardless of model, have a tendency to corrupt themselves or worse when battery power is low, especially when they shut off due to low battery. Sometimes recoverable, sometimes not. The M2 MBP versions have been solid, however.

This is a *very* interesting data point/“informal discussion”. In my case, the battery was not low at all. In my use, the MBP is almost always plugged in.

 

[OrenLindsey]

the SSD health could be part of it. The SSDs built into MacBook Pros are only designed to last ~150TB written over all time. There is a way to see how much you have written overall, but I don't remember how to.

 

[_timo_redux_]

I also have a higher end, 16" Mac Book Pro, 4 TB / 64 GB, original shipped-with OS (Big Sur? Not sur-e.) About a week ago I left it overnight to update some security patches; when I came back to it after work it wouldn't boot. After several attempts to get it started I got the exclamation point / url for restarting to revive or restore. A revive did not work, but I did get a restore, unfortunately updating the OS to Sonoma before I was ready for it. For those who don't know, a revive is supposed to keep your data, while a restore wipes the drive. As I have nightly backups I was OK, although it took a long time of course to get back to a log in.

My usual MO is when I replace a laptop the old one goes to my work office. We'll have to see about this one; about a year left on the Apple Care.

 

[mecloud]

the SSD health could be part of it. The SSDs built into MacBook Pros are only designed to last ~150TB written over all time. There is a way to see how much you have written overall, but I don't remember how to.

I have sometimes used SMART Utility (Volitans Software has been making that since around the mid 2000’s) and it does give all that info along with a generalized bill of health (“passed”/“failing”/“failed”). Unfortunately, I didn’t have that installed on the trouble MBP…it’s normally something I use as a diagnostic if I start seeing strange behavior of any kind….which, up until the computer would not boot the other day, I had never seen.

 

[mecloud]

I also have a higher end, 16" Mac Book Pro, 4 TB / 64 GB, original shipped-with OS (Big Sur? Not sur-e.) About a week ago I left it overnight to update some security patches; when I came back to it after work it wouldn't boot. After several attempts to get it started I got the exclamation point / url for restarting to revive or restore. A revive did not work, but I did get a restore, unfortunately updating the OS to Sonoma before I was ready for it. For those who don't know, a revive is supposed to keep your data, while a restore wipes the drive. As I have nightly backups I was OK, although it took a long time of course to get back to a log in.

My usual MO is when I replace a laptop the old one goes to my work office. We'll have to see about this one; about a year left on the Apple Care.

Is your MBP also an M1?

It’s interesting to read that you were apparently able to get it booted into what I think was “internet recovery”…in several hours of troubleshooting attempts, mine never was able to do that. It only was able to boot into DFU mode which allows another Mac to do a “revive” or ”restore” via USB connection and Apple Configurator. When the Genius Bar people at the Apple Store successfully did the latter, my MBP was also on Sonoma (known issues with some of the software I use). Fortunately the new M2 MBP I purchased that day (Monday 10/17) came loaded with Ventura, which works fine with the software I use.

 

[_timo_redux_]

Is your MBP also an M1?

It’s interesting to read that you were apparently able to get it booted into what I think was “internet recovery”…in several hours of troubleshooting attempts, mine never was able to do that. It only was able to boot into DFU mode which allows another Mac to do a “revive” or ”restore” via USB connection and Apple Configurator. When the Genius Bar people at the Apple Store successfully did the latter, my MBP was also on Sonoma (known issues with some of the software I use). Fortunately the new M2 MBP I purchased that day (Monday 10/17) came loaded with Ventura, which works fine with the software I use.

Yes, an M1.

And yes, I meant the DFU mode.

Many, many failures trying to hold down the right key combinations and release at the right time. It killed a Friday night; would have been a real drag if it had been a work day.

 

[mecloud]

It appears that this M1 MBP failure (which was the first of FOUR 16 inch MBP brickings I experienced in less than two weeks) was actually *this* issue:

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/m1-max-black-screen-at-boot-after-updating-ventura-13-6.2405267/

 

[maerz001]

It appears that this M1 MBP failure (which was the first of FOUR 16 inch MBP bricking I experienced in less than two weeks) was actually *this* issue:

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/m1-max-black-screen-at-boot-after-updating-ventura-13-6.2405267/

So its just a software bug?

Can u at least give your M2 back in the 14 day window for the M3 which will probably come out next Tuesday?

 

[mecloud]

So its just a software bug?

Can u at least give your M2 back in the 14 day window for the M3 which will probably come out next Tuesday?

If the new M3’s come out in the next few days, yes that would be well within the 14 day return window and I therefore may end up doing that.

Of course, who knows what time-sucking horrors may be baked into the new M3’s…I hate to make assumptions from “stuff I read on the internet” and feed into aimless hysteria, but my own experiences are telling me there are very serious QA issues at Apple. In addition to this crazy recent “OS update bricking MacBook Pros”, a couple friends have experienced very strange problems from their iPhone 15 Pro Max’s (my own 15 Pro Max has been trouble free though).

 

[makeitrainnaren]

download a brew utility called smartctl aka smartmon tools. you can run a command to get SMART status since Apple now longer shows internal SSD sector count.

smartmontools

Homebrew’s package index

formulae.brew.sh

 

[mecloud]

download a brew utility called smartctl aka smartmon tools. you can run a command to get SMART status since Apple now longer shows internal SSD sector count.

smartmontools

Homebrew’s package index

formulae.brew.sh

Good to know of another SMART status app, but that doesn’t appear to be factoring into the issues that I and some others are seeing with Monterey/Ventura Mac OS updates bricking 14 and 16 inch MacBook Pros.

 

[chabig]

The point was:

1) to see if any other M1 16-inch MacBook Pro users (or, really any other recent-generation MacBook Pro users) had experienced any similar failures, and if so…

2) attempt to determine any reasons for said failures.

1) Yes of course other people have failures.

2) It is called infant mortality. It’s impossible to build perfection.

 

[mecloud]

1) Yes of course other people have failures.

2) It is called infant mortality. It’s impossible to build perfection.

I had THREE “infant mortalities” of M2 16 inch MBP’s in eight days. That in addition to the original M1 failure this thread was started about. The problem almost certainly seems to be an unfortunate interaction between a bad Mac OS bug and one particular display setting, as noted in detail in the other MacRumors discussion that I linked previously.