M3 with upgraded RAM vs M3 Pro

[Bosig]

Hi!

I have just purchased the 14" M3 base MacBook Pro but upgraded the RAM to 24GB along with 512GB of storage. Still waiting on the delivery.
However, I’m starting to wonder if the base 14" M3 Pro might be worth it? It would be a downgrade in RAM, 24 -> 18, but a bump in CPU/GPU performance and a more silent/better fan solution.

The reason to upgrade the RAM to 24 GB is more due to future proofing rather than needing it right now.
I plan to use the computer as my hobby developing machine (I am a software developer) and general purpose laptop.

What do you think?

 

[MayaUser]

M3 Pro all the way

 

[Basic75]

I wouldn't get the M3 Pro if it means getting less RAM.

 

[ZebedeeG]

They're both going to be great machines... But if it were my choice I think I'd probably go for the M3 Pro as it's likely the better all rounder.

M3 upgraded to 24GB: More memory + better battery life

M3 Pro (stock 18GB): More CPU cores, more GPU cores, higher memory bandwidth, faster SSD (sure I saw this in posted benchmarks)

In most situations I'd think that the higher memory bandwidth and a faster SSD for when it does need to use swap would more than make up for having less memory installed...

 

[Bosig]

Thanks for the answers! I think ZebedeeG summed the pros with each model pretty well.

What I'm concerned about is the longevity of the computer. I have no doubts that both specs would suffice right now.

Like whether the chipset or the amount of RAM be the first 'noticeable' bottleneck as is ages.

 

[Basic75]

Like whether the chipset or the amount of RAM be the first 'noticeable' bottleneck as is ages.

I would always choose more RAM than a slightly faster processor.

 

[Basic75]

In most situations I'd think that the higher memory bandwidth and a faster SSD for when it does need to use swap would more than make up for having less memory installed...

If you end up in a situation where your working set doesn't fit in RAM it doesn't matter too much how fast your CPU is since it will spend too much of its time waiting for the SSD.

 

[ArkSingularity]

They're both going to be great machines... But if it were my choice I think I'd probably go for the M3 Pro as it's likely the better all rounder.

M3 upgraded to 24GB: More memory + better battery life

M3 Pro (stock 18GB): More CPU cores, more GPU cores, higher memory bandwidth, faster SSD (sure I saw this in posted benchmarks)

In most situations I'd think that the higher memory bandwidth and a faster SSD for when it does need to use swap would more than make up for having less memory installed...

Well, even the fastest SSDs are orders of magnitude slower than RAM due to latency. On a page fault, the computer has to do a context switch to completely move the running process out of the CPU core that generated the fault, get the OS kernel into the CPU, find and grab the whole memory page from the SSD (in 16KB chunks), wait several hundred thousand CPU cycles worth of time for the SSD (access latency), and then move the original process back into the CPU to resume execution. This happens on every single page fault that has to go to swap.

The reason the performance impact isn't usually very severe is because the OS makes every effort to swap the least frequently used data first. If the data isn't being used very often, you won't really feel the difference, but as soon as you start swapping more actively used data, the computer is going to grind to a near-halt (red memory pressure indicates that this kind of thrashing is occurring).

 

[ZebedeeG]

...as for longevity...

I'd expect that Apple will stop supporting all M3 equipped machines with macOS updates at the same time (though Apple has a habit of surprising!) making them obsolete whichever M3 you choose*.

Before that day comes both configurations are likely to run equally well.

* Though of course even without Apple support, if they are still in working order they'll likely go on for years. Hard to say which will fair better in a decade or so!

 

[Basic75]

Hard to say which will fair better in a decade or so!

You mean which will fare better? And I believe we can, how often have you thrown out a computer because it had a bit lower multi-threaded performance? And how often because it didn't have enough RAM? In my surroundings only the latter has ever happened.

 

[boak]

Does your work benefit from better multi-core performance or additional GPU cores?

 

[ZebedeeG]

You mean which will fare better?

Can I blame my autocorrect? I think that it must have run out of RAM..!

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

 

[magbarn]

I would always choose more RAM than a slightly faster processor.

Depends what the OP is doing. If he's more of an Air type user, then 18gb is more than enough. But I guess that makes all the more reason to just been more reasonable with the upgrades and just get the 16gb upgrade only. Once you start speccing the base model up, it becomes superfluous. It's the same situation with loading up a M2 Mac mini, once you load it up, the base Studio becomes the better value.

 

[ArkSingularity]

Depends what the OP is doing. If he's more of an Air type user, then 18gb is more than enough. But I guess that makes all the more reason to just been more reasonable with the upgrades and just get the 16gb upgrade only. Once you start speccing the base model up, it becomes superfluous. It's the same situation with loading up a M2 Mac mini, once you load it up, the base Studio becomes the better value.

Apple's price ladder has a way of making you always feel like you're missing out unless you get the "next best thing". It's a weird feeling to spend $1500+ on a computer and to still have that lingering feeling of having made some compromises that feel below the price bracket these devices are priced at.

The $1599 base model MacBook can still only handle one external screen natively, for example. Most people don't use dual screens, but for those who do, it's gonna be somewhat of a disappointment to discover that third party solutions are needed to be able to do it. You really have to spend about $2000 before you start to get out of that portion of the price ladder.

 

[Bosig]

I'm using one external 1440x3440 screen, and from what I saw on a comment on reddit, the M3 should be able to support it @ 144hz with the right cable.

I guess that all developing work benefits from more multi-core performance. At work I have a M1 Max with 32GB of RAM, which never slows down. So I'm not sure where the bottleneck would be.

I will probably be doing some development with Rust, Java, iOS etc. Possibly running a handful of docker containers. But the important thing is not whether it takes 1:23 or 1:03 seconds to compile a large project, but that the computer is not grinding to a halt. And I feel like I might have answered my own question here. Perhaps M3 + 24GB RAM is the way to go

 

[Mcdevidr]

The pro is a better machine for the money. The extra 6gb ram though, i know everyone is making it seem you will get 100+ years of use out of the computer with a little extra ram but the reality is by the time the 18gb is not good enough you will have gotten another machine anyways. Thats my 2 cents anyways.

 

[streetfunk]

M3 MBbase has only one fan !
M3 MBpro has two ! its quiter. the noise is different

you might find here some infos

 

[Sami13496]

Which is more important for the kind software development you are doing? More RAM or better CPU?

Does GPU play any role in software development?

These weren’t retorical questions. I’m asking I do some web development and been wondering which is more important RAM or CPU.

 

[Bosig]

I'm not sure which one is more important. I guess both would be almost equally important.

And no, GPU does not play a part in this for me. I will most certainly not play any games or do any graphics intensive work on this computer.

 

[foo2]

Which is more important for the kind software development you are doing? More RAM or better CPU?

Does GPU play any role in software development?

These weren’t retorical questions. I’m asking I do some web development and been wondering which is more important RAM or CPU.

The XCode benchmark makes it blindingly clear that the tiny difference in max SSD speed [SSD-gate] doesn't matter at all, and that cores are a massive help in making a machine faster, as well as the year over year architectural improvements. And as long as the job fits in your working set, RAM doesn't make any difference.

GitHub - devMEremenko/XcodeBenchmark: XcodeBenchmark measures the compilation time of a large codebase on iMac, MacBook, and Mac Pro

XcodeBenchmark measures the compilation time of a large codebase on iMac, MacBook, and Mac Pro - devMEremenko/XcodeBenchmark

github.com

M3 scores are already posted in the comments section.

 

[mecloud]

For my use, the Pro all the way in this comparison. (Though what I actually ended up purchasing is the 16-inch high-end Max in its base 48gb/1tb configuration).

One reason not yet mentioned in this thread: There are many times I need all three Thunderbolt/USB-C ports. The non-Pro M3 14-inch MBP eliminates that single port on the right side.

Oh, and you can get the Pro in Space Black. I really like the new color compared to the Space Gray or Silver.

 

[Malus120]

While I'd generally advise getting more ram than you think you need, in this case, I really think the M3 Pro is going to be a far better choice in the long term.

M3 Pro: 1 More P Core, 2 More E Cores, ~40% faster GPU, 50% more memory bandwidth, another thunderbolt port, better/quieter cooling, support for 2 external displays (or 1x8K60) (vs only 1 external display on the M3)

The M3, even fully configured is only 24GB of ram vs 18GB on the base M3 Pro. If this was 16GB vs 32GB that'd be one thing but we're only talking about an extra 6GB of ram here (certainly not nothing as it's 33% more, but not exactly revelatory/game changing either) which is unlikely to be the difference between the machine being able to do something vs not being able to do it.

Honestly, the "ideal choice" here is to help line Tim Cook's pocket (ugh) and go for 36GB of ram on the M3 Pro. THAT would be a much more capable, future proof config. But that's also an extra $400 (or 20%) so I can understand if that's not something you want to do.

*Addendum: Have you considered an M1 Max (or an M2 Series machine?) Adorama or BH had the M1 Max with 64GB of ram and a 2TB SSD on sale for like $2199 a week or so ago and it's gone on sale at/near this price regularly. IMHO that is a way better value than either the M3 or M3 Pro machines unless you absolutely need something the M3 series offers.

 

[picpicmac]

Like whether the chipset or the amount of RAM be the first 'noticeable' bottleneck as is ages.

Right now I am charging the battery in my PowerBook G4 17" (yes, really), from 2003.

It has 1GB RAM. I just checked prices on OWC for the upgrade to 2GB (the max for this machine.)

That machine I bought new back in 2003 because I was going to live overseas for 3 years and need a good computer that could serve me well.

It did. And when I came back to the US I continued to use it until late 2008.

Point being:
1) even the best laptop (and in its day, the 17" PowerBook G4 was the luxury laptop) is going to seem just so-so after about 5 years.
2) the only reason I don't use the machine to this day is the limited RAM. I could boot from an SSD and the machine could run fast enough for many mundane tasks, the PowerPC chip is still capable of doing every day computer tasks. But having only 1GB of RAM hamstrings it for any imaging work. Even back in 2003 the memory limitation was felt, but I still used Photoshop (while overseas with digital cameras).

I'm a defender of Apple putting 8GB on base models as the typical computer user doesn't really need more.

But if you do imaging work with Photoshop or the software from Nikon/Canon/whoever, you know that RAM is more important than just a few more CPU cores on a chip.

For software development, I suspect the issue will be if you use any virtual machines, need to run Windows, etc.

So IMHO (and I am in the market and trying to make the same decision as you but with a Mini), spec out your Mac with:
A) the right amount of RAM for your use case;
B) the right interfaces.

 

[foo2]

I played with a new to me dual G5 for a little while in 2020 or 2021. I had serious trouble even getting it on the internet and getting a basic browser going - due to lack of modern browser security available for a PPC-compiled browser; the PPC-compiled Firefox, and even a browser like iCab, have all long since stopped. I can’t imagine trying to get a G4 laptop going. I admire your patience.

 

[wonderings]

What are you using the computer for? The longevity of Apple computers is big in my opinion. I was using a 2014 5K iMac for almost 10 years, and will still be happy using it today and I am in graphic intensive work. My M1 Max blows it away now, but the 5K is still more than usable outside of not being supported by Apple anymore for OS updates. Your computer will be usable till and after Apple stops supporting it. Always great to get the best specs you can get now, but if you are not doing stuff that requires heavy amounts of RAM then 18 gigs is a very different story then 8 gigs.