M4+ Chip Generation - Speculation Megathread [MERGED]

[thenewperson]

I mean M1 to M2 saw a 10 to 12 core increase and m3 got to 16 cores

m4 stayed the same but buffed the pro versions

i could see a higher core count for the max this time with the extra time and the chiplet thingy that tsmc has

also x2 elite has 18 cores so probably to compete with them

(even though the x2 elite is still cooked)

It’s possible, though I’m not holding my breath.

I don’t think Apple has anything to worry about with XE2.

 

[aaronage]

I doubt we’ll get much increase. I actually could see them pull an M3 Pro and change the M5 Pro to 8P+6E to keep it at 14 cores, with the Max going to 12P+6E for 18 cores. I just don’t see more P cores, but I could be wrong.

I'd love to see a return to the more balanced M3 Pro style configuration.

I have an M3 Pro 6P+6e 14" MacBook Pro for work. My typical workload is mixed and keeps the system busy at all times (none of the cores get to park for long!). I love that the peak CPU power draw of this chip is only around 45-50W - switching between moderate load to full load (e.g. a build/compile) frequently doesn't pull enough power to heat it up. It very rarely exceeds lukewarm and the fans are, worst case, a faint whir.

M4 Pro 10P+4e pushed power consumption waaaay higher (~75W for CPU load). It's too high, it can't match the M3 Pro experience. Apple sacrificed quality-of-life for outright performance with that chip 😒

IMO, they should let the Max be the performance at all costs option and rein in the Pro.

 

[deconstruct60]

? I didn't say anything about the iPad Air. I don't expect the iPad Air to get even Thunderbolt 3 anytime soon. Incorporating Thunderbolt x into the base SoC doesn't mean all devices like iDevices will that SoC get Thunderbolt x. The Macs like the Mac mini would get that Thunderbolt x upgrade though.

The plain Mn to get the lifecycle and volume Apple needs has to fit the requirements of the chain of products it gets passed through. Some substantive limitations are placed on the plain Mn come from the iPad Pro and iPad Air.
The SoC is a succesor to the A1-X line of SoCs. It is just covenient to use it the low end Macs and Vision Pro also.

That's true, but I'd be surprised if Apple decoupled DP 2.1 support from Thunderbolt 5.

It would be a change from the past practices ( ignoring mulit stream DP features , trailing behing in implementations) , but it is also a change if their Thunderbolt 'running buddies' is also gone (Intel). If Thunderbolt is 'dead in the water', then continuing the tactic of propping up Thunderbolt by hiding he DisplayPort improvements inside of it would turn into a problem.

DP 2.1 using some lower level TB transport mechanisms. It is just substantially simpiler. It just takes TBv3 40Gb/s bidirectional bandwidth and just points it all outbound ( 4 lanes out instead of splitting them 2&3 in/out ). They can bypass ( if power isolated shutdown) the TB switch and just do pure pass through. TBv5 is higher clocks (more power) and more complexity). Fine if hooking to a display docking station, but if all want to do is talk to plain monitor display.

I expect all future Thunderbolt 4 Macs to support up to DisplayPort 1.4 only.

Intel mobile SoCs already do most of DP 2.1. AMD .. same thing more of DPv2.1 covered. The only laggard holding onto DP v1.4 is Qualcomm. However, they are also completely avoiding Thunderbolt also for the moment. (Understanble and trying to get a Windows market share base to build off of as first priority). Mediatek/Nvidia are covering HDMI 2.1 instead of their N1/GB10 offering, but they are no where near as customer level price point as the plain Mn ( more like a Mn Max ).

 

[EugW]

The plain Mn to get the lifecycle and volume Apple needs has to fit the requirements of the chain of products it gets passed through. Some substantive limitations are placed on the plain Mn come from the iPad Pro and iPad Air.
The SoC is a succesor to the A1-X line of SoCs. It is just covenient to use it the low end Macs and Vision Pro also.

Your argument here does not make sense. The existence of the iPad Air has no direct relevance as to what Thunderbolt versions get included the base Mx chips.

The iPad Air does not support Thunderbolt at all, and it doesn't even support USB 4. The iPad Air maxes out at 10 Gbps USB 3, despite having an M3 in it.