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Its a bit harsh to say people buy power for status rather than Utility. In the case of the BMW M series, people like the power for sure but its actually the vehicle handling thats special not the power. With mobile devices, most people prefer more power for that extra buffer and future proofing for later.
With the smart shockers/suspensions now used, M drivers hardly use the two higher handling modes. For me, i loved the E-46 M coupe. No adjustable shocks though. That motor was fabulous IMO, everything about it except the service schedules. When BMW went to solid tyres, for a short time the M series rode better - because they continued to use pneumatic tyres. But they still didn't handle roads that were not smooth. Or speed bumps.

As for future proofing - its certainly an issue, but for notebooks, its really about RAM with a macbook and the CPU generation and also, when the computer was sold. And Apple doesn't supersede based on processors. They supersede based on introduction dates. A case in point is the Mac Pro 7,1, and some notebooks, with intel CPUS, that were removed from support not due to CPUs but due to the sales date of that architecture.

I think its better to pay less and get a year old model because the substantial savings will result in a more contemporary replacement in shorter period of time - from a financial perspective.

Some though, like sparksd, will get full value out of their purchase. Others will love the screen, as its fabulous. But for many, the extra abilities are overkill. For instance, many satisfied iPad users used their Pros for several years, despite not having camera ID or pro microphones. I still think an Air with a duel OLED would have sold many more iPads and reduced Pro sales - because to me at least, the screen on the M4 is a real reason to upgrade.

But if one wants future proof by adding RAM and drive capacity - for most that is waste of money. And the thing that kills an iPad is actually its battery, and the iPad is being superseded when Apple refuses to replace the iPad's battery (despite Apple charging the user quite a bit for that "privilege"). When that happens people should get a third party to replace the iPad's battery (or do it oneself but its a big job). But instead people will use it connected more and more to a power cord, and eventually the wear and tear on the connection causes the iPad to no longer accept a charge. That's when its actually superseded. Way way before IOS support or functionality stops due to the CPU etc being a cause. IMO its the reason iPads have not increased their battery endurance much at all, while other Apple devices like phones and computers have increased their endurance by significant amounts.
 
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My response to the reviewers - "So what?".
that’s fair but the question i got was “where is the widespread consensus” and i’m sorry all reviewers are in consensus.

I won’t post to this thread anymore because it’s gotten really testy. But I think no need for people to feel so attacked as if we won’t all benefit if apple takes ipad more seriously, as if ipad is a perfect operating system. every youtuber i’ve seen that self-professes to use ipad day to day always has the phrase “you have to learn how to use iPad to fit your use case” somewhere in the review. sorry that’s not the intuitive and easy to use OS most people want ipad to be

and it certainly is completley unreasonable pricing for apple to charge ipad users 1,600 to buy back into the ecosystem with the m4 upgrade.
 
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that’s fair but the question i got was “where is the widespread consensus” and i’m sorry all reviewers are in consensus.

I won’t post to this thread anymore because it’s gotten really testy. But I think no need for people to feel so attacked as if we won’t all benefit if apple takes ipad more seriously, as if ipad is a perfect operating system. every youtuber i’ve seen that self-professes to use ipad day to day always has the phrase “you have to learn how to use iPad to fit your use case” somewhere in the review. sorry that’s not the intuitive and easy to use OS most people want ipad to be

and it certainly is completley unreasonable pricing for apple to charge ipad users 1,600 to buy back into the ecosystem with the m4 upgrade.

Unreasonable? It's a discretionary buy - you don't have to buy it - and as with any other product, the vendor will charge what they think the market will bear with the highest rate of return, the goal being to maximize profit.
 
Yes - the facts are that the base iPad is very cheap IMO. The Air IMO is just about as good as the Pro, but its screen while very good, is far inferior for lovers of colour and gamut etc. Is the Pro good value? I would say yes for those who want a great screen and I guess for those who will use it a lot. Otherwise save your money.
 
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Crappy ass Remarkable Pro = $600
M4 iPad Pro = $999

The iPad Pro is so bad and so overpriced.
 
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Never? You bought a device that will be obsolete and out of support in a year or two. For a device that is almost 4 years old, 650 is a lot. Meanwhile I made lot of money using my M1 iPad Pro. Several times more than what I paid. If you are using iPad to watch YouTube videos I get it. It’s a toy for you.

A little over a month later, for some reason, Apple is selling the USED equivalent of my M1 iPad Pro for $1700, and that's without the Pencil or keyboard. Or rather, they would be selling it if they had one in stock.

PWG8qeV.png


For an iPad that will be obsolete three years sooner than my newest one, this price is insane to me.

Even with the lower specs, $650 for the same size/generation of iPad sounds like a steal.
 
Ipad is like a car without wheels with the ipados. Useless ar best but u can watch movies in it.
I disagree, I use my iPad way more than my MacBook Air. If I could go back, I’d purchase a iPad Pro with Magic Keyboard instead of my MacBook Air. I can get by with iPad os as a computer and actually prefer it over Mac OS. It’s definitely more versatile for me. Also, Apple Music is better on iPad and there’s no Apple fitness + app on Mac OS. I subscribe to both of those services and use them daily.
 
I bought M4 iPad Pro so I can impress others. I take it to Starbucks everyday and spend 16 hours there just showing it off. In fact I bought two M4 iPad Pros and I use them side by side pushing out 4K videos. I bet you dont see many using two M4 Pros side by side at the same time. It just wouldn't be the same if I had anything else other than the M4 Pros. It's all about pure $$$$$$tatus. :cool:
 
Can anyone explain to me why the pro models only have one thunderbolt port?
At this price I shouldn’t have to juggle tasks with my port, it’s a little disappointing.
 
Can anyone explain to me why the pro models only have one thunderbolt port?
At this price I shouldn’t have to juggle tasks with my port, it’s a little disappointing.
Mine is hooked up to a Thunderbolt 3 dock. iPads have never had more than one port in 15 years of existence, so this should be a surprise to absolutely no one. Apple’s desired aesthetics are the only explanation that anyone can give to you.
 
Can anyone explain to me why the pro models only have one thunderbolt port?
At this price I shouldn’t have to juggle tasks with my port, it’s a little disappointing.

Per above - its' not just aesthetics. Its also intended function.

Because when you're carrying a device around during regular use you don't have 15 cables hanging out of it, plugged into ports that would impinge on battery space. 90% plus of users will probably never even use the thunderbolt port it does have, outside of charging and MAYBE video out. Most stuff will be wirelessly connected on this class of device. For the 99% use case, ANY ports are dead useless space that could be better used by more battery.

If you DO need to plug things in, at a desk - docks exist. Still one convenient cable; the rest of the crap stays plugged into your dock at your desk.

That's why.

If you're attempting to plug multiple things into an iPad (even a pro) - you're an extreme edge case and this isn't built for edge cases.
 
Per above - its' not just aesthetics. Its also intended function.

Because when you're carrying a device around during regular use you don't have 15 cables hanging out of it, plugged into ports that would impinge on battery space. 90% plus of users will probably never even use the thunderbolt port it does have, outside of charging and MAYBE video out. Most stuff will be wirelessly connected on this class of device. For the 99% use case, ANY ports are dead useless space that could be better used by more battery.

If you DO need to plug things in, at a desk - docks exist. Still one convenient cable; the rest of the crap stays plugged into your dock at your desk.

That's why.

If you're attempting to plug multiple things into an iPad (even a pro) - you're an extreme edge case and this isn't built for edge cases.
All I wanted to do was plug my USB-C aux wired headphones in while I charge my iPad I didn’t know I was treading uncharted waters sorry

Actually, when you’re carrying a device around for regular use “as you say” all you have is cables when out and about

I guess if I had a little more disposable income all my problems would be solved, care to share some? Or are we just sharing opinions today?
 
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All I wanted to do was plug my USB-C wired headphones in while I charge my iPad I didn’t know I was treading uncharted waters sorry

I guess if I had a little more disposable income all my problems would be solved, care to share some? Or are we just sharing opinions today?
There’s plenty of options to choose from… don’t have to spend a lot.



 
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If you're attempting to plug multiple things into an iPad (even a pro) - you're an extreme edge case and this isn't built for edge cases.
Wanting to charge an iPad while using wired headphones is not an extreme edge case. I'm holding out hope that the headphone jack returns. If it were useless, the MacBooks would not have one.
 
Wanting to charge an iPad while using wired headphones is not an extreme edge case. I'm holding out hope that the headphone jack returns. If it were useless, the MacBooks would not have one.

I doubt very much that the jack will ever return to either the iPad or the iPhone - Apple wants you to invest in AirPods.
 
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i think the thing with ipad and keyboard is that theoretically, you can upgrade the ipad. In practice, most keyboards i think get disgusting within 2-3 years and so you have to replace both. also apple loves money.

I think ipad accessories are vastly overpriced. IT's amazing to me nobody has created a good 3rd party one.
 
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i think the thing with ipad and keyboard is that theoretically, you can upgrade the ipad. In practice, most keyboards i think get disgusting within 2-3 years and so you have to replace both. also apple loves money.

I think ipad accessories are vastly overpriced. IT's amazing to me nobody has created ag ood 3rd party one.

I've had an MKB on an M1 12.9 for over 4 years now and it's still in great shape.
 
Actually, when you’re carrying a device around for regular use “as you say” all you have is cables when out and about

Eh?

My iPad gets plugged in to charge, I've used it for a full day to do network training courses, etc.

keyboard/mouse bluetooth
headphones: bluetooth
network: wireless/cellular
printing: wireless

You may be living in the past, but the world has moved on
 
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All I wanted to do was plug my USB-C aux wired headphones in while I charge my iPad I didn’t know I was treading uncharted waters sorry

Actually, when you’re carrying a device around for regular use “as you say” all you have is cables when out and about

I guess if I had a little more disposable income all my problems would be solved, care to share some? Or are we just sharing opinions today?
There is something to be said that iPad is meant to be a wireless / cloud first device. If apple had their way, everything would be wireless / cloud but harder for people on productive computers.

It's like asking why does macbook air only have 2 ports? Surely if they wanted to they could have 3 or 4.
 
All I wanted to do was plug my USB-C aux wired headphones in while I charge my iPad I didn’t know I was treading uncharted waters sorry

Actually, when you’re carrying a device around for regular use “as you say” all you have is cables when out and about

I guess if I had a little more disposable income all my problems would be solved, care to share some? Or are we just sharing opinions today?
It is unfortunate Apple got rid of the headphone port IMO. But there are inexpensive splitters for those who need simultaneous charging and wired headphones, although dongles are still annoying to have to use. Apple is just banking that only a small minority need that.
The other option is if you're using a Magic Keyboard, you can use the keyboard USBC port to charge and the iPad USBC port for audio.
 
There is something to be said that iPad is meant to be a wireless / cloud first device. If apple had their way, everything would be wireless / cloud but harder for people on productive computers.

It's like asking why does macbook air only have 2 ports? Surely if they wanted to they could have 3 or 4.

I use my MacBook Pro m4 max for high end productivity every day and the only wire I use is to a dock for external monitors and charging. But it has plenty of ports including as readers, Ethernet, usb-a and audio output.

iPad Pro could do the same with its single thunderbolt port.

If you plan to use modern devices from pretty much any vendor: wireless is the primary connectivity. Whether it’s a vr/ar device, a tablet or laptop.

Want wires? Desktop. Or a dock/hub.

Wires on handheld or mobile devices snag on things, get in the way, are a pain to plug/unplug, etc.
 
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Eh?

My iPad gets plugged in to charge, I've used it for a full day to do network training courses, etc.

keyboard/mouse bluetooth
headphones: bluetooth
network: wireless/cellular
printing: wireless

You may be living in the past, but the world has moved on
Yes sadly there is no Apple Store in the country that i live in and none planned for the future
 
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you know re-reading my message, i really meant for it to insult myself. i am the buyer of ipad pro with hopes and dreams of it replacing my mac. but as someone who works for a cloud based company who doesn't actually need too much, even the fact that google docs is trash on ipad pro makes things so hard. like ipad pros are really a bespoke machine, it may be worth it if it fits your particular use case.

but if apple tomorrow brought 120hz down to ipad air, like how many of us would still buy the ipad pro? I know I wouldn't. I am blessed enough to spend that much of a premium for a nice screen but I am honest with myself that I'm paying the apple tax.
This is the key right here. I bought the iPad Pro + Magic Keyboard, and it totaled close to $2500 for the configuration (13" 1 TB with the nano texture and cellular). I did love it, but I couldnt stomach paying that much for an iPad. I still needed my MacBook air for my workflow, so to pay that much for a device that couldnt replace it... just didnt make sense... so I had to return it :(
To the OP, and @FrozenDarkness / @sonicrobby, I agree with you all, and with many others in the thread, that the iPP is priced “robustly”, especially when comparing it to the costs of the basic 11th gen iPad, and iPad Air. The situation is what it is. So given that, I’ve adjusted my value curve appropriately. I still want to optimize for value, where I can.

I agree the M4 iPad Pro is a bit of a luxury / splurge. I got my M4 iPP when it released (had the 2018 A12X 11” iPad Pro for last 4 years, now given to my kid), and I still have a 2021 M1 Pro 14” MBP (day 1 buyer). I got the new Magic Keyboard and Apple Pencil Pro for it also also. All on discounts / sales.

When it comes to the iPad Pro, any storage upgrades, you really pay through the nose for. Same as in RAM / Storage upgrades pricing on all the Macbooks. It’s been egregious for awhile and it continues to be. But when it hurts the most are items like the iPP. If you get the base model 11” (16gb / 256gb storage), it’s $999. And this has been frequently on sale this year (not through Apple Stores, but on Amazon, other legitimate resellers) for $899 (I think it was $869 just last week during Amazon Prime Day).

At that price, it’s not that bad value. But as OP did, if you upgrade even to just 1TB, it’s $1599 and 2TB option is $1999! More than twice the price. And that’s still just for the 11”. And these are (usually) people who are trying to use the iPP more like a laptop. And if that’s you, I empathize with the desire to get more “macOS-like” features on iPadOS.

But clearly, the value proposition quickly deteriorates. It’s like the current Mac Mini. The base model M4 (16gb/256gb) is $599! What an amazing value! 16/512 is $799, and 16/1TB is $999. Almost double the price just to go from 256gb to 1TB. Almost all reviewers said / recommended Base Model as best purchase.

Point being - if you can think of the iPad Pro as an iPad first (and with a mini compromise of Magic Keyboard to get some “laptop” like use), and not like a Macbook, there is better value at the lower storage models. For how I use it, I’m not even close to filling the base 256gb. While I could almost certainly get away with an iPad Air based on my usage, I just like the screen, better form factor, it being a more premium product. And while it isn’t cheap, if you go with the base model, there’s decent enough value that I feel ok with the mini splurge!

(Especially after keeping my 2018 11” A12X iPP for so many years!)


Good luck. Apple refuse to replace iPad batteries unless you have AppleCare. There is a whole thread on it. They will claim the battery capacity is >80% even if it is literally a handful of hours.
 
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