Mac Pro Gaming

[goMac]

There isn't really that big a market for gaming on a Mac. Games are costly to develop and optimize on one plateform, more so for two. It becomes a game of diminishing return.

The AAA companies target the PC, Xbox and PS3, and with this they get like 95% of all customers. Which incentive is left to spend $$$ and ressources for the 3% of Mac gamers and the 2% of linux?

Things are actually getting better. The PS3 and PS4 both use OpenGL. If you're porting to PS3 or PS4, you've actually gotten quite a ways towards a Mac port. That's why most games support both OpenGL and DirectX these days.

(Nintendo consoles use OpenGL as well, but their impact is less these days.)

 

[tuxon86]

Things are actually getting better. The PS3 and PS4 both use OpenGL. If you're porting to PS3 or PS4, you've actually gotten quite a ways towards a Mac port. That's why most games support both OpenGL and DirectX these days.

(Nintendo consoles use OpenGL as well, but their impact is less these days.)

Not really going to happen. They won't spend the money to port to the mac small gamers community when they know you'll buy the ready available pc version and play via bootcamp if they don't port it. There is also the problem of the lower performance of mac vs pc hardware which complicates the process of porting.

The mac gaming market is just too small. Most studio are strugling to keep afloat as they are now.

 

[goMac]

Not really going to happen. They won't spend the money to port to the mac small gamers community when they know you'll buy the ready available pc version and play via bootcamp if they don't port it. There is also the problem of the lower performance of mac vs pc hardware which complicates the process of porting.

The mac gaming market is just too small. Most studio are strugling to keep afloat as they are now.

Yet the selection of Mac games on places like Steam is actually pretty decent. Lot's of AAA games, and even some games that have never been Mac like the Elder Scrolls series are coming to Mac.

Mac marketshare is high enough, and if you've already got an OpenGL and OpenAL version, it's something you could put an intern on for a few weeks, especially with Mavericks bringing OpenGL up to snuff. What's the big overhead and cost?

It used to be even if you had an OpenGL/OpenAL version, you had to do the PowerPC port, but that's gone now as well (and less of an issue with all the PowerPC consoles.)

 

[tuxon86]

Yet the selection of Mac games on places like Steam is actually pretty decent. Lot's of AAA games, and even some games that have never been Mac like the Elder Scrolls series are coming to Mac.

Mac marketshare is high enough, and if you've already got an OpenGL and OpenAL version, it's something you could put an intern on for a few weeks, especially with Mavericks bringing OpenGL up to snuff. What's the big overhead and cost?

It used to be even if you had an OpenGL/OpenAL version, you had to do the PowerPC port, but that's gone now as well (and less of an issue with all the PowerPC consoles.)

Mac marketshare are around 8%... There are more people running vista than mac with 10.8

http://www.netmarketshare.com/operating-system-market-share.aspx?qprid=10&qpcustomd=0

Opengl isn't a panacea. It's hard to code directly with it. This is why studios use game engine. There is no mac version of unreal engine 4. Neither is cryengine 3 it seems. And between you and me, both would struggel on mobile gpu.

 

[goMac]

There is no mac version of unreal engine 4. Neither is cryengine 3 it seems. And between you and me, both would struggel on mobile gpu.

Huh? Unreal Engine 4 isn't even out on Windows yet either, but it's expected to have a Mac version. And Cryengine 3 already has a port to OS X. Crytek released iOS games that use it. And as I already said, if there are OpenGL versions (and if it supports the PS4, there are), it's pretty easy to bring to Mac.

I'm not sure what mobile GPUs have to do with anything, but if it can run on an iPad, I'm sure it'll be just fine on a mobile gpu.

 

[tuxon86]

Huh? Unreal Engine 4 isn't even out on Windows yet either, but it's expected to have a Mac version. And Cryengine 3 already has a port to OS X. Crytek released iOS games that use it. And as I already said, if there are OpenGL versions (and if it supports the PS4, there are), it's pretty easy to bring to Mac.

I'm not sure what mobile GPUs have to do with anything, but if it can run on an iPad, I'm sure it'll be just fine on a mobile gpu.

Not according to their website it doesn't. They advertise for the PC, PS4 and Xbox one only. No mention of Mac anywhere. IOS =/= OS X. Presently Cryengine 3 is advertise for PC, XBox 360 and PS3 only on their website. No one program directly in opengl. It's too time consuming to have to write every single shader in opengl for a game. The vast majority of studios uses games engine and I've just demonstrated to you that the two most powerful and popular are not on mac os x.

Games on IPad aren't the full version of the games on PC. The IPad hasn't the processing power to play a 1 on 1 port of a game. Those port are a subset of the main game.

 

[rabidz7]

If it is watercooled then maybe. If has 7970GHz then yes. If AMD CPU then yes. If both or three then for sure. If neither, no.

 

[goMac]

IOS =/= OS X.

The only difference between iOS and OS X as far as games are considered is that iOS uses GL ES, and OS X uses GL proper. But GL ES is a subset of proper GL, so for the most part GL ES code runs in GL. But even if a developer is worried about that, GL 4 includes a flag that officially lets it run GL ES code. And while that's interesting, it's also an unnecessary transition because we know from their other platforms they very likely have a proper GL renderer anyway.

GL shaders? Like I said, they're supporting GL on other platforms, so clearly SOMEONE is writing GL shaders. There are a few automated DirectX -> GL shader translators as well, just in case you're lazy.

OpenGL is actually doing pretty decently these days because if you're deploying on any platform besides the XBox (360 or One) and the PC, you've got to do OpenGL. And most people are in that situation. DirectX is only available on Microsoft platforms.

 

[tuxon86]

The only difference between iOS and OS X as far as games are considered is that iOS uses GL ES, and OS X uses GL proper. But GL ES is a subset of proper GL, so for the most part GL ES code runs in GL. But even if a developer is worried about that, GL 4 includes a flag that officially lets it run GL ES code. And while that's interesting, it's also an unnecessary transition because we know from their other platforms they very likely have a proper GL renderer anyway.

GL shaders? Like I said, they're supporting GL on other platforms, so clearly SOMEONE is writing GL shaders. There are a few automated DirectX -> GL shader translators as well, just in case you're lazy.

OpenGL is actually doing pretty decently these days because if you're deploying on any platform besides the XBox (360 or One) and the PC, you've got to do OpenGL. And most people are in that situation. DirectX is only available on Microsoft platforms.

Again... Studio are using game engine to develop games. They don't have time to write each game individually. Hence the popularity of Unreal and Crytek.

OpenGL is a low level graphics library. It isn't a game engine. You have to spend a lot of time doing a lot of coding and that cost money. Instead you take an already baked engine and spend the time doing better maps, arts and fx.

In short, game engine company code with opengl. Game studio don't code with opengl, they use an engine instead. Is that simple enough?

The fact that the Mac support OpenGL doesn't mean **** if no one port their engine to the mac. Do you understand now? And they won't rush to port them because Mac represent at most 8% of the PC market and of those 8% a tiny minority are willing to spend $$$ on gaming. Mac are mostly a productivity/media creation plateform.

 

[jncoanalog]

Again... Studio are using game engine to develop games. They don't have time to write each game individually. Hence the popularity of Unreal and Crytek.

OpenGL is a low level graphics library. It isn't a game engine. You have to spend a lot of time doing a lot of coding and that cost money. Instead you take an already baked engine and spend the time doing better maps, arts and fx.

In short, game engine company code with opengl. Game studio don't code with opengl, they use an engine instead. Is that simple enough?

The fact that the Mac support OpenGL doesn't mean **** if no one port their engine to the mac. Do you understand now? And they won't rush to port them because Mac represent at most 8% of the PC market and of those 8% a tiny minority are willing to spend $$$ on gaming. Mac are mostly a productivity/media creation plateform.

I am by no means an expert in game development, but a quick google search seems to contradict your claims regarding Unreal Engine:
http://www.unrealengine.com/en/platforms/
(aside from the fact that UnrealEngine 3 is stated as fully supporting both Mac OS X and iOS - in fact, those are the very first two platforms listed in their website -, UnrealEngine 4, which seems to be in its very very early stages, states compatibility with "PC, PlayStation 4, and Xbox One, with other platforms to follow"...)

Also, regarding CryEngine, an OS X port is something that Crytek clearly don't underestimate:
http://mygaming.co.za/news/pc/56362-cryengine-coming-to-linux.html
and
http://www.crytek.com/career/offers/overview/frankfurt/programming-engineering/junior-programmer

Dice, the company behind the Frostbite game engine (which powers the acclaimed Battlefield series) also seems extremely interested in OS X gamming:
http://www.groths.org/frostbite-game-engine-coming-to-mac-osx/

Electronic Arts which, as you surely know, is one of the most important game developers / distributors recently ported their Steam competitor (Origin) to OS X and started distributing OS X versions of many of their games:
http://store2.origin.com/store/eaemea/pt_PT/cat/mac/categoryID.62022900

Also, there are other Engines out there you know? And some of them support OS X just fine...
http://unigine.com/products/unigine/licensing/, for example...

Another major example, the Source Engine, seems to be very much into OpenGL, and consequently into OS X and Linux as well... from the Wikipedia article:

Mac OS X support (2010, multiple games)
In April 2010 Valve released all of their major Source games on Mac OS X. All future Valve games will be released simultaneously for Windows and Mac.[27][28] Games will only use Direct3D on Windows, and only OpenGL on the other platforms.

So, while OS X can represent only 8% of the PC Market (taking your word for it), OS X + iOS + Linux Distros + Google's Android and Chrome OSes + every single gaming console out there except for the Xboxes, really start to constitute a market one should consider when developing games (and game engines for that matter).
If the engines support OpenGL, porting PS or iOS or Nintendo-ready engines to OS X (and Linux and Android and etc, etc...) should be fairly easy and would probably make economic sense in most of the cases.

Also, keep in mind that OpenGL is platform agnostic (both software and hardware-wise), so it only makes sense that game (and game engines) developers start to take into consideration the advantages of having their games (and game engines) ported to OS X, Linux and the likes...

Just my 0.02$ though

 

[ActionableMango]

I have no idea who is planning what for which engines, but I do know that Mac gaming has never been better in OS X.

Between native ports, building cross-platform from the ground up, Cider, and Steamworks, there has been an explosion in titles that work on OS X. The App Store has also enabled a plethora of indie games, and don't forget Macheist and Humble Bundles! My God has it ever been this great for Mac gaming?

And that's despite the fact that we can all just bootcamp to Windows anyway! I remember people predicting that Bootcamp would completely kill off games in OS X. How wrong they were!

I'm also seeing several Windows-only games being made to work on OS X by complete amateurs at home using nothing more than a modded cider wrapper. If some dude in his basement can do that in his spare time and it works with only a couple of bugs despite having no access to the source code, then it simply cannot be that hard for a company to do it right.

And while you can tell me that Cider is not a native port, I'll tell you that if a game works well in OS X, then that's great and I don't care what you call the magic behind the curtains.

 

[tuxon86]

I am by no means an expert in game development, but a quick google search seems to contradict your claims regarding Unreal Engine:
http://www.unrealengine.com/en/platforms/
(aside from the fact that UnrealEngine 3 is stated as fully supporting both Mac OS X and iOS - in fact, those are the very first two platforms listed in their website -, UnrealEngine 4, which seems to be in its very very early stages, states compatibility with "PC, PlayStation 4, and Xbox One, with other platforms to follow"...)

Also, regarding CryEngine, an OS X port is something that Crytek clearly don't underestimate:
http://mygaming.co.za/news/pc/56362-cryengine-coming-to-linux.html
and
http://www.crytek.com/career/offers/overview/frankfurt/programming-engineering/junior-programmer

Dice, the company behind the Frostbite game engine (which powers the acclaimed Battlefield series) also seems extremely interested in OS X gamming:
http://www.groths.org/frostbite-game-engine-coming-to-mac-osx/

Electronic Arts which, as you surely know, is one of the most important game developers / distributors recently ported their Steam competitor (Origin) to OS X and started distributing OS X versions of many of their games:
http://store2.origin.com/store/eaemea/pt_PT/cat/mac/categoryID.62022900

Also, there are other Engines out there you know? And some of them support OS X just fine...
http://unigine.com/products/unigine/licensing/, for example...

Another major example, the Source Engine, seems to be very much into OpenGL, and consequently into OS X and Linux as well... from the Wikipedia article:

So, while OS X can represent only 8% of the PC Market (taking your word for it), OS X + iOS + Linux Distros + Google's Android and Chrome OSes + every single gaming console out there except for the Xboxes, really start to constitute a market one should consider when developing games (and game engines for that matter).
If the engines support OpenGL, porting PS or iOS or Nintendo-ready engines to OS X (and Linux and Android and etc, etc...) should be fairly easy and would probably make economic sense in most of the cases.

Also, keep in mind that OpenGL is platform agnostic (both software and hardware-wise), so it only makes sense that game (and game engines) developers start to take into consideration the advantages of having their games (and game engines) ported to OS X, Linux and the likes...

Just my 0.02$ though

They don't exist yet and other plateform doesn't necessaraly mean os x either.
Opengl is plateform agnostic to the point that you have to make a check each time you invoke a function to see if your gpu supports it. The hardware maker are the one who implement it in their drivers and there is no certitude that a given function is fully supported.

And no porting isn't that easy. Games and engines use plenty of low level calls which are plateform dependent. The event handler is totally different depending on which os you run for exemple.

Beside simple programs that follow the posix standard, porting code is never easy or trivial. Try it sometime...

----------

I have no idea who is planning what for which engines, but I do know that Mac gaming has never been better in OS X.

Between native ports, building cross-platform from the ground up, Cider, and Steamworks, there has been an explosion in titles that work on OS X. The App Store has also enabled a plethora of indie games, and don't forget Macheist and Humble Bundles! My God has it ever been this great for Mac gaming?

And that's despite the fact that we can all just bootcamp to Windows anyway! I remember people predicting that Bootcamp would completely kill off games in OS X. How wrong they were!

I'm also seeing several Windows-only games being made to work on OS X by complete amateurs at home using nothing more than a modded cider wrapper. If some dude in his basement can do that in his spare time and it works with only a couple of bugs despite having no access to the source code, then it simply cannot be that hard for a company to do it right.

And while you can tell me that Cider is not a native port, I'll tell you that if a game works well in OS X, then that's great and I don't care what you call the magic behind the curtains.

So for you, using a hack is supporting os x?
And define well... 60+ fps or 30 or 15... And with a couple of bugs as a bonus... Yippeedooo...

 

[jncoanalog]

They don't exist yet and other plateform doesn't necessaraly mean os x either.
Opengl is plateform agnostic to the point that you have to make a check each time you invoke a function to see if your gpu supports it. The hardware maker are the one who implement it in their drivers and there is no certitude that a given function is fully supported.

And no porting isn't that easy. Games and engines use plenty of low level calls which are plateform dependent. The event handler is totally different depending on which os you run for exemple.

Beside simple programs that follow the posix standard, porting code is never easy or trivial. Try it sometime...

What doesn't exist yet? I really couldn't understand...

Any given task could be made fairly easy depending on the resources you throw at it.
And while for me porting anything (OpenGL or any other type of code) would be extremely painful (just because I'm really not interested in doing it), if it makes sense for my business (both functional and economical) that is exactly what the 4 developers that work for me will be doing, for whatever time it takes them.

So, when my client needs my company to port 16 000 existent websites from an exiting framework to our own proprietary framework, that is exactly what I ask my developers to do.
And I really don't care that it will take them 4+ months to have a solution up and running, as long as what my client pays me covers their (and my) work time and the company still manages to make some profit to reinvest somewhere else.

My point was only that there seems to be a growing market for Mac (and OpenGL-based) gaming and gaming engines. And also that there seems to be a trend that somewhat confirms my assumption (EA, Valve, Blizzard, etc, all releasing games and porting their gaming platforms to OS X, + the fact that one of the two "most popular" gaming engines - Unreal - already supports the mac/iOS and that the other - CryEngine - may as well be moving in that direction in a foreseeable future).

 

[tuxon86]

What doesn't exist yet? I really couldn't understand...

Any given task could be made fairly easy depending on the resources you throw at it.
And while for me porting anything (OpenGL or any other type of code) would be extremely painful (just because I'm really not interested in doing it), if it makes sense for my business (both functional and economical) that is exactly what the 4 developers that work for me will be doing, for whatever time it takes them.

So, when my client needs my company to port 16 000 existent websites from an exiting framework to our own proprietary framework, that is exactly what I ask my developers to do.
And I really don't care that it will take them 4+ months to have a solution up and running, as long as what my client pays me covers their (and my) work time and the company still manages to make some profit to reinvest somewhere else.

My point was only that there seems to be a growing market for Mac (and OpenGL-based) gaming and gaming engines. And also that there seems to be a trend that somewhat confirms my assumption (EA, Valve, Blizzard, etc, all releasing games and porting their gaming platforms to OS X, + the fact that one of the two "most popular" gaming engines - Unreal - already supports the mac/iOS and that the other - CryEngine - may as well be moving in that direction in a foreseeable future).

Unreal 4 isn't available on the mac. It may be in the future but it won't be when the new batch of AAA titles get release. And i don't see cryengine being port to the mac soon, since it's a very demanding engine when it comes to gpu spec and the mac are underpowered in that field.

Are you really trying to compare html/php/jquery website conversion with low level c++ porting of applications?

They haven't ported the games and engine because the mac market is too small and the hardware, especially when it comes to gpu, are at best middle of the road.

As for the market share, a simple google search would have given you the info... Here it is.

http://www.netmarketshare.com/operating-system-market-share.aspx?qprid=10&qpcustomd=0

 

[jncoanalog]

Unreal 4 isn't available on the mac. It may be in the future but it won't be when the new batch of AAA titles get release. And i don't see cryengine being port to the mac soon, since it's a very demanding engine when it comes to gpu spec and the mac are underpowered in that field.

Are you really trying to compare html/php/jquery website conversion with low level c++ porting of applications?

They haven't ported the games and engine because the mac market is too small and the hardware, especially when it comes to gpu, are at best middle of the road.

As for the market share, a simple google search would have given you the info... Here it is.

http://www.netmarketshare.com/operating-system-market-share.aspx?qprid=10&qpcustomd=0

Well it seems to me that Unreal4 isn't available to anyone but a few selected developers, and judging by the Unreal3 compatibility with OS X, when the team says "more platforms to follow" it's only natural that one believes the Mac would be included...

No, I'm not trying to compare any kind of porting, because as I said to you earlier, I don't know anything about the technicalities involved.
I was just trying to show you that if it makes sense (meaning it's best for your users AND it's best for your business), the technicalities or the difficulty level of the task doesn't really come into question...

As for market share, the link you provided doesn't state what's the sample size, so I don't know what that 8% figure refers to. But assuming THIS is somewhat correct, that 8% represents almost 30M users, if 5% of those are interested in gaming, it represents almost 1.5M users. And this is if you take 2012 shipments alone... so 1.5M * $60 (Diablo III pricing) = $90M in revenue.

Of course my maths aren't really very trustable, but surely Blizzard must have thought something along those lines...

But then again, why would you really believe that those market share maths you presented us (or any others for that matter) are anywhere close to reality?
http://www.neowin.net/news/apples-pc-market-share-rises-or-falls-who-knows-the-analysts-clearly-dont

Apple could be loosing market share, Apple could be gaining market share, who really knows? I don't, and if I was a game developer I wouldn't care less... what I would care is to make a market study and try to understand if it will make (economical) sense for my company to develop for the Mac, and it seems to me that a lot of game developers are starting to think that it does...

Well, don't take my word for it, but aside from the fact that AAA developers and publishers seem at least more interested in the Mac than before, some developers also believe that "backing from Apple (relative to game development and / or porting) is at an 'all-time high' "; see http://uk.ign.com/articles/2013/01/28/mac-gamings-biggest-challenges

 

[Tesselator]

I have no idea who is planning what for which engines, but I do know that Mac gaming has never been better in OS X.

I don't think so. With the advent of 10.7 and now 10.8 about half the games on my HDD no longer work at all. The OS won't even attempt to load them and they get a white circle with a cross through it over their icons. Some of those games were the most fun to play and almost none of them will be updated to run on the new OS.

And that's only the most recent cut. Other even more drastic cuts have occurred one after the other. I guess 80% of all games ever made for native OS X execution now no longer work. The current Mac OS and hardware might be a "better than ever" environment for game development but it's currently pretty messed up for gamers in general.

Meanwhile most of my 15 or so year-old Windows games still work in Win7 (and probably Win8 as well - untested). And I have literally hundreds of them - both free and commercial (some I even created myself).

 

[slughead]

I don't think so.

His statement is that gaming has "never been better"

Gaming on Mac is HORRIBLE right now--totally abysmal.... but I think he's right, it's never been better

We are getting new games, and that's something rather new.

 

[Tesselator]

His statement is that gaming has "never been better"

Gaming on Mac is HORRIBLE right now--totally abysmal.... but I think he's right, it's never been better

We are getting new games, and that's something rather new.

Hehe...


-----
What new games are we getting BTW?

 

[slughead]

Hehe...


-----
What new games are we getting BTW?

We got starcraft II and Wow; a couple steam games like Portal 2 and Civ5

Probably more. Personally, I use windows for gaming like all other sane people.

 

[MagicThief83]

This really depends on which video cards are included. The top-tier will likely have dual W9000, but those cards cost $3,500 each (putting the cost at >$7000, but maybe Apple can discount that somewhat through bulk pricing).

The bottom tier is said to still " dual workstation GPU"--likely FireGL (AMD). The problem is that low-end / prior generation workstation cards are basically totally obsolete for gaming. Having them in Crossfire (joining 2+ cards together) will help but Crossfire is prone to frame variability, stuttering, etc.

Single GPU setups or even SLI (NVidia's multi-GPU) offer a much better gaming experience. It is unlikely Apple will offer a single GPU setup.

One thing we can reasonably be sure of: The GPU likely will not be user-replaceable and even if it is, they are extremely proprietary so options will be very limited. If not replaceable, you're locking yourself into a video card that, even if high-end, will be nearly worthless in 3 years. This turns your "investment" into a disposable machine.

So, in short: the entry model will likely suck for games, GPU options will be limited, upgrades will likely be impossible, it will likely use workstation cards which are overpriced and/or useless for gaming, and if you're buying this for gaming then your friends won't like you.

This is why I just kept my old mac pro for productivity and bought a gaming PC.

I decided not to waste my time (and life) on Apple: I went the Hackintosh route instead and I couldn't be any happier! I have an amazing machine that gives me the best of both worlds: stable OSX usage and blazing gaming performance under Windows. I have a top-of-the-line NVIDIA Geforce GTX 770 with 2GB VRAM and it handles any game with relative easy. I also dual-boot using separate SSDs, and still have ample storage using separate 7200 rpm HDs. All in all, I'm extremely pleased and am glad I didn't wait on Apple this time, as how I did with the iMacs. The new Mac Pro will undoubtedly be a beast, but to spend $3500+ just for gaming in my opinion, isn't worth it. The new Mac Pro configured to how I'd want it would probably cost $4000+. I built my new machine for approximately a little less than half that amount. The money left over, I bought a great 27" IPS display with dual HDMI ports and an amazing sound bar!

 

[MagicThief83]

I forgot to mention, I read a post recently on Mac Rumors describing how Steve Jobs considered and almost killed off the pro lineup of Macs (which isn't surprising to say the least). It's hard to determine whether or not this would affect the new Mac Pro and just how wide of an audience this machine (and what Apple would allow) would cater to; meaning, this machine is designed primarily for a niche market, so I doubt Apple would allow it to be configured in a such a way that would make it more appealing to a broader consumer market (e.g., consumer/gamer GPUs, etc.).

 

[slughead]

I decided not to waste my time (and life) on Apple: I went the Hackintosh route instead and I couldn't be any happier! I have an amazing machine that gives me the best of both worlds: stable OSX usage and blazing gaming performance under Windows. I have a top-of-the-line NVIDIA Geforce GTX 770 with 2GB VRAM and it handles any game with relative easy. I also dual-boot using separate SSDs, and still have ample storage using separate 7200 rpm HDs. All in all, I'm extremely pleased and am glad I didn't wait on Apple this time, as how I did with the iMacs. The new Mac Pro will undoubtedly be a beast, but to spend $3500+ just for gaming in my opinion, isn't worth it. The new Mac Pro configured to how I'd want it would probably cost $4000+. I built my new machine for approximately a little less than half that amount. The money left over, I bought a great 27" IPS display with dual HDMI ports and an amazing sound bar!

Great choice. When the nMP comes out, I'd suggest buying a second GTX770 and SLI them for greater justice. Then come back on here and make fun of all the silly people using a $7000 machine and getting lower frame-rates.

 

[MagicThief83]

Great choice. When the nMP comes out, I'd suggest buying a second GTX770 and SLI them for greater justice. Then come back on here and make fun of all the silly people using a $7000 machine and getting lower frame-rates.

I might just do that lol...

 

[Tesselator]

I decided not to waste my time (and life) on Apple: I went the Hackintosh route instead and I couldn't be any happier! I have an amazing machine that gives me the best of both worlds: stable OSX usage and blazing gaming performance under Windows. I have a top-of-the-line NVIDIA Geforce GTX 770 with 2GB VRAM and it handles any game with relative easy. I also dual-boot using separate SSDs, and still have ample storage using separate 7200 rpm HDs. All in all, I'm extremely pleased and am glad I didn't wait on Apple this time, as how I did with the iMacs. The new Mac Pro will undoubtedly be a beast, but to spend $3500+ just for gaming in my opinion, isn't worth it. The new Mac Pro configured to how I'd want it would probably cost $4000+. I built my new machine for approximately a little less than half that amount. The money left over, I bought a great 27" IPS display with dual HDMI ports and an amazing sound bar!

I've recently been thinking it would be cool to have separate SSDs with different OS installs on them and then boot from a USB3 open drive-dock. It would be like using the cartridge port on the Commodore 64. Swap the cartridge (SSD), hit the button and start up a totally different system. 3 or 4 128GB SSDs would do... Linux, OS X, Win7, Win8... Plug & Play.

I forgot to mention, I read a post recently on Mac Rumors describing how Steve Jobs considered and almost killed off the pro lineup of Macs (which isn't surprising to say the least). It's hard to determine whether or not this would affect the new Mac Pro and just how wide of an audience this machine (and what Apple would allow) would cater to; meaning, this machine is designed primarily for a niche market, so I doubt Apple would allow it to be configured in a such a way that would make it more appealing to a broader consumer market (e.g., consumer/gamer GPUs, etc.).

Honestly, I doubt there's even the slightest bit of truth to that. People here just make stuff up (A LOT!!!) as there's no accountability or credibility ratings like there are on some other sites. So best to just disregard that - then you don't have worry about speculating even further as to what that might mean.

 

[antonis]

I believe that in the near future things will change for the better on that matter. As more companies start to include Linux in their plans as a decent/capable gaming platform (since Linux desktop usage is also growing), we'll see more support for OpenGL (not only for games directly, but also for game engines too).

As for the new MP as a gaming desktop machine, I guess we'll have to wait and see what is going on with the GPUs. If they aren't upgradeable, things will not look good and more people will turn to the iMac side.

As a side note, what's the point of 2 AMD GPUs if they are not connected with crossfire ? Is there a different/equivalent connectivity implemented ?