Mac Pro Refresh "b" Possibilities?

iBighouse

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Mar 11, 2012
585
231
I am wondering what you Mac Pro users see as likely or possible changes to the Mac Pro when it gets a refresh release later this year, based on "b" refreshes of prior years?
 

pragmatous

macrumors 65816
May 23, 2012
1,378
99
Well this refresh is a bit different.

New DDR4 RAM, higher capacities, and new socket. New CPU's. New 2 year support socket support. Meaning every processor for 2 years will fit in the 2011-3 socket. Giving you a pretty lengthy upgrade path. You probably won't see another refresh for 2 years after this next one in the fall.

I am wondering what you Mac Pro users see as likely or possible changes to the Mac Pro when it gets a refresh release later this year, based on "b" refreshes of prior years?
 

peabo

macrumors regular
Feb 14, 2008
201
0
Well this refresh is a bit different.

New DDR4 RAM, higher capacities, and new socket. New CPU's. New 2 year support socket support. Meaning every processor for 2 years will fit in the 2011-3 socket. Giving you a pretty lengthy upgrade path. You probably won't see another refresh for 2 years after this next one in the fall.
With regards to the socket, I believe the 2,1 (and 1,1) uses the same socket as the 3,1 but putting newer CPUs in the older revisions won't work at all. So I wouldn't count on that same trick working in the nMP when we get to that point.

The ability to swap chips between the 4,1 and 5,1 only works with a firmware hack, so I'm guessing we'd have to count on one being made for the nMP.
 

Umbongo

macrumors 601
Sep 14, 2006
4,934
54
England
With regards to the socket, I believe the 2,1 (and 1,1) uses the same socket as the 3,1 but putting newer CPUs in the older revisions won't work at all. So I wouldn't count on that same trick working in the nMP when we get to that point.

The ability to swap chips between the 4,1 and 5,1 only works with a firmware hack, so I'm guessing we'd have to count on one being made for the nMP.
Correct.
 

pragmatous

macrumors 65816
May 23, 2012
1,378
99
It's not the same socket and the Ivybridge-e CPU will not fit in the 2011-3 socket.

info about xeon E5 haswell-ep processors
http://wccftech.com/intel-xeon-proc...-2014-broadwell-ep-18-cores-45-mb-cache-2015/

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7773/intels-three-versions-of-socket-2011-not-compatible

Here you can see the notch pins are completely different. It won't fit in the socket because it's keyed differently.

It would be like trying to fit DDR3 into a DDR2 motherboard. Same pins but different key notches.


With regards to the socket, I believe the 2,1 (and 1,1) uses the same socket as the 3,1 but putting newer CPUs in the older revisions won't work at all. So I wouldn't count on that same trick working in the nMP when we get to that point.

The ability to swap chips between the 4,1 and 5,1 only works with a firmware hack, so I'm guessing we'd have to count on one being made for the nMP.
 

handsome pete

macrumors 68000
Aug 15, 2008
1,720
255
It's not the same socket and the Ivybridge-e CPU will not fit in the 2011-3 socket.

info about xeon E5 haswell-ep processors
http://wccftech.com/intel-xeon-proc...-2014-broadwell-ep-18-cores-45-mb-cache-2015/

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7773/intels-three-versions-of-socket-2011-not-compatible

Here you can see the notch pins are completely different. It won't fit in the socket because it's keyed differently.

It would be like trying to fit DDR3 into a DDR2 motherboard. Same pins but different key notches.
No one is saying it's the same socket. They're actually pointing out that even if the upcoming Haswell and Broadwell chips share the same socket, then there's still no guarantee you'll be able to upgrade easily between the two.
 

pragmatous

macrumors 65816
May 23, 2012
1,378
99
I don't think intel will do that in the server market unless there are serious technological changes such as DDR4.

No one is saying it's the same socket. They're actually pointing out that even if the upcoming Haswell and Broadwell chips share the same socket, then there's still no guarantee you'll be able to upgrade easily between the two.
 

koban4max

macrumors 68000
Aug 23, 2011
1,582
0
I am wondering what you Mac Pro users see as likely or possible changes to the Mac Pro when it gets a refresh release later this year, based on "b" refreshes of prior years?
what makes you think there will be a refresh this year?
 

pragmatous

macrumors 65816
May 23, 2012
1,378
99
what makes you think there will be a refresh this year?
Because Haswell-ep is coming out real soon.

"We have been working with Micron since the early days of DDR4 memory definition and through DDR4 product launch," said Geof Findley, Intel DCG Memory Ecosystem Director. "We are very excited that our mutual customers will be able to reap the benefits of this new memory technology to improve performance and reduce power as part of future Intel Xeon processor E5-2600 v3 product family based systems with production availability of these new processors in 2H’14."

http://www.zdnet.com/micron-kicks-o...ntel-haswell-ep-server-processors-7000028027/
 

koban4max

macrumors 68000
Aug 23, 2011
1,582
0
Because Haswell-ep is coming out real soon.

"We have been working with Micron since the early days of DDR4 memory definition and through DDR4 product launch," said Geof Findley, Intel DCG Memory Ecosystem Director. "We are very excited that our mutual customers will be able to reap the benefits of this new memory technology to improve performance and reduce power as part of future Intel Xeon processor E5-2600 v3 product family based systems with production availability of these new processors in 2H’14."

http://www.zdnet.com/micron-kicks-o...ntel-haswell-ep-server-processors-7000028027/
they didn't directly say this year..but it looks more like early next year.
 

AidenShaw

macrumors P6
Feb 8, 2003
18,627
4,628
The Peninsula
Apple may be months or years late....

Because Haswell-ep is coming out real soon.

"We have been working with Micron since the early days of DDR4 memory definition and through DDR4 product launch," said Geof Findley, Intel DCG Memory Ecosystem Director. "We are very excited that our mutual customers will be able to reap the benefits of this new memory technology to improve performance and reduce power as part of future Intel Xeon processor E5-2600 v3 product family based systems with production availability of these new processors in 2H’14."

http://www.zdnet.com/micron-kicks-o...ntel-haswell-ep-server-processors-7000028027/
Regardless of what other x64 vendors do this fall with the Haswell-EP release - Apple's history is to wait months or years before updating the Apple Pro. I'd say that it's a safe bet that by the end of 2016 Apple will start to ship Intel's late 2014 chips.
 

handsome pete

macrumors 68000
Aug 15, 2008
1,720
255
Ok then this statement "If I'm not mistaken, it isn't up to Intel. That's an Apple issue." is very confusing.
Because while Intel is responsible for the CPUs, Apple takes care of the motherboard and the rest of the internals. Just because the sockets are the same, it doesn't mean that CPUs will be swappable. That's in Apple's hands. Hence why people brought up old Mac Pros needing a firmware hack in order to use newer CPUs.


You brought up that Intel created Thunderbolt. I'm not sure why that was relevant to this topic.
 

pragmatous

macrumors 65816
May 23, 2012
1,378
99
In that case yes it depends on motherboard compatibility. The socket itself is compatible with all processors for about 2 years though. Intel has no control over the motherboard makers if they will a good motherboard or not.

So in essence you're right.

Because while Intel is responsible for the CPUs, Apple takes care of the motherboard and the rest of the internals. Just because the sockets are the same, it doesn't mean that CPUs will be swappable. That's in Apple's hands. Hence why people brought up old Mac Pros needing a firmware hack in order to use newer CPUs.


You brought up that Intel created Thunderbolt. I'm not sure why that was relevant to this topic.
 

VirtualRain

macrumors 603
Aug 1, 2008
6,304
115
Vancouver, BC
Regardless of what other x64 vendors do this fall with the Haswell-EP release - Apple's history is to wait months or years before updating the Apple Pro. I'd say that it's a safe bet that by the end of 2016 Apple will start to ship Intel's late 2014 chips.
:confused: you are truly bizarre sometimes.

You, more than anyone, ought to know that shipping new systems depend on a variety of factors. Remember the much anticipated launch of Nehalem back in early 2009? In that instance Apple was the first vendor shipping Nahelem Xeons... Up to a month prior to anyone else.

Of course, no one expects Apple to pull a repeat of that, but suggesting there will be a 2-year lapse on Haswell is just bizarre. You're clearly very frustrated with Apple and the Mac Pro... Do you find that spewing nonsense is somehow therapeutic? It's certainly not helping anyone else around here.
 

Mactrunk

macrumors regular
May 12, 2005
163
52
This is all just conjecture and opinion.

We make predictions based on past performance.

Nobody knows what Apple is planning.
The secrecy assures that small businesses who depend on MacPros can't make definite plans.

Keeps us on the edge.
Always wondering.

Great business model!
 

calaverasgrande

macrumors 65816
Oct 18, 2010
1,291
161
Brooklyn, New York.
hopefully a Kensington lock slot.
I have $100 gadgets that I can lock down with a security cable. But my $5000 Mac? Nope.:mad:
I suppose Apple is counting on hiding in plain site?

Possibly they could hop on Intel's new NVMe SSD technology.
 

repentix

macrumors regular
May 26, 2013
205
2
I want them to skip the Haswell EP and update the new mac pro for Broadwell EP, this means 80 Pcie lanes! Haswell EP has only got 40. With 80 Pcie lanes the Broadwell mac pro could possibly have 8 Ram slots as the current one failed to have this many because of the 40 Pcie lanes that Ivy Bridge has (classic mac pros had 8 slots because of the dual cpus)

http://www.hardwareluxx.com/index.p...-details-on-18-core-broadwell-ep-surface.html
 

Riwam

macrumors 65816
Jan 7, 2014
1,084
244
Basel, Switzerland
hopefully a Kensington lock slot.
I have $100 gadgets that I can lock down with a security cable. But my $5000 Mac? Nope.:mad:
I suppose Apple is counting on hiding in plain site?

Possibly they could hop on Intel's new NVMe SSD technology.
........................

I assume that thieves will find it much easier to make money out of stolen iPhones, MacBooks or iPads than of a stollen nMP.
But of course previous MP were from that point of view safer.
A thief running with a previous MP had a hard way to make a living :D
 

LiamHD

macrumors member
Jun 5, 2014
69
0
I really hope that they get rid of the trash can design, it looks bloody awful compared to the 2012< Mac Pro's hence why I bought an older model. The whole point of me buying a Pro was because they were built for Creative professionals and were easily upgradable the nMP is not easily upgradable.
 
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