Macbook A1534 Thermal Paste replaced, runs a bit hotter?

[Bioshock.Rocks]

Hey guys,

I purchased this laptop about 2 weeks ago and I am pretty much in love with it. I have a 2011 Macbook Pro but I'm thinking about selling it because I don't feel the need to have another Macbook.

This whole 'fan-less' system on laptops kind of freaks me out. I'm used to my laptops running hot due to the gaming I sometimes do on my Macbook Pro. I felt this Macbook get a bit warm and though - What if I changed the thermal compound on this unit to some Antec FORMULA 7 Nano Diamond Thermal Compound that I have laying around that was for my Macbook Pro?

I went ahead and changed the paste without any issues. I was watching some youtube videos and I felt the laptop get a bit warm. I surfed tumblr and I REALLY felt the Macbook get warm near the CPU area.

My question is would the heat be that the compound that was applied transferring heat faster from the CPU to the heatsink or did I not apply it right thus the amount of heat coming from the bottom of the unit? As I'm typing the laptop isn't hot - it's just cold/warm.


Thank you for your help and I hope you have a great day!

 

[T5BRICK]

I really wouldn't have messed with it, but since you already have, do you have any before/after temperature data? Why you "feel" on the bottom case isn't accurate at all.

 

[maflynn]

I'd look to get what temps you're actually running. And as T5BRICK stated, I personally wouldn't have messed with it.

Odd are, that if the CPU is running hotter then before, you misapplied the compound or even maybe using the wrong one compound.

 

[Queen6]

Without before and after CPU temperature with exact same load and conditions, there is no real way to tell. Personally I doubt it makes any significant difference. Elevating the rear of the notebook will likely be more beinificial allowing the base to radiate heat more efficiently.

Q-6

 

[maflynn]

I doubt it make any significant difference.

I've done it before, and in only one case did I notice it having some positive results. Even so, that positive result was I think if memory serves me (its been several years) only 5c.

 

[Algus]

Laptops that don't have fans can't really get hot enough to need them. They're also relatively low power. The Core M in the rMB and the Rockchip ARM CPUs used in some chrome books are examples. You don't need much CPU power at all to power even 1080p video playback these days.

You will want the thermal paste on that thing but I don't think using a more expensive gaming paste is going to make much of a difference. If it wasn't applied right, you might actually hurt it! Monitor your temps as you use the system and repaste if things are out of whack.

It's not uncommon for the cases on Macs to get fairly warm. The aluminum spreads the heat out and the entire device gets hot but not dangerously so. I've seen before where someone said Apple markets their computers as notebooks and not laptops because of this Dunno if that is true but the aluminum heating up is definitely true, normal, and not particularly hazardous to your device. but maybe to your bare legs if you're using the computer on your lap

 

[Queen6]

I've done it before, and in only one case did I notice it having some positive results. Even so, that positive result was I think if memory serves me (its been several years) only 5c.

Unless changing the TIM is done in a highly methodical manner, odds are you will never really know. Apple`s portables tend to run hotter than their PC counterparts as that`s how Apple designs them, rather than the TIM or application. Personally unless the system is throttling or shutting down due to thermal overload, there is no need for user intervention, other than periodic cleaning of the (active) cooling system.

Q-6

 

[MrAverigeUser]

You didn´t even communicate the CPU-temperature after the re-pasting….

Me, I think the limiting factor (= bottle neck for heat transfer) is primarily the tiny (insufficient?) little metal piece for "cooling" and less the transfer of heat between CPU and cooler. And one more reason perhaps the too thin aluminum case around which does not let diffuse the heat in it more than just locally and so limits the surface area for exchange with the ambient air - plus too less space between MB12" and the surface under it …. and less the not-so-good-applicated thermal paste… (put onto separate mounted cpu and gnu with one flash.. the chinese way...arrrggg…)

as you can see here:

https://de.ifixit.com/Teardown/Retina+Macbook+2015+Teardown/39841

 

[maflynn]

Personally unless the system is throttling or shutting down due to thermal overload, there is no need for user intervention

Even then, you may be better off taking it to Apple having them deal with it. Macs are more and more sealed and opening them up poses higher risk of damaging something, At least for me, the risks are not worth the reward.

 

[Queen6]

You didn´t even communicate the CPU-temperature after the re-pasting….

Me, I think the limiting factor (= bottle neck for heat transfer) is primarily the tiny (insufficient?) little metal piece for "cooling" and the too thin aluminum case around which does not diffuse the heat more than just locally and so limits the surface area for exchange with the ambient air - plus too less space between MB12" and the surface under it …. and less the not-so-good-applicated thermal paste… (put onto separate mounted cpu and gnu with one flash.. arrrggg…)

as you can see here:

https://de.ifixit.com/Teardown/Retina+Macbook+2015+Teardown/39841

For me the rMB`s cooling is fine, you just need to be mindful that the system is passive and what it`s sitting on. The cooling system also seems to be fairly effective given the TDP and the size of the baseplate.

My own 1.2 rMB will run at 2Ghz all day long if sat on a small powered cooler, which rather indicates the TIM, heat sync and baseplate can efficiently remove heat from the CPU at 100% load. Where the rMB will struggle is flat on the desk, in high ambient temperatures, as will any passive cooled system of the same spec.

Q-6

 

[MrAverigeUser]

For me the rMB`s cooling is fine, you just need to be mindful that the system is passive and what it`s sitting on. The cooling system also seems to be fairly effective given the TDP and the size of the baseplate.

My own 1.2 rMB will run at 2Ghz all day long if sat on a small powered cooler, which rather indicates the TIM, heat sync and baseplate can efficiently remove heat from the CPU at 100% load. Where the rMB will struggle is flat on the desk, in high ambient temperatures, as will any passive cooled system of the same spec.

Q-6

ok - but most people use it on a flat surface like a table , don´t they?

and add a cooler underneath the MB12" is a good solution for you - but not at all elegant in terms of mobility for everyone, is it?

 

[Queen6]

ok - but most people use it on a flat surface like a table , don´t they?

and add a cooler underneath the MB12" is a good solution for you - but not at all elegant in terms of mobility for everyone, is it?

I tend to elevate the rear of my notebooks for ergonomics, I am also mindful what the rMB is sat on, as the base is effectively the notebooks cooler. FWIW I have little if any issue with my 1.2 throttling, equally it`s usage spectrum matches it`s capabilities.

Not a solution, more a factor of curiosity, for CPU intensive tasks, I have far more powerful hardware, equally in pinch it`s handy to know how to get the most out of such a diminutive system.

Q-6

 

[DeltaMac]

ok - but most people use it on a flat surface like a table , don´t they?

and add a cooler underneath the MB12" is a good solution for you - but not at all elegant in terms of mobility for everyone, is it?

I think it is more important on a fanless system to consider how (and where) you use it, remembering that the case is quite efficient for cooling, but there's physical limits. Running tasks at a high CPU/GPU level likely means the throttling unless you have auxiliary cooling available, such as a cool pad.
If you want to stay "elegantly mobile", then be aware that throttling happens under some conditions - as it should.

To the OP - re-doing the thermal compound, if it makes the cooling more efficient, would make the link to the heatsink better - more heat transfer, so the exterior, in turn, would also be warmer. So, you did a good job, and it now feels warmer to you - as it should.
Better, as others here have suggested, is to compare the measured temps of the chipset, both before and after the re-grease. If you get better cooling, then the chipset should run cooler - and as a consequence, the outside case will be warmer. Does that make sense?

 

[MrAverigeUser]

To the OP - re-doing the thermal compound, if it makes the cooling more efficient, would make the link to the heatsink better - more heat transfer, so the exterior, in turn, would also be warmer. So, you did a good job, and it now feels warmer to you - as it should.
Better, as others here have suggested, is to compare the measured temps of the chipset, both before and after the re-grease. If you get better cooling, then the chipset should run cooler - and as a consequence, the outside case will be warmer. Does that make sense?

AGREE! this is an absolutely logical and convincing argument - as long as you show that it is now less or not more throttling than before under equal load-conditions.

 

[oneMadRssn]

I've changed the thermal paste on a few Apple computers recently. At most I see a 5C drop, which is not something you would feel at all on the exterior. Most of the time the drop is just 1-3C, or within the margin of error as I see it. That said, thermal paste in the Macs gets dry and crumbly after 3 or 4 years. Recently the 2011 Macbook Air we had since launch started heating up more, and I suspect the paste just stopped being as effective. Changing it did the trick, as the temperatures seem to be back to normal now.

 

[Bioshock.Rocks]

Thank you for responding guys (and gals) I didn't know I was going to get these many responses. The bad thing about this that would of been helpful was that I did NOT get a temp reading before, I got too excited to even think about it.

The reason why I changed the thermal paste was because on my Macbook Pro was running extra hot, changing the thermal paste helped stupendously - I thought by replacing the thermal paste on this Macbook without a fan would aid it big time.

Also, I thought the less thermal paste you apply the better? I opened up the heatsink on this Macbook and I see exactly what is picture on the Teardown for this Macbook over at iFixit

I added some of the Antec Formula 7 paste just to the 'reflector' part of the processor and not all over the processor like how its pictured.

With Core M does the thermal paste have to go all over the processor (the green part as shown in the picture?) or do you think how I did it is just fine?

Thank you

 

[unphased]

I definitely still have a soft spot for my A1534 as well. I have a 2017 model ("MacBook10,1"). I have an iPad Pro M1 and M1 Max 16" too at this point, but the 12" A1534 is still by far the most portable computer I own that I can still get work done on. (We can maybe revisit this a little when I get hands on steam deck, but that thing is missing a keyboard and might be out of the running.) Perhaps not quite as quickly to get something done, but the extreme portability definitely allows for having a computer with you in a range of situations that would otherwise preclude one.

I did find this topic that relates to the cooling situation:

https://www.reddit.com/r/macbookrepair/comments/ldbye3

This seems to indicate contrary to most of the discussion here that, provided you're ok with case temp rising quite a bit higher, there is definitely room for improvement if you want to allow the thing to hopefully both throttle less and live a bit longer.

Now my understanding of this all is that the 2015 model had more overall flakiness (perhaps it's accounted for mostly to heat), and that they must have improved this aspect in the 2017 version. I am in fact having some real trouble finding teardown photos of the specific 2017 version I've got. Might need to just go ahead and take it apart myself to see if the tolerances are different. Anyway, one point against doing this is that Apple did fix it for 2017 so that I no longer need to worry about it almost certainly dying on me due to heat like I would need to for a 2015 unit. But it seems that doing a shim/paste on CPU and a pad between heatsink and case is likely to offer something substantial.

What I can definitely say, is that according to iStats Menus, this thing regularly spends time throttling and bouncing off 100 degrees celsius. It'll struggle in that mode for multiple minutes upon rebooting and other various daily tasks. This is was the case right from the beginning.

I think that even if it ends up only gaining 10% or less of actual sustained performance, it still may be worthwhile just to get a significant reduction in the amount of time that the CPU section of the logic board is spending at such high temperatures.

I think that this guy's computer from the linked reddit thread has a lower spec CPU so that's why he can run cinebench without throttling, but my i7-7Y75 throttles pretty readily when running R23 single threaded, and definitely will throttle hard on the multi threaded benchmark.

Will post back if I ever end up embarking on this little project. The chip is kind of special, I've seen it boost to 3.1ghz and honestly even today it still has pep.

 

[EugW]

With regards to throttling, check out my 5 year-old MacBook 2017 thread:

This is how the 2017 MacBook Core m3, i5, i7 behave during sustained CPU load: 10+ runs of Cinebench

As I suspected, the table material makes a difference. The first time I ran the test on my 2017 MacBook Core m3, I ran it on a granite counter, and turned off WiFi and Bluetooth. I just ran it again, but this time ran it on a wood table (which would act more as an insulator, keeping the heat...

forums.macrumors.com

Bottom line, after 10 consecutive runs of Cinebench R15, performance loss on my Core m3-7Y32 was all of 7%. For the i7, it was a 6% performance loss.

For a fanless machine not designed for extended hardcore number crunching, that's not enough to worry about IMO. And for my machine, it feels about the same in everyday use as it did when I bought it, so I haven't bothered changing the thermal paste.

So far there have only been two Macs I've owned where I've bothered doing this: 1) MacPro1,1 when I upgraded the CPUs at age 15, and white MacBook4,1 which was over 10 years old at the time. Actually I have other Macs that are over 10 years old and I haven't bothered changing the thermal paste in those either.