MacBook Pro 9,1 CPU Temperature?

Discussion in 'MacBook Pro' started by kcrossley, Sep 12, 2015.

  1. kcrossley macrumors member

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    Mar 22, 2009
    #1
    I'm getting ready to upgrade the SSD and the hard drive in my Mid 2012 MacBook Pro 2.3GHz non-retina laptop. Since I'm opening this sucker up I'm wondering if I should reapply the thermal paste. My CPU speed with just Safari running is around 59C with a Samsung 840 Pro SSD and a Hitachi 1TB Travelstar 7200RPM drive. Do my temperatures look normal?

    http://www.everymac.com/systems/app...re-i7-2.3-15-mid-2012-unibody-usb3-specs.html

    Any advice is appreciated.

    Screen Shot 2015-09-12 at 5.07.49 PM.png
     
  2. macenied, Sep 12, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2015

    macenied macrumors 6502a

    macenied

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    Aug 20, 2014
    #2
    Looking perfectly fine to me. Sure, if you are comfortable with removing logicboards you could reapply the thermal paste but normally this should not be needed and the paste is expected to last for many years. If you are not so comfortable with this kind of work, stay away, there are chances that you could break connectors or cables.

    Never apply any force when you detach something. If it needs force, you are doing it wrong.
     
  3. snaky69 macrumors 603

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    Mar 14, 2008
    #3
    There are thousands upon thousands of threads on this very subforum asking the same question. And they all have the same answer.

    Yes your temperatures are normal.

    No you have nothing to worry about.

    Mobile silicon can safely reach 100-105C before throttling to prevent damage. There are failsafes whereas the computer will shut itself down if it ever reaches a point where heat could cause damage.

    I suggest you promptly uninstall all monitoring software, all they do is make you obsess over something you have very little control over and are taking away from the enjoyment of your machine.
     
  4. duervo, Sep 12, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2015

    duervo macrumors 68000

    duervo

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    #4
    Mine used to be like that until I reapplied the thermal paste. Now, they are this.

    I'll also add that these temps were with Chrome v45.0.2454.85 running (9 tabs open). Mainly because I find it interesting due to the fact that Chrome, prior to v45, was a beast on OS X. Giving credit where credit is due, it looks like (at this time) the Chrome devs have done a good job with v45 on OS X.
     

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  5. kcrossley thread starter macrumors member

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    Mar 22, 2009
    #5
    WOW! That's a big difference!

    I've read that the Apple assemblers get a little sloppy with the thermal paste and often use too much, which, as you know, has the opposite effect of its intended use. May I ask which brand of thermal paste you used? I was looking at the Arctic 5, but a lot of people are switching to Arctic MX-4 because it's easier to apply and is non-conductive.

    Also, what type of application did you use—pea sized dot, line, x-pattern, etc.?

    Here are some interesting videos I found on both:

     
  6. duervo macrumors 68000

    duervo

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    #6
    Tiny pea-sized glob, that I then spread around with a zip-lock sandwich bag that I wrap around my index finger. Gives me a smooth plastic surface around the finger tip.

    Keep in mind, paste does have a cure time. The time to cure varies with brand as well as type. Artic Silver 5, for example (what I used with my MBP) takes up to 200 hours to cure. So, temps shouldn't be measured until the curing is done.

    There are lots of theories around using lines, or drops, or spreading. I've tried them all, and never saw much of a difference worth noting between any of them. The key with all of them is that there needs to be paste coverage across the cores of the processor. So I just play it safe and spread the crap over it.

    My dual socket Xeon host had pea drops done to it when I built it. Idle temps were 28-30C (X5650's.) Next time I did them, I used lines, and got same results. Third and last time I did it, I just spread it like I did with my MBP, and got 29-31C. But a 1 degree diff could be attributed to me using different paste the last time, because I ran out of the Noctua paste that came with the heat sinks and fans. So, I'm not worried about it for now. Next time I do it, I'll try to get my hands on some more Noctua.
     
  7. kcrossley thread starter macrumors member

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    Mar 22, 2009
    #7
    duervo, what MacBook model do you have. I want to make sure I'm comparing Apples to Apples. Pun intended. :)
     
  8. duervo macrumors 68000

    duervo

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    #8
    Mid-2012 non-retina 15", i7-2.3, nVidia 650M 512MB. Same exact one you have, afaik.
     
  9. kcrossley, Sep 14, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2015

    kcrossley thread starter macrumors member

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    #9
    So overall what is your opinion of the thermal pasting job Apple did? Do you have any before and after photos? And finally, the Arctic Silver company recommends tinting the heat sink. Did you do that?

    Thanks!
     
  10. duervo macrumors 68000

    duervo

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    #10
    No photos.

    The job that the factory (not Apple) did with the paste left it literally oozing out the sides .. Enough so that even some of the the circuits that were up to 5mm away from the edge of the heat sink were covered in paste. Pretty standard job for the time, though. The Thinkpad W510's, T42's and T61P's were the same. All oozing out the side of the heat sinks. I re-applied the paste on them all once they were opened up for their first cleaning, which was usually about a year after initial power-on.

    I haven't looked at the Thinkpad W540 that I have now, so things may have changed for the better (I doubt it though.)

    So, liberal application of thermal paste is not something isolated to Apple's products. I think it's important to point that out here. It's pretty much industry-wide, which (IMO) points the finger at whatever factory/factories in China are responsible for the assembly.

    I didn't do anything to the heat sinks in any of the systems that I touched, MBP included. They are all still in stock condition.
     
  11. kcrossley thread starter macrumors member

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    Mar 22, 2009
    #11
    Thanks for the info. I found out that Arctic MX-4 is NOT made by Arctic Silver, which is a little misleading. I'll order the Arctic Silver 5 instead. Somebody mentioned that the bead should be about the size of a pencil eraser. Does that describe about how much you used?
     
  12. duervo macrumors 68000

    duervo

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    #12
    Depends on the pencil. Wooden pencil? Too big. The size I used was closer to mechanical pencil eraser size (those erasers that usually have some type of cap over them.) For my Xeons the bead was a little bigger (those processors have a much larger surface area than the mobile one in the MBP,) but still not as big as a wooden pencil eraser.

    The GPU surface is even smaller. If you do it, you will need to reapply the paste on both the CPU and GPU, because they are both covered by the same heat sink. (You can see that in videos though.)
     
  13. kcrossley thread starter macrumors member

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    Mar 22, 2009
    #13
    That's good to know. Thanks for the advice. I contacted Arctic Silver and they recommended a new thermal paste they now make, which is called Céramique™ 2. Apparently it's non-conductive and never dries out.

    http://www.arcticsilver.com/cmq2.html
     
  14. duervo macrumors 68000

    duervo

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    #14
    I've heard of that stuff too. I don't recall seeing a recommended cure time when I read about it though. You may want to ask them about that.
     
  15. kcrossley thread starter macrumors member

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    #15
    From Arctic Silver:

    Due to the unique shapes and sizes of the particles in Céramique 2, it will take a minimum of 25 hours and several thermal cycles to achieve maximum particle to particle thermal conduction and for the heatsink to CPU interface to reach maximum conductivity. (This period will be longer in a system without a fan on the heatsink.) On systems measuring actual internal core temperatures via the CPU's internal diode, the measured temperature will often drop slightly over this "break-in" period. This break-in will occur during the normal use of the computer as long as the computer is turned off from time to time and the interface is allowed to cool to room temperature. Once the break-in is complete, the computer can be left on if desired.

    Source: http://www.arcticsilver.com/cmq2.html
     
  16. duervo macrumors 68000

    duervo

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    #16
    Yeah, pretty vague though :(

    The MBP does not have a fan directly on the heat sink, so according to them it will take longer than 25 hours. I would err on the safe side and just assume a similar time as the AS 5: 200 hours. So, about 2 weeks of normal 8hr/day use.

    I suspect that they probably just don't have enough data yet to confidently state cure time for laptops.
     
  17. kcrossley thread starter macrumors member

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    #17
    True.

    It seems that most MacBook Pro owners go with Arctic Silver 5. My only concern with Arctic Silver 5 is that it's conductive. I'm assuming, based on your description of the OEM thermal compound that was in your system, that the manufacturer's use thermal compounds that are non-conductive.

    Did this point cause you any hesitation when deciding to go with Arctic Silver 5?
     
  18. duervo macrumors 68000

    duervo

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    #18
    Most likely was non-conductive, yeah. There was a thread around here ages ago where somebody posted the exact thermal paste that Apple uses, or what they suspected at the time was being used.

    If you use AS5, and conductivity is a concern for you, then I would use the spread method, and wouldn't bother with the bead or line, because once the heat sink is on, you won't be able to see how far the paste is coming out the sides, if at all. There's much less chance of oozing happening to that degree if you spread it on.
     
  19. kcrossley thread starter macrumors member

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    #19
    Did you spread the AC5 on the processor only or did you coat both the processor and the heat sink?
     
  20. duervo macrumors 68000

    duervo

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    #20
    Processor only. Back in the 90's I used to do both, but switched to CPU only about 12 years ago. I've seen no discernible difference in the results.

    Also, some people do both, some just do the heat sink. Doesn't really matter though. The key is to ensure that the physical cores get coverage with the paste.

    I used alcohol swabs to gently clean off the factory paste from the processor and heat sink first. I just use the swabs I can get at a drug store or Walmart where I am, by the pharmacy section. Couple dollars for a pack of 100 swabs. They work great for that purpose.
     
  21. kcrossley thread starter macrumors member

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    Mar 22, 2009
    #21
    After a lot of reading, I decided to go with Gelid GC-Extreme thermal compound. I'm going to attempt the replacement tonight (fingers crossed).

    Does anyone know how long it takes for Gelid to cure? Also, do I need to do anything special to the MacBook Pro, while the new compound is being cured?
     
  22. duervo macrumors 68000

    duervo

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    #22
    That stuff is non-curing. So, not applicable in your case.

    If you use a paste that requires cure time, you just have to use your system like you normally would.

    Take your time, that's all. First time I ever did thermal paste on a MBP, it took me roughly two hours. Now it probably takes me about 30 minutes (still take my time doing it.) I used the iFixit guides to check for any caveats (and there are some.) The most common areas where people screw up are stripping screws, or breaking cable connectors or cables, because they were simply too rough on the unit. If a cable appears to be "stuck" when you try to disconnect it, that's a warning sign for you to stop and verify (iFixit and YouTube) that you are disconnecting that particular cable properly, because while some cables you just pull up on (like the one for the battery), others you need to slide out across the surface of the logic board (not up and away from it.)

    Don't use a metallic object like a flat screwdriver to pry the battery cable off. You risk shorting out the system and damaging it if you do. If you don't have a plastic spudger, then the corner of something like a drivers license, credit card, or (my fav) a store points card or frequent flyer card should do the job.
     
  23. kcrossley thread starter macrumors member

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    Mar 22, 2009
    #23
    Great tips. Thank you. And yes, I learned many years ago (after destroying many an item) NEVER to force anything. Unfortunately, my sons haven't learned that lesson yet. :)

    What did you use to clean off the heat sink and CPU. Some people suggest coffee liners, probably because they're lint free.
     
  24. duervo macrumors 68000

    duervo

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    #24
    I used alcohol swabs that I bought from the pharmacy section at Walmart. $2 for a box of 100 swabs. I probably used about 6 of them before I was satisfied the heatsink, CPU, and GPU were clean.

    Don't worry too much if you can't get all the old compound off the tiny circuits close by the chips. (I left them alone on mine.)
     
  25. kcrossley thread starter macrumors member

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    Mar 22, 2009
    #25
    Good idea. Thanks. I'll update this thread as soon as I'm done. May even have a few photos to share. :)
     

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