Macbook pro retina with mountain lion UI

Zedman5526

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Aug 25, 2012
14
0
Hi I've read various threads about the stuttering/lag in the mountain lion UI and I have some question. Is this a software problem that can be patched up with an update? I get stuttering when I switch from dashboard to desktop. but not desktop to dashboard using the control arrow key method. Is this the kind of stutter people has been getting like during the transition animation?
 

stevelam

macrumors 65816
Nov 4, 2010
1,215
3

nontroppo

macrumors 6502
Mar 11, 2009
430
21
How exactly does "pixel scaling" cause "stuttering" - can you link to the relevant analysis that says the nearest neighbour interpolation algorithms saturate memory bandwidth or overwhelm GPU/CPU computational resource, or are you pulling that out of your proverbial ... — this is a software issue, and doesn't affect most users.
 
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AZREOSpecialist

macrumors 68020
Mar 15, 2009
2,115
925
Don't listen to clueless posts like these who clearly dont understand that it isn't a resolution issue, it's a pixel scaling issue.

No one knows if it can be fixed via software.
^^ and don't listen to people like this who are equally clueless and don't understand that this issue does not even exist. Not only do these people not even own or use the machine in question, they are unable to reproduce the issue and post a video.

To the OP, I suggest you go to a Mac reseller and try for yourself. You're never going to figure this out by reading forums. Go and use the machine and judge for yourself.
 
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Stetrain

macrumors 68040
Feb 6, 2009
3,548
18
Don't listen to clueless posts like these who clearly dont understand that it isn't a resolution issue, it's a pixel scaling issue.

No one knows if it can be fixed via software.
Scaling performance could cause issues with the non-best-for-retina modes, but should have nothing to do with performance in Best for Retina mode.

The only thing being scaled in Best for Retina mode are non-retina apps, and those are simply pixel doubled which should be pretty computationally inexpensive.
 

nontroppo

macrumors 6502
Mar 11, 2009
430
21
Even at non-best-for retina:

Bandwidth of the NVidia 650M is 80GB/s ... Bandwidth on the Intel HD 4000 is 25.6GB/s ... Even at our oversampled 3840x2400 we have a demand of 1.6GB/s — still way under the memory bandwidth of either card.
Interpolation (pixel scaling) is backed by solid hardware (as it is used often in games) and is a very cheap operation computationally, especially the nearest-neighbour used in most places.
 
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Zedman5526

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Aug 25, 2012
14
0
Hi guys, thanks for the reply, I've had a play around with the gfx card status and it seems that the lag disapears when using the discrete graphics card setting i.e the nvidia card. the transition stutter from dash board to desktop using control arrow key seems to be a problem caused by the integrated graphics card. so there is a fix but its taxing to the batteries. any opinion?
 

stevelam

macrumors 65816
Nov 4, 2010
1,215
3
^^ and don't listen to people like this who are equally clueless and don't understand that this issue does not even exist. Not only do these people not even own or use the machine in question, they are unable to reproduce the issue and post a video.

To the OP, I suggest you go to a Mac reseller and try for yourself. You're never going to figure this out by reading forums. Go and use the machine and judge for yourself.
theres a difference between an issue not existing and a user completely ignoring them like you do. you've already made previous comments on how little glitches and minor slowdowns don't *bother* you at all. thats completely different from saying they don't actually exist.

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How exactly does "pixel scaling" cause "stuttering" - can you link to the relevant analysis that says the nearest neighbour interpolation algorithms saturate memory bandwidth or overwhelm GPU/CPU computational resource, or are you pulling that out of your proverbial ... — this is a software issue, and doesn't affect most users.
read the bottom line from this screenshot.



allow me to bold it for you.

Using a scaled resolution may affect performance
or are you saying you know something more than the fine folks at apple?
 

nontroppo

macrumors 6502
Mar 11, 2009
430
21
or are you saying you know something more than the fine folks at apple?
No, I'm responding to the OP that asked about the origin of the stutter some people have complained about.

Your screenshot says nothing about what Apple think "may" affect performance, and an objective analysis of the hardware makes it clear it is not hardware based. Therefore this is a software issue; unless you have evidence to the contrary?

Will Apple optimise their drivers and WindowServer drawing code? I suspect things will get better, though I personally have little faith in the GPU driver engineers at Apple. Luckily, at least for me, the rMBP works wonderfully in the real world under heavy workloads even at the "may affect performance" 1200p, today.

The only reliably reproducible unusable UI performance I can elicit is resizing the App Store (quartz debug shows a glitchy ~10fps), but that even floors my 2012 ATI5870 24GB octocore Mac Pro running a 2560x1440 non-retina Cinema Display (also ~10fps), so this is not rMBP specific. The fact some people see this depending on the browser they use, or in the case of the Spaces animation depending on what program is running in the destination space or what settings are applied to the dock just confirms this is software based.
 
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AZREOSpecialist

macrumors 68020
Mar 15, 2009
2,115
925
Ah yes, denial as practiced by many, brings them a very blissful life :)
You can't deny the existence of something that does not exist, right?

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theres a difference between an issue not existing and a user completely ignoring them like you do. you've already made previous comments on how little glitches and minor slowdowns don't *bother* you at all. thats completely different from saying they don't actually exist.
Your efforts might be better spent at posting a video of the actual issue versus expounding about it ad nauseum. I have yet to find anyone here at MacRumors who is able to post a simple video showing these problems. If you can't show us the problems, how do you expect anyone to believe they exist? Is this like god or something? LOL
 

Zedman5526

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Aug 25, 2012
14
0
coming to think of it the lag/stutter in mountain lion Ui is not a model specific thing, i.e I've read in other threads that the macbook air and even the i mac is having a little stutter problem. and they all seem to have it down to the problem with the drivers of HD4000 intel graphics card.