Wow!! So, they came to your house and ripped these features right out of your MB?? That's horrible!!
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Wow!! So, they came to your house and ripped these features right out of your MB?? That's horrible!!
I don't really understand how Apple is tightening their profit margin on the new MacBook, it's not the lack of firewire, battery meter, or IR port that make me say that.. nor the lack of an SD card port, those things all add up to less than $10 in raw materials.
A $300 HP very likely has all of that, and despite being the same res with a 15" screen, and with a much cheaper processor .. still....
What's Apple doing to be making slim profits? They need to fire their accountants if they can't profit huge off the new MacBook, it can't possibly cost them more than $300-400 (max) even with R&D to produce.
Seriously, and it looks fine to me, but there's very little compelling about it. I'm not sure about the new LED screen, but the old plastic MacBook screen was by far the worst LCD in the industry, even worse quality than perhaps those $300 HP laptops.
A $300 HP very likely has all of that, and despite being the same res with a 15" screen, and with a much cheaper processor .. still....
What's Apple doing to be making slim profits? They need to fire their accountants if they can't profit huge off the new MacBook, it can't possibly cost them more than $300-400 (max) even with R&D to produce.
Seriously, and it looks fine to me, but there's very little compelling about it. I'm not sure about the new LED screen, but the old plastic MacBook screen was by far the worst LCD in the industry, even worse quality than perhaps those $300 HP laptops.
Wrong. They aren't subsidizing this model to grow it's market share.
HP's biggest footprint is in Printing.
That subsidies losses in other divisions.
No Ir??
What is the flippin point of releasing a new macbook and remote on the day and not make them compatible? Especially as the write up says that any mac from 2005-onwards will work with the new remote??
Big fail if true Apple.
What is the flippin point of releasing a new macbook and remote on the day and not make them compatible? Especially as the write up says that any mac from 2005-onwards will work with the new remote??
Big fail if true Apple.
While I don't like it one bit, I can at least understand SOME rationale in the claim that FireWire is more of a "Pro" feature than otherwise. However, there is little justification in similar claims for the IR port or SD card reader.
Given that IR ports and remotes are increasingly common on computers less expensive than the MacBook, it seems unlikely to have been removed to cut costs or keep a given price point. It also seems reasonable that a fair amount of its use would come from people using the remote to listen to music via Front Row or iTunes, or changing slides in a presentation (possibly one in a college classroom), none of which is a strictly professional use, so the argument that it is a "Pro" feature appears to be unjustified. So why was it removed? Was it to upsell to the MacBook Pro? Or was it a sacrifice of the form of the new design over function? Whatever the reason, I don't think all of the people complaining about its loss are suffering from a sense of entitlement.
If Apple were going to include a card reader on any of their notebooks, I would have though it would be in the MacBook rather than the MacBook Pros. This could be a result of my ignorance of high-end cameras and such, but so many of the little point-and-shoot cameras out there use SD and SDHC cards that it makes more sense to me to have one on a consumer-oriented machine than one intended for professional use. As with the IR port, the fact that so many inexpensive computers do have card readers (sometimes several of them for the various types of cards), it seems unlikely that it was left off to cut costs or keep the price point. If it was sacrificed for the form factor, that is a shame. If it was sacrificed to upsell the MacBook Pro, that is even more of a shame.
I understand that Apple would like to create a distinction between the MacBook and 13" MacBook Pro, but they're going about it in what is to me an odd way. Customers who are looking to buy a computer for their jobs may have specialized needs that a standard MacBook doesn't (and maybe shouldn't try to) meet. For example, my work as a student (which will hopefully eventually lead to similar work professionally) frequently requires that I write and test simulations that are intended to run on multi-processor machines. Everything I write must be tested on one of my university's clusters, but waiting in the queue can be very time consuming. It would be a great help if I could do more extensive testing on my own machine prior to submitting to the queue, but I would need something with four cores. Since these are projects in regular, required coursework, I am not eligible for any kind of grant to purchase something like a Mac Pro, which in all honesty would be far more than I need given that I have access to the clusters for anything that truly requires power. Since portability would be more beneficial than sheer power, I would be just fine with a moderately-powerful 4-core laptop. If Apple doesn't want to offer one, that's fine, but this is an example of just one option that is specialized and not for everyone that would be a legitimate distinction between the consumer and professional models.
I'm sure that my situation is not unique. To cater to specialized needs, Pro models should be offering options like a different selection of GPUs or more dedicated memory in the existing ones, higher-resolution screens, panels with greater viewing angles or color fidelity, 4-core processors or faster variants of those currently in use, extra ports, or Express Card slots. These are plainly obvious ways to separate a consumer-oriented model from a professional-oriented one. While we see some of those in limited form, we more often see artificial distinctions that seem arbitrary or even pointless to many, which is in my opinion where at least some of the ire apparent on this board may be coming from.
The poster who mentioned leather seats and a moonroof has it right when it comes to the true distinction between the models: luxury. Aluminum bodies and arguably sleeker styling on the MBPs are not something that will help a person do a job any better than plastic, however they are a sort of luxury and serve to make the MBPs a status symbol. I like anything I buy to be aesthetically pleasing, so I'm very happy that Apple offer a good design; however it should not be a substitute for the options that really do make a machine distinguished for professional work, and removing everyday options like an IR port or SD card reader from the base option to make the MacBook Pro models seem like better deals shouldn't fool anyone.
In fact, since the MacBook Pros don't really offer any specialized features that would make them better suited to some professional use, maybe they should just rename them MacBook Lux? If everyone is clear that they are intended to be the equivalent of leather seats, maybe fewer people would be upset when Apple makes this sort of change to the lineup?
Given that IR ports and remotes are increasingly common on computers less expensive than the MacBook, it seems unlikely to have been removed to cut costs or keep a given price point. It also seems reasonable that a fair amount of its use would come from people using the remote to listen to music via Front Row or iTunes, or changing slides in a presentation (possibly one in a college classroom), none of which is a strictly professional use, so the argument that it is a "Pro" feature appears to be unjustified. So why was it removed? Was it to upsell to the MacBook Pro? Or was it a sacrifice of the form of the new design over function? Whatever the reason, I don't think all of the people complaining about its loss are suffering from a sense of entitlement.
If Apple were going to include a card reader on any of their notebooks, I would have though it would be in the MacBook rather than the MacBook Pros. This could be a result of my ignorance of high-end cameras and such, but so many of the little point-and-shoot cameras out there use SD and SDHC cards that it makes more sense to me to have one on a consumer-oriented machine than one intended for professional use. As with the IR port, the fact that so many inexpensive computers do have card readers (sometimes several of them for the various types of cards), it seems unlikely that it was left off to cut costs or keep the price point. If it was sacrificed for the form factor, that is a shame. If it was sacrificed to upsell the MacBook Pro, that is even more of a shame.
I understand that Apple would like to create a distinction between the MacBook and 13" MacBook Pro, but they're going about it in what is to me an odd way. Customers who are looking to buy a computer for their jobs may have specialized needs that a standard MacBook doesn't (and maybe shouldn't try to) meet. For example, my work as a student (which will hopefully eventually lead to similar work professionally) frequently requires that I write and test simulations that are intended to run on multi-processor machines. Everything I write must be tested on one of my university's clusters, but waiting in the queue can be very time consuming. It would be a great help if I could do more extensive testing on my own machine prior to submitting to the queue, but I would need something with four cores. Since these are projects in regular, required coursework, I am not eligible for any kind of grant to purchase something like a Mac Pro, which in all honesty would be far more than I need given that I have access to the clusters for anything that truly requires power. Since portability would be more beneficial than sheer power, I would be just fine with a moderately-powerful 4-core laptop. If Apple doesn't want to offer one, that's fine, but this is an example of just one option that is specialized and not for everyone that would be a legitimate distinction between the consumer and professional models.
I'm sure that my situation is not unique. To cater to specialized needs, Pro models should be offering options like a different selection of GPUs or more dedicated memory in the existing ones, higher-resolution screens, panels with greater viewing angles or color fidelity, 4-core processors or faster variants of those currently in use, extra ports, or Express Card slots. These are plainly obvious ways to separate a consumer-oriented model from a professional-oriented one. While we see some of those in limited form, we more often see artificial distinctions that seem arbitrary or even pointless to many, which is in my opinion where at least some of the ire apparent on this board may be coming from.
The poster who mentioned leather seats and a moonroof has it right when it comes to the true distinction between the models: luxury. Aluminum bodies and arguably sleeker styling on the MBPs are not something that will help a person do a job any better than plastic, however they are a sort of luxury and serve to make the MBPs a status symbol. I like anything I buy to be aesthetically pleasing, so I'm very happy that Apple offer a good design; however it should not be a substitute for the options that really do make a machine distinguished for professional work, and removing everyday options like an IR port or SD card reader from the base option to make the MacBook Pro models seem like better deals shouldn't fool anyone.
In fact, since the MacBook Pros don't really offer any specialized features that would make them better suited to some professional use, maybe they should just rename them MacBook Lux? If everyone is clear that they are intended to be the equivalent of leather seats, maybe fewer people would be upset when Apple makes this sort of change to the lineup?
It isn't a crap machine...
I believe Apple is simply trying to keep costs down while increasing the power of the system. If they have to sacrifice some of the lesser features such as a battery charge indicator on the outside or an IR port, well...good. I would rather that then to pay an extra $100 for features not essential to be a quality Apple product. And with the introduction of the new LED screens, I'm sure Apple had to cut costs somewhere.
I believe Apple is simply trying to keep costs down while increasing the power of the system. If they have to sacrifice some of the lesser features such as a battery charge indicator on the outside or an IR port, well...good. I would rather that then to pay an extra $100 for features not essential to be a quality Apple product. And with the introduction of the new LED screens, I'm sure Apple had to cut costs somewhere.
Umm My early '09 MacBook certainly does have an IR port...
The iSight does nothing when the green light isn't on.
And what about the Mac Mini?
I agree with most of the opinions here about downgrading the Macbook feature to help distinguish the Pro. It's also possibly that the 13" Macbook Pro is such good value that they are forced to strip features out of the new Macbook to seperate it in the market. Lets not forget that the recent 13" unibody Macbook was relabeled 13" Macbook Pro's =)
The white plastic MacBook is by far the largest selling Mac ever. It sells over aluminum MBPs and MBs. A lot of people view the aluminum as a negative that is pretty but easily dings and damages while plastic stays nice and durable.
Exactly. It's a nice $799 laptop that's missing a few features other $799 laptops have.
ARe these $700 notebooks as well?
http://blog.laptopmag.com/mac-tax-repealed-new-macbook-compares-favorably-to-similarly-priced-pcs
Bt
But it does have bluetooth, so it can be controlled via iPhone/IPT
The lack of infrared port surprises me given the new remotes. Are they now a "pro" feature too?
But it does have bluetooth, so it can be controlled via iPhone/IPT
Two possible reasons for the lack of an IR port:
1) Apple wants to drive the consumer to the Apple TV as opposed to Front Row on the Mac. Now the MB is less convenient than the ATV for viewing movies or listening to music.
2) Apple would probably remove the IR port from the MBP if so many professionals weren't using their MBPs for slideshows. However, many students (most of whom probably buy a MB) also use the remote for slideshows, so this move is just baffling.
But college kids who buy a MB will need a remote for presentations! For some students, even a $200 difference between the MB and MBP is hard to swallow when they don't even have pennies to rub together.
I'm pretty surprised at the lack of IR receiver; then again, that seems to be one of those features that you either use or don't.
This MacBook reminds me of the eMac, and I'm pretty sure that's the market they had in mind when they created this Mac. It's simple, robust, functional, and they'll be able to drop the price by mass producing it before next years education buying season.
As for the IR port... I have a black MacBook I've been using for 3 years+ now and I honestly can't remember the last time I used the remote, or where it is for that matter. Meanwhile, most movies and anything you download typically does not come in MPEG format and doesn't work in Front Row, plus watching movies on a 13-inch screen from far away isn't practical. I simply hook my Mac to my TV whenever I want to watch a movie, and the remote doesn't work with VLC. So yea, unless you buy stuff off iTunes all the time it's not really that useful for a 13-inch laptop.
As for FireWire-400, it's dead and has been for years. Apple themselves doesn't don't even make devices that use FireWire anymore, the iPods and iPhone have long been USB only. Meanwhile, there is almost no device that uses FireWire exclusively anymore, almost all cameras and video cameras use USB now, and when it comes to FireWire hard drives they all use FireWire 800 and USB 2. I expect FireWire-800 to be phased out soon as well. There's some politics behind this as USB is Intel's baby, and Macs are now Intel. Once Intel drops USB 3 Apple will be one of the first companies to jump onboard and it will be the foreseeable death of FireWire-800. Meanwhile, Apple has teamed up with Intel to create a next gen fiberoptic universal connector / port that will likely replace FireWire, and video in/out function.
As for the indicator lights for the battery... seriously? People use these? If I want to know how much battery I have I just open my laptop. Never in my 8-years of being an Apple laptop owner have I had any use for the indicator lights on the battery. The only time I could foresee using them is if the battery is detached from the computer someone has several batteries and needs to double check to see which one is charged. This new MacBook doesn't have a user removable battery so this point is moot.
If anything the biggest issue with this new MacBook is the fact the battery is not user removable, and should probably cost $100 less. Meanwhile the EDU discount is only $50 off, when it is $100 for even the entry level MBP-13. Meaning it's only a $150 pricing difference for the education market between models. It's nice, but could be better. Apple really needs to find a way to get this MacBook into the retail $899 spot, and education pricing at least $849.
As for the IR port... I have a black MacBook I've been using for 3 years+ now and I honestly can't remember the last time I used the remote, or where it is for that matter. Meanwhile, most movies and anything you download typically does not come in MPEG format and doesn't work in Front Row, plus watching movies on a 13-inch screen from far away isn't practical. I simply hook my Mac to my TV whenever I want to watch a movie, and the remote doesn't work with VLC. So yea, unless you buy stuff off iTunes all the time it's not really that useful for a 13-inch laptop.
As for FireWire-400, it's dead and has been for years. Apple themselves doesn't don't even make devices that use FireWire anymore, the iPods and iPhone have long been USB only. Meanwhile, there is almost no device that uses FireWire exclusively anymore, almost all cameras and video cameras use USB now, and when it comes to FireWire hard drives they all use FireWire 800 and USB 2. I expect FireWire-800 to be phased out soon as well. There's some politics behind this as USB is Intel's baby, and Macs are now Intel. Once Intel drops USB 3 Apple will be one of the first companies to jump onboard and it will be the foreseeable death of FireWire-800. Meanwhile, Apple has teamed up with Intel to create a next gen fiberoptic universal connector / port that will likely replace FireWire, and video in/out function.
As for the indicator lights for the battery... seriously? People use these? If I want to know how much battery I have I just open my laptop. Never in my 8-years of being an Apple laptop owner have I had any use for the indicator lights on the battery. The only time I could foresee using them is if the battery is detached from the computer someone has several batteries and needs to double check to see which one is charged. This new MacBook doesn't have a user removable battery so this point is moot.
If anything the biggest issue with this new MacBook is the fact the battery is not user removable, and should probably cost $100 less. Meanwhile the EDU discount is only $50 off, when it is $100 for even the entry level MBP-13. Meaning it's only a $150 pricing difference for the education market between models. It's nice, but could be better. Apple really needs to find a way to get this MacBook into the retail $899 spot, and education pricing at least $849.
@*LTD*
You keep repeating that firewire is dead. It's not dead yet. It's surely dying, but it's not dead yet, and it won't be for a while. Floppy's are dead, not firewire.
You keep repeating that firewire is dead. It's not dead yet. It's surely dying, but it's not dead yet, and it won't be for a while. Floppy's are dead, not firewire.
Thank you. I'm not a pro, but I use Firewire..
Who remembers when MacBooks used to come bundled with the remotes in the box
No, it's two. The MacBook air has one speaker and they mention it here
I've flipped my black Macbook to look at the battery a total of two or three times to see how much juice I have left. It either is plugged in or on battery power (at which point the battery meter indicates what left).
The remote was a neat feature initially but after I got a Touch & they released the Apple Remote app, it's been tucked away in a drawer somewhere forgotten.
Firewire is nostalgic, but not a deal-breaker for me either. With the price of cheap, external USB drives that I use primarily for backup, it's just a matter of plugging it in and walking away.
What does interest me is the current machine costs nearly half of what mine did 3 years ago, has more power under the hood, recognizes a full 4GB, has a better screen, and a better graphics subsystem to boot and comes at a time when I'm looking for an inexpensive upgrade option.
The remote was a neat feature initially but after I got a Touch & they released the Apple Remote app, it's been tucked away in a drawer somewhere forgotten.
Firewire is nostalgic, but not a deal-breaker for me either. With the price of cheap, external USB drives that I use primarily for backup, it's just a matter of plugging it in and walking away.
What does interest me is the current machine costs nearly half of what mine did 3 years ago, has more power under the hood, recognizes a full 4GB, has a better screen, and a better graphics subsystem to boot and comes at a time when I'm looking for an inexpensive upgrade option.
The Macbook started life as the eBook the laptop version of the eMac.
I too find it strange people believe they need to go pro to get a remote. I mean it still has bluetooth and lots of people will want a mouse for use when on a desk,... so buy a mouse that doubles as media remote. You could buy to the the fancyists ones you can find (or one co-branded by some swanky designer) for the price difference of macbook to pro. The magic mouse touch gestures probable does does a better job than the remote and it doubles mouse.
Firewire or SD Slot or Both, yes I could see that pushing people up to needing a Pro. But A remote control
would love to see a new iMac teardown iFixit, and a core i5/core i7 teardown when theyre released.
I'm starting to wonder if Apple removes and puts back features (newer models) later to make people want to upgrade.
