MacBookPro NVIDIA 8600GT issues

Discussion in 'Mac and PC Games' started by theSchtickler, Jun 27, 2007.

  1. theSchtickler macrumors member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2007
    #1
    So I just get my brand new 15" MBP with 4GB RAM and 256MB GFX card, and I test my fave multiplayer Call of Duty 2, and it runs like silk at full rez on my Dell 24" at 1920x1600. Fantastic!

    Then I quit it, do a days work, and the next time I start it up, its running like a piece of crap! Totally unplayable, its like just skips twice a second. I've read that Apple have written some appauling NVIDIA drivers, which makes sense apart from the fact that it ran so well the first time?

    Anyone got any ideas on how to fix this issue?
     
  2. grossimassi macrumors newbie

    grossimassi

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2007
    #2
    I dunno...
    I hope they fix these GeForce drivers...
    People with radeon gfx can play World of Warcraft with any problem, and with a better video card I have many problem and game its not playable at all.
    Reading ton of forums these days... noone can tell me how this is possible.
    Lets wait and see
     
  3. DoFoT9 macrumors P6

    DoFoT9

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2007
    Location:
    Singapore
    #3
    do you run parallels at all?? not to play the game, but just to do work...

    does a restart do anything?
     
  4. theSchtickler thread starter macrumors member

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    Jun 27, 2007
    #4
    Yeah, tried restarting, tried reinstalling, trashed the prefs.....

    And haven't installed parallels yet, though I will soon.

    I think I'm gonna have to install bootcamp and XP, then buy a PC copy just so I can play it.....:mad:
     
  5. rbarris macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2003
    Location:
    Irvine CA
    #5
    A software update for 8600 based MBP's was released today, please try it out.
     
  6. theSchtickler thread starter macrumors member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2007
    #6
    Loaded the update, its an improvement, but its still unplayable. Why do they bother releasing a patch that they haven't written properly. Two strikes ... :mad:
     
  7. rbarris macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2003
    Location:
    Irvine CA
    #7
    Please drop me an email - I'd like to investigate more closely what is happening on your machine.
     
  8. roaringchicken macrumors newbie

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    Nov 25, 2007
    Location:
    Canberra, Australia
    #8
    Did anyone find a solution to this problem? Just bought a MBP with 8600GT 128MB and have exactly the same issue.

    Andrew.
     
  9. rbarris macrumors 6502

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    Location:
    Irvine CA
    #9
    Can you be more specific which type of issue you are running into ?
     
  10. roaringchicken macrumors newbie

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    Nov 25, 2007
    Location:
    Canberra, Australia
    #10
    That described by the original thread poster. When he tried playing COD2 on a new MBP with 8600GT card, it was unplayable - "its like just skips twice a second".

    I have exactly the same issue - just upgraded from a MBP with 1600XT to a new 2.2Ghz MBP with 128MB 8600GT card. And COD2 runs like a dog at any resolution. Really strange - the frame rate might be 20-30 fps but the experience is a 'skipping' type one (as if 2-3 fps). As a comparison, there is no problem with UT2004 - it runs even better (can now do 1920 x 1200 at max settings).
     
  11. DoFoT9 macrumors P6

    DoFoT9

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    Jun 11, 2007
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    Singapore
    #11
    did u change the power settings at all?? e.g. running off battery. because that might clock it down to save power

    if its not that id say that its a coding error or something similar.
     
  12. MichalM.Mac macrumors regular

    MichalM.Mac

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2006
    #12
    Same Problem

    2.4 Ghz MacBook Pro - GF8600M GT 256 MB VRAM. MacOS X 10.5.1

    I tried to play CoD 2 on high and low setting, but game is still weird .. choppy .. hard to desribe. I turn FPS counter on (via console) and i have 50-60 frames per second on low, medium and high setting. I belive, that game is "choppy" because of drivers. See.. i have perfect real framerate, but on screen it's not that good. Friend has MBPro with X1600 and everything is ok...

    sorry about my English...
     
  13. roaringchicken macrumors newbie

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    Nov 25, 2007
    Location:
    Canberra, Australia
    #13
    Haven't found any solutions yet so I've done the one thing that I have least hope in - logging a support request with the supplier! I like Aspyr however my experience of support from software companies (in general) has been appalling (the exception being 'one-man' bands). They usually ignore what you have written and go through pro-forma questions that presume you are an idiot. Anyway, rant off. I look forward to being pleasantly surprised by Aspyr...
     
  14. jakeguy99 macrumors regular

    jakeguy99

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2007
    #14
    The problem was supposedly fixed when apple sent out the new MBP update, however it did not fix the problem in CoD 2 and if you email aspyr support all they will say is that it is an Apple issue. We need to go directly to apple and tell them the issue was not fully resolved. (The update fixed the stuttering issue in world of warcraft). However in the mean time; go to console and set your max fps to about 45 or 50. It will fix the stuttering issue and is a temp fix for this problem. The command for this is /com_maxfps 45 and to make sure it is working /cg_drawfps 1
     
  15. MichalM.Mac macrumors regular

    MichalM.Mac

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2006
    #15
    Temporary..

    Thanks for tempopary solution. Now the issue is less visible, but i still have weird felling about game and screen refreshing. Does Apple know about that ? If not, what we have to do about that ? some letter from "mac gaming comunity" ? Well ... i'll be very happy if they realese fix soon.
     
  16. jakeguy99 macrumors regular

    jakeguy99

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2007
    #16
    Yes, i think this is the best idea, we need names and a lot of them for them to actually fix this issue. It took them months to "fix" the issue that was to supposed to fix the CoD 2 graphics tearing issue along with other graphics problems. The lower fps settings will work fine, but it is not the same as playing on maxed fps. Also set your refresh rate at 75, that may fix your other problem. And il be happy to sign the letter to apple.
     
  17. Freyqq macrumors 68040

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2004
    #17
    is this in OSX?

    in vista i cannot hit over 1024x768 on my 2.2 ghz MBP even though I'm using a 24" monitor capable of 1900x1200. The new drivers were suppose to fix the issue but have not. Any suggestions? THanks.
     
  18. jakeguy99 macrumors regular

    jakeguy99

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2007
    #18
    Yes, with cod 4 i have the same problem, the game quits out if you go above 1024x768. Sadly I have not been able to figure this one out yet as it is winblows, i cant even get my monitor to stay as main screen after restart. I will look into this more and see if there is a fix.
     
  19. MichalM.Mac macrumors regular

    MichalM.Mac

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2006
    #19
    Letter

    I gladly sign.. if somebody write it. I think thah my english isn't good enough for that so i leave this on someone else, who uses english as primary language :)
     
  20. roaringchicken macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2007
    Location:
    Canberra, Australia
    #20
    Well, I got a response from Aspyr. There was the usual stuff assuming I'm an idiot
    ...make sure that no other programs are running in the background. Be especially aware of any programs that access the internet...
    and then the pertinent response:
    We have found that the GeForce 8600 has some problems processing the graphics in some of our games.
    We are currently working diligently with Apple to get these issues resolved. Since none of our titles were ever tested or approved for play on The Nvidia 8600 that is in the new Macbook Pros, we cannot support any of our games on these machines at this time.
    Apple did just release an Open GL update specifically for New MacBook Pros with the 8600 in them.
    You can download it here:
    http://www.apple.com/support/downloads/macbookprosoftwareupdate12.html
    Of course the Open GL update appears as one of the normal Apple updates so I had already installed it (and made no difference).

    I find this Aspyr's response surprising. It has been my experience that games made for older graphics card usually work better (and without any issue) on newer cards. This is the first time I've ever encountered this sort of problem and I've been playing games over many (10+) years on just about every (professional) laptop Apple has released during that time. However, I admit that the developers will have much better insight into this than I will!
     
  21. supahmunky macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2008
    #21
    Solving this issue and gaining serious performance:

    After thorough studies in a lab at my university, here's what I've found about this issue on my MBP (C2D 2.2ghz, 4GB ram, GF8600GTm 128MB, 160gb HDD @ 7200rpm): MBPs run very hot, and the firmware instructs the CPU and GPU to temporarily downclock every other second or so when reaching a certain heat to limit the generated heat. For the fraction of a second when they downclock, the computer can't generate images as well so the game skips. That's why the games run fine at first when the computer is cool, but quickly become unplayable. It's basically a design flaw from the MBP: Apple could remove this feature but then the MBPs would be at severe risk of overheating because it can't clear out the heat on its own; not with this thin aluminum body and small fans. Keeping it that way protects your hardware but won't let you use it to its full potential... the different updates try to balance out safety and performance loss, but the problem will always remain because it's inherent to the computer's design. (They also have to deal with battery issues, but we'll assume that you don't care much about gaming performance when you're not plugged into the wall.)

    As far as solutions go, you could hack the Apple firmware and remove this, but it would not only ruin your warranty, it would greatly endanger your computer. So your only safe option is to externally cool down the CPU and the GPU so the firmware won't have to downclock them to prevent overheating.

    Personally, and since I use my MBP as both my main and my gaming computer, here's my setup:

    First part: I have two 12cm fans blowing cold air on the CPU and GPU at all times. To help you with placement: if you look at the keyboard from the top, one chip is under the / button and one is under the 6. If you blow air directly on them at all times, they will NEVER overheat and thus never downclock under normal operation. You'll also notice a significant performance boost because they operate cooler thus more efficiently. If you're looking for serious gaming performance tweaks though, read on...

    Second part: I like to dig more out of my machine, so for gaming (under Windows naturally), I'm using a modified Forceware 167.45. Supercache uses 1GB of my ram to give to the video card, so I have a total of 1.128gb of VRAM. With Rivatuner, I'm clocking my CPU at 2.6ghz, my GPU at 650mhz and my VRAM at 1050mhz which is the most I've found it safe to overclock. This all amounts to terrific gaming performance, but terrific heat too. With this setup, I had to build an extra external cooling device...

    To safely use my overclocking setup, my computer rests on a piece of aluminum under which runs copper tubing through which I send regular car coolant. There's also a piece of cloth to protect the computer from the possible condensation, and underlying fans are built into the tubing, drafting air from a cold area though holes into the aluminum onto the CPU and GPU. I have a pump that circulates the prestone in the tubing under the computer from a 2L tank. Once it's out from under the computer, I have a 40cm x 40cm intercooler built on a 30cm industrial fan that cools down the prestone and sends it back in the tank. The whole liquid cooling system cost me about 70$ and took me about a week to build. You can email me if you want pictures and/or plans on how to build it.

    With all this work, I've made this 2500$ laptop into a machine as powerful as my old desktop (C2D E6600 @ 2.66ghz, 4GB ram, GF8800 Ultra), but it's not for everyone and you have to make sure to remove the overclocks when you take it off its cooling system.
     
  22. DoFoT9 macrumors P6

    DoFoT9

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2007
    Location:
    Singapore
    #22
    not that i have an 8600 or anything, but i would love to see some of those pictures!!!!

    im just wondering, why would you do all that work when you have the PC in the same house?? like seriously your not going to take all of those fans and cooling devices with you on a camping holiday are you???
     
  23. supahmunky macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2008
    #23
    i'll take some pictures and put them online as soon as my cooling system is out of whatever box it's in (i'm moving right now so...)

    and to answer your question: i don't have a pc; the beige box i'm referring to in my post is my old computer that i sold to buy this MBP. as to what i bring around, i designed my cooling system to be modular so i have three possible setups:

    - computer only (overclocks off and no gaming; that's my school/work setup)

    - computer + two fans [one for the CPU and one for the GPU] (overclocks off but i game with it anyway, that's what i bring around when i go on long trips or to game with friends)

    - computer + fans + liquid cooling system (overclocks on, i don't bring it around, i only use it at home)
     
  24. DoFoT9 macrumors P6

    DoFoT9

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2007
    Location:
    Singapore
    #24
    ok so that makes logical sense now if you dont own a home PC to game on.

    im just interested in how you have these fans set up, do you have them from below (underneath the lappy) or above (pointed directly at the keyboard) and you use an external keyboard or something.

    quite interesting post ASAP ;p
     
  25. supahmunky macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2008
    #25
    The two fans I use for the CPU and GPU are regular 12cm PC case fans, and they're underneath the computer. I do use a Logitech S530 for Mac kit (wireless keyboard and mouse) and a 23in cinema display, but it's more for usability than comfort. My first attempt at cooling the MBP was to put the fans directly on the desk and have the laptop sit on them but as you'd guess, the airflow was limited because of the natural seal that was created that way. So I cut small dents into the fans' upper and lower sidewalls to allow air to flow through them at the bottom, up on the chips and then out through the upper sides' dents. I once thought of powering them through USB but the actual power output of a USB port made me change my mind and I went with a nifty 12v R/C car battery charger :p. Eventually I built the liquid cooling system around them for better cooling while overclocking.
     

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