macOS 13: What We Know So Far

The System Preferences changes sound really, really bad. I hope this isn’t true

Individual preferences sorted by app is one of the *worst* choices they made in iOS. It’s really annoying to scroll through a long list of all apps to find the setting. I just use the search function.

It was a nice thought, but the way it works doesn’t work well. I like that in Mac OS the app’s settings are all standard in the application menu. Very easy to access and use
I kind of doubt they will do that for every application. Some Macs has over 100 applications! I think what they meant was system applications (such as... perhaps Notes). And, I'm sure Apple will find a way to make it Mac-like/have the UI be Mac friendly. It'd make no sense if Apple basically copied and ported over the Settings app from iOS onto the Mac.
 
Hope to see virtualization software be able to support DirectX 12 translation layer to Apple Metal.
With DX12 now on a completely different architecture (x64 vs ARM) than the current crop of Macs this is super unlikely. Full emulation is the only option now; call translation is dead.
 
I need to share one thing here... I've been using a Mac Mini M1 since 2020, and I will put the things super honest and truthful. Not only that, but I don't have iCloud enable, no documents inside documents and desktop folders, no documents inside my Home folder either. My machine is just had Applications inside. Nothing more. (Everything is stored on HDD cartridges, Nintendo-like that I use depending on my needs) With that being said Big Sur was the fastest, usable, flawless OS running in that machine. Monterey is buggy, slow and unstable. I restore with Big Sur and the beauty of speed was back, I re-install Monterey and the buggy experience is back. You can swear by Monterey all you can, but as soon Apple tries to squeeze M1 power to the OS, everything went to hell. Big Sur needs to be your option if you want to take advantage of the powerful M1.
 

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Oh boy. Good luck. I got Monterey pre-installed on new Studio Ultra and feel it needs many more dot-version upgrades to reach the stability of about any of the macOS versions before BigSur. Many things work as expected but- IMO- some things just beg... BEG... for Snow Monterey for a year or two. I'll hope your usages are such that you won't run into the same kind of stuff I have.
Ha ha thanks. Sheesh, sounds even worse than I thought. Well I can't wait any longer, or macOS 13 will be out, and then a brand new 13.0.0 will be installed on new Macs. This way I'll be able to stick with 12.x.x and it's minor updates and bug fixes.
 
Suggestion: Backup your “as is” boot drive so you have a way to go back if it disappoints… OR install the upgrade on an external and boot with that for a while to try it before you are very committed to it.
 
Monterey was a pass for me. I am on an ageing iMac 5k which still serves me well but Mavericks was sluggish on it ( may be better now after a few updates) I'd like to see a bit of a UI refresh. There has been little change in a few years. And optimised. I want it to be zippy and I dont mind of it's low on features. Just zippy.
I find Mojave to be fast and stable on my 2015 rMBP (16GB RAM, 1TB SSD). No desires or plans to update it, going by all the complaints of newer macOS versions.
 
Was there a particular change in OS that caused a slow-down, or is it progressive? I just got a 2019 iMac that came with Catalina. I put Monterey on it; comparing Monterey and Catalina, Monterey may be slower. However, I don't want to install Catalina, since it loses support in a few months, so it's Big Sur or Monterey. Wondering if there's a significant difference in snappiness between those two.
I wouldn't worry about "support". I'm running Mojave, and there's no issues. Just keep your backups up to date, as always, and you're fine.
 
I need to share one thing here... I've been using a Mac Mini M1 since 2020, and I will put the things super honest and truthful. Not only that, but I don't have iCloud enable, no documents inside documents and desktop folders, no documents inside my Home folder either. My machine is just had Applications inside. Nothing more. (Everything is stored on HDD cartridges, Nintendo-like that I use depending on my needs) With that being said Big Sur was the fastest, usable, flawless OS running in that machine. Monterey is buggy, slow and unstable. I restore with Big Sur and the beauty of speed was back, I re-install Monterey and the buggy experience is back. You can swear by Monterey all you can, but as soon Apple tries to squeeze M1 power to the OS, everything went to hell. Big Sur needs to be your option if you want to take advantage of the powerful M1.
I didn’t see any slowdown on my 2019 MBP in upgrading from Big Sur to Monterrey . I wonder if the way you are keeping all of your files on external hard drives might be causing something to work inefficiently?
 
We an expect further development in Metal, AR kit, bringing IOS apps to Mac and I hope some language support that was missing. Shortcuts.
 
I wouldn't worry about "support". I'm running Mojave, and there's no issues. Just keep your backups up to date, as always, and you're fine.
By support I meant security updates. I'd been running High Sierra on my main computer until last week, which means 18 months beyond its last security update; stuck with it b/c it's the last OS that implements subpixel text rendering natively, and thus the last OS on which text looks sharp on non-Retina monitors, at least to my eyes. No issues, since I practice good hygiene, but my job finally put its foot down, so I had to update. I don't want to install an OS that I'm going to have to switch over in a few months, so Monterey stays ahead of that.
 
How about Mojave? Update to that, apply all updates under APFS and then copy that to a HFS+ partition and it’s just as snappy as High Sierra.
Works great with SSD in my Mac Mini.
Thats sounds really interesting.

Can you please share a link with the tutorial? Specially the copy all to HFS+. Which content i need to copy, etc
 
Just give me a solid OS that works. I migrated from 10.6.8 to 12.3 and a new M1 MBP and there are so many problems.

  • No longer can use CCC as a bootable drive.
  • External drive being used for time machine will not unmount. Can not eject disk, well after time machine has run. “disk still in use”. Have to force quit, and can still an unsettling clunk when power is turned off.
  • Migration assistant wouldn’t work with old system and new system. Had to manually transfer items.
  • Iphoto transfer to photos, now hundreds of video files that were 100% viewable on prior system were not transferred. Those individual files (.avi from 2006-2008) which were completely viewable on the previous system iphoto and quicktime, are now deemed unreadable by quicktime.
  • Final cut pro crashes multiple times per project.

I got hooked into the mac ecosystem in the 80s and 90s because of the ease of use. Things just worked. You plugged peripherals in and they worked. You didn’t have to spend time maintaining your system, it just worked, so you could get on with your work. Seriously, with all this buggy behavior, can the premium for mac still be justified? Are PCs still that much worse?
Recently went from 10.6 snow to 10.11 El Capitan and had all kinds of problems with time machine and Firefox and terminal.
Shame there wasn’t a TFF for snow then I would have stayed there.
 
I kind of doubt they will do that for every application. Some Macs has over 100 applications! I think what they meant was system applications (such as... perhaps Notes). And, I'm sure Apple will find a way to make it Mac-like/have the UI be Mac friendly. It'd make no sense if Apple basically copied and ported over the Settings app from iOS onto the Mac.

You say that but their UI design has been really bad over the past few years. I don’t have much confidence in Apple’s UI team right now
 
We an expect further development in Metal, AR kit, bringing IOS apps to Mac and I hope some language support that was missing. Shortcuts.
AMD and Nvidia really bring lots of enhancements for gaming such as FSR and DLSS which increase FPS. About Metal,... it just works.
 
Thats sounds really interesting.

Can you please share a link with the tutorial? Specially the copy all to HFS+. Which content i need to copy, etc

Quite simple but may take a day to complete depending on your amount of data and USB port speeds:
-Obviously backup your data and disconnect your backup drive for safe keeping.
-Assuming coming from older MacOS like El Capitan or Sierra or High Sierra and your computer supports Mojave or higher. If it doesn’t support Mojave there’s another program called dosdude1 but that’s a little more complicated and found in the other forums here at MR.
-Set up a new empty external hard drive that is about the same size of your older hard drive or larger, choose Guid: HFS+ In disk utility, use a different name on external drive. Drive doesn't have to be SSD it’ll just be really slow. (Be careful when using disk utility to only choose and erase the new external hard drive and not any other drives.)
-Download carbon copy cloner from bombich website. (throw them a bone if everything works great.)
-Clone your old High Sierra internal drive to the destination of the new external drive with safety net off. If it asks you to copying the recovery partition you can try to hit yes. (Depending on your amount of data and whether you’re on USB2 or USB3 this copy could take all night for everything.) [Make sure your external drive doesn’t get too hot from all that data, I was using a sata dock and the drive was very warm so I kept the fan on it.]
-After copy completes Boot from new drive by rebooting computer and hold option key and select new disk.
-Desktop and files should look identical to your older drive, you can get info on your old hard drive and the new one and they should be within a gigabytes of each other. (Carbon copy cloner doesn’t copy the trash or some temporary files so that’s why there could be some differences.) If not or if a lot of data is missing reboot and go back and start over again with a copy and make sure it completes without error.
-Eject old High Sierra disk. That way you’ll know you’re on the correct external hard drive.
-Download Mojave:
(You may need to change clock back to 2019 if certificates are expired on your installer.)
-Install Mojave from applications folder.
-It will take a while and reboot many times. (You may hear a long tone from your computer and a funny looking progress bar, don’t panic that’s just the software updating the firmware on your computer that Mojave brings along.)
-A new introductory screen may appear, answer the questions.
-Once it’s done you’ll notice that the new hard drive disk is now in APFS format after the desktop appears.
-Correct the clock to today’s date.
-Apply all security updates on new Mojave disk until no more updates. (Updates moved back into the system preferences. Or Apple menu/about this Mac/system updates.)
-The computer may seem unresponsive at times and take a long time to shut down or reboot but that’s the slowness of the APFS, You may see a swirly, just let it continue it’ll finish eventually.
-Don’t open mail or other apps yet.
-Run carbon copy cloner from bombich again, if it asks you about a previous task you can delete it.
-Clone the external Mojave hard drive to the destination of the old High Sierra drive with safety net off.
(Copy shouldn’t take as long because it’s only copying the operating system changes and not your user folders, it might be around 15 GB of differences or less.)
-After copy completes reboot computer, Hold option key, select your original hard drive.
-Once you get your desktop, go to system preferences and change the start up disk to your normal hard drive.
-You can eject the new external disk.
-Launch all your apps like Mail and let it upgrade your data to the Mojave version.
-When you feel comfortable that everything came across correctly you can reconnect your back up drive and continue from there on.
-Mojave will be the last version of macOS you can run that supports older 32 bit apps, I’m still using iDVD in Mojave and it works great.
-Now you get a few more years out of your computer.

Notes:
The reason we had to apply the security updates in Apple‘s APFS file system is because security updates will not install with HFS+.

Since Apple has discontinued security updates for Mojave you no longer need the APFS file system.

Other updates like App Store updates and Safari updates will still install under HFS+ if they become available.

Unfortunately the APFS file system is very slow on older computers with a mechanical hard drive but we know that older computers running HFS+ are still very snappy.
So if you use a SSD formatted to HFS+ It will result in even faster boot times than Apple’s APFS file system on older hardware.

(I think I covered everything.)
 
Quite simple but may take a day to complete depending on your amount of data and USB port speeds:
-Obviously backup your data and disconnect your backup drive for safe keeping.
-Assuming coming from older MacOS like El Capitan or Sierra or High Sierra and your computer supports Mojave or higher. If it doesn’t support Mojave there’s another program called dosdude1 but that’s a little more complicated and found in the other forums here at MR.
-Set up a new empty external hard drive that is about the same size of your older hard drive or larger, choose Guid: HFS+ In disk utility, use a different name on external drive. Drive doesn't have to be SSD it’ll just be really slow. (Be careful when using disk utility to only choose and erase the new external hard drive and not any other drives.)
-Download carbon copy cloner from bombich website. (throw them a bone if everything works great.)
-Clone your old High Sierra internal drive to the destination of the new external drive with safety net off. If it asks you to copying the recovery partition you can try to hit yes. (Depending on your amount of data and whether you’re on USB2 or USB3 this copy could take all night for everything.) [Make sure your external drive doesn’t get too hot from all that data, I was using a sata dock and the drive was very warm so I kept the fan on it.]
-After copy completes Boot from new drive by rebooting computer and hold option key and select new disk.
-Desktop and files should look identical to your older drive, you can get info on your old hard drive and the new one and they should be within a gigabytes of each other. (Carbon copy cloner doesn’t copy the trash or some temporary files so that’s why there could be some differences.) If not or if a lot of data is missing reboot and go back and start over again with a copy and make sure it completes without error.
-Eject old High Sierra disk. That way you’ll know you’re on the correct external hard drive.
-Download Mojave:
(You may need to change clock back to 2019 if certificates are expired on your installer.)
-Install Mojave from applications folder.
-It will take a while and reboot many times. (You may hear a long tone from your computer and a funny looking progress bar, don’t panic that’s just the software updating the firmware on your computer that Mojave brings along.)
-A new introductory screen may appear, answer the questions.
-Once it’s done you’ll notice that the new hard drive disk is now in APFS format after the desktop appears.
-Correct the clock to today’s date.
-Apply all security updates on new Mojave disk until no more updates. (Updates moved back into the system preferences. Or Apple menu/about this Mac/system updates.)
-The computer may seem unresponsive at times and take a long time to shut down or reboot but that’s the slowness of the APFS, You may see a swirly, just let it continue it’ll finish eventually.
-Don’t open mail or other apps yet.
-Run carbon copy cloner from bombich again, if it asks you about a previous task you can delete it.
-Clone the external Mojave hard drive to the destination of the old High Sierra drive with safety net off.
(Copy shouldn’t take as long because it’s only copying the operating system changes and not your user folders, it might be around 15 GB of differences or less.)
-After copy completes reboot computer, Hold option key, select your original hard drive.
-Once you get your desktop, go to system preferences and change the start up disk to your normal hard drive.
-You can eject the new external disk.
-Launch all your apps like Mail and let it upgrade your data to the Mojave version.
-When you feel comfortable that everything came across correctly you can reconnect your back up drive and continue from there on.
-Mojave will be the last version of macOS you can run that supports older 32 bit apps, I’m still using iDVD in Mojave and it works great.
-Now you get a few more years out of your computer.

Notes:
The reason we had to apply the security updates in Apple‘s APFS file system is because security updates will not install with HFS+.

Since Apple has discontinued security updates for Mojave you no longer need the APFS file system.

Other updates like App Store updates and Safari updates will still install under HFS+ if they become available.

Unfortunately the APFS file system is very slow on older computers with a mechanical hard drive but we know that older computers running HFS+ are still very snappy.
So if you use a SSD formatted to HFS+ It will result in even faster boot times than Apple’s APFS file system on older hardware.

(I think I covered everything.)

Wow that looks long but doesn't sounds difficult. I will try it for sure.

Thank you!
 
I'm confused. Which part of iOS cloud backup is without encryption? My understanding is the data transfer is e2e encrypted and the data at rest is encrypted with your private iCloud key which Apple doesn't even have access to.
Unfortunately, this is wrong. Yes, the iCloud backup is "encrypted". But not with end-to-end encryption. Apple has the keys and can look into the backups. This is also done - at the latest when there is a request from a government agency. Therefore, iMessage is not suitable for confidential data, because you do not know whether the other party uses iCloud Backup.



"But careful: encryption is great. However, true privacy only comes with end-to-end encryption. It is important to know that for any kind of encryption, someone must have the key. End-to-end encryption can only be decrypted by the sender and receiver of messages. In case of the encryption offered by Apple (and many other cloud providers), however, the keys are in the hands of the respective company. A detailed explanation can be found in our article on end-to-end encryption.
[...]
Apple’s own Messenger iMessage also reveals the paradox around the much-vaunted “security”: messages in iMessage itself are secured with end-to-end encryption – but once the messages are stored on the phone, they still end up on Apple’s iPhone backup without the protection of end-to-end encryption."
 
The main thing I want to see in macOS 13 is a revamped Music app. The "embedded browser" model that it is now is clunky and has some issues, in particular with the way searches work. If you search the store and browse it for a while, you must hit "back" many times to be able to search your library. The store is often sluggish as well. Separating various non-music services from iTunes was a good first step, but the Music app is still messy and I think there is a lot of room for improvement.

Looking forward to the new Classical app. This might finally be the change that causes me to switch from Qobuz.
Amen to this. Especially to those of us that for whatever reason still like to have music on their desktop like I am a professional musician and I need the actual files. I always say “I am now a Luddite. Because I wanna actually have an own the ones and zeros “

But you are absolutely correct the music program on the desktop is truly one of the worst programs I’ve ever used in my life. In the search feature is horrific. And it is so clunky and unfriendly UserWise.

Hey you mentioned some thing that sounded like a program name because unless it shapes up I’m going to have to redouble my efforts to find a program it works better. I have looked in the past but not put a ton of effort into it.
 
Amen to this. Especially to those of us that for whatever reason still like to have music on their desktop like I am a professional musician and I need the actual files. I always say “I am now a Luddite. Because I wanna actually have an own the ones and zeros “

But you are absolutely correct the music program on the desktop is truly one of the worst programs I’ve ever used in my life. In the search feature is horrific. And it is so clunky and unfriendly UserWise.

Hey you mentioned some thing that sounded like a program name because unless it shapes up I’m going to have to redouble my efforts to find a program it works better. I have looked in the past but not put a ton of effort into it.
I switched to Swinsian as a good pre-Music iTunes clone... haven't opened Music.app since
 
Unfortunately, this is wrong. Yes, the iCloud backup is "encrypted". But not with end-to-end encryption. Apple has the keys and can look into the backups. This is also done - at the latest when there is a request from a government agency. Therefore, iMessage is not suitable for confidential data, because you do not know whether the other party uses iCloud Backup.



"But careful: encryption is great. However, true privacy only comes with end-to-end encryption. It is important to know that for any kind of encryption, someone must have the key. End-to-end encryption can only be decrypted by the sender and receiver of messages. In case of the encryption offered by Apple (and many other cloud providers), however, the keys are in the hands of the respective company. A detailed explanation can be found in our article on end-to-end encryption.
[...]
Apple’s own Messenger iMessage also reveals the paradox around the much-vaunted “security”: messages in iMessage itself are secured with end-to-end encryption – but once the messages are stored on the phone, they still end up on Apple’s iPhone backup without the protection of end-to-end encryption."

I've read that doc and while at first glance it can seem insecure the overall model does work.
The private key for your backup is stored in your keychain, not on Apple's servers (unless you iCloud Keychain, I'll get to that in a sec). Apple can not unlock your backup without this. The writes you make to Apple's backup servers are encrypted before they leave your phone. This includes iMessage backups.
Apple DOES have the keys to the transmission of the data. This means that they can see the actual packets sent but since they only contain encrypted data for your backup they still can not see your data.
Which brings us to the security of the iCloud keychain. The keychain is unlocked with your password and IS E2E encrypted. Apple cannot access these.
Apple designed it like this with intention. The crux of it all is the E2E encryption of your keychain. They have enough access to what you are sending and receiving to debug their protocols but not enough as to actually see the content.
iMessage works similarly in that if I were to send a message to you, I would encrypt a message with your public key before I ever put it on the wire. I then encrypt the entire packet with Apple's keys before it is sent. There is identity information Apple has access to (they know I'm sending you a message) but they don't know the contents of the message itself so privacy is maintained.
 
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They need to fix the TV app. All four of my macs on Monterey including the brand new Mac Studio can’t play downloaded movies or tv shows after a couple days. It completely freezes the tv app. I need to deauthorize and authorize the computer every couple days. It happens on my laptop too with nothing connected so it’s not a monitor issue.
 
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