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[Merged] Marketplace Rules and Eligibility Feedback and Discussion

T

ttran88

macrumors regular
Original poster
ModNote: This is now the official (don't know how to make a (TM) on a Windows keyboard) Hay Guys, How Do I Post In The Marketplace thread, as well as your place to discuss any alternatives to our marketplace rules and procedures, your support for the way things are, etc. --mkrishnan

How do I get into the marketplace?
 
Why can't I access the marketplace?

I know this dosen't belong here but I don't have many options ha.

Anyways I just noticed I have over 250 points and i have been a member for more than 6 months. How do I access the marketplace?
 
MarketPlace Rules

So, I had a talk with mkrishnan today and he suggested me to make a thread about it, so we can discuss about it.

There have been lots of threads about "should I sell my old Mac to get a new one?" or "how much is my Mac worth?" lately because of the MBP update but there are dozens of these even without an update. Most of these threads gets closed because they violate the current MarketPlace rules.

In my opinion, asking advice for that kinda things should be allowed, as long as it doesn't involve selling over MacRumors or advertising.

Currently, most of the people who needs advice like that, can't access the MarketPlace, which is a good thing because it's more secure that way. Isn't MarketPlace for selling/buying/trading items, not asking advice of their prices?

As you may notice, I'm not asking this for myself as I can access MarketPlace, but it makes me sad to see dozens of threads made by newbies who may have registered just to ask that, getting closed and wastelanded.

So wouldn't it be fair if it was allowed in buying tips category? If there is member-to-member selling or advertising, then it should be closed or moved to MarketPlace

I'm just sharing my opinion and willing to hear others opinions, especially mods' and admins' 😎
 
rdowns said:
Allowing that kind of defeats the purpose of the Marketplace rules, IMO.
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How's that? If I ask current value of my iMac, how does that defeat the meaning of MarketPlace? AFAIK, MarketPlace is meant for member-to-member trading, that's why there is the post limit so it's not full of scammers.

As I said, this is purely an opinion question, but I'd like to know why you think that it'd make MarketPlace useless

Cheers
 
If someone posts something along the lines of "Is $XXXX a good price for my MBP?", a potential buyer could see it and make an offer via PM, thus circumventing the marketplace and negating the rules made to protect users from scams. Similarily, if someone posts "what's a good price for my MBP?" and a responder offers a reply, they can then continue the thread with "ok, anyone want to buy it for $YYYY?" again circumventing the marketplace.

That's why I report things like that, anyway. If someone links to mac2sell or whatever the OP has their answer and there's no good reason for the thread to continue.

In my opinion threads like that should get deleted instead of Wastelanded, so no sale can be reached via PM.
 
miles01110 said:
If someone posts something along the lines of "Is $XXXX a good price for my MBP?", a potential buyer could see it and make an offer via PM, thus circumventing the marketplace and negating the rules made to protect users from scams. Similarily, if someone posts "what's a good price for my MBP?" and a responder offers a reply, they can then continue the thread with "ok, anyone want to buy it for $YYYY?" again circumventing the marketplace.

That's why I report things like that, anyway. If someone links to mac2sell or whatever the OP has their answer and there's no good reason for the thread to continue.

In my opinion threads like that should get deleted instead of Wastelanded, so no sale can be reached via PM.
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Hmmm, good point. Doesn't that loophole exist already though? If it's only closed, the thread can still be viewed and thus anyone can PM the OP.

Should PMIng then be tighten (or is it already)? I'm just giving out options so no need to take me seriously as I'm not making the decisions anyway 😉
 
Hellhammer said:
Hmmm, good point. Doesn't that loophole exist already though? If it's only closed, the thread can still be viewed and thus anyone can PM the OP.
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Yes, the loophole exists... which is why I think threads should be deleted 😛

Should PMIng then be tighten (or is it already)? I'm just giving out options so no need to take me seriously as I'm not making the decisions anyway 😉
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Well, if a member only registers to sell their machine and have less than 5 posts, they can't PM anyway. I don't really see how changing that limit would help any more than not changing it.
 
miles01110 said:
Yes, the loophole exists... which is why I think threads should be deleted 😛
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But then, if someone has already posted e.g. Mac2Sell link, it'll be gone meaning that OP walks out with nothing

Well, if a member only registers to sell their machine and have less than 5 posts, they can't PM anyway. I don't really see how changing that limit would help any more than not changing it.
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5 posts are easy to get, just flood to 5 threads, takes less than 10 minutes. As the main concern is scamming, if PMing is bumped to e.g. 50 posts it would be harder to scam

Or how about a a sticky in buying tips section telling way to determine the value of your Mac? All that is needed is link to Mac2Sell and something like look for eBay for similar Macs. Then when mod closes the thread, he could post a link there which would pretty much be everything OP needs.

Again, just posting what comes to my mind 🙂
 
I feel if the OP creates a thread that that does not state their intentions to sell, it should be allowed; they just want someone to tell them if they're being scammed, etc. and as a community we should be able to assist folks in that matter; sure it presents a risk that a potential buyer will ask if the item is for sale (and I've been guilty of that a few times).

The marketplace I feel is just a cocoon to protect members from scammers and bad seeds, but it's simply just a protection. If a member should choose to PM another member outside of the marketplace and a non-FS thread, it is the responsibility and risk the buyer has, and not that of MR.

As with the marketplace itself, I think the best way to prevent non-marketplace threads from popping up would be to enable everyone to click the link to the marketplace. Of course in this case non-eligible members would be directed to a page stating why they are not eligible, including the FAQ link to the reason, a link to the marketplace rules, and link to the FAQ for the forums as a whole. That way people know a marketplace exists, promotes the FAQ, so threads on why there is no marketplace do not show up. At the same time eligible members would be able to access said forum directly. However for the suggestion here, I don't think vB lets you link the same forum to two links based on eligbility, so possibly everyone with less than 250 posts and 180 days would only view one version of the forum (that says they are not eligible), and every one else (who is eligible) would see the real forum.
 
Hellhammer said:
...

I'm just sharing my opinion and willing to hear others opinions, especially mods' and admins' 😎
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In that case I'll chime in, but my opinion only represents my own views. 😎

As I understand it (and another mod or an admin can correct me here if I'm wrong), the reason for this particular bit of the MP rule is that such threads have the potential to become offers to buy / sell in the thread, thereby circumventing the eligibility rules for the Marketplace. Though I understand it can seem a bit strict not to be able to ask about pricing, my personal opinion is that if rule were not in place as it is, some people might post asking about price, but hoping for offers.

This doesn't mean I'm opposed to changing the rule, it's just my feeling on the matter so far.

alphaod said:
...

As with the marketplace itself, I think the best way to prevent non-marketplace threads from popping up would be to enable everyone to click the link to the marketplace. Of course in this case non-eligible members would be directed to a page stating why they are not eligible, including the FAQ link to the reason, a link to the marketplace rules, and link to the FAQ for the forums as a whole. That way people know a marketplace exists, promotes the FAQ, so threads on why there is no marketplace do not show up. At the same time eligible members would be able to access said forum directly. However for the suggestion here, I don't think vB lets you link the same forum to two links based on eligbility, so possibly everyone with less than 250 posts and 180 days would only view one version of the forum (that says they are not eligible), and every one else (who is eligible) would see the real forum.
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I don't know if it's technically possible, but I think this is a great idea. 🙂
 
There's no ideal solution. The problem in the past was that threads asking for pricing advice sometimes (not always) turned into deal-making threads. And some users got burned making bad deals with members who had little or no history in the forums. That's why we changed the rules.

We prefer to close or Wasteland threads with pricing questions rather than delete them, for a couple of reasons. Although people can still send purchase offers by PM and get themselves into trouble, they see the red flag that the thread was closed. We usually post an explantation and/or link to the rules so they get fair warning that way too. Second, it lets the thread-starter see any answers that were already posted and lets people PM pricing advice if they want to help the thread-starter.

We're the first to admit that it excludes some well-meaning questions by newer members and that the protection against bad deals isn't foolproof. It's a compromise.
 
Doctor Q said:
There's no ideal solution. The problem in the past was that threads asking for pricing advice sometimes (not always) turned into deal-making threads. And some users got burned making bad deals with members who had little or no history in the forums. That's why we changed the rules.

We prefer to close or Wasteland threads with pricing questions rather than delete them, for a couple of reasons. Although people can still send purchase offers by PM and get themselves into trouble, they see the red flag that the thread was closed. We usually post an explantation and/or link to the rules so they get fair warning that way too. Second, it lets the thread-starter see any answers that were already posted and lets people PM pricing advice if they want to help the thread-starter.

We're the first to admit that it excludes some well-meaning questions by newer members and that the protection against bad deals isn't foolproof. It's a compromise.
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What I mean is that if it becomes deal-making, someone will report it anyway and warn/remind OP that selling outside MarketPlace is forbidden. We have many users that post to those threads, e.g. spinnerlys, miles01110.. so it would be pretty hard to start making deals before someone sees and reports it. I understand PMing is your own responsibility.

Anyway, if it's not possible to allow those threads, even for giving them a try, is making a guide (I can make it) or sticky what mod could then link to the OP so he's not walking away empty handed?

I'm just having my feelings for the newbs who asks that. Sometimes they get closed even though the selling is not the main part but it's mentioned somewhere. Kainjow's "this thread violates MarketPlace rules, please see rules" post it just so, hmm, so simple and exhaustive, no offense of course 😎

Any other ideas how this could be improved with other than allowing it?
 
miles01110 said:
If someone posts something along the lines of "Is $XXXX a good price for my MBP?", a potential buyer could see it and make an offer via PM, thus circumventing the marketplace and negating the rules made to protect users from scams. Similarily, if someone posts "what's a good price for my MBP?" and a responder offers a reply, they can then continue the thread with "ok, anyone want to buy it for $YYYY?" again circumventing the marketplace.
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But who cares? Really. You see the MP is nice and all and most who go there hope to not be scammed. But if someone wants to post a thread asking how much something is worth and someone else comes along and makes an offer then fine, close it because it's outside the MP. However, if someone wants to continue the transaction outside the MP then caveat emptor. Buying and selling in the MP does not somehow guarantee the transaction to be scam-free. MR doesn't guarantee to warranty the product nor does the company provide any additional guarantees should something go wrong. What MR does provide is what can be seen as a pseudo safe-haven for sellers and buyers. If someone wishes to complete a transaction outside MR's MP then so be it. As I said, it's not like MR would refund someone's money if something were to go wrong.

However, I believe Hellhammer's idea is indeed counter intuitive to the MP rules. While I don't care if someone wants to complete a transaction outside the MP, I do care if we allow fly by night "members" to post things for sale that could potentially lead to issues.
 
The who cares was in relation to who cares if someone wants to complete a transaction outside the MP. It's not as though the MP somehow has this magical power to prevent any wrong doing. Established members have been seen scamming others.
 
jessica. said:
The who cares was in relation to who cares if someone wants to complete a transaction outside the MP. It's not as though the MP somehow has this magical power to prevent any wrong doing. Established members have been seen scamming others.
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You're losing me. I didn't make any sort of claim to the contrary...? There's no foolproof way to solve the problem.
 
Harmless topic removed

I was notified by a forum leader that my topic was removed. My topic was asking what the price of something I owned was. I thought it was unfair for my topic to be removed, i wasn't even trying to sell it. I know aboutthe rules of the marketplace and everything. But I still don't think it's fair
 
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