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It IS sad. When I worked at AppleCare I had a lot of customers frustrated because they had to buy a $129 upgrade to 10.5 for their 4 year old PPC MacBook just to be able to start their new iPhone 4, while if they had skipped switching from their 2002 Win XP PC to that MacBook they wouldn't have to buy anything additional.
A lot of customers got angry because suddenly now their iP4 became a lot more expensive than they expected and all I could do was refer to the system requirements and apologize that whoever sold them the iPhone didn't mention this.

It's one of the reasons why I went back to/refuse to buy anything Apple when I needed a new computer. It became really annoying not being able to run certain things unless I upgraded. I almost submitted to it a couple of times, but eventually I sold my Mac.
 
So funny to see how people who normally complain about MS copying Apple now is in the mindset of "If it's done differently from how Apple does it, it won't work".
And who said this is influenced by iPad? More influenced by their own WP7 obviously. Is it the idea of integrating concepts from two different types of os' into one, synergy? Not a revolutionary idea no matter who came up with it first and you can't copyright mere ideas.

I'm sure Gramps will be ok with the desktop version of Windows 8. You people do know that this is just the tablet/touch screen version, right? RIGHT..?

While I agree Windows 7 actually runs great, Vista did run horribly. I'm not on the trash vista train, I'm speaking purely from experience. I was an early adopter and file copying operations were like a quarter of the speed compared to XP, not to mention Window refreshing when moving windows around was horrid. It did get better with the reliability update they pushed out a few months later, and ofcourse when hardware got better, but it WAS bad, compared to XP anyway. I feel like Windows 7 isnt actually any faster, it just came out on 2009 hardware instead of 2005 hardware.

On a side note, while i like the new eye candy in windows 8 (it sure is purrdy), it seems like an OS with an identity crisis.

I have to be honest, these justifications are foreign to me being a Mac-only user. I was surprised to read these explanations. So Windows users don't upgrade their OS because it's a hassle, it often doesn't work, and it's not worth the money?

Now I understand why my PC friends who have switched to the Mac always call me before upgrading their Mac OS--they're afraid of what might happen. My reaction has always been one of confusion. I say, "You don't need me. Just pop in the DVD and click the install button...what's so hard about that?" They don't seem to trust me when I tell them this.

We have over 50 Macs where I work they range from 5 years old to brand new and they are all running Snow Leopard. Upgrading a Mac's OS is a cost-effective way to speed up a machine, gain more features, and keep current.

If upgrading Windows is such a nightmare, I can see why PC users opt to just buy a new computer. I guess Windows 8 will be a success simply because it will ship on all new PCs starting some time in 2014.

Upgrading in not a nightmare on a newer machine. Upgrading a 5+ year old machine is not worthwhile for a lot of users. And Windows is used on tens of millions of machines in the business world and they just don't upgrade every time something new comes out. That would be a nightmare, and an expensive one at that.
 
It IS sad. When I worked at AppleCare I had a lot of customers frustrated because they had to buy a $129 upgrade to 10.5 for their 4 year old PPC MacBook just to be able to start their new iPhone 4, while if they had skipped switching from their 2002 Win XP PC to that MacBook they wouldn't have to buy anything additional.
A lot of customers got angry because suddenly now their iP4 became a lot more expensive than they expected and all I could do was refer to the system requirements and apologize that whoever sold them the iPhone didn't mention this.
why would they need to pay $129. Snow Leopard has been and still is $29... hardly a large expense in the scheme of owning any smartphone these days.
 
It IS sad. When I worked at AppleCare I had a lot of customers frustrated because they had to buy a $129 upgrade to 10.5 for their 4 year old PPC MacBook just to be able to start their new iPhone 4, while if they had skipped switching from their 2002 Win XP PC to that MacBook they wouldn't have to buy anything additional.
A lot of customers got angry because suddenly now their iP4 became a lot more expensive than they expected and all I could do was refer to the system requirements and apologize that whoever sold them the iPhone didn't mention this.

It's one of the reasons why I went back to/refuse to buy anything Apple when I needed a new computer. It became really annoying not being able to run certain things unless I upgraded. I almost submitted to it a couple of times, but eventually I sold my Mac.

Uncle Steve does this for your own good. He wants you to have a new computer. And he wants your wallet.
 
why would they need to pay $129. Snow Leopard has been and still is $29... hardly a large expense in the scheme of owning any smartphone these days.

First of all, officially the only way to upgrade from 10.4 to 10.6 is to upgrade to 10.5 first or use the $129 Mac Box Set version of 10.6. This is ofcourse BS since the Mac Box Set version is the exact same version as the retail version but this is the officially supported solution and what we told the customers.

Secondly, you might have missed that I was talking about a PowerPC MacBook, not an Intel MacBook, and 10.6 won't even run on PPC, so all customers with PPC MacBooks have no other choice but to buy the 10.5 upgrade, if they can even find it (AppleCare can offer it when needed, but it costs $129 like it always has).
 
At first I thought that was a screenshot of a new version of Windows Media Center, a program that works great with a remote control but not so great with a keyboard and mouse. I don't mind that on my HTPC, but wouldn't want it for a PC where I'm trying to do work.
 
First of all, officially the only way to upgrade from 10.4 to 10.6 is to upgrade to 10.5 first or use the $129 Mac Box Set version of 10.6. This is ofcourse BS since the Mac Box Set version is the exact same version as the retail version but this is the officially supported solution and what we told the customers.
since both are the same, there is no need to buy the $129 version, that was my point
Secondly, you might have missed that I was talking about a PowerPC MacBook, not an Intel MacBook, and 10.6 won't even run on PPC, so all customers with PPC MacBooks have no other choice but to buy the 10.5 upgrade, if they can even find it (AppleCare can offer it when needed, but it costs $129 like it always has).
yep i did :D
 
since both are the same, there is no need to buy the $129 version, that was my point

Agreed, but I was talking about Apple's official stance, which is what customers get when they call AppleCare, and Apple's official stance is that you can't get away with just $29 when upgrading from 10.4 to 10.6. I don't think that's very nice behaviour from Apple since they're basically lying the customer to his/her face.
 
Agreed, but I was talking about Apple's official stance, which is what customers get when they call AppleCare, and Apple's official stance is that you can't get away with just $29 when upgrading from 10.4 to 10.6. I don't think that's very nice behaviour from Apple since they're basically lying the customer to his/her face.
agreed 100% they are just cashing in on the less knowledgeable and trying to milk "2" upgrades from people who skipped Leopard.
 
I think iOS is an operating system that is derived from Mac OS X, with some things left out and other things added and not just a layer on top if it. And you?

I think iOS is OS X with a different GUI. I think Win8 is Win7 with two GUIs you can choose between. A GUI is, after all, just an app.
 
It IS sad. When I worked at AppleCare I had a lot of customers frustrated because they had to buy a $129 upgrade to 10.5 for their 4 year old PPC MacBook just to be able to start their new iPhone 4, while if they had skipped switching from their 2002 Win XP PC to that MacBook they wouldn't have to buy anything additional.
A lot of customers got angry because suddenly now their iP4 became a lot more expensive than they expected and all I could do was refer to the system requirements and apologize that whoever sold them the iPhone didn't mention this.

I got an iPod Touch given to me and then found out that I had to upgrade my iBook from Tiger to Leopard in order to just install the updates. Yep, I was annoyed.

s.
 
I'm sure Gramps will be ok with the desktop version of Windows 8. You people do know that this is just the tablet/touch screen version, right? RIGHT..?

I neighbor, who is 83 years old, got a new computer a couple of weeks ago. He used to have an old XP box but it got to slow and the new box came with windows7. He stopped by every other night with tons of questions because he e.g. couldn't figure out how to get his windows back after he minimized it. Overall it were many small changes that totally confused him - and I had to show everything several times because he was so used to XP and couldn't get used to windows7. But now I think he got it, since he doesn't ask that many questions anymore.

My point is: Small changes like the windows7 update already confused him a lot - giving him Windows8 will be a nightmare for him. Eventually he will get used to it - but especially older people don't adjust that easily to new things.
 
XP can't upgrade to Windows 7

Originally posted by AidenShaw:
Agree if "older" means 6 to 10 years old. Five years ago was when the Core Duo was the headline CPU, and 3+ GHz Pentium 4 was the standard CPU (from Intel).​

I was thinking in the 6-8 year old range.

There was another post that said that a 5 year old PC could have a Core 2 Duo - almost true, the Core 2 was released in July 2006.

There's a good chance that a 4½ year old PC would have a Core 2 - just like some of today's Apples.


Upgrading in not a nightmare on a newer machine. Upgrading a 5+ year old machine is not worthwhile for a lot of users. And Windows is used on tens of millions of machines in the business world and they just don't upgrade every time something new comes out. That would be a nightmare, and an expensive one at that.

Just to point out the obvious, but you can't upgrade the OS directly from XP to Windows 7. You must do a clean install.

You could upgrade to Vista, then upgrade to Windows 7 - but the clean install is probably simpler, safer and faster.


Shocked to see Microsoft getting into what some frequent posters refer to as the "iToys" business.

:p

But Microsoft isn't neglecting their computer stuff to focus on toys - Microsoft can multi-task and develop two things at once.
 
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I consider my self an Apple fan boy, but this new offering from Microsoft looks pretty amazing. I agree with many in here, the static app icons on the home page needs revamped if Apple wants to continue it's rising stardom.

I have no intention of leaving Apple because of any particular OS, but they can't sit around content with the status quo. I hope they bring the heat on 6 June 11.
 
Way to insert a troll comment but I'll clear that doubt.

I use Windows 7/ Windows XP on my macbook. (sometimes)

For all my FPGA programming, I used Windows XP as the tools were best supported on that system.

The old XP machines are just there for the people who:

1. have found XP to be of great use for them.
2. don't need much hardware for their work.
3. don't have much resources with them.
4. enterprises who are slowly moving to windows 7.

That does not imply that Apples don't last longer than Windows laptops. Side by side, people bought sony vaio in the office and here we go... 2 years down the line and they are mostly unusable. (not all though)

So comparing a huge majority of systems, macs do last longer. My 2006 iMac is in great shape and performs great on snow leopard.

But whatever...

I don't know. I'm using our old 2003 Windows Desktop with XP and it works exactly like the day we bought it...seems to last a long time. We just added a new monitor and mouse throughout the years. This computer is 8 years old and works perfectly so I'm not sure about your devices. (though I know you said not all of them are unusable)
 
Agreed, but I was talking about Apple's official stance, which is what customers get when they call AppleCare, and Apple's official stance is that you can't get away with just $29 when upgrading from 10.4 to 10.6. I don't think that's very nice behaviour from Apple since they're basically lying the customer to his/her face.

agreed 100% they are just cashing in on the less knowledgeable and trying to milk "2" upgrades from people who skipped Leopard.

Gosh, talk about a twisted perspective! Apple decided to make Snow Leopard a cheap upgrade to Leopard, while asking people with older versions of OS X to essentially pay full price, which they had every right to do. But to make installation a simple one-step process for everyone, they didn't force you to install Leopard first. So if you chose to skip Leopard, you did so illegally, but Apple placed no technical hurdle in your way. The same if you bought a single license copy of OS X and then installed it on 100 office computers. It's more or less an honour system.

Would you have preferred Apple forced you to activate every licence like Microsoft or Adobe? Perhaps you'd also prefer to pay Windows prices for OS X?
 
Gosh, talk about a twisted perspective! Apple decided to make Snow Leopard a cheap upgrade to Leopard, while asking people with older versions of OS X to essentially pay full price, which they had every right to do. But to make installation a simple one-step process for everyone, they didn't force you to install Leopard first. So if you chose to skip Leopard, you did so illegally, but Apple placed no technical hurdle in your way. The same if you bought a single license copy of OS X and then installed it on 100 office computers. It's more or less an honour system.

There was no mentioning of an upgrade in the license. Apple sold it as an upgrade but the license did not prohibit you from installing it on a machine without a Leopard license.
 
Well Done MS

This UI looks very cool. :cool:
Just hope it works as smoothly once it's put under pressure. :)

The BIG plus for me is absence of faux leather or wood planking or those other truly awful iOS backgrounds, I know it's only eye candy but sometimes that actually matters. :eek:
 
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