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You missed my point in reference to the XBox 360, on which I've really enjoyed trying to play Call of Duty 4: Modern Warfare on a massive 62" screen with a mate's 14 yr old son. He was so good it was scary! I couldn't fault the 360 either. It's a great tool.

What I meant was that anyone can make a good product and not make any money. But M$ actually seem to make a virtue out of losing money on every one.

You see the primary purpose of business is to make a profit on all activities. It's a simple principle based on receiving in sales revenue, more than you spend in materials, labour, packaging, marketing, shipping and other overheads.

It's not difficult, this same process has been oiling the wheels of commerce since Og found he had two rocks and Ug needed one!

What Microsoft seem to be engaged in is vindictive market share acquisition for the sole purpose of damaging the competition. The only reason they're able to do this is because they are cash rich. The reason for this is because they have a monopoly on their core product. But like a drug dealer, they've got the world hooked on this product that damages their productivity and generally disappoints at every turn.

Now, you will note that I'm not crying foul because M$ have an unfair competitive advantage. No, that's business too. Any good business would do the same. But one would hope that the primary purpose would be making a profit as well as gaining market share, not just gaining market share for the sake of it, and market share to diminish the profits of the competition.

In war, the objective is to destroy the enemy or remove their effectiveness. This is achieved by a combination of effective tactical manoeuvres and dominant force where it exists.

In the absence of original, marketable ideas of their own, M$ is engaged in copying its competitors in mature markets, and then making war on that market. It's destructive and divisive. And it demonstrates a lack of imagination, moral courage, basic business nous and wit.

They've also done the same thing with the Zune and failed. Why? Because of many factors:

It's a blatant tip-off.
It's fatter.
It's ugly.
It's not been thought out.
It's unpopular.
iPods are far superior.
Apple are the dominant maker in the music player field.
The music player market is saturated.
The music player market growth is actually slowing.

Jobs follows Wayne Gretsky's advice and wins. Gates and Ballmer look in their rear view mirror for opportunity to imitate, and then attempt to bully their way in. If you see this rely as an example of me showing an "...utter lack of knowledge" etc. I really can't help you.


You show your utter lack of knowledge when you say that "any stupid idiot can do that" in reference to the Xbox. Microsoft entered the video game market, which is a VERY challenging market, and totally dominated it. Sony, which has been the ultra iconic brand of video gaming, cant even touch Microsoft in the multi-billion dollar US gaming market. In addition to the console itself, Xbox live is one of the most impressive things Microsoft has ever done. The problem with you is that your biased against Microsoft so you totally trash all the above as if it doesnt mean anything, when it is actually extremely impressive. Your comment; "uncle bill's porno pics of his lady friend while the neighbors kids are playing a game on it" shows not only your bias but also your immaturity, your lack of any good real points, and your lack of intelligence. Totally throwing the xbox and the surface table into the garbage as if they could be created by any stupid idiot is laughable. Apple makes really amazing products, and so does Microsoft. Certain things Apple does better and certain things Microsoft does better. However, discarding innovations made by Microsoft simply because you don't like them is ridiculous.
Thanks for making me laugh though.
 
You can't use those numbers to support your argument. That study represents the market share for Internet SMTP mail exchangers and not the entire mail transfer agent space. Lots and lots and lots of places that use Exchange for their internal e-mail systems use either sendmail or postfix for their MXes. Exchange's SMTP gateways just don't work well for large SMTP loads.

The fact that the study compares sendmail, postfix and Exchange should have been a dead give away, even if people didn't read the article.

Also, for the record, I can't find a single dictionary that agrees with your definition of "enterprise".
That's odd. His definition is pretty consistent with industry accepted practices and a quick search found multiple on-line dictionaries with at least one consistent definition.
 
You clearly don't deserve this. But where shall we start?

I worked in the intelligence field before going into design and marketing in the early '80s, making my first fortune in London launching PLCs.

I bought tons of Apple between 2001 and 2003, sat on them as they went up, and sold at the end of last year making several thousand percent profit.

I bought even more Google at launch and sold them in November last year too, at another massive profit.

The same money invested in M$ over the same period would have won me a $3-4 profit. Think about that.

I could retire tomorrow with the product of my accurate market assessment in the tagible form of cold hard cash in the bank. But I'm busy building a .Com.

I make decisions like these every day. You could learn a lot by studying the mistakes these clowns just made. There's a Chinese proverb that says: "Failures are teachers - study them well. The best teachers are other people's failures."


Wow, you seem to know everything. Every single thing that you labeled as "Fact" is not a fact at all.
You seem to take this whole Microsoft vs. Apple thing very seriously. Why? Dont you have anything better to do other than sit around all day and think of ridiculous things to say about Microsoft?
Let us all know when you own a company like Microsoft, since you seem to know everything about everything you should be the next worlds richest man in no time. :p
 
I bought even more Google at launch and sold them in November last year too, at another massive profit.

Probably should have rebought after the dip since it was clear that their click sales were going to again be profitable. Ooopsies!
 
Fuzzy Math?

""Despite our best efforts, including raising our bid by roughly $5 billion..."
And
"On February 1st, Microsoft made headlines after publicly offering to purchase Yahoo for $44.6 Billion"
"while Microsoft's offer topped out at $47.5 billion"

Umm - let's see here. 47.5 - 5 = 42.5 which is noticeably smaller than 44.6

They didn't even increase their offer by 3 billion and he says "roughly $5 billion"??? I don't think anyone would say $2.9 billion is "roughly" $5 billion. Had they actually offered $5 billion (49.6) Yahoo might have actually taken it...

Of course this explains a lot of how MSFT counts Zunes - they've sold 3 but Ballmer is convinced they've sold "roughly" 5 ;)
 
They didn't even increase their offer by 3 billion and he says "roughly $5 billion"??? I don't think anyone would say $2.9 billion is "roughly" $5 billion. Had they actually offered $5 billion (49.6) Yahoo might have actually taken it...

They increased it by 5 as their stock has dropped since the first bid and the bid is partially in stock.
 
GREAT NEWS - now I don't have to cancel my Yahoo Services which I pay for.

Put simply, M$ would kill Yahoo.

And Yahoo, please get more mac friendly.

that is all, over.
 
Obviously you don't care about "old stories" or "history" since the first Volkswagen was built in 1931 (yes designed by Hitler). Not created for the Nazi's. Not during WWII.

Well, I was close enough from the top of my head, without looking it up on Wikipedia. But you're right: It doesn't matter to me. It's not relevant anymore.

--Erwin
 
Late to the party, so forgive me if I tread old ground.

I, for one, and very happy to see Yahoo! not a part of the Microsoft conglomerate. It doesn't make sense from a business standpoint. MS would do better to spend $30 billion in making a real competition for Google/Yahoo! than buying Yahoo.

For that much money, I could make competition for Google/Yahoo.

Yahoo is a great participant in the open source community. From their Ajax tools all the way to Zimbra, they have shown support for open source. All of which would be lost if MS took over. Lost in the sense that the support would go, not that the code would disappear... But having full time PAID software engineers working on a project is significant loss.

Also, recently Yahoo announced new API structure for their entire web sphere. Soon any service on Yahoo will have API's usable for anyone to develope. This is a great deal.

Also, Yahoo is pushing ahead in the mobile market faster than any of their competitors.

Oh, and to the comments on Exchange and OSX, the answer is Zimbra. Zimbra and OSX server plus some work on Mail, iCal = hotness.

Indeed with Mail, Flickr, Zimbra, I think the best match up is Apple and Yahoo (on a deal level, perhaps not on a purchasing one).
 
Agree or not with the deal, Yahoo is taking it in the pocket book this morning.
The European markets are already starting to set the tone for todays trading.

Yahoo (YHOO, Fortune 500) shares are expected to fall sharply when the market opens in New York. In Frankfurt, the stock sank 19%. Microsoft (MSFT, Fortune 500) shares rose 4% in Germany.

MS may just get the fire sale deal.
 
GREAT NEWS - now I don't have to cancel my Yahoo Services which I pay for.

Put simply, M$ would kill Yahoo.

And Yahoo, please get more mac friendly.

that is all, over.


Microsoft would pay $48 billion for a company so they could kill it ? Brilliant. :confused:
 
Agree or not with the deal, Yahoo is taking it in the pocket book this morning.
The European markets are already starting to set the tone for todays trading.



MS may just get the fire sale deal.

Cry havoc, and let slip the dog's of war...


Yahoo! may be done very soon if they don't pick up their stock, I hope it doesn't happen...
 
Microsoft would pay $48 billion for a company so they could kill it ? Brilliant. :confused:

Yahoo uses BSD servers, open source programming like Perl and PHP. MS would change all of that. MS portal running BSD? not likely. Yahoo would become the silverlight expo.

They would spend $48 billion for the mindshare Yahoo has, not for the tech behind it.

and users would run to google.

(IMHO)
 
Yeah, from the $33 offer to $23. That's real strong. :rolleyes:

and what price per stock would you be happy to see apple sold for? they were at $14 a share in 2002, and they came back.

this is short term. in the long term, Yahoo is better alone. The acquisition by MS would have left both companies with no capital and no where to go but down.
 
Excuse my ignorance here, but what 20thC style services do you PAY for from Yahoo. I left them three years ago when I got fed up of being repeatedly told I wasn't a member of the group I formed, and having to constantly re-log in.

Ad that was after I'd paid for the hours of therapy sessions I needed to get over all that nasty, intrusive and distracting clutter, endless security traps.

Having received one of the early invites to join GMail in June 2004, I've never used anything else. It has its little faults. In fact it froze on me - once! and once every month or so, I have to log in again.

You're right, even if M$ doesn't actually set out to kill Yahoo, that is what would happen. Yahoo has no future. The only option for Yahoo was to take the deal on the table... imho.

The next [yard sale] offer will be lower. Yang will need extra personal security and insurance for his private parts as furious investors try to find enough cash to take out a class action. Meanwhile, M$ will plunder a rapidly emptying ship and discover they've bought the tools to play a new game called: 'Let's pretend it's 1997'.


GREAT NEWS - now I don't have to cancel my Yahoo Services which I pay for.

Put simply, M$ would kill Yahoo.

And Yahoo, please get more mac friendly.

that is all, over.
 
Why not?

Yahoo in the marketplace dilutes M$'s market share in what they see as a 'them' [Google] v 'us' [Microsoft] war. They hope to gain some expertise from Yahoo. And since it's clearly difficult for Redmond to hire top people to work for them these days, their only option, as they see it, is to buy these people as a job-lot from a competitor. It's a seriously flawed logic, but that really is the motivation here!

What M$ clearly don't realise is that for the majority of computer users, as well as people who work for big tech companies, is that Google is 'us' and Microsoft is 'them' - and it's been this way for some time now.

Of course this has come about for many reasons, but the most convincing evidence that it has, is embodied in the fact that to 'Google' very quickly became a verb. To Google something has become the generic term for internet search. Not just AN internet search, or even most people's understanding of internet search, the very core of internet search itself in the consciousness of people of all ages, all over the world.

Here's another measure of how interesting a company really is. If you Google the name of any big company, the Wikipedia page usually comes up in the first 3-5 results - right?

But if you Google the term term 'yahoo', even during the current heightened interest in them, in a page of 100 results, the Yahoo Wikipedia page is about 40th!

As Google has proved, search is about relevance. You won't find a more decisive indicator of the full implications of that fact.


Microsoft would pay $48 billion for a company so they could kill it ? Brilliant. :confused:
 
Here's another measure of how interesting a company really is. If you Google the name of any big company, the Wikipedia page comes up in the first 3-5 results - right?

But if you Google the term term 'yahoo', even during the current heightened interest in them, in a page of 100 results, the Yahoo Wikipedia page is about 40th!

As Google has proved, search is about relevance. You won't find a more decisive indicator of the full implications of that fact.

forgive me, i don't understand what you are pointing out.
 
Very Happy

First off I'm very happy that MS walked away. They really don't need the headaches that Yahoo would bring them.

Yahoo is still living in the 2000-2001. The only way they'll be able to survive will be if some one bails them out or buys them.

If MS really wants them, then they should just wait for the Yahoo fire sale, which should be happening in the next 6 months, when the stock is trading well below $20.00.

I'm still pushing for Microsoft to buy Verizon!
 
But if you Google the term term 'yahoo', even during the current heightened interest in them, in a page of 100 results, the Yahoo Wikipedia page is about 40th!

Its actually 27th, and the links above that are all to Yahoo! pages.
 
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