MIDI sequencing + OS X

Discussion in 'Mac Apps and Mac App Store' started by BigBurd, Jun 7, 2002.

  1. BigBurd macrumors member


    Jun 7, 2002
    The Beautiful Berkshires
    Anyone heard a rumor about when a decent MIDI sequencing application, useable with OS X, is going to be released?

  2. Quark macrumors regular

    Jan 9, 2002
    Me too!!

    I have been waiting patiently for something that works well.

    I have used some of the shareware stuff to try them out and they aren't that good.

    Jaguar seems like it might have some of the connectivity settings that will make more of these types of programs appear.

  3. mymemory macrumors 68020


    May 9, 2001
    Prtools is the only one talking about it.

    The problem is not the OSX version of the soft. The problem is that there is not where to run in features. Most of the midi/ audio soft have about everything, I guess that is the mayor concern. But I'm sure that by the end of this years most of the companies would have their products running on OSX.
  4. barkmonster macrumors 68020


    Dec 3, 2001
    OS X isn't 100% yet for audio & midi...

    In the next update (According to an article in Sound on Sound Magazine) Mac OS X is going to have native support for all the Yamaha MLan stuff, bye bye midi, hello firewire!

    As for basic midi, OS X doesn't have ANY support for patch names in it's current version of core midi, I find the way patches appear in protools using OMS under OS 9 is such an easy way of find the preset I want to use, PCs generally have to enter all kinds of annoying control codes to select banks and patches.
  5. Grokgod macrumors 6502a


    Feb 26, 2002
    Deep within the heart of madness!
    Doesnt Mbox come with protools LE, I guess this means that its for OS9?

    I wanted to buy it but wasnt sure if USB midi, digital interface is the way to go?

    But its backed by protools.... I guess I need to find out more about it.
  6. Wry Cooter macrumors 6502

    Mar 10, 2002
    You might see more choices after Summer NAMM.

    (But I am reminded of the last hot piece of gear I saw from summer NAMM which didn't ship until October, and didn't have the promised bundled Mac software for yet another year...)

    In some ways, this is the most support and attention that Apple has given Midi and Audio in some time. In other ways, making the leap to OS X is just going to be more than some of the sequencing/recording apps are going to want to deal with.. Also their have been a lot of hurdles going back to OS 8.6, when Apple was too busy merely trying to rise from the ashes to give proper attention to Music creation support.
  7. Grokgod macrumors 6502a


    Feb 26, 2002
    Deep within the heart of madness!
    I'm sad and not happy.

    I am worried about the state of music appz for APPLE.

    It seems like this is the area that APPLE is in the most disarray.
    I hope that they get some attention on it.

    Then I remind myself of the glory days when all musicians used a mac or an Atari,
    Remember those, they worked great with midi.

    They are still some musicians that use APPE arent there>?
    But they are probably still in OS9
  8. j763 macrumors 6502a

    Nov 25, 2001
    Champaign, IL, USA
    Most of the musicians are still in os 9, protools and the like...
  9. Dunepilot macrumors 6502a


    Feb 25, 2002
    I'm in OS 9 using Logic Audio 4.8.

    I'd like to have access to more firewire audio input methods - why has noone jumped on this one apart from MOTU with their 828 (which is £200 more expensive than PCI-based equivalents)?

    Looks like I may go with the USB Tascam 428 on the basis of price...
  10. Aquanaut macrumors member

    May 10, 2002
    Re: I'm sad and not happy.

    The Atari was the last time we ever saw a computer with built in MIDI ports. I remember the 1040ST as rock solid and very creative - I plugged it in a few months ago and couldn't believe how clunky and un-slick it all feels (too many years using the Mac, I guess).

    I would love to be running everything in OSX but first I think we are in for a similar step-up to what we experienced when MIDI first appeared (and what a relief that turned out to be - bye bye CV gates).
  11. Grokgod macrumors 6502a


    Feb 26, 2002
    Deep within the heart of madness!
    not soslick anymore~

    Yea, but in its day the Atari was a Gode send, it had midi in and out ports.
    And worked hard and rock solid.
    Its so strange that Macs just got a input port back finally!
    maybe Apple has something good inmind for music since they have finally gotten back to getting this rudimantary port back to the macs.
  12. billiam0878 macrumors 6502

    Mar 15, 2002
    Winter Park, FL
    Audio Input

    Yea, it's nice to see audio input again though it might be for a microphone for web conferencing (for which I thought I heard Apple might be adding support). Interesting nonetheless,

    Bill :)
  13. shadowfax0 macrumors 6502

    May 2, 2002
    Don't Worry everyone, those folks over at...uhhh...those guys who make Phrazer and Reason, those guys :) have juat made a whole bunch of Audio apps for OS X native, and I heard an awful lot about ProTools going to be here just as soon as Jaguar is released, it's supposed to be like the current ProTools on steroids, faater, more reliable, etc etc. And in case no one saw, Jaguar is going to have some HUGE improvements in audio input and management, so just hang in there :) Also, Peak DV and Deck 4 (3.5?) are out/coming out, as well as a whole bunch of their other products, I just think everyone is waiting for Jaguar.
  14. ear2ear macrumors member

    Feb 23, 2002
    The digidesign rep told me it would be fall when we see a new ProTools. Until then, I continue to slug it out in 9 (not that its really that bad though).

    Actually, I have some reservations about PT for OSX, because it will certainly finally be optimized for the G4 (I have a G3), will likely require more ram, and be a $ upgrade, so its going to be a more-expensive-than usual upgrade.

    But you can't really complain about all this since OS X isn't ready yet. Why haven't we seen the ProTools HD midi box, or Logic's native OS X software. Anyone who stayed informed when OS X came out knew it would be 1-2 years before we'd be invited to the party, but the specs make it worth the wait. Hell, many XP users are still out in the cold for pro audio apps and drivers. Its the nature of the business.

    I plan to watch for new software this autumn, see how it is, and any kinks that will accompany its intro, then, IF it is worthwhile, I'll set aside some cash to do a complete upgrade this time next year - new app - new OS - new mac, too.
  15. Wry Cooter macrumors 6502

    Mar 10, 2002
    I wonder how much wait and see is in Steinberg's court. Any Cubase users tracking possible OS X support? The Steinberg USA road shows usually take a AMD box along, because of muscians chronically thin wallets. Usually you have about 8 very enthusiastic kids treating Digital Audio apps as if they were an Xbox release, for every 2 relatively sober people actually already making a living in the music industry asking the mac support questions. Uh.. we plan to but this third party plug in is only on peecee....

    More generally regarding The Midi Audio layer of OS X and support from the music merchandizing biz...If it ain't in the box by MWNY it won't be in the box by NAMM... check this out...

    Macworld Conference & Expo, July 17-19, 2002...

    NAMM Summer Session
    Join us in Music City USA, July 19-21, 2002...

    At least one is after the other rather than competing... I hope several developers take a full week for conventions
  16. neut macrumors 68000


    Nov 27, 2001
    here (for now)
    OSX audio apps

    Cabase SX and Reason 2.0 are the only ones i know of...

    Pro Tools (digi) has been in the works for quite some time.

    many others are on there way
  17. gelbin macrumors regular

    Jan 18, 2002
    osx and audio apps - logic audio

    emagic has had plans for logic audio for X for about a year now. we should see it soon, i would guess sometime around jaguar. it was really supposed to be with version 5, released back in like february, but it is obviously delayed, and i think due to changes in osx (a la jaguar).

    as for firewire interfaces, the 828 is not the only option. there are a bunch, including the 969 (i think, motu's other interface) as well as one by metric halo which is said to kick butt.
  18. BigBurd thread starter macrumors member


    Jun 7, 2002
    The Beautiful Berkshires
    MOTU DP & OS X

    I've heard the MOTU will release a new version of Digital Performer, that will be able to be used with OS X, soon. Anyone heard anything that would support this rumor?
  19. Edge100 macrumors 68000

    May 14, 2002
    Where am I???
    Certainly, all the major developers of sequencing packages (Digidesign, Steinberg, Emagic, MOTU) will have their products moved over to OS X within the year (that is, one year from now). This is fairly certain.

    Audio is really the last sector still completely in OS 9. Moving the sequencing package will help. But...

    Without support from companies like Native Instruments, these packages will be less than ideal. I, for one, rely HEAVILY on VST instruments and plug-ins to make music. Even if Emagic ported Logic (my preferred sequencer) to OS X today, I couldnt move. I need Absynth, Pro-52, B4, FM7, and the Waves plugin package to be moved over before I can even consider it.

    Pro audio is VERY demanding of a computer. And not just of a CPU, but of all the components. You need a system with gobs of RAM, a quick processor, and especially, a fast (>7200RPM) hard drive. From what I've seen of the audio packages already available for OS X, the current systems just arent enough.

    My iMac 600, which handles my OS 9 audio needs just fine (>24 audio tracks, several softsynths, a few reverb plugs, and tons of delays, compressors, and EQs). I tried the Reason 2.0 demo in OS 9 and X and I can tell you that there is a much bigger CPU load in OS X. Herein lies the problem. In order to take advantage of OS X for audio, we really need a new breed of computers. I realise that my iMac isnt the fastest computer out there, but it worked for my audio in OS 9.

    I think that a simultaneous release (or thereabouts) of new, much faster PowerMacs, and some OS X-native sequencing packages, will go along way to securing the audio market for Apple. The current batch of computers just wont have the headroom.
  20. drastik macrumors 6502a


    Apr 10, 2002
    The audio just needs a little push, and think that push is going to come from Digidesign. Tey say that Pro Tools X is in development, and I expect it sooner rather than later. I'm going to DIgiWorld here in NAshville on 17 July, I'll let everyone know what I hear.:D
  21. Wry Cooter macrumors 6502

    Mar 10, 2002
    I was considering attending, but I can't afford the big rig pro tools right now anyway, so I feel out of place at a 'mortgage your house to buy pro tools upmty ump" sales presentation. It IS invigorating to see Digi actually being more aggressive on the low end as well-- the notebook as portastudio concept will probably bring them more growth than they realize.

    Sneaking into NAMM itself drastik?
  22. Edge100 macrumors 68000

    May 14, 2002
    Where am I???
    I agree. The $10000+ ProTools rig is nice, but c'mon! Unless you make 4 or 5 times that in a year, it simply isnt worth it. I make music for fun, and maybe make a little money from it too, but it certainly isnt my major focus. The MBOX from Digi is (hopefully) just the beginning of something much more fundamental for Digi.

    Digi has always operated based on the fact that their systems allowed people to do things that werent possible without the Digi hardware. In the past, computers were simply too slow to do anything substantial. This has changed. For instance, TDM effects, which require native DAE hardware, are no longer the cream of the crop. AmpFarm, for example, was the one and only guitar amp simulator plug in for quite some time because it only ran as a TDM plug. Now we can see a number of VST plugs that are doing the same thing, but relying soley on the CPU for the processing cycles. We've got the power now, so Digi has to move with the times. Giving us a product like the Mbox is not only great for the consumer (high quality A/D D/A converters, good mic pres, portable), but, as you say, it will undoubtedly help Digi to develop more and more products just like it.

    I have a friend who is quite a bigtime producer in London and LA. He still uses ProTools in the studio on a Dual 1GHz, but uses Logic on his iBook while on the road. He can do this because the iBook really provides all of the processing power he needs. Sure, you cant record 24 tracks at once or have the quality of PT hardware on the iBook, but once its all laid down, todays systems have plenty of punch!
  23. 3rdpath macrumors 68000


    Jan 7, 2002
    2nd star on the right and straight till morning
    i think its gonna be quite a while before we see X as a serious audio platform. as was stated before, there are too many programs that must be compatible to X before the jump from 9 can be made.

    though i'm not a protools fan, i do think they will be the first to go to X because many post houses use PT without all the assorted aftermarket periphs.

    i personally don't see any reason to worry about it. its the same as wanting to go to 24/96...many many post houses and audio professionals( including ILM on the new star wars) are still running at 16/44.1 or 48 and its not holding things back.

    and i think OMS is just kludgy. not to mention the last update was when? and its patchlists were updated what year? i think freemidi is quite nice though it can't transmit midi to reason 1.01 which is a drag. i think that'll be worked out in reason 2.0...when it ever ships...

    and regarding NAMM shows...the old saying is NAMM stands for
    " Not Available, Maybe in May...". there should be a penalty for manufacturers who show items they can't ship. and MOTU is very guilty of this with DP 3.1:rolleyes:
  24. johnny macrumors newbie

    Jun 26, 2002
    Canada, eh?
    Logic IS COMING SOON. Oh. And...hi.

    Hey all.

    First of all, I'm a longtime lurker who decided to come out of the wordwork and raise some hell. So hi. You'll be seeing lots of me.

    Secondly, Logic for osX is coming EXTREMELY soon. And it's going to be GREAT. All the features of 5 -- but fully core-audio ready. I had a conversation with someone at eMagic last month who said it will be May or June, almost certainly. That only gives them ten more days.

    Not saying it's a guarantee, but it sure as hell looks better than it used to.

    Cubase SX is also going to be released for osX in a couple of months -- and it looks pretty sharp too. I'll be sticking to Logic though.


  25. Wry Cooter macrumors 6502

    Mar 10, 2002
    I think you can pretty much forget about OMS, and concentrate on the Midi Audio layer in OS X. When Gibson bought Opcode, it was pretty much merely to bury them (their vision for the electronic music future is the ethernet based band guitar and public address thing) Apple had the good sense to hire Doug Wyatt, who actually created OMS, but can no longer do a thing with it under that name, to help develop the midi underpinnings of OS X.

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