Mobile Google Maps to Offer GPS-Like Positioning

[elcid]

The technology to do this has been around for ages, but I had always assumed it required co-operation from the network provider.

If Google find a way to do this without the explicit support of the network provider, then there's gonna be a lot of annoyed networks out there.

Go Google!

SL

I second this. It is just triangulation between towers. Thought it would require network provider too but you never know what google has up their sleeve.

 

[TurboSC]

niiiiiice.

I can't wait to see what the SDK will bring in terms of functionality for the iPhone... I'm excited.

 

[plumbingandtech]

...at least not in that sense. Just trying to light a fire under the rears of anyone from Apple who might be reading.

Don't get me wrong - I LOVE Apple. I'm tying this on my Mac right now, and I'd never own a PC unless I HAD to. They had a GREAT opportunity to make something incredibly ground breaking with the iPhone, and in the arena of design, sure, it's prettier than any other phone out there. But as far as what it DOES, it's not exactly groundbreaking, let alone ahead of the .

Yah. That Curve is JUST like an iPhone. Might as well call it the iCurve.

Where do I _not_ sign up.

 

[clevin]

as of now, it only supports BB, WM Nokia, not iPhone nor treo

 

[mustang_dvs]

Sounds cool, but I would like REAL GPS. Also, wasn't legislation passed in the USA after 9/11 where GPS had to be in all cell phones so people can find you? Not exactly sure if that's true, much less actually in the iPhone. If it is, it should be fairly simple to tap into the GPS thing and see where you are (and other people, which is kinda freaky).

The Wireless Communications and Public Safety Act of 1999 stipulated that cell phone carriers implement mobile phone location as part of an e911 service. Carriers in the U.S. either use Triangulation-Assisted GPS (Verizon and Sprint - both CDMA) or Time Difference of Arrival Triangulation (AT&T and T-Mobile - both GSM/GPRS).

Alternativly you can just GET a GPS enabled phone. But hey. Its iPhone. Why would one ever want something with more, and better features.

Very few GPS 'equipped' mobile phones (all of them CDMA phones) actually allow users to access the GPS data, as it is a far less accurate GPS location than most GPS navigation devices (hence the need for triangulation assistance for e911 service).

 

[MacinDoc]

Excuse my ignorance, but exactly how much use is a GPS-like device that's accurate within ten city blocks? Let's see, is this my destination, or is it on the other side of the freeway? Is this the right place to turn, or should I have turned 9 blocks back? This level of accuracy may be sufficient when targeting a nuclear bomb, but for most other uses, other than determining whether you're in the correct city, it's of little use.

 

[mulletman13]

What is with people constantly complaining about the 10 city block thing?

That is a worst case scenario.

If you actually take time to read how the actual thing performs it is accurate within a block, or even pinpoints the location perfectly. Also, as more data is logged, more towers are put up and so on -- the devices will get more accurate.

It's like how phone companies tell you that your phone will be activated within 2 days -- when its typically online and active within minutes.

 

[jpine]

10 city blocks is a pretty big error bar when you're trying to get directions to something in a city...but it's better than nothing.

A city block, depending on how one defines a city block, can be as long as two tenths of a mile. We could be talking about 2 miles here. Still, it is a start for a devices that is not meant to measure distance or give direction. Just don't ask for the nearest ER.

 

[mcarnes]

I don't think this is accurate enough to use reliably in the city. And in the woods I want my Garmin. I don't think Steve would use this in the iPhone.

 

[jokarak]

Not very accurate from home

Hm...just installed it on my E61. The map claims an accuracy of about 1.7km, but looking at the map, it's off by about 6~7 miles. I'll try again tomorrow when I'm on the road, because I have lousy reception at home.

Cool, nonetheless, though...gotta love technology

edit: Another downer: they've added two confirm prompts where before there were none. One seems to be EULA and the second is one of those "don't use while driving" disclaimers.

edit2: Thinks are looking better on the disclaimer front: you only get the warnings on the first run of the program (and when you reset it - I did that by mistake). Moreover, you are no longer prompted on the E61 to choose a connection, it remembers the last connection and automatically logs on. Haven't gone to the street to see how accurate "my location" is in an area with better reception/more cell towers than home.

 

[BiikeMike]

I just tried it again while out, and it said "accurate to within 5,000 meters"

 

[TurboSC]

It's like how phone companies tell you that your phone will be activated within 2 days -- when its typically online and active within minutes.

True. Once Google starts expanding their tower locations it'll be pretty accurate...

I can only imagine how google will use this technology and Android to take over the mobile front haha. I'm glad Google and Apple are buddies

 

[phastings]

Damn.. apparently this doesn't work with the older (2nd generation) Nokia series 60 smartphones (ie: my phone). But it does work with the newer 3rd generation ones. That totally sucks. At least the google maps app is updated...

Ok, I'm a little confused. I have been using this technology since my Nokia 720 ten years ago.

There are plenty of other mapping solutions out there - I have been using the one supplied by Orange on my phone for those same 10 years to get me out of trouble when the pubs turf out and I need a local taxi firm.

So therefore is it not Google that are behind the times?

 

[Cleverboy]

Ok, I'm a little confused. I have been using this technology since my Nokia 720 ten years ago.

There are plenty of other mapping solutions out there - I have been using the one supplied by Orange on my phone for those same 10 years to get me out of trouble when the pubs turf out and I need a local taxi firm.

So therefore is it not Google that are behind the times?

Welcome to how technology works. People rediscover things that have existed before, but in limited, far less ubiquitous ways. Like the solution for your Orange phone may not have had a mapping solution as nice as Google maps tied to it that reports traffic conditions, etc. Only you know if it does. This is a huge advancement for ubiquity.

I'm anxious to see when the service will stabilize and become a fixture. I assume Google may add WiFi spots to its database in the next revision and cross-match phones with GPS, so that it begins to let folks with laptops logged into, for instance, Starbucks... use "My Location" from their browser-based Google maps.

I remember listening to an interview with Eric Smidt on 20/20 or something, where he openly discussed the idea that Google wants people to be able to comparison shop while standing in front of a product on a shelf. Allowing folks to find nearby locations that sell the item, and show how much the nearby location is charging. Moreso than your Nokia 720 running something "10 years ago", we're entering a much more accessible level of expectation for location-base search.

Along with Google's WiFi, wireless spectrum and dark fiber initiatives... somehow I think they've got their eye on a bigger picture of how all this wonderful technology (however long in coming) integrates together.

As an aside, I really hope Apple doesn't let TOO much time pass on implementing this... and/or doesn't have something planned that's not as good. Considering Google is on the board, it seems silly to think they weren't long aware of this rollout. The "BETA" status of the service does seem more than enough for Apple to take the scenic route.

~ CB

 

[sunfast]

I echo a few opinions on here - that it doesn't seem accurate enough for city use and, anywhere important, I want my proper GPS.

That said, I'd be very interested to see it in real world usage.

 

[Cleverboy]

I echo a few opinions on here - that it doesn't seem accurate enough for city use and, anywhere important, I want my proper GPS.

That said, I'd be very interested to see it in real world usage.

That's odd, I'd think it was just the opposite. It can be fantastically accurate in the city, but not so in rural areas. "Anywhere important" just sounds impossibly subjective. If Navizon is a judge (and theoretically move the service quality UP from there), it will be fine for many many people as a fallback way to grab a sense of where you are. For others, it simply won't always work when they need it to. It's no replacement for GPS tracking, but an extremely welcome option that shouldn't be apart of any "EITHER/OR" scenario. Having used Navizon, I remembering thinking very much... "Boy, I bet if Google did this, the performance would be better, and they're network of data would be more robust". I didn't even realize how much more they could do as well.

~ CB

 

[spedney]

Just installed and tried it on my Nokia 5500. Works fine... says accuracy is 1.7km but is actually only about 200 metres out. Not bad for Norway!

 

[superleccy]

Works good on my Nokia N95.

The N95 has GPS anyway, which I generally don't use because of the crapness of Nokia's software, and the time it takes to find enough satellites (sometimes hours).

The new version of Google Maps will work with either the N95's GPS, or use cell positioning. Cell positioning picked out a location about 5 mins walk away (but did it very quickly), and GPS positioning homed in on my exact location to within a couple of meters, but it did this gradually as it found the satellites one by one.

At least the cell positioning is good enough to get you "on the right page" of the map.

And positioning aside, the new Google Maps is a slick bit of software... and when it's free, who's complaining?

SL

 

[ma2ha3]

at my place it is about 3 km out, according to verizon i am living in the middle of a major highway. Verizon think i am a trailer.

 

[twoodcc]

even though it's not all that accurate, still looking forward to this in my iPhone

 

[operator207]

You are very right. When talking about cell phones. However, Clive was talking about Google being able to use this for To: From: directions on a computer connected via Cable/DSL/Dial-up/Etc. This would mean you could pull up Google maps on your desktop and get directions to somewhere without typing in your current location.

I had thought Google Earth had this for a while, but I don't remember.

Thats a lot to get out of:

Interesting... Yeah, can't Google just query your IP and put your dot on the map? T'would make it easy for "from here" / "To here" directions...

-Clive

I do not see any remarks towards DSL Cable or computer. You DO realize your phones, with internet access, do have IPs, right? Regardless....

IF and only IF you do not use wireless or a router for your DSL Cable etc. If you do, then the same iana IPs apply. Every DSL and Cable company around here offer a router for some price when you get your DSL or Cable. Most of the time its free, or very close to free. If directly connected to your DSL or Cable, no router and have the ISP acquired IPs, then I guess this would be ok, but that is so far and few between, that I seriously doubt many are like that.
ATT DSL Modems have a router built in, at least for my father's (also has wireless) and a friend's (just wired router). Neither payed anything for them. Both have had them for years, then replaced them with new ATT stuff ~2-6 months ago.

Still, the IP that you get from ATT or whomever, will be dependent on where its allocated.

The IP for my parents DSL, in Arlington Texas, shows the address of:
OrgName: AT&T Internet Services
OrgID: SIS-80
Address: 2701 N. Central Expwy # 2205.15
City: Richardson
StateProv: TX
PostalCode: 75080
Country: US

Ya, thats a hell of a lot more than 10 blocks. (~34 miles)

I guess what I am trying to say is, your wrong, it STILL APPLIES to your computer. Either you have a iana IP, and it won't matter, or you have your DHCP/Dynamic/Static IP from your ISP, and it will have your ISP's address, not yours and will either be inaccurate, or highly inaccurate. Either way, it will be less accurate than 10 city blocks.

 

[jokarak]

Better in the city

Ok, I'm testing this again in an area with better cell coverage, and it is off by the stated margin of error (1.7km - my actual location is at the inner edge of the margin of error circle). Pretty fancy, I must say.

 

[TimJim]

Thats good news, it will be navigation without buying anything extra.

 

[kingtj]

More pessimistically, perhaps ......

It's plenty accurate enough to roughly find your location, and target-market some advertising to you that's relative to the stores in the vicinity.

I echo a few opinions on here - that it doesn't seem accurate enough for city use and, anywhere important, I want my proper GPS.

That said, I'd be very interested to see it in real world usage.

 

[elistan]

Some friends of mine actually worked on e911 stuff years ago when they worked for Alcatel, so this sort of capability has been around for a while.

This is not a competitor to turn-by-turn GPS systems like the TomTom. Prior to this, Google Maps didn't allow for ANY automatic positioning and that's still true for PCs, Macs and iPhones. Yet still find the application extremely useful, and I expect a lot of other Google Maps users do to. So what does this do? It adds a little bit of extra functionality to make using the app easier. It's not a Jesus App, here to grant digital salvation. It's just a nice little upgrade, one that I've actually wished for several times.

There have been plenty of times I've brought up Google Maps to look for a restaurant, book store, street address, whatever, except the last time I used the app I was 30 miles away (easy to do in DFW.) So I have to zoom out, scroll over, zoom back in... It's not the end of the world of course, but it'd be nice to just slect a single button and have the app re-center over my general area, so that I can do my search for "indian restaurant" or whatever. Most of the time I'm not interested to know that I'm within 10 feet of a particular location. I already know where I am! I just want to be able to do a search of my general surroundings, so I can find whatever it is I'm looking for.

That's not to say that I wouldn't welcome true GPS positioning - I'd love to have that feature, to be honest. (I can't see any technical reason why Apple couldn't add bluetooth GPS to the iPhone's profiles.) But I'm not going to deride the cell-tower triangulation feature because of its limitations - it's not everything I want, but I still want it.